Ian Dewhirst

Well since it is in fact the Greatest Record Of All Time I can imagine that they would have to meet the demand. But the promos beat 'em by a good couple of years at least in that case. There was only one known copy for a good 9 months to a year after Levine found it - I know 'cos I had the 2nd one......... Was it you that put one in a toaster on another thread? Or was that modernsoulsucks LOL.... Ian D

Phew. Thank the Lord for that! Well done that man 'modernsoulsucks' and good luck with the hearing aid. Anyway, Stuart, I owe you a drink for that plus Steve Rumney sends his dearest regards and wouldn't mind meeting up for a drink as well. So since it's the season of goodwill to all men and forgiveness for any perceived Othello Robinson injustice can I suggest you PM me and maybe we can rope in the two Steves and meet up for a dwinky? Ian D

No hisses, pops, blips, jumps or crackle either! Ian D

The original point was why risk, say, a styrene press of a £5K super-rarity which will get chopped up after being played numerous times on different decks. This has just been nicely discussed in another thread about terrible accidents with rare records with instances of rarities being destroyed by dodgy decks. Although the thread has twisted and mutated into a healthy discourse as to the relative merits of different formats, as all good threads should, the basic thrust was would Northern Soul audiences accept alternative formats to vinyl and I think the overwhelming response has been NO. Northern Soul is quite reasonably addicted to vinyl. Which is fair enough. I'm as guilty as the rest of us in that respect. But I'm also aware that the world is changing, sometimes faster than many of us would like. Also the majority of Northern Soul has already been digitised for CD releases, so I think there's a certain amount of snobbery involved in owning the originals. I think I've said earlier that the act of owning original vinyl is like 'a badge of honour' for many - almost like it confirms the passion of the owner. But these days it also involves having a lot of disposable income doesn't it? Also I note with interest that one of the world's top collectors (if not THE top one) has recently digitised his own collection and sold off most of his originals. Is he any less of a soul fan because of it? And, yes, Bearsy it's nuts to do a carver of a perfectly good CD or digital copy unless you just want to fit it into a 7" record box. It'll cost you £20 just to make it look like a 7" with a lesser sound quality! So maybe it's peer pressure? Would anyone dare turn up at a gig with a laptop? I dunno but we're living in interesting times LOL....... Ian D

I can't remember that! Are you sure Stuart? If I did it was a one-off 'cos I've never chipped any of my own records LOL... Please accept my humble apologies (but NOT at today's prices)! And that's what I love about digital files - no hisses, pops, farts, cracks or clicks and.....oh shit....my motherboard's crashed......... Ian

I don't think they are. Only the promos were around for the first few years - not a pink one in sight. If they were as old as the promos, then where were they all that time? Ian D

The decks at Samanthas in Sheffield were notorious for destroying styrene presses! If I were seriously collecting today's ultra-rarities I honestly don't think I'd risk playing 'em unless the equipment was up to scratch. Mind you - you can't always tell..... I wish you'd put this in the other thread about playing rare records out 'cos this is EXACTLY what I was getting at. It's nice playing these goodies out but you have to live with the hiss forevermore......... Ian D

At least it's only a re-press! Ian D

A new one on me Dave but I'll do some digging around.... Next you'll be asking about floatation tanks! Ian D

Yep, deejayed there a few times. The venue was famous for it's record decks being suspended from the ceiling on 4 wires! I also remember writing-off one of my cars on the way back from Cleethorpes but still making it to the Cat's Whiskers for a set on a Sunday afternoon - how's that for commitment! Am I going nuts or did I once DJ there with Jr Walker & The All-Stars? I seem to remember but can't be absolutely sure that was the venue..... I think there were two promoters at different times - John 'Kojak' Harvey (interesting bloke - I never knew where he came from or whether he was a big Northern fan or not) and Terry ? (forgotten his name but he promoted a lot of gigs in the early 70's). But Meanwood? Phew. Not a good place to hand around on a dark night LOL..... Ian D

Cheers Roger, Useful but still sketchy though. The weird thing is that the strings are all mixed in a very similar way but the producers and arrangers are all different on many of the records. It makes me wonder if Ed Wingate used to have a final listening say in each of the mixes and made sure that the strings were upfront in the mix..... Maybe one for Rob Moss...... Ian D

Just listening to some stuff today and it occurred to me that there's some really terrible mixes which made it to record. For the less technically-minded, the mix is what gets pressed onto vinyl, so if it's crystal clear it's usually a good mix and if it's muffled or you can't hear certain elements of the record, then it's mixed badly. So a couple which have always sounded awful to me:- "They Say" - The Ovations "Gee Baby" - The Malibus Any other contenders? Ian D

I've been listening to the string sections on the intrumental versions on records like Duke Browner "Crying Over You", The Tartans "Nothing But Love", Wingate Love-In Strings "Let's Have A Love-In" and Al Kent's "The Way You've Been Acting Lately" and I love the way they've been mixed in the original recordings. I think they've mixed better than the Motown recordings from the same era because they're more upfront in the mix. So were these all the same string section? I presume they were.... If so who were they? And also was it the same engineer on all these recordings? Any info appreciated. Thanks in advance. Ian D

If a computer analyses it then it has to be digital and this sounds like a digital interpretation to me. The only way you can get an analogue version is via the tape or vinyl........ Ian D

Remember a massive load of Canadian Motown releases were brought in by Bostocks in the early 1970's. I bought hundreds at the time which were available at Bradford, Leeds, Wakefield and Huddersfield markets @ 25p each - in fact I still have many of them sat on the shelves right now. Maybe one reason why they're priced down? Ian D

I'm not so sure Derek. How many great tracks which never get aired are on Refrosoul? Having a massive choice can provide spontaneity which you wouldn't necessarily have with just a box of pre-selected stuff. Every time I read Manifesto and the various columns in there or some of the threads on here, it makes me want to hear a lot of the records described. What would Sam, John Manship or Tim Brown play if they had the option of having their entire collections with them instead of just a box of 'regulars'? I don't think it's a 'security blanket'. I think it's having a massive choice. But I take your point about the Greg example not being like for like. But there's also a part of me which wouldn't mind hearing a bit more diversity generally in some of the gigs I go to as well. Has there ever been a Northern gig with 4 decks with 4 jocks taking a deck each and having a Northern soundclash? Now THAT would be interesting..... Ian D

I think The Cooler King has the right attitude. There can be a balance. If Don Davis sent me a previously undiscovered killer on MP3 what am I gonna do - NOT play it??? Plus let's not forget that all these records were cut from tape first - the vinyl is the second format in the chain if you think about it....... Ian D

Actually MP3's are pretty crap for quality - WAV files are the way to go apparently. But you're right. It's very difficult to sexually molest an MP3..... But there is a bit of sexual undercurrent going on with the vinyl thing though isn't there? I can't count the amount of times I've been accused of loving vinyl more then women LOL........ Ian D

You're WAAAY too romantic Paul! I want a vinyl record to be as near to the original recording as possible. I can't tell you the amount of ticks, scratches, hisses, jumps and pops which have totally pissed me off on recordings I love - I have no fondness for fighting through beaten-up records to hear a recording. Also, most of the scratches have been put on by people who had the record before me and didn't look after it! The vinyl is merely a format - a carrier Paul, it's not an organic living breathing thing. You may be developing a very unhealthy obsession here LOL..... And you're being a little unfair describing someone who may use a laptop as some "lack lustre, chair bound, lazy, charlatan, downloading onto his laptop and pressing play at the event". Is this a million miles different from a lack lustre, chair bound, lazy, charlatan, with a few quid putting a stylus on a record at an event? Nope. Same thing. I think if you'd ever seen someone like Greg Wilson (who by the way has a huge vinyl collection) use a laptop creatively you'd probably think again. Vinyl is a very loveable format but it's only the means of getting the recording to the public. Let's not over-romanticise it. Ian D

20 years of waiting then the other half steps on it! Sounds like divorce material right there! Have you forgiven her yet? Or renewed your marriage vows LOL? Ian D

No wonder the title's "It Really Hurts Me Girl" LOL Ian D

You're absolutely right Spot. I was young and had rare vinyl blinkers on! I'd have been aghast at playing anything other than pure originals and rarities and I had very little respect for people who played boots or acetates back then. But when we're in an age of £10K rarities I'd certainly be thinking twice about playing 'em out several nights a week that's for sure. Wouldn't be able to afford it for a start! And the last bunch of Northern I've sold have been by far the most difficult with people's expectations of grading being sky high. I just can't get into conversations about grading and stuff like that. My attitude is the record's rare, it's 40 years old, it got played a lot, so let's be realistic on condition. But, no, people are incredibly anal about condition and grading. So back to why I started the thread - is it worth playing £10K rarities out when they're going to get devalued by maybe 50%? I pitched this thread because I have similar discussions with numerous people almost every day regarding the death of vinyl and I thought it would be an interesting thread because the Northern scene really will be the last bastion of vinyl I reckon. I thought it would generate some heated debate and it has. And I certainly wrecked a lot of very decent rarities on those bloody decks at Samanthas which were notorious for carving up vinyl....... Plus people like your good self would never have had it any other way wouyldja? Ian D

I think I may have been guilty of a slight exaggeration there Kev! I just worked it out on the train and even with my couple of thousand CD's chucked in the figure's far more likely to be 80-100K thinking about it. Including 7" and 12" B sides as well LOL.... We might just be the last generation of vinyl though. I'm not sure if tomorrow's audience will have the understanding for blips, jumps and scratches...... Ian D

Haha LOL! Agreed! I've already got a few so shall I press acetates? I'm getting the new set-up sometime between Boxing Day and the New Year so I'll let you know what I decided on.... Ian D

OK Barry, here's a situation to ponder. Right now I have pretty much everything I want right here, right now, on either vinyl, CD or a digital format - probably over 250,000 tunes in total. Yet, if I elected to use a laptop to play them @ a gig, I would accused of 'selling out', 'not being real', 'being lazy' or 'not committed' etc, etc. So if I won the lottery tomorrow and then spent £500,000 with Browny, Manship, Brady and E-Bay and amassed exactly the same records on original vinyl would that then make me OK and credible again? Whaddaya think? Ian D