Ian Dewhirst

Haha LOL! You're right Tony - I never saw "Prayin'" as a two-step. Arnold Blair's "Trying To Get Next To You" is the one that springs to my mind. When I think of all the copies I left in the 70's it kills me now LOL...........It sounded horrendous back then but put it in another context and era it made perfect sense. Ian D

Oh yep, there's a few around which are usually beaten-up as they were early plays for most DJ's but I've only seen a couple of white promos in 25 years and never ever a sealed issue (which the scan is). OK, it ain't Northern and not really sexy on here but I think Chic were one of the most innovative groups ever, so nice items IMO... And I didn't know about the Ed Summers connection but WHAT A RECORD! Brilliant! And a brilliant use of the Joe Anderson backing track! Just found a clip on You Tube:- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_2M9GAtENA Ian D

This is a fantastic thread for me Lisa, so thanks for kicking it off! I think a 'key' chart on some of the classics would make a lot of sense if anyone was prepared to undertake such an exercise. I know I'm drawn to weird changes and diminishing chords and other interesting tricks 'cos whenever I've had musicians analyse some of the songs I like, they'll say things like..."oh, they technically shouldn't have done that", "that's weird, you NEVER follow an E with a minor C" and "what the f*&k have they done there?" etc, etc. Some of 'em work and some of 'em don't - ever heard the out-of-key horns on Towanda Barnes for instance and her impossible pitching LOL (even though it's still a phenomenal record)? The above mentioned "I'm Gonna Change" and "The Night" (and even "Who Loves You" come to that), all have really interesting key changes and weird arrangements and I'm wondering if it's because The Four Seasons and Frankie Valli were highly focussed on vocal harmonics and their arrangers and producers could try out some innovative key changes and challenging arrangements? I'd also like to know the keys and chords used on Duke Browner's "Crying Over You" as well as many of the vintage Detroit string backed releases - Al Kent, San Remo Strings, John Rhys etc, etc.... And "Exus Trek" LOL! What the HELL was going there? Over the years I've always liked virtually anything with a great string arrangement and certainly stuff with challenging arrangements - Bobby Gentry's "Ode To Billy Joe" is a good pop example - what's the secret of that song's incredible arrangement in musical terms? Questions, questions. Please keep the analysis coming Catfish, Shorter Soul and Rachel. This could be the 'Guardian Section' of S.S. LOL.... Ian D

So what's the deal on "I'm Gonna Change" - The Four Seasons? There's some interesting stuff going on there isn't there.....? Ian D

Wow, nice to see such an eager market out there. Tell yer what, I'll do the Stanley Mitchell Dynamo reissue and the Tomangoes Washpan styrene boot for £100 the pair. How's that for a bargain? Doesn't surprise me though. I had a well-known collector here a few years ago who insisted on buying my Mel Britt boot despite me not wanting to sell it particularly. In the end he said he wouldn't leave without it and ended up paying £50 for it so I could get another one. Needless to say I've never managed to get another one, so maybe he wasn't so daft after all........ Ian D

Yeah baggy trousers and million-mile per hour dancing LOL! It'll never catch on....... Ian D

Morning Dave, Yep really slow on most but some lovely stuff when they do get round to it - Black Ivory, Melba Moore, Papa John Creach etc, etc, plus that Canadian 12" Walter Gibbons mix of Gladys Knight's "It's Better Than A Good Time" is something else and RARE! Circa £500 at the moment I think...... However, maybe not quite as rare as these:- Withdrawn immediately as the record was signed to Atlantic but not before a couple got out....... Ian D

OK, Lenny, I've always found that the combination of waving my cock whilst showing people my huge collection generally has the desired effect.............. Ian D

I think that the Special Products one was a legitimate re-pressing probably done by Soussan in '74/'75 ish. I found about 200 copies of the re-press in an L.A. thrift store in '76, so I can only presume that they were done in L.A. and the over-pressings were dumped......... Ian D

I'm pretty sure that the promo 45 has long and short versions. I've never seen a 12" - I don't think it exists..... Ian D

Me too. I keep thinking 'that's another £200 wiped-off the value of that record' LOL.... I've lost count of the amount of cue-burned styrene pressings I've heard over the years. It got to the point when I would actually turn down styrene presses of certain records as I knew they weren't as robust as vinyl pressings for regular deejaying. There's a LOT of Amy, Bell, Mala, Dyno-Voice, Smash, Fontana, Okeh, Columbia, Date and Loma records out there with the dreaded hiss........ Ian D

Absolutely Sunnysoul. Just terrible. And then you think about Teddy Pendergrass and Johnny Wilder from Heatwave suffering similar fates from car crashes. And Marvin being shot by his dad whilst sequestered in a small bedroom off his head on coke. And Tammi Terrell's 'suspicious' death. And Otis' death in a plane crash. Phew. The percentage of tragedies for Soul Singers is long and deep and extends all the way from Frankie Lymon to Tupac Shakur. Tragic. Ian D

OK, I know records were designed to be played and that's exactly what I've done over the last 40 odd years. But it really makes no sense to play RARE records often on different decks with different styli. They'll get beat-up. I've probably said it hundreds of times before, but it's just crazy to play rare records on anything other then preferably one really well-calibrated set of decks which are maintained regularly. These records are rare artefacts in many cases - like rare paintings, so it makes no sense to scrawl all over 'em does it? Also, there is such ferocious concentration on record grading these days! People still expect to get mint records from 40 years ago LOL.....Well, those are becoming less and less now. So where will the future good condition copies come from? Vinyl is now almost redundant in most areas of the music business apart from specialist areas. It won't be long before it becomes economically unviable to continue manufacturing decks and certainly keep various styli in stock - I can no longer replace the stylus on my state-of-the-art deck at home for instance. They just don't make 'em anymore..... I recently tried to glimpse into the future to see where all this was leading and I've attached an article I wrote for Manifesto called "Northern Soul In The Digital Age". Manifesto___Northern_Soul_In_The_Digital_Age.doc Whilst it's full of the usual hyperbolic writing I'm known for, I think it speaks a lot of unplatable truth for many of us, so I guess it's worth reading. I now carry the biggest music collection I've ever had in my life. It's a combination of several thousand vinyl, several thousand CD's and several thousand digital files. Because my collection is always in a mutating state, I'm also in the business of selling stuff, like most of us on here so I have to deal with the vinyl grading issue all the time and it's a pain in the ass! Some of the records I sell are 40 years old and have obviously been played on a number of decks over the years and are still perfectly good, yet people expect mint condition stuff more often than not. Well, that just ain't gonna happen in the future. The mint records are the ones which never get played and who wants to just LOOK at a record? Different decks are deadly. Believe me. Ian D

Patience IS a virtue after all Daz! Ian D

For sure Carl Davis is the least tragic of all the people I mentioned. A delightful fellow who was nothing less than a pleasure to deal with when I had to licence something from him. I think Carl was one of the lucky ones who was obviously forced to do some real estate work when the studio work dropped off for him in the mid 90's. THAT was the tragedy for me - the fact that such a consumate arrangement genius should be reduced to working in a real estate office. Mind you, far better that then going down the Steve Mancha route for sure, which probably accounts in part for his current predicament. Ian D

Whoops, sorry Dave, obviously some clarification required:- 1) Last time I spoke to Carl Davis in the early 90's he was out of the business and working in a real estate office which is a tragedy to my mind. 2) Darrell Banks' death was also a tragedy no matter how he was killed and no matter what the circumstances surely? 3) When Steve Mancha came over in the mid 80's he was an alcoholic who clearly had trouble functioning on a normal basis which I also consider to be a tragedy? All 3 are tragedies Dave, as per the subject of the thread. Different levels of tragedy for sure, but all tragedies in one form or another to my mind............... Ian D

Thanks Rob. It's also worth remembering that creative people are often not business people. Their minds usually work in completely different ways, quite understandably IMO - if you're a musician you generally want to focus on creating music or a performance rather than on the nitty-gritty of the business areas, which are usually best left to management. If you can trust them that is. I would say that at least 99% of the artists I've met or interviewed have been ripped-off in some form or other - usually in their earlier careers, as both Gloria Jones and Mary Wilson have pointed out on two seperate occasions in the last couple of months alone. Things really haven't changed a great deal since the Frankie Lymon days in some areas of the business - hopelessly bad contracts and/or fraudulent accounting are still the norm for many artists. Even worse now, is that records aren't selling anymore, so there's even less in the pot to rip-off! And I'd love to read that Tony Cumming's article again if anyone has it. One of the better ones over the years IMO... Ian D

Some food for thought there Rob. Funny you should mention J.J. Barnes as I had the pleasure of seeing him at Keighley Variety Club on a Sunday night in the early 70's. I believe it was his first UK tour off the back of his Northern Soul success and I seem to remember him almost breaking down in tears when the whole audience started singing the words of "Please Let Me In" - his first song of the show. I don't think he could believe that people even KNEW the song leave alone the amount of resonance the song had with a club full of people in Keighley on a rainy Sunday night LOL. It was one of the most emotional things I've ever witnessed. I also thought J.J. was genuinely shocked by the knowledge and reception to each of his songs throughout his whole performance. Plus, I was just one in a long queue after the show, waiting for my copy of "Our Love Is In The Pocket" to be autographed by the man himself. Can you imagine the gamut of emotions which must run through you when you experience something like that? To go from relative obscurity in your lifelong hometown to a compulsive audience of thousands in a foreign country? Tony Cummings wrote about this phenomenon very eloquently in his famous "The Strange World Of Northern Soul" article for Black Music magazine in the mid 70's using Eddie Foster as the example. Over the years I've seen many examples of highly talented people in many areas reduced to dealing with the realities of a life which doesn't necessarily reward talent or creativity as maybe it should. Carl Davis - possibly one of the greatest producer/arrangers of all time working in a real estate office? Bob Relf, Steve Mancha and numerous others drinking themselves to death. Darrell Banks shot on the street. The list is endless. To many of these people, the adulation we show them in the UK is often too late. We have a tendency to worship our heroes in a way that not many other scenes manage. But the reality of many of our hero's lifestyles is almost unimaginable to us. The Music Business is a marauding giant which sucks talent in and then splits it out when it's past it's sell-by date. Not much evidence of 'capitalism with a concience' in my experience that's for sure. So when these guys come over here and experience true adulation some 10,20 or 30 years later, it probably shows them what might have been if things had worked differently..... Plus there's a LOT of luck involved. Mary Wilson, who looks stunning and is a cultured, well-balanced lady of 64 was one of the lucky ones. James Fountain probably spent that $8 he received for "Seven Day Lover" the day he got it. Wonder where he is now? Ian D

Some more nice originals and other bits and pieces ending later today....... https://search.ebay.co.uk/_W0QQsassZrockthedancefloor Best, Ian D

I went on a Casino cruise ship in St Petersburgh, Florida in the early 90's and got seated opposite two elderly black ladies for the meal before they opened up the gambling tables. We got talking and they asked me what I did and I told 'em I was in the music business and one of the ladies mentioned that her nephew used to be in the music business in L.A. I asked her what her nephew's name was and she said, "Oh, you won't have heard of him because he's never had a hit record but he played a lot of sessions. His name's Jimmy Conwell". Naturally I went nuts and spewed out Jimmy's entire discography! Both women just couldn't believe what they were hearing. They eventually phoned Jimmy and told him of the conversation and he then got in touch with me when I got back to the UK and I put him onto a dealer and he re-pressed "Mellow Mellow Me" which was a popular two-stepper at the time. Small world. Ian D

Very well racked in the HMV Oxford Street Megastore yesterday and SELLING by the looks of it Sean! The Millie was racked across the top two rows along with a good range of Kent titles in the racking underneath. The sales guys seem to have done a bang-up job! Ian D

You know what - I saw a bunch of faces which all looked vaguely familiar or, at the very least, had the well-dressed 'knowledgeable veteran souly' look about them and I guess that was you lot outside. Yep, it was great and Mary was on superb form wasn't she? The lass still has a fine set of lungs and she looks just fantastic. I'm off to the Diana Ross outdoor show in July as well so I guess I'll see you lot there as well -https://www.easternbreeze.co.uk/newsite/DianaRoss/diana.htm I'd LOVE to see the Supremes belting out "You Keep Me Hanging On", "Love Is Like An Itching In My Heart" and even "The Happening" again. They really were the queens of Northern Soul weren't they? A great night! Got me all nostalgic for the 60's again LOL...... Ian D

Mary Wilson of the Supremes did a great interview last night at the Victoria & Albert Museum with Channel 4's (and Soul Source regular) Stuart Cosgrove expertly chairing the proceedings with some intelligent questions and knowledgeable anecdotes. Ms Wilson was in fine form with some great insights into the machinery of Motown and the evolvement of the Supremes before she climaxed the proceedings with a brilliant acappella song to a standing ovation! Also some great coverage generally including a pic in the Evening Standard and most of the freebie papers. A great job all round IMO. Many thanks to Jo Wallace for getting me down there (I owe you one Jo). Had a great night and good to see Stuart again with the ravishing Mrs Cosgrove. There must have been a bunch of Soul Sourcers down there last night, so who else was there? Ian D

Copy that. I have a 'stuck' payment which no one can seem to unlock. Weird shit going on........... Ian D

Oh how I miss the North. There's nowt like a knee-trembler with the local bike amongst the empty beer crates wi a bag o' chips to follow! Happy days...... Down here it's getting boring these days - it's all trios of supermodels, back to their Chelsea pads with Venezuelan dwarfs serving bowls of cocaine...... What I'd give for a local bike and a bag of chips these days........ Slightly off-thread I know, but I can remember one occasion where I had to sell a World Column so I had enough dosh to wine and dine a highly desireable female I was targetting at the time LOL... And yep it was worth it. Maybe not worth a Del-Larks or Four Perfections but definitely worth a World Column LOL.... Ian D