Sweeney

It seems a very childish thing to do - that's for certain. No-one likes to see their livelihood messed with, but unless the person is going to be named and shamed on this forum why bring it up here? It's effectively a private matter between two people who just happen to be members of this forum. Yes, it has entertainment value, but little more. I just found the original post a bit over the top. Northern Soul isn't 'sinking lower' as a result of one person's daft actions against another is it?

Bit dramatic - how is this an example of 'Northern Soul Sinking Lower'? How is the entity known as Northern Soul even involved? Why is a business transaction between two adults worthy of our attention? Complain to the relevant authorities on E-bay and let's get back to talking about Rare Soul.

On one of my auctions I stated my shipping policy as being worldwide. An American sent a message giving me grief asking why I won't ship to the US - am I anti-American etc. Told him politely not to bid if he was that stupid (but not in those exact words) Your bloke wasn't an American was he Pete?

Hmm... A difficult one. I've got the ABC version and think it's great. Having said that - If I didn't own either I'd buy the Boola Boola version. I think they got it right the first time and there's just a little bit less cohesion on the ABC version as a result of the increase in tempo, especially with the harmonies etc. It's a close run thing, however. Ten years ago I favoured the ABC version. I wouldn't say no to a free copy of either!

I quite like this as an ender: The Charades - Never Set Me Free (MGM) charades.mp3

I can vouch for this. Bought a copy of Lena Zavaroni's 'Ma, He's Making Eyes at Me' as a less than serious birthday present for a friend who collects Stax. I thought he was going to faint when he opened the package. His face was an absolute picture!

I've always thought the best Detroit 60s dancer bar none to be "Uptight" by Stevie Wonder - if this was an unreleased Motown acetate, or one of 3 known copies on La Beat or some other minor label, we'd all be going mental for it. 2. Marvin Gaye's "Lonely Lover" or at a stretch his version of "Sunny" 3. Tammi Terrell's "Lone Lonely Town" All the so-called 'pop' hits weren't too shabby by any stretch of the imagination either!

I reckon Dolly Parton has as much or indeed more credibility than Anita Harris or Helen Shapiro or Lynne Randell or Judy Street or many more examples of stuff of that ilk that's been played down the years.

It's not an immediate sound, but the more you hear it the better it gets.

You're absolutely correct Winnie. Maybe it doesn't want to progress. Obviously my views are personal ones - I've always thought of the scene (or my view of the scene) as being largely-speaking progressive. I obviously accept if others don't share that view. It's a big enough church for us all to worship at. I guess all you can hope for at the end of the day is that in our dotage we can all go somewhere to listen to Rare Soul and have a pint and talk cobblers.

IMHO this is probably the single fundamental problem with the Rare /Northern Soul Scene as it stands. It's too bound up with misguided notions of tradition and etiquette and other negative connotations which get in the way of the music. Why should so called younger DJs have to serve an "apprenticeship"? When I was loosely involved with promoting a night it was usually the younger DJs that provided the thought-provoking and interesting sets. Maybe the reason they did that was because they weren't weighed down by the tedious baggage of where a record was played first and by whom or if talcum powder was used or whether or not drinks were spilt on the dancefloor. The entity known as the Rare/Northern Soul Scene is an organic living thing and can't be controlled whether we like it or not. We can't influence where it goes or what shape it takes and topics like this one invariably end up with talk of respect for tradition and ensuring that "young people" coming onto the scene pay proper homage to what's gone before. Why should they? Are we in danger of becoming Teds? True progress in any endeavour only comes as a result of individuals who are willing to stand up and challenge the prevailing orthodoxy, be they young or otherwise. Are young DJs important? Yes - but only if they're willing to take risks and move the scene forward.

I've always loved this. Top notch soul. Every home should have one.

This has been discussed before. The price is unlikely to come down in the same way as digital cameras have as it's very much a 'niche' product. Digital cameras were always going to supercede normal film-based cameras in the same way that CDs and MP3s have superceded vinyl. As a result the uptake has meant significant price reductions. This product will have a limited market. Laser Turntable

Hmm... That sounds very "Rare".

On the one hand you describe the Four Vandals as a "Hustle" and of "plots being hatched" and "one big joke that fooled you all" and now you try to recant and claim that no wrongdoing was intended and that others on the scene are to blame for the whole sorry mess. This is even after you've provided evidence of how the record was given a half-baked cover story to purposely mislead people into believing it was an authentic piece. If, as you claim it was intended as a harmless prank to show up the folly of the Northern/Rare Soul scene, then it didn't work. If it was intended as something a lot more sinister, then it hasn't really worked either. Granted, the idiots who allegedly paid big money for it should have been more clued up as it's not even a convincing hoax, but who is the real loser here?

A worthy candidate for Post of the Month!

"Drifting" from Charles Earland's The Great Pyramid LP is pretty damn good as is "River Luvrite" by Oneness of Ju Ju from the Space Jungle Luv LP.

Hi Geoff - the night was called George Jackson! and the version of For Your Precious Love we played is from an LP called "Bring It On" released in 1983 on Churchill/Augusta Records. Worth getting if you see it cheaply (I don't think it would cost more than about a tenner).

Trevski - I didn't claim that NW was mainstream soul, I merely said that the 'Rare Soul' genre could be/is defined as being non-mainstream soul. Is it a bad thing to make records that sound like 60s/Northern Soul? No, of course not. People can express themselves however they like in a musical context. It's what others do with those records that can sometimes be problematic. I completely accept that the group didn't set out to make a Northern Soul soundalike to appeal to the Northern/Rare Soul scene, because that would be just too perverse and bizarre a scenario to contemplate. I personally wouldn't like to hear it at a Soul do, but it's only three or so minutes out of my life, so it's no big deal and what makes this scene of ours so great is the sheer diversity on offer. Yes, I agree that we shall have to differ with regard to this record. It would be boring if we all liked the same things.

On a RARE SOUL forum, it sort of does come into it. As I've said to Pete my use of Rare Soul was in the context it's generally used ie. non-mainstream soul music and NOT pertaining to scarcity. I don't care what a record costs, or how easy it is to get, my overriding concern is the Soul content. I do agree with you that there are plenty of unknown, semi-known or even well-known records that don't get enough exposure on the scene and that's my point, really - until those avenues are fully explored should we be playing Soundalikes in the place of decent Soul records? I also agree that there's too much emphasis on a record's rarity or cost, but that's always been an issue on the scene and it's never really going to change, unfortunately. I accept that you and others are great advocates of this group, and I will probably buy the CD at some point, as it's very nice but it just ain't a soul record IMHO. Sorry.

Pete - I used the term 'rare soul' in the context it's used on this forum i.e. non-mainstream soul records and not the 'two known copies' type of rare you're referring to. I've never subscribed to the view of rarity equalling quality. Yes it is a good pop record, it has the required beat etc. but then so do any number of records made since the sixties. It doesn't make them soul records, however. Does that mean the 80's Phil Collins tunes that use the Motown-style beat are acceptable for soul venues? I'd like to think not. Surely what we celebrate in Soul music rare or otherwise is the passion and originality on display? I just don't see how this particular product fits. Others have different views I guess.

It's been discussed before and the general concensus seems to be that while it's a nice enough pastiche, it really doesn't have much to do with rare soul. A pleasant set of pop tunes.

All Dave Godin is guilty of is exposing truly beautiful music to those who otherwise may never have found it. He was correct at the time to call it what he did, but unfortunately it became a byword for all that we with hindsight now find embarrassing when the scene was exposed to the general public - as keithw mentioned things like "Footsee", daft trousers etc. Not the fault of Dave Godin, I hasten to add. The entity that Dave Godin christened "Northern Soul" is a very different beast to the global rare soul scene that exists today. I personally think "Rare Soul" is a better general term - not as romantic as "Northern Soul" and all the positive images it conjurs up for me, but more accurate. Maybe it shouldn't have a name at all? To suggest is to create, to describe is to destroy, as they say.

Pete Smith will have kittens when he hears this!

Don't get me wrong - there are many DJs who's main concern is giving the punter what they want. They may have records that are expensive (then again so do many collectors on this forum) but it's not the overriding criteria they use in putting together a thoughtful set. My issue is with those who confuse quality with rarity/value at the expense of entertaining the customer..