Barry

Sorry Ivor, I can see that I can be vague with my posts - I've that much arrogance in me, I occassionally can't see past it. Of course 'House Music is Disco's Revenge' (that statement, although a fantastic media spin-line, is flawed in itself, if only in the respect that there is little, if any, difference in arrangement and vocal content) House is Disco (?? What does this board deem Disco? - there's another thread ). Disco was always House - it just happens that the term 'House' - as it is called these days, (the Kick and Hi hat sequenced production ) - pigeon hole wasn't around back then to coin. There has never been a gap in US vocal based productions, there has always been the the same integrity, that four to the floor beat and the same reasons behind people feeling the need to catalogue their feelings in a studio - getting it down. Nice soundbite - but I see no difference between the two termed forms. Mainly as I have continually bought (and for me, understood) danceable black music and how it needs to progress...much the same as anything. I respect everyones view on here, that is if it is given without prejudice...I'll not counter anyones post as long as it is a positive one. Harmony is easy....don't hide your insecurities under a negative response.

If I'd have been a Cub mate, the first badge I'd have earned (fr you anyhow) would have been my arrogance badge. If you skip through my posts, I generally give a view, an honest arse-free one, based only upon my good times dancing and attending Northern nights...and on the back of that I occasionally get taken to task by people like yourself....as I am a nobody in real NS terms. If Keb/Brian Rae/Ady or whoever came on here rattling on (as I do) about what formed their views, I know you wouldn't have a go, you'd accept them. It'd be nice if you would respect my miniscule input (and my involvement was anything but, I put in). I can talk, at length, about every Nighter that ran from '79 to '90 - it just happens, I was a kid when Wigan thrilled me, and I occassionally like to share that....but if you want5 I'll apologise to you for that and look after your view of the way this thread has run!?:? Please have a little perspective, I know I'm an easy target for the type of sniping poster like yourself - but I have as much right to post on here as you ever will. As the COD's said - 'I'm A Good Guy'. You just need to read between my lines.

Late nights and soul music....the great social leveller.

That was the track that I was enquiring about as it happens when he got the right hump, he was a bit up himself, or so I thought in my youthful illegal state.

Another great list lads and another couple of bob spent on summat I should have bought when I was a kid. They all fill the gaps though ay? Thanks.

As ever, in that fantastic air-tight NS world he inhabits. PM me fella, and I'll give you his number...it's obvious by post your he won't mind.

Very little, I suppose, to do with Northern but an awful lot to do with Black America (I hope the Mods allow this post) but check this beautiful anonymous bedroom production out. Just stunning.

Mate! In one. I wouldn't have bothered posting all my over elaborate red wine based postins on here if I'd have read that first.

On the flip though Bearsy, you've hit the nail on the head there mate....it's the house music that you, or whoever knows, that is the only way a subjective view is formed. You really cannot give a biased view of anything unless you know what you're talking about. A lot of posts that follow a 'Soulful House' thread are based upon a limited knowledge, I've not really got a problem with that at all, we all have a learning curve to sit on, I'm a realist (my knowledge is limited compared to others on here, I worked for it though)....but Christ! there's so much 'Soulful House' released worlwide weekly, it's unreal. Look back a the history of the scene, how many die hard 60'a lovers (cue the flood ), haven't grown to accept certain 70's productions? I know there will be a significant portion, yes, but, my age old argument is that to truly understand black music, you must see that there - year after year - is very little difference in production techniques. get over the 'Boom - Tit', kick and hi hat production of 'Soulful House' and there's nothing more than a black man or woman singing. I served Sam with 'House' for years and he would turn tracks down over certain production elements, no matter how worthy (I thought) or 'soulful, vocally, a track was. But that's how people are - fair do's, each to their own. On the back of that though, the story your alotted oracle (the person you face on the dancefloor at any given time) tells you, is just - and only - that. His story...nobody elses. If you can't think outside the box, at least stick your head over the edge...it'll pay dividends.

Was he Steve!?

You don't know me do you!? I've known Alex and Dave since me bird was a baby. ...I am the Chalet King.

I agree with you Steve but I also do to a degree understand the view of how the productions may have dated for some somewhat. I still love 'em anyhow.

Nice one for the reply lads but it's a Fraternity copy I'm after.

Bearsy - I'm here. Tony (Rounce) - I used VSR simply as it is a track that I thought the majority of this board could relate to as in it is a four to the floor, percussive and exciting production - a la House - if you think that there aren't any Soulful House records that haven't pissed old Vicki into a cocked hat, then you need to take a little more interest mate.) I am also sick to death of the old DJ Genesis, Michael Procotor posts. The reasons these records get so much unwarranted stick on this board is due to the unimaginatave, lack lustre, interest that Northern dj's give over to seeking out newly released Black American productions (Not 'Soulful House/House or 'whatever' term you may think be derisory as people read your posts - in reality they are - Black Danceable Music - Northern). A Northern Soul DJ (Sam or whoveer) is just that - a person who gives their time, majoritively, over to Northern...not new releases...and they should be taken with a pinch of salt. I'll give you a tip re 'Soulful House' - stop looking Stateside and start looking to Europe....many of the old Bradford Modern Room stuff that is still remebered, where just that. I could play you stuff that would make you weep on a dancefloor. I mean it. What you get told is right on the dancefloor by 'significant others', isn't always that.

Anyone want to trade an original 'Jewel' and a oner for an Ike Strong?

OFFER! - £80??

It sounds right Malc, stage to the left as you looked at it? Maybe? And I'm sure Rushbrooke was on, so for the first time in my life I am being positioned somewhere in the UK by someone else.

Frankie Knuckles over quote: But it ain't, is it really....in truth 'House Music' is the Chicago based/Euro involved fusion of styles....all the vocal NY stuff that we (Our scene) deem acceptable (Why? as it's formula that hasn't changed since we were babbies) is simply a quantised, sequenced continution of the stuff we grew up with and are familiar with. Fair do's - the studio orchestra is out the door but what do we still have - melody, brass, keyboards, hi hats and sweet black vocals....just Disco. Todays nighter played House Music is no different to Vicki Sue Robinson. Word!!

On Fraternity required - I shouldn't put this as I hate it when others do - but I had to sell mine and desperately want one back.

Tiffs rings a bell, maybe Malc....Christ! I can't believe I can't remember the venue.

Thanks for the response Malc. All I'm trying to say - that is in my limited view of the NS scene over the last ten years (I've never stopped buying btw), and I know it stands in a different corner these days, due to many factors, is that when I have turned out on occassion, it seems a little over dependant on tracks that are dependant on your years....and not smack in the face dancers....of course I understand that the body of the scene is getting on a bit...but I can't, in my humble opinion that is see this scene dragging in the much vaunted new blood. I like so may others grew up on The Invitations, The Vibrations, Williams & Watson etc but tracks in the vein of Creative Source, King Tutt, Brainstorm, The Nite-Liters, Willi J & Co da di da cut the mustard to me as a 16 year old. Are DJ's sets open to this kind of dancefloor 'fire' these days?

Does stuff such as Theryl, S'Janay, Bobby Jonz, Clausel, Frank Washington, Demetrius etc, you know, that 12" indie period ever get played out these days?

As if echoing my question, my CD has just decided to play an old Brian Rae Wigan play - Herbie Mann's - 'Waterbed'. May not be seen as Northern in certain quarters but certainly an All-Nighter play that swung me.

I'm asking a question here that can only be answered by the older lot I think - but - are there any nighters that play Northern, be that oldies or newies/modern, in a way that you could see kids wanting to be a part? We all know quality Soul, yes - but I think what I'm trying to say is that when we were lads and lasses, it was the uptempo, urgent sounds that appealed. There are obviously ways that a set can encompass certain records and still leave the listener on edge. We've all been there. Are there any nighters offering this today? It has to be exciting to entice youth surely? Long in the tooth searing soul understanding and a lifetime of pain follows the sweat based dancefloor excertions that youth allows you? Are the more energy sapping , danceable Modern 70's/80's Northern releases the key to the longevity of the scene? Please don't go on the age old 60's defensive thing, the Willie Mitchells, Roscoe & Friends and a myriad of others will argue that for you...but are tracks like the aforementioned used correctly anymore? Northern appear to have at last understood quality, whatever the tempo, does the scene have the bollocks to understand that its music seems to be glazing over in a haze of quality hip-acceptable swayers?

Karl, thanks, you're a Diamond.