Robbk

The basic beats of "My Sugar Baby" and "Do I Love You" are remotely similar (one of 3 or 4 Frank Wilson's "fast song styles", to which he has returned many times. But "Do I Love You" has different instruments featured at different times, with different melodies, and it also has a LOT more changes and breaks, while "My Sugar Baby" rarely deviates from its basic beat (bass line). So, I would say that these two songs are far from being identical.

That's not even the case of Wally Roker and Big Dee Ervin using the same background track for two different productions. They are the exact same song. It's just a song title change (or Alternative title).

Weird that Tommy Cogbill would copy an Ollie McGlaughlin backing track. I wonder if Milton Wright (R. Rights III) is the connection? The Masqueraders, originally from Texas, did work out of Detroit with LaBeat Records for 3 years. They should have met Ollie during that period.

I remember a rumour in the 70s and 80s, that Sidney Barnes sang on The Fellows' record, and was George Clinton's assistant producer in the recording session. If that's really true, maybe that's why the group listed on the record couldn't be "The Parliaments". Maybe it was some or all of The Parliaments, plus Sidney? But, I think we had someone already ask Sidney that question some years ago.

We had this one slated for one of the later LPs in our "From The Vaults' series (#4, if I remember correctly).

I have never seen nor heard of any recording (tape, vinyl demo record, or acetate) that Sherry Payne made for Solid Hitbound Productions. Wouldn't that have been part of Don Davis' master tapes (which should have been in his son's hands when he died)?

Neither of those 2 is singing lead on this cut. But, I believe George is singing in the background.

That intro is from Miserlou (a Turkish song). But, it was based on a Gypsy tune, and those Gypsies, although originally from North India, moved through Iran, and eventually to Egypt, before they came to Europe. So, it well could be an Egyptian tune. Misr means Egypt in Arabic and the consonants "M-S-R" mean Egypt in ALL Semitic languages, both modern and archaic(Arabic, Hebrew, Aramaic, Sabean, Akkadian, Canaanite, Eblaite, Assyrian, Babylonian, etc.) It is interesting that the Pop version from the 1930s came from a Greek version of the 1890s Turkish song. And that version was the origin of The Cardinals' R&B version from 1954., and Dick Dale and The Deltones' Surf instrumental version from 1962.

Why would it be a "takeover", when Mike Gradney had started and owned BOTH labels. He started Spry first, and ran it in 1957-59. Then it became inactive. Then, he started Cenco in early 1961. He revived Spry in late 1961. Both ran concurrently, with some overlap in releases. The confusion in release record numbers seems to have started when both labels were running, and continued with Cenco after Spry was shut down the final time. Maybe it just became difficult for his tiny staff (probably himself and no more than 2 or 3 others, at most) to keep track of everything while running 2 different labels.

I've gone through literally millions of 45s in my many years of record scrounging. I can't really estimate the number I looked through in one day at John Anderson's, or Bob Hillyard's or Jane's House of Records, or Music Man Murray's, or Ray Avery's, or Bob May's, or Record Merchandising, or Wenzel's Music Town, or Art Turco's or any others of the large warehouses or distributors. And, I can't recall all the great records I found at each place. I do remember finding all 4 Moniques at John Andersons, and paying only 3 quid apiece for them (including the 2 valuable ones). I remember paying 50 cents for The Servicemen on Chartmaker. I found hundreds of high-value Soul and R&B and Blues records over the years on days I searched through many thousands of 45s. 30 years ago, I could have recounted what I found where and when. But now those are distant memories, seemingly from someone else's life.

Yes, it was only on an LP, at least in USA and Canada. I've never seen a "foreign" 45 or EP with it, but, I'm not an expert on non-US Motown releases.

“All Your Goodies Are Gone” was the only side of that 45 they played on the radio where I was (Chicago, L.A. San Francisco Bay Area). I got a nice bonus, and was very happy to find out that the flip was right up my alley, and MUCH, MUCH MUCH more to my taste than the "A" side.

As we've only seen the name, "Enigmatic Productions" on production of two old songs that were previously Co-owned by LeBaron Taylor and Don Davis, I assume that Enigmatic Productions stands for co-productions by Don Davis and LeBaron Taylor made AFTER Davis moved to Stax, and the latter had made his working arrangement deal with Al Bell, and are situations in which Davis is producing a recording which is using a background track still co-owned by both Taylor and Davis, according to their own deal made when Solid Hitbound Productions broke up in 1968 (e.g. Taylor didn't come to Memphis and sit in on the recording sessions of Joni Wilson, but his 1/2 owned old 1966 or 1967 recordings were used in new productions). Notice that Liz Bacone got production credit for "Flame, Flame, Flame". And I would guess that the flip of The Limitations' release would have been an "Enigmatic Production", ONLY if an old Solid Hitbound backing track was used on it.

That Joni Wilson track was CLEARLY recorded in Detroit, and was likely a George Clinton production. I don't know how or why Lebaron Taylor would have gotten his hands on a Ric Tic master tape. He WOULD, however, have had access to Revilot and Solid Hit tapes from Solid Hitbound Productions, which was co-owned by himself and Don Davis. The sound of the instrumental background of Joni Wilson's Volt cut written by George Clinton (ostensibly for Solid Hitbound Productions), is perfect for George Clinton's time with them. "Flame, Flame, Flame, on the other hand, sounds like it was recorded in Memphis at Stax's usual studio. Because Don Davis was working with Stax at that time, I assume that he had no problem with Taylor having his own Philadelphia artist use one of their previously-recorded Solid Hitbound tracks, as he, himself, would get money out of it if her record would become a hit. In fact, Taylor probably only got to place that record deal with Stax because Davis was working with them as a major producer and A&R man at that time.

Thanks. I think it has been well established that Louis Curry cannot possibly be Harry Gates. And there has been no connection found that there is any family relationship.

Ha! Ha! He's not the only one!!! Thanks Dave.

I have a hard time believing that Tony Micale was a member of The Fabulous Apollos. I'm sure I've seen photos of the group, at least on posters for live events (back in the day), and they were an all Black group. Tony was with Ed Wingate, as a member of The Reflections, and as solo artist, Tony Michaels, during most of the period The Fabulous Apollos operated. Besides, his voice is very distinct, and I don't remember hearing his voice in any of The fabulous Apollos' cuts. I think that that is a mistaking of Tony Daniels for Tony Michaels, IN FACT, using the link you posted, I got to Soulfulkindamusic, and Tony Daniels is printed there, rather than Tony Michaels.

Interesting to learn that Reggie Lamont was Tony Daniels!

Yes, Frank Brown owned and managed Valtone. I hadn't seen Val's name, but I assume (guess) that "Val" was his wife, named Valerie. I have read that Joe Matthews was a group member, and sometimes lead (I remember them having different leads on different songs).

I used to have long conversations with Kris on SDF. She hasn't showed up there for several years. None of Ralph and Russ Terrana, Dennis Coffey, Clay MacMurray, Spyder Turner, Jack Ashford, or any of the other people active in Detroit in the mid and late '60s, who posted on Soulful Detroit could answer that question when we first asked it back in 2001. The problem is that I'm not on ANY of the new media (Facebook, Instagram, and the like).

No, you aren't. I dislike it, intensely.

You are probably right. In any case, I can't place the singer's voice.

Sorry. I don't recognise that voice. He doesn't sound like any of the other male early teen singers I know. I don't remember anyone from Philadelphia that might be him.