Robbk

Last Train to Clarksville-Four Tops Good lovin'-Elgins A Favor For A Girl-Brenda Holloway Where To Go? -Stevie Wonder -Don't know this exact title as I don't know music past 1971 or so. Titles will NOT be direct word for word translation - only the gist (basic idea). I'm Not an Angel - Stevie Wonder

I now know for sure, thanks to Keith Hughes, that National Sound Corp. started up operations in 1989. Therefore, any demo records or acetates from them could NOT be an original, ordered by Motown personnel. So, such a record would need to be considered a bootleg.

Robert West was The Fabulous Playboys' manager. They were one of his groups, -just like The Falcons. He owned The Falcons' name. That's why he was able to just put the Playboys in as if nothing happened. The Playboys (AKA Fabulous Playboys) had recorded for his own Contour Records in 1958-59, before being recorded by Don Davis for DaCo Records in 1961. He had stayed their manager all through that time. I believe they had sung some backgrounds on some of his other artists' recordings in addition to making local club appearances during that time. But, as we stated above, when Lupine 124 was released in 1964, they were only singing in clubs and singing backgrounds, they hadn't had a release as the featured artists on LuPine to that point.

It can't be Archer, as it is not an Archer code.

Ha! Ha! I've got that album! I bought it when it was new. No WONDER I never play it!

Motown actually released The Four Tops version of "The Last Train To Clarksville on a single"??? Why did they even record THAT??? Next thing I'll hear is that they also recorded "Pushin' Too Hard" and "Inna Gadda Da Vida" (however it is spelt!).

I have my Palmers mastered at Bell Sound and Sheldon, and als o 3rd stamp insignia that I don't recognise, and pressed at 4 different plants, only Columbia Midwest and ARP that I can recognise, I assume the 3rd different plant is Rite, as the code looks compatible.

"Let Yourself Go" was recorded in The Snakepit. United Artists didn't start recording Marv in New York until mid 1963.

Does it sound like Marv Johnson on the acetate? It would be nice if it was someone else singing on a demo for Marv. Can you upload an MP3 of it?

I've had that record since it was out. It's Sonny Monroe and The 2nd Falcons group (Fabulous Playboys) on both sides. it's a different recording of "Lonely Nights" from Robert West's earlier recording sung by Gene Martin (which had The Primettes (Supremes) backing him) on Lupine 106, from late 1962. Lupine started in 1962. But 1024 was released in 1964.

What's the title? I can't read pop-ups.

Naturally, this is the first UK issue of a Motown record, as it was the first Motown record, issued one month before Wade Jones on RayBer.

Not too many people would call Jackie Wilson Brunswick releases "Motown records", nor would they refer to any of the Anna productions as "Motown". Marv Johnson's recordings leased to United Artists in 1959-1962 were written by Motown writers, produced and recorded by Motown producers in the same studios as concurrent Motown releases were being produced/recorded, using the same session players and back-up singers, and arranged by the same arrangers. While under his recording contract with UA, Marv Johnson was writing and producing Motown songs and records in Motown's offices. Jackie Wilson's songs were written by Berry Gordy, but in no way could be considered Motown productions. They were arranged by Brunswick contractors in New York, and arranged by New Yorkers, instruments played by New York session players. "Reet Petite" was recorded in 1957, long before Motown Records existed. But, even Jackie's 1959 and 1960 recordings, recorded after Motown was in operation, had only Berry Gordy's writing as a link. Cornell Blakely's Ace and Mercury-distributed Rich records releases are much more "Motown" than Jackie Wilson's Gordy-written releases, or even non-Barrett Strong Anna releases. Even The Spinners' "That's What Girls Are Made For", is a bit less a "Motown record" than Marv Johnson's '59-'62 releases, as although it was recorded in "The Snakepit", using Motown session players, it was produced by non-Motown staff, and written by non-Motown staff, and sung by non-Motown singers. Although Marv Johnson wasn't a contracted Motown singer while contracted to UA, he was a contracted Motown songwriter and producer, and was currently working for Motwn. None of Gwen Gordy, Harvey Fuqua nor any of The Spinners were working for Motown at that time, in any capacity, as far as I know.

I see that "Money" by Barrett Strong out in spring 1960, preceding The Miracles "Shop Around" by many months, was released on a later London American number 9088, to "Shop Around"'s 9276. Also, 4 Marv Johnson records (admittedly UA releases in USA - but Motown produced) were released before "Shop Around's 9276, starting with "You Got What It Takes" in Dec. '59 on 9013, and followed by "I Love The way You Love" on 9109, "Ain't Gonna Be That Way 9165, "Move Two Mountains" 9187 and "Happy Days" 9265.

Yes. Perhaps because he wasn't the normal lead of the group, was the reason this song wasn't released. The whole vocal delivery in this version is "sticky" and a little "jerky-(less fluid). And the instrumental is different, including the sax. It's less "punchy" and I like the vocal much less. To me, he other version is MUCH "tighter". This again proves that Northern Soul is mainly about the dance beat, and my taste is about a blended overall compsosition of the vocal and instrumental performances AND the songwriting melody and song structure (lyrics no effect whatsoever).

Yes. This is the version Rod taped from me.

The New York address tells me it's a product of New York's Jobete Music office, which means that it must have been recorded in 1963, and was probably sung by one of their artists as a demo. It DEFINITELY isn't Tamala Lewis or Norma Jenkins. The only other female artist that I can think of that they had singing demos was Carol Moore. I'll have to listen to Moore's recordings to see if her voice was the same. But, I don't think she had as full or as deep a voice as this singer. IF it is, indeed a male lead singer singing in falsetto, I can't imagine it being The Parliaments or Roy Handy or The Serenaders, or Timothy Wilson or Sidney Barnes. The only one I can think of who sang falsetto was Sammy Turner. But. this singer's voice sounds nothing like Sammy's.

Thomas, do you possess the actual acetate? If so, could you please upload a scan of its label? Even if it doesn't have the songwriters and recording date listed, just seeing the label might give a clue to what year it was recorded.

It's definitely a female lead. Probably a single artist. From its sound, I'd guess that it was recorded in 1961, or, possibly, early 1962. I have the idea in my mind, that I've seen on an official list, that the song was written in 1961. But, when I looked it up on "Don't Forget The Motor City", it showed year of song written, and recording dates both as "unidentified". I don't think any other years are possible. The singer sounds hauntingly, at times, like Mary Wells. But at other times, not at all like her. I'm pretty sure she is not Mary. I don't really think that the lead singer and background singers are a group. It must be an, as yet, unknown Motown artist. I can't think of another female artist they had at that time in 1961, who has that same voice.

Naturally! All Canadian Motown releases came out on Tamla, before Canadian Tamla-Motown started. Motown cuts that were being released on US Motown or Gordy were released on Canadian Tamla with an M code or G code preceding the Canadian catalogue number. Tamla received a T-code. If I remember correctly, there are several Canadian major labels and a few minor Canadian labels having a label discography on Flynny's "Soulful Kinda Music" website. Quality, Apex, Sparton, Regency and REO all had quite a few Soul records released on them, as did the Majors' Canadian affiliates. I've never heard of any compilation of Canadian Soul Music label discographies. That would be a nice thing to have. But, I believe it needs to be compiled by a few Canadians. I, myself, have no time to contribute to such an undertaking, and in any case, have traded off the greater portion of my Canadian Soul records, because of having good quality US issues of those same releases.

Didn't National Sound Corp. (of Detroit) start up operation in the mid to late 1970s? I seem to remember that Ron Murphy used them for his own -, later projects, but that any '60s Motown acetates and demo copies made there would have to have been made by non-Motown people (apparently at the behest of NS people). i don't believe Motown would have cut any there in the late 1970s for their "From The Vaults" project, or for their subsequent early '80s oldies LPs, or the Motown 25th Anniversary LP projects. I believe we discussed that last issue on our previous "Motown Acetates" thread, in which we posted label scans of acetates and recording studio demos. National wasn't listed on Soulful Detroit's list of 1960s recording studios and wasn't on their map. I don't remember seeing any 1960s Motown cuts on demos from that studio in The Motown vaults, nor any official Motown documents or any demo that had proof that it was an official Motown project to make that demo. further, I don't remember seeing any other Detroit Soul label during the 1960s having any demos made by national. The only demos of '60s Soul cuts I've seen made by National seem to be NS-related (e,g, made in the late 1970s or 1980s by Detroiters to sell to Brits, or made by Brits while they were visiting Detroit, to get previously unreleased cuts on plastic, to have "physical records" to be used by them as DJs on The Northern Scene in the UK, or to be sold to DJs for NS play.

Satintones! Joy of joys! A pre-1962 song!!! Maybe it's a long lost Equadors recording!!!! I'm eagerly looking forward to hearing it!

Don't Forget The Motor City lists the artists as "unknown". The songwriters are also unlisted, and so was the recording date. Jobete Music "proof of ownership" acetates usually listed the writers AND recording date. If we could see who the songwriters were, and if there was a recording date on it, AND listen to the recording(s), perhaps we could make an educated guess as to the group was, based on a combination of making an educated guess as to the producer (from the songwriters) and comparing the voices of the group to groups produced by those producers. Can we get someone to post an MP3 of that song? Can we get a label scan, as well?

Not sure if it had "Baby Have Mercy On Me" on the other side, or just "Suspicion" on one side. I DO remember seeing "Baby Have Mercy On Me" on a Jobete Music acetate, but don't remember if it was on a 2-sided or one-sided acetate.

The acetate with our "From The Vaults" selected version, was a normal 7 inch cream-coloured label, which was a normal Jobete Music acetate, with the title in red typed letters, "Jobete Music Co," in black typed letters, and no artist listed. I believe that that acetate was auctioned off in the 1989-90 auctions, and ended up in England, as well.