boba

sugar and spice were a very pop-oriented act, not a counterexample. marvin / tammi style act. edit: dumbness in my post removed

they were also cadet which was the pop/soul version of their label. i don't think chess were trying to position all artists as pop, probably the already more successful ones.

in my experience the blue non-starred is rarest. i don't know if it is most valuable or "desirable" though.

ok thanks so much. I assume you're also confirming that the second video (which is what is on the Goldmine LP) is the charms unlimited release? Thanks again.

I think Chess was positioning the Dells as a pop-oriented Soul group for a long time, which is why they were on Cadet. Even the Argo stuff ("goodbye mary-ann"). Their harmonies could compete with the 5th Dimension or Association and they did poppy soul cuts. The Terry Callier writing added a folksy edge. The long version of Stay in my Corner got AOR rock play.

Hi Gareth, thanks a lot. Are you saying the Soul inc on Emblem is not the recording in the first youtube video I posted? Thanks a lot.

ok now i'm confused. there are 3 recordings in question: 1) soul inc. on emblem 2) charms unlimited on emblem 3) soul inc. off of that Live LP is the soul inc on emblem the same recording that's on the live LP? And the Charms Unlimited is what was actually used on the Goldmine Soul Supply comp and is the second youtube clip? And there is nothing "Boo" related, right? And the Charms Unlimited is a different group probably?

the record you sent me is much more soul than the other two sides. the a-side is some psychedelic pop vaguely soul thing. this also has that psychedelic thing in it but is more squarely soul.

there is harmony! it's not soul.

thanks so much for your help, started a new thread

So the soul inc. 45 on emblem is this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKrY4MjYUw4 from the thread about the goldmine soul supply LPs, on one of the LPs is a track crediting "Soul Incorporated" and says "a Boo recording" (which is not mentioned on the emblem 45 label in any way) and references a producer who is not mentioned on the emblem 45 label. Apparently, there is actually a *very* different version released on the Goldmine soul supply LP, which is this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzckRhmnesA does anyone know the source of the version that appears on the Goldmine soul supply LP? Was there some beach LP that had it? I can't imagine there was a 45 on a "Boo" label by Soul Incorporated that had this track, or if so, it must be ultra rare because I haven't seen a reference to it, picture of it, etc. in ~20 years of collecting. If there is a 45, would love to see a scan. Thanks in advance for help.

I think Roburt made reference to it above, but I just got the irony of the record being titles "center city".

interesting, is it the same song and clearly the same group? maybe I should start a new thread?

ok thanks, I'm familiar with "snap in adapters". thanks again.

The Hesitations were signed to Kapp, a pop label that attempted to create crossover hits. I don't think they "sold out" by signing to Kapp, they were probably super excited that their manager or a Kapp A&R person or however they got there got them there. I really don't see the comparison to James Carr or the Soul Brothers Six, especially in that they were Southern Soul acts that were more inherently "chitlin" and that they weren't signed to a big pop label.

Thanks Kevin, that was the most direct answer to the specific question about this 45. It was probably a solid center 45 and you're saying it was machine dinked. Wonder how it ended up in the US and if it was dinked overseas, at a store in the US, or at home in the US. I hit "marked solved" but I didn't want to kill the larger discussion so I unmarked it. Also, I'm familiar with the 3 pronged centers that are cut and are attached to the center hole so it looks like there's a triangle in the center. I also know that when these are removed it's visible where the 3 prongs were. I'm confused by the term "spider centers", is that referring to the cut-out centers or is referring to a fully dinked center filled with a snap in adapter?

Thanks a lot, i think that seals the deal on it not existing on "Boo" (aside from the fact that I've never seen it). Maybe someone bootlegged it on it with fake credits or something, maybe it was cover-up related, maybe it was just something they put on the LP -- not relevant to me at this point.

The story of why US 45s have large holes and LPs had small holes is pretty well documented, it comes down to the format wars (RCA vs. Columbia) and an attempt to force an incompatibility between two types of records. Instead of one winning, one type ended up being the format for singles and the other for long players. However the way these got filtered down to other countries probably makes the story even more complicated, as to what technologies / formats / musics were popular in those places (for example, India using 78s into the '70s). I still don't understand though -- do you think the single pictured in the ebay auction had a spider snap in adapter when it was manufactured that someone just took out? Because it definitely was manufactured in a small hole version, as I found on musicstack. Did someone manually "dink" it?

yeah, this is BS, right? The only label for this is Emblem? I'm asking because I'm trying to correct an entry in Soul Harmony Singles that has this single listed on "Boo". There is no reference to a "Boo recording" anywhere on the Emblem 45. Maybe it was someone's cover up related thing?

actually some people I know in Chicago talk about how great Zach and the other Constellations were, talking about how professional looking, acting, dressing they were, as if they were destined for greatness, and how they were whenever they came back to the city. Artists looked up to people like Jackie Wilson as show business entertainers who truly "made it".

This is probably a pretty dumb question to some people here but being in the US I have no idea. I have seen solid center UK 45s and the ones with the triangle that you can pop out. I'm wondering about a record like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/FAT-LARRYS-BAND-Center-City-Nighttime-Boogie-WMOT-10951-45-rpm-R-B-DISCO-FUNK-/141053677801?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item20d77450e9 It's a UK press record. I looked on musicstack and there are solid center copies. Does that mean that all copies had solid centers? This copy doesn't look like it had the triangle thing popped out. Does this mean that someone manually dinked it with a machine or something? Or was this pressed in the UK with the larger center hole? The copy pictured does look like the center is worn / bulging out. Also wondering about the general history of centers in UK presses and why they didn't have the larger centers in the first place. Thanks in advance for any insight.

I'm pretty good at making cracks flush and stabilizing them so they won't move. There are also different types of cracks -- from tiny cracks in the run in groove to widely separated records that are cracked all the way through.

Most collectors think that artists wanted to stay chitlin circuit singing raw soul to an R&B audience. Artists wanted to cross over and actually be commercially successful. The Temptations and Supremes were acts whom artists looked up to. I don't want to hear those songs but I understand that when an artist signed to a major label their goal wasn't to make music I like.

I got this turd in the mail today. This is not a soul 45. A-side is some psychedelic pop crap, I think I hear three voices singing harmony with a girl chorus, maybe slightly soulish but not soul. B-side is a little more soulish but still pop, has two male singers, but not even Sam and Dave level harmony, i think they switch off maybe once or twice. There is a girl chorus in the background. The main dude singing also sounds white, but even if it was soul dudes, it's not a soul single. I want my $25 back...

thanks for the info wish i had the two halt 45s, great transitional