Dave Thorley

As this is early days, 5 or 10 records covered in detail, artist history, were they got the record from, cover name and story where applicable is a good starting point. Over the years that it ran, the mainroom alone had more than 15 dj's playing. So that could amount to 150+ records covered in detail plus others would get covered in other parts of the book, if you looked in detail at music styles like, crossover, un-relased Motown, beat ballads, 60's newies, modern, new release etc. But we are indanger of this becoming a book written by committee and written before it's written. But don't stop putting up comments as they are helpful in my thinking about the project.

Hi Barry Know exactly where your coming from, but the question was would I concider writing a book about Stafford and yes I would. As to one persons veiw point, in the hours since this thread started I have given this very issue some thought. If I was to take on the project, it would be important that it was well researched, just being there isn't enough. That it included many peoples veiws and memories and although it's focus maybe that club, it should be put it context of the time and other clubs before, then and later. My initial thoughts are that it would cover these main areas. The times (some social comment), the venue (event, history, roots), the DJ's (their stories, views), the records (top five's with detailed histories, record hunting stories, music styles played, artists stories), the people (key faces, fashion, stories related to the crowd). I think there is more than enough to make it interesting. Also the style of the writing would be important, it should be a book that anyone could pick up and without knowing the codes of the scene, still understand and find compelling. One subject books can be fascinating, as they allow you to go to a level of detail, that more general tomes cannot do. I love Farrari cars and have books on just one model, people write about single key battles in wars, so it can be done. You will always get those that will have the veiw, why just Stafford, as they didn't go or had a loyalty to another club. But surley that's the point of the book to tell it's story, then time ans sales will tell if has any value. Dave

As always Ken, you just have the ability to make me smile. Love you lots. OK, no promises, but will have a think and a chat with Micky about it. So Chalky, get rooting through all that stuff you've collected all these years, might be ringing you for some help Arnie, your names already there, if I do it. Tony, don't worry I've never been one to get to romantic about anything.

Interesting thought. But my memory is shot would need alot of help. As someone has said already there is a fair bit to write about and not just the records, people etc. But the times as well, Thatcher, the miners strike, the change in the drug culture, fashion , many that came were out of work at the time. I'll have a word with Micky Ritson, he might be interested in publishing it. Trouble is, that was just one club, that at the end of the day not that many attended compared to Wigan, Yate or The Mecca. Would there be enough people interested in reading about it ?

Over the years the links between the european soul scene and the artists in the U.S. have grown ever stronger, to a point where many of the collectors/dealers here can call artists in the U.S. friends. This has seen alot of the money paid for rare records going straight into the hands of the people that made the records. With the addition of re-licencing of tracks for CD's, this flow of funds has infact increased. Nothing is ever perfect, but in the main, I think this scene has a better set of values than most. In conversation with many artists in the U.S., they will tell you that they love the support that the european soul scene has shown them, at a time when most of the U.S. couldn't give a damn about them and the music that they have made. Last night I was inconversation with a well known Detroit producer/artists and several people in the U.K. The people here have growing concerns about his health and lack of mental stimulous, so collectivly are planning to send him money to start a project to bring some un-released tracks he has out. But in reality this is more about showing him that we care and creating a project to keep him active, if the tracks eventually come out then that will be a bonus. Yes the scene being dancefloor driven and supply and demand feed has driven up record values far beyond their material value, but this in a strange way has also benifited the artists in the U.S., fueling a demand that has lasted for more than 30 years and longer than any other music scene I can think of.

So how many of you bought 2/3 copies waiting for them to dry up

Has to be one of the all time Fcuk up's. But am confident that we have more luck next time

I'm sorry you couldn't make it. We put this on at a low door tax with 2 rooms and a bunch dj's so peeps could have a get together. Was the only date we could find before Xmas, that clashed with the leased venues within reasonable traveling. End result, it went well, but I have to say more often than not, you do get nervous before you open the doors nowdays. There is no answer to the crowded calender, you open your doors believing you have an event that will stand on it's own two feet. You promote to your best ability, provide great sound systems, choose a quality venue, then it is up to people to decide where they want to go. But you do need to have deep pockets, so you can cover losses if you get them. I understand that, and never complain if I do fork out, I'll never give up promoting cuz I Love Soul Music and love seeing happy faces.

Just Outside Of Memphis Dave Thorley Somewhere across the eastern side of the U.S. is an invisible line, which marks notionally what is called the deep south. In 1800's the point that slaves fleeing the south felt safe was the Ohio river, but today it's more flexible. Infact the deep south is more something of an attitude than a defined place. In many of the mid west cities you can meet people and without them saying so you can guess that life started for them somewhere else. It's that laid back, happy view of life; things will work out if you give them time and that time itself is it's own master, so why rush it. Two people that Malayka & I met last time we were over there; choose many years ago to make the journey, in different directions to find new oppertunities. Producer Manny Campbell, who travelled south and Wilson Meadows opting for the north. Manny Campbell-The Musically JourneymanManny and I have known each other for a while, but this was the first time I had time to sit down with him and discuss his creative past. In the UK his production work with artists such as The Nu-Rons, Rotations, Lazzistics, Tearra and Ebony Evans to name only a few, is well known. But his journey started back in the 60's; firstly working for a newspaper in the Philadelphia suberbs. Not long after starting at the paper he got called up and joined the army (he was stationed in Bamberg, Germany). The time he had in the forces made him reconsider his path and on his return to Philly he started down the track of a musical career. At first Manny focused his skills on vibes, playing with east coast jazz organist John D Francis. But like many talented people in the cityhe also worked round the various studio's, like Sigma, Mercury and Soulville. His first attempt at production was in 1964 for Carol Porter on her track 'You are the reason that my heart beats'. Following this he got contracted to United Artists for 2 years. "But corporate life wasn't for me" Manny says with a big smile on his face. We are sitting in the office of Coastal Records in Atlanta. A hive of activity with recording and record promotion people spread over a number of offices. Manny sits behind his desk with tapes stacked high to one side, looking across the office to a wall with pictures and discs of his current bunch of proteges. "I spent too much time scouting for the label or auditioning groups and not enough time in the studio. The only work I really enjoyed away from the studio for them was working with Murray and Dorsey, the publishing and marketing arm." So when his contract was up he headed out on his own as an independant producer, working with Thom Bell, Norman Harris and Earl Young. By the late 60's he was building a reputation as a hit producer. "Yeah, about this time I was given The Rotations to work with. They had, had some local sucess with Frantic amd Mala records and were looking for their next hit. "So we started working with them on some sessions. We produced four tracks, 'Don't ever hurt me/I could be like columbus/ Whatcha gonna do', and 'We want freedom'. The first two came out on Lawton, but after contractual problems the second two were never released. I did release one of them many years later in partnership with Dave Halsall from the UK, but 'Whatcha gonna do' was never put out." He plays the two tracks to us, whilst these are playing Malayka wisphers "we've got to get these they're stunning" After some discussion we argree with Manny a deal that will lets us release them in the U.K. Not long after working with The Rotations he met up with a bunch of guys from New Jersey, called The Nu-Rons. Manny was in a club and heard the guys playing. "I thought I can do something with these guys" In 1973 he got them in the studio and recorded 'All of my life' and 'I'm a loser', along with two more tracks 'I can see the love' and 'You are my heaven' again the second two never saw the light of day. "The trouble was they were all married, had kids and couldn't commit the time, so things never really went anywhere, although we did put out two more disco tracks a couple of years later." By the mid 70's he had become disillusioned with Philly; "drugs had taken hold of the streets and you could see the start of the gang thing. I thought this wasn't a good place to bring up my kids." In 1977 Manny packed his bags and moved down to Atlanta and set up Coastal Records. He had no doubts about getting involved in the music industry again. This was the start of one of his most productive periods. As well as his own productions he worked with GRC and August Moon. "I worked on some pretty aweful records like Ripple, but they paid good money". Throughout the late 70's, 80's and 90's Coastal had a string of releases with Tearra, Lazzistics, Thea-Luise and Vari. "Vari did really well in Europe, while they were on tour one year we rented a house on the Isle Of Wight, that was fun". Athough everything was going well for him down in the south he didn't lose touch with his old buddies back in New Jersey and even went out on tour with The Sugarhill Gang through his booking agency. Not everything he worked on, went well though, "we had this great tune with Tony Troutman, it was getting plays everywhere, I thought I have a big hit on my hands. Next thing I know is I'm getting calls from distributors telling me that Tony has pressed the record on his own label and is trying to sell it behind my back. Sadly we had to go to court to sort that one out and of course no one really won." Coastal today is still a vibrant place and a sucessful record label. "You have to stay in touch with changing musical tastes and recording technics. The trouble with many older artists down here is that they still try to do business like it was in the old days and then they wonder why they don't have hits. Also the money is not in pure black music, but in tunes which cross over." Coastal demonstrates that, with their current artist roster which includes Hip Hop, Gospel, Jazz, Blues and R&B. The artist who captures currently everything about Manny's aproach to the business is Ebony Evans and her hot soulful CD 'Luv's fire'. "The buzz on this is great, it's selling well over here and in Europe, she's been doing radio interviews over there every few weeks, it's great." Manny is a real journeyman who left the north to find sucess in the south. But his real skill has been the ability to write and produce music that has - in my opinion a timeless quality, while he keeps himself abreast of an ever changing music industry. Wilson Meadows-Long way homeHometown for Wilson is Chattanooga, Tennessee. Born in 1944, he is one of five brothers, two of which, Wallace and Eugene, were to join him on his musical journey north in search of sucess. "We were inspired by The Impressions as we had grown up with Fred and the boys here in town." We have come to meet Wilson at his house in Chattanooga, when we knocked at the door a tall handsome, lean looking man opens the door, Wilson physic belies his 63 of age. With good old southern hospitality we are welcomed into his home and soon sat down and chatting about people from the business we have meet on our trip. He smiles when we mention some of them; "I haven't seen 'em in years. Do you know Brad Shapiro ?- we did some great stuff with him back in the 70's" I tell him that I've never met him, he kindly lets me have his phone number that I can contact him later. Again the conversation goes back to the early days in the business. Like so many young kids back then his idols were Sam Cooke, Jackie Wilson and groups like The Drifters and Isley Brothers. "We used to see Fred Cash and his group performing locally", back then they were called '4 Roosters and A Chick', in the early 60's they headed off to Chicago and changed their name to The Impressions. Not long after that my brothers and I headed north too and signed for King records in Cincinnati." Wilson's first group is well known to collectors of 60's soul, The Zircons. The line up included brothers Wallace and Eugene along with Emanual Thompson and Robert Eppinger. Wilson tells us that the name for the group came from the owner of King records who gave it to them when they arrived. It has caused some confusion over the years as it seems that the name had been used in the late 50's early 60's on several other groups recording for Winston, Dot and a number of other small labels. But the name was soon to become firmly theirs when their first release 'No twisting on sunday/Mama wants to drive' came out on the King subsidiary Federal; the group started to create a stir. After one more release for the label the group headed further north to New York. Here over the next five years they learned their craft the hard way, working one and two clubs a night, while trying to cut the odd disc here and there. Wilson muses how the industry was very much rooted in the streets, many guys in the business had other less legal activities. "We had a manager with connections all over town. One night he came into our dressing room when after we finished our show. He congratulated us on a good performance and he told us that he has got another booking for us that night on the other side of town. We told him we were all in, but he made it very clear that there was no option. He had promised that we would appear because he owed some guy and that we were not going to let him down." Whilst in New York the group cut three singles for the Heigh-Ho label, one of which has the much sought after soul dancers 'Go on and cry, cry/Was it meant to be this way'. In the early 70's they also cut one release with Capitol records 'Finders Keepers', but as success was little for the group they decided to head home again. "We had had a great time in the north. When we started out you needed to travel up there if you wanted sucess, but by the 70's lots was happening down south" On returning home the group changed their name to The Meadows Brothers and cut one release on Hip Spin, the very catchy uptempo dancer 'Get on down like soul folks do'. Soon after this they hooked up with Brad Shapiro and cut two singles and later a great album, which saw a lot of club plays in Europe in the 80's. Throughout this time the group toured, but by the end of the 80's they sort of burned out. In the 90's Wilson released his solo album 'Memories' on Bob Grady records. "I had been going into a studio owned by Mike Headrick to cut some demos. He liked what he heard and said lets cut some tracks. So we recorded three, which Mike gave Bob to listen to. Bob then played these to some guys in England and they just flipped. Thats how the album got done, it was at first a european release only and did real good over there." Wilson's wife Jeanette, a talented singer in her own right came in and did backing vocals on this album. We have been sitting around at Wilson's house for about three hours chewing the fat, when Jeanette comes home and joins us. She couldn't believe that in all that time we were sitting there Wilson hadn't offered us anything to drink, we explained to her that the conversation was so much fun that we just got lost in time. They both told us that they feel blessed with how things have turned out over the years. Wilson makes a point of telling us how important he feels the european fans were for him throughout his career. He also talked about his work and progress on the new cd, which by the time this article appears should be out, 'Go on and cry' on Shout Records. At that, it's time for us to make my goodbyes and as I often feel on these occassions, it's be a privilage to meet and talk to a real soul man. CD ReviewsWhilst on my travels, we came across a few new albums worth telling you about, first up is one that has been getting a fair bit of airplay over here.Butch Williams-Introducing Butch Williams-Stargazer RecordsButch was leadsinger of 70's Louisville soul group The Heartbreakers, which did the northern soul favourite 'I've got to face it' on Derby City. He is a passionate advocate of Louisville music and this album has been a labour of love, using many local musicians on each track. The album is a nice mixture of Soul, Blues and jazz styles. The track that has generated a great buzz is the Memphis styled mid tempo soul number 'Keep on lovin' me the way you do'. I say Memphis styled as it has great horns, that remind you of 70's Willie Mitchell productions supported by the southern style guitar of local man Michael Wells. I also love the Besonesq ballad 'Forever more' and the 60's jazzy style dancer 'Mary Ann', a tribute to the late local singer Mary Ann Fisher. The album is a must buy that nis now availble from www.cdbaby.com Also from Louisville comes the re-issue on cd of what has been one of the hardest boogie LPs to find on the planet. Snap, not the 80's dance group. But a soulful outfit that had just one release on a local Louisville label in 87. Re-issued by Louisville musician and impresario Ron 'Mr Wonderful' Lewis.S.N.A.P.-Snap-Dynamic Imperial RecordsThe album is a great mix of uptempo and midtempo boogie dancer, supported by a couple of cool ballads. Lead vocals are shared between Russell Carver and Paula Yarbrough. This will please lovers of soulful 80's boogie like SideEffect, Lakeside and G.Q. and is also availble on www.cdbaby.com Last but not least - a new release from Atlanta based Haywood Tucker. It is his first album in over 10 years. Haywood is well known for his outings on his own Heywood records and the 12"/.45 'I'm yours', that appeared on the short lived Budwiser talent search series of releases. Haywood has been working on this for over 15 years. "I just wanted to get it right" he told us Haywood-Fancy blue-Analog Records He delivers smooth sweet vocals over well produced instrumentation, led on many tracks by piano. He layers his vocals as lead and backing oh so well. This set delivers a well rounded collections of dancers and ballads that show that Atlanta soul is alive and well. Stand out track for me is possibly the first ever soul dance side about tennis!!!-'Let's play tennis', is a great midtempo dancefloor winner with a real feel good groove. It has been getting a fair bit of club and airplay of late. Put this album on your shopping list, again available on CD Baby.

Good job he's Austrian then, might get a bargin

OK Tony, got my tin hat on, sitting under the desk as I write this and have all the curtains closed. Just never got Otis, now Marvin maybe

Thanks Mate

Off topic but anyone got one of these for sale ? Gentlemen Four that is

Used to be a great place for record hunting in 70's/80's, but been told it's hard work now days. But Dave Moore on here is your man to ask

It's impossible to run a nite nowdays without there being something near. Hope you keep on with the event. Did put up a thing in events asking peeps to put up 2008 dates, so we all could try to avoid each other. Was suprised how few took the chance to post their dates for next year. It's still there if you want to join in

Hi Simon Also have a nice LP by him somewhere

Johnny Scott-Let me be a winner-Portra Came out twice, originally with long spoken intro, second issue which went straight into the beat. Anyone remeber the story behind this. Dave

I suspect, that as this thread moves along the greater number will be instrumentals. No vocals to make a judgement on, but they did have that beat.

Was it early '80 maybe? Prob 200 outside, obviously not enough to warrant the opening (and staffing) of the whole venue. Just M's open - nobody ever seems to mention this period. You asked the opening question about a poorly attended time at the Casino, which it was. You asked, when did Wigan die ?. People responded, with their view. On a open forum their will be some that will have a different view to yours, which surely is healthy. But reading the comments none has said it wasn't a great and important club, just that they viewed it differently to you. Whats wrong with that.

Country Roads-High Voltage The Whole Thing-8th Ave Band Along Comes Mary-Baja Marimba Band The World Is A Ghetto-George Benson Good Thing Going-Phil Coulter

They did about three releases on this label, all came out on 45 as well

But do you think anyone really bid on it, as bidder ID is hidden?

Oh Pete, I know exactly what Stafford was. Alot of tosh is written about the club, it was just the next phase in the northern soul story. But it did have, more like The Mecca a full line up of DJ's that went out of their way to play new tunes. But any good DJ would make sure the dancefloor worked and that meant playing some stuff that got that buzz going again. We were also lucky to have an audience that accepted a less than full floor so that new stuff could be played. If you read reviews of the club of the time many that came expecting another Wigan hated it. I was just lucky to have some great DJ's, with collective passion at the right time, in a great club.

We all have our favorite clubs, and for different reasons. I loved every nite that I went to Wigan. Even to poorly attended saturdays in the last 2 years. But I always felt then and now with hindsight that if you had taken Richard away from Wigan, then the amount of truely new tunes played there over the years would be less by half. Many of the others played a mixture of new, old/re-activated. Where as I can remember going to The Mecca, both when they were still played northern and later and only knowing 50% of what was played allnite. Wigan was a monster club, in every respect and should be held in high reguard, but also viewed with an air of reality. The introduction of the Friday Oldies allnighters, caused a casum in the scene similar to The Mecca's move to Jazz Funk/Disco and still affects us today. The club owners took, took and never put much back. The club facilities were shocking, flooded toilets, sticky carpet, ceiling coming down in places. But you still had to love it.

Was at Maxies one thursday night when Steve and Larry Grayliss used to do it and Larry found the clubs records. "Fcuk me Dave look a real Leon Haywood". Think the record left that night with Larry Welcome Richard