Frankie Crocker

Salvadors - mind blowing... James Bounty - astonishing... Not everything John auctions commands ridiculous prices though and for the second or third week running, some items have gone for less than book price or what the consigner might have hoped for. Pete is absolutely right in what he says as we're now seeing common items going for stupid money to lazy shoppers who plainly don't search the internet and have no regard for the current going rate of readily available records.

Useful to know. This is a confusing one. There are at least three variations, and although I have two of them, I still don't have the original release.

End of an era. Would go there in the 70's breaking the journey between London and Manchester. One of the better stores back in the day but surely must be mined out long ago?

Not seen the clip but question whether Northern Dancing can be done well in a TV studio? Can you enjoy a glass of Chardonnay in a public toilet? Should you laugh at stupid people making fools of themselves or take pity on them? Northern Soul was once an underground movement so shame on anyone for giving it unwarranted media coverage? Northern aficionados never courted publicity - it was the media writers and camera crews. Maybe it's time to tell the media to get lost and have nothing to do with them.

Hi Pete. I happen to like the Comedy Sale thread. I also think the Salvadors pressing issue is worthy of our consideration. It may come to pass that John has allowed erroneous details to be published in conjunction with an auction item. Hopefully further discussion will throw up the truth, or stimulating reading material in the meantime.

A lot of sense here Richard. The Salvadors were essentially a Chicago group it appears. They left St Louis. They somehow hooked up with Jo Armstead and her amazing song writing talent maybe in I967 or shortly after QED. They recorded an obscure track on the Nike label, presumably soon after arriving in Chicago: this Nike label format is different to other artists' releases. Stick By Me Baby appears to be the first release on the Wise World label unless there is a #300 out there? There is another Wise World label, the one the Classics recorded on, presumably a Chicago label but pressed in Detroit? So, speculating further, did the Salvadors take their great song back to St Louis for a Wise World re-press to avoid clashing with the Chicago label or did they just take a second batch of Chicago pressed 45's down to Missouri QED? I do not think there is any evidence of a St Louis pressing at present - all the signs are that the record was pressed twice in the same Chicago plant. Whatever the true story, it is a truly fantastic record and one that no amount of discussion will discredit. Anyone got Joshie Jo's side of the story?

Why is Elliot James Langridge wearing a green round-neck jumper over a shirt, when high-kicking at the Casino? At least he appears spaced out and has matching towelling wrist-bands to add to the authentic look

Ask Tony Smith #2, Prophonics on here. Shame if it has been booted recently as someone will be hoodwinked at some stage.

Andy, your sales box was ALWAYS worth a look. Agree with the bit on clowns spending big money to collect to DJ... Better to buy for the sound and if the records pile up, well so what...

Ownership gives opportunities to play whatever you want, whenever you want. Discover B sides. Make your own mix-tapes. Discover records you never knew you had. Buy records for a second time and then find the other one in the collection - then buy a third copy not knowing you actually had two already. A thousand records is pretty substantial so don't be hard on yourself. Think of how to spend your retirement - you will need a lot of records to pass the time so buy them now...

Hi Kev. Did you wear Wayfinders shoes as a kid? Should have as they had a compass in the heel. The north starts at Liverpool, Manchester, Sheffield and Hull. South of this is the Midlands, in two bits, West and East, once known as the Black Country because... All this tosh about miners going to Wigan Casino is down to Pete Waterman but BBC documentaries are trying to clarify matters by mixing soul history and the industrial diversification of Northern England during the Thatcher years.

So it hit the spot then. Nice work team.

Most definitely, I couldn't agree more with you but with Northern Soul at the pinnacle.

Wigan on a Saturday then in the shires the following Friday? Like yourself, I reckon Wigan DJ's doing the rounds would pick up on potential sounds. Many of the top jocks were into Soul Bowl, Soussan's specials and a few specialist record shops so collectively they were influencing each other and the venues they featured at.

Like you, I remain baffled by the pop-up venue promoted by Wigan connections. All the venues I went to such as Locarno, Ritz, Cleethorpes Pier and minor gaffs around Manchester and North Wales were heavily influenced by Wigan playlists and still managed to air new sounds such was the availability of recent imports. For sure, credit should be given to a host of regional venues but Wigan was THE national venue and it's contribution should not be underestimated.

Dave, like yourself, we were youngsters(17-22) just out for a good time. Certainly not elite in any way unless you viewed Allnighter goers in general as the mega-privileged and of course that's how it felt back in the day.

I reasoned the picture sleeves were for commercial purposes and the white demos just giveaway items but this evidence confirms Okeh used picture sleeves for both demonstration and issue copies.

Pete, the white demo probably never came with the picture sleeve - you could have kept the sleeve and married it up with an issue at a later date.

I wonder if it was the same one? Can't remember the date I sold it but the first guy I showed it to fetched his mate from the Record Bar and he snapped it up.

Hi Dave, the reference to the Union Bar implied we knew where we were going without debating the music policy of Wigan v Cleethorpes. Based in Manchester, you could do Blackpool, Wigan and The Ritz in a weekend so there was no incentive to head cross country to Cleethorpes. The Beachcomber, main floor and M's at Wigan were an unbeatable combination that Cleethorpes could only aspire to.

Kegsy, you'd have been pretty daft (or dead keen) to take in both Wigan and Cleethorpes in the same night. I guess some of the Leeds crew probably achieved it accidentally as they were never much good at reading maps.

Really surprised by the Williams and Watson. £150 in a picture sleeve would be the going rate but most would settle for the record alone. Someone evidently has more money than the rest of us and logically goes to the top man in the trade. After taxes and commission, John has to please customers, consigners and himself plus a large staff so I reckon today's auction prices are about right. I bought Too Late from Soul Bowl in 1976 and sold it at Wigan for the same price, £5.00...funny old game.

Not well up on the Winter Gardens story but had the impression punters would flit between the two. I was based in Manchester and North Wales 1974-1979 so going to Blackpool and Wigan was a no-brainer. I don't recall sitting in the Students' Union Bar debating whether to go to Cleethorpes as opposed to Wigan - it was logical to get the last train from Victoria to Wigan Wallgate AND the music was as good as it gets allowing for experimental attempts to introduce new sounds and blatant attempts to compete with the Mecca spins.

Without doubt, a scorching roster of DJ's but Cleethorpes came after Blackpool and Wigan, building upon the foundations and exposing new sounds as any good venue should do. The Pier never overtook Wigan. It complemented Wigan and forced the Casino to up it's game. Anyone who attended both Wigan and Cleethorpes Pier would have no doubts as to which was the superior venue back in the day and in a historical context.