Chalky

you do seem to talk out of your arse at times why don't you venture to some of the rare soul allnighters and listen to what is played before making ill informed postings on here. How do you know that no new records are being played if you don't attend the nighters, how do you know what is being played and what is? you have said yourself you don't attend rare soul all-nighters. As others have said can you tell us who these DJ's on the rare soul scene who are from the Mod scene/background are?

isn't this stating the bleeding obvious Nev Whenever a record is discovered, played for the first time on the scene every man and his dog goes looking for it.

at least one of the "3 known" was one of those on offer as far as I'm aware, I've only seen the recent other one on ebay and then this one??? so still only a few "known" so hardly another Clara Hardy is it, but at the end of the day you takes your chances, same with any rare record.

I've a Three Voices membership somewhere I think Sean. I've also flyers for Soul Town and Three Voices, Top Dog and Three Voices, or something along those lines.

To be honest I don't think anyone has tried to tell anyone where they should go and what they should listen to, people are free to go where ever they want and listen to what they want, don't recall anyone saying otherwise. The topic is about the problems and issues around the scene today and the main issue that seems to re occur is that there are too many venues which are having a detrimental effect on the overall scene. three venues in one area on the same night splitting what could be a decent crowd in one venue for instance. The analogy that choice is good might work down the high street when you want a new shirt but choice in this case when 9 times out of 10 (song in there somewhere) there is no real choice is bad for a shrinking and ageing scene. I think another thing that most agree on is promoters need to work together, will they though? What can be done, someone suggested some sort of alliance like the scooter scene has/had. Would that work on the soul scene, would promoters be prepared to put egos and self interest to one side for the greater good of the scene. Could a promoter stomach being told he could put a venue on in a certain area because one already being promoted? Could rival promoters get together and share the local scene, say one have a night one month, the other the following month so on and so on? I doubt it personally but its food for thought! Maybe memberships are once again required to keep out those who have no other interest other than a late pint or three, maybe a Soul Club of Great Britain, or any membership from another club gets you in as long as there is some sort of affiliation, just like working mens clubs used to have? Or are promoters more interested in the extra few quid rather than the well being of their regulars?

Looks interesting That Elliot chap reminds me of a younger Byrney

In your opinion just as my opinion Lifeline is the best all-nighter. And actually I went several times, not in the last two years but prior to that several times so get your facts right before shooting your mouth off. As for the music, I know what it was. The place wasn't for everyone, just like other nighters aren't to everyones taste. Why do some want to make this topic a "this night is better than that night" etc. Its about issues and problems on the scene, nothing else. If Top Dog or anyone else got owt to say to me about Burnley or Lifeline do it via PM.

well the bar has got knocked off so you'll have to find somewhere else in this sea of mediocrity, or is there no where left to go now

I agree with you Paul there. Think Butch the last few times I have heard him has been as good as I've heard him in a long time, his sets are pretty varied, probably not enough for some but he certainly not stuck to the 60's. Boomerang should be good, two one hour sets I think, the last time he was there he was superb.

But soul nights are part of the issue whether you like it or not. Boomerang for instance has Butch on doing a two hour stint (hardly 70's/crossover either), many travel to Boomerang and similar events who also book top dj's and it does have an effect on the attendance at allnighters. The same for weekenders.

I can think of one soul night that shuts a 1am and it has many travellers, from as far as Scotland and London, Boomerang at Canal Tavern, Thorne. Sean Hampseys Just Soul has it's share of Travellers too from what I hear. No doubt there are other examples too of people travelling to Soul Nights.

Thanks Joan, probably said that better than I could. Some need to remember that the nighter promoters they are knocking should be thanked for allowing them a room to play to a minority. The minority is not what the NS scene is about and like Joan said if it was what the majority wanted it would be in the main room. Also got to agree with you Joan about the style of music Paul is continually going on about, the majority don't want it at an all-nighter, you only have to watch the dance floor reaction at an all-nighter when an hour or so is forced on them, it doesn't go down well. Reet, work to do

But why don't we see these other 147 people enjoying Northern Soul at venues like SHS and travelling the country to taste other venues? We should be trying to encourage them to support the wider scene and not ignore them.

it is nothing to do with snobbery, elitism or anything similar it is all about the plethora of venues and the detrimental effect it is having on the scene. Whether you care ton admit it or not the scene is in decline and something needs doing soon to reverse this before it goes to far. So if you have no interest in reading what others opinions are on the state of the scene bugger off and read something else.

There are soulies into oldies, rarer stuff and modern so they can have a detrimental effect on the local scene if all on the same night. You say Xray wouldn't affect one of the other clubs but we all started at youth clubs and progressed, things are no different in this situation but if the venues clash then a choice has to be made.

There is a saturation of venues full stop, whether they are good or bad is irrelevant, how do you know if they are bad? Do you go to them? You say you have your ear to the ground, just what do these young DJ's play? Callum and Azza are good Dj's and deserve a chance but they don't play anything that is already on offer if everyone is totally honest about this. Also some of the venues mention are city centre venues playing to a totally different crowd who have little if any affinity to the Northern Soul All-nighter scene so how can you compare the two???? Dj's age shouldn't come into the debate, it is the quality of the DJ's set that is what matters. Should Keb not get any bookings on the funk scene cause of his age, should he step aside for a younger DJ who isn't in the same league as Keb? It wouldn't happen so why should the Northern Scene be any different? As nlong as the music is quality I couldn't give a monkey if the Dj is 20 or nearing retirement age. Experience is a mjor advantage and this comes with knowledge, the two go hand in hand.

Just where does Lifeline say it has a strict music policy? The DJ's a free to play what they want, they are encouraged to play anything other than the norm. Saturday night there was plenty of the funky stuff, records like Wally Coco you keep going on about. Mick played a fair bit of it, Sam was the same. If a Dj doesn't play something that isn't to yours or anyone elses taste then that is down to the DJ not the promoters. I also keep seeing Europe is the way forward, granted they don't have the baggage we have and at some venues there is a bigger scope of genres played, but by and large many are primarily oldies, records that are well known over here and have had plenty of turntable action. We are not like Europe we don't have the same audience which here by and large want to hear 60's dancers. The funky stuff isn't to everyones taste, I've no wish to hear endless amounts of it, it is boring after a while and repetitive, many are simply average records, dancers yes but average records. Rather than keep having a go at the scene on here and the promoters and DJ's, why not promote an all-nighter?

Different music policies don't wash with me. At the end of the day its all part of the same scene, just because one plays some at the rarer end and the other oldies is irrelevant IMHO.

Who goes where isn't the issue, after all it is ones own choice where to go and listen to soul music and whether or not we go all-night or to a soul night. The real issue that is having a serious detrimental effect on the scene is there is to much choice, too many events. We have already had one crazy example of three venues in close proximity to each other on the same night, sheer madness, there are probably several other instances around the country on any given weekend. I said it earlier, there are not enough soulies to go round, there are not enough youngsters getting into the scene. Many who do all-nighters no longer stay all-night which is understandable considering work, families etc. The bottom line is promoters have to start working together and putting the greater good of the scene first and not their own self interest. So what if someone doesn't dj, just go out and enjoy the music without the worries or hassle of promoting. So what if your half dozen mates aren't posting in lookbacks how good you are and that the sun shines out of your arse, it is about the music and a scene not any one individual. The scene is in decline and something needs to be done soon, no, now!! We need full venues, less of the local rivalries and politics, we need something that will attract youngsters onto this great dance scene. We also need tolerance, not every other comments in lookbacks saying that at some stage the music didn't do it for them, it probably did it for someone else. Most of all as said it needs cooperation between promoters!

The fighting, bickering and politics has always been there and always will be. What is splitting the crowd is not the politics but three venues in the same area on one particular night, not saying who is right or wrong, who should be promoting or who shouldn't, just the simple fact that there are three venues and not enough punters to go round.

Don't get me wrong, not having a go at you, just promoters in general, it is happening all over the country. Personally think it is crazy to have three promotions in the same area on the same night whatever the music policy. This is where promoters should be working together.

this is what puzzles me, if there are a couple of venues already being promoted in any particular area why put another on?

It is not the amount of nighters that cause the real problem, its the weekenders as well. There have been at least 3 weekenders the last few weeks, two more to come in the next two weeks and the best of the lot Cleethorpes just a few weeks away. Promoters don't work together and too many put self interest ahead of the bigger picture and very few put the greater good of the scene first. Others do nothing but slag off the scene cause they don't get their way. All this combined is slowly killing the scene. There are not enough punters to go round the plethora of venues that can be found on any given weekend, the amount of youngsters coming onto the scene is negligible and having no real impact, especially on the all-nighter scene. All this combined with the cost of actually getting to a venue which can amount to a three figure sum for a night out, family life, work, the actual age of the average soulie it is inevitable that something is going to suffer. More and more fail to stay until the end of the night at many venues. Everyone is suffering to some capacity and this is having a big effect on the scene in general and I fear it is too late to do anything about it and besides I don't think some want to do anything about, happy to exist in their own little scene.

Great list of records Brian, hearing those for the first time in a club like the Wheel must have been fantastic Can you still get the book?

Cheers pal, should have looked in refosoul!