Roburt

A few old pics ...

The Hull lads outside the Wheel ... 3rd from left is Graham Bolton (now living in Australia). He went off with a bloke to get some gear ahead of going into the club one night. They rolled him, took his money & beat him up. Not a good night for Graham.

Loads of US acts made appearances on BBC radio shows from 1962 thru to the start of Radio 1. Some I know that were live on BBC shows were Sugar Pie DeSanto, backed by Mike Cotton Sound (64 -- Top Gear, Saturday Club + on RSG on TV), Supremes, Ronettes, Dixie Cups -- all on Saturday Club in Oct 64. The BBC also recorded the 1964 US Blues Festival package at their Manchester show (again Oct 64). It was common practise for any US acts (pop, soul, blues) who came here for promotional purposes or to tour to be booked to appear on a BBC radio show back then (before Radio 1, lots of BBC radio consisted of recorded live performances).

Back in the 60's / early 70's, lots of soul stuff was considered to be for a 'specialist market' with limited appeal in some Euro countries. So countries, like the UK, that had major pressing capacity would manufacture extra copies which were specifically to service overseas markets. I seem to recall UK 45's being sent to countries such as Belgium & Holland for sale there. I would come across copies when over there -- I worked for British Rail at the time & we got free rail / ferry travel via Harwich to Rotterdam & Zeebrugge, so went a few times a year. I'd drop into record shops over there on each visit, to get copies of locally pressed stuff in pic sleeves.

THIS MAY NOT TRULY FIT INTO THIS THREAD BUT ... Stringfellow ran niters @ the King Mojo in 1966/67 but then it was proposed night clubs / discos that didn't sell alcohol would also need to be licensed by their local councils (early 67). It took time for the legislation to pass into law but the fact it was coming was plain to everyone in the biz. The Mojo was in a residential area & so teenagers turning up close to midnight & milled about upsetting the suspicious locals. Those small folk were out on the streets again early on the Sunday morning, milling about & walking down into the city centre. A few milk bottles disappeared off house doorsteps as some punters needed a drink (don't forget, we're talking about 1967 when the God Squad were still in command & you could do very little on a Sunday as everyone was still supposed to go to church). The police got involved & as pep pills were also an issue, the police took a dim view of allniters & the crowd who attended such events. So, it was evident to the Stringfellows that if they wanted the Mojo to be granted a license to continue under the new law, the niters would have to end. So on Sat 15th April (67) the Mojo held it's last niter session. BUT, Stringers still wanted to be able to book the big visiting US soul acts, so a new strategy had to be brought in. He'd have to pay full whack to book those acts for a normal Frid / Sat / Sun 8 till late session -- he was getting most acts for niter sessions at a reduced rate coz they'd already played & been paid for one gig earlier in the evening). So he needed to come up with a session which he could charge a bit extra admission for but still get his acts at a reduced rate. So he started up Sunday alldayers. Starting around midday & finishing around 11pm. By July he had introduced his new session & booked the likes of the Drifters (most probably the Invitations really) & Garnett Mimms to play live. The out-of-town punters returned to join the locals and the place was buzzing. All had a great time BUT when the session ended around 11pm the out-of-towners had no real way of getting home -- no town to town buses still running & very few night time passenger trains. So loads of those in attendance were stuck. ... FOR A NITER, you just walked into Sheffield town centre, went into the bus stn cafe & hung around an hour or so till the 1st buses / trains of the day could take you home. So no way to get home & a few let Pete S know this fact. So on that first night after the dayer session, a select bunch were locked in the club to sleep on chairs or the floor. They then headed home on the Monday morning. So what could have been a WORST EXPERIENCE for many old regulars was averted by the club's owners.

Never really had any nightmare niter experiences. The Mojo was in a quiet residential area of north Sheffield (one of the main reasons it was shut down by the council), & local rockers never bothered to go up there to harass the mods going to the club. The Nite Owl was in central Leicester but again no real horror stories from my time there. The club was a small cellar club though & (when a top act was on live) could get very full. Being in a cellar it had little alcoves in the walls formed between pillars that supported the higher floors. I can recall seeing a couple having sex in one of those alcoves, oblivious to all the dancers packed in around them. As the club got hot & sweaty when full, I sometimes used to ask the bouncers if I could go outside for a bit (to chat & cool down). They'd let me but obviously thought I was going outside for dubious reasons (to sell pills ?). On my return into the club one night, a bouncer obviously thought I was a dealer & took me aside to tell me he could get his hands on an illegal gun if I wanted to buy one for protection purposes !!! (i was about to celebrate my 18th birthday & was still 'wet behind the ears' so his offer scared me a bit). Lots of mates had horrific tales of being rolled near the Wheel when they'd gone off to buy stuff to help them make it through the night. There were obviously robber types around at those niter sessions but I never came into contact with any (lucky I guess). The worst thing that happened to me on trips to the Wheel were ... 1/ on a winter's night crossing the Pennines in a Hull lads car, we hit black ice & skidded across the road. This spooked the car owner / driver & he immediately decided to head home & we had to bail out & go wherever -- we never made it to the Wheel that night. 2/ arriving too late at the Wheel, you would be refused entry (would this have been after midnight & therefore technically we were trying the pay & enter on a Sunday ?). Anyway, we didn't fancy going home so went to another Manc niter (@ the Majestic). That club was disc only & had few people in , no atmosphere so a bum night all around. Later trips (80's / 90's) were made to venues such as Clifton Halls, a club in Huddersfield, Loughboro, Leicester (Odd Fellows ?), Bradford (Queens Hall), 100 club, Stafford (TotW) and more -- but again , no horror stories.

I listened to Boba's interview with the Traits / Centre stage. The guys from the group said that it was Despenza that originally gave them the name the Traits. The guys went off & did other things with another manager after their Contact 45's had gone cold ... one member (Kirk Davis) went out to LA & joined the Major IV. They got back together around 71 and Despenza re-signed them. He recut them on their old hit as Center Stage and put the new 45 out on Dispo. He then got them signed by RCA, but forged their signatures on the RCA contract & went off with their signing bonus cheque (they never did get to see any of that money). They had cut some other tracks under Donny Hathaway's supervision & RCA put those out (2 x 45's). The group then cut stuff directly for RCA but RCA management were a bit unnerved by the whole situation surrounding the group & never released any of their additional tracks. When asked about Despenza, they said he was corrupt but a genius. Boba & the guys also say that their 1st RCA 45 had also been put out by Despenza on Marc (it featured their cover version of "Are You There" but was mis-titled on the Marc 45 version).

I would have been as Wally Roker owned both Canyon & Soul Clock Records. Soul Clock was started by Ron Carson but soon taken over by Roker.

Just to ensure complete info on Rudy & his UK exploits are on this thread .... His BBC Radioplay Lp + a pic of him performing @ the 100 Club ... ALSO the song "Seems Like I Gotta Do Wrong" is a bit strange. Rudy cut it for Canyon but the versions of the song released at the time had it credited to Dee Ervin (Irwin) & Lynn Farr. It was a hit & other versions have been cut down the years. BUT STRANGELY it isn't a registered song with either BMI or ASCAP. I guess who penned it has always been disputed (& with Rudy Love having passed, I guess he will not be pushing his case anymore).

Prompted by a related current thread ... The best way to make money in the music biz in the long term has proved to be to get your name registered as the writer of a song. When a recording of that song was released / is reissued OR a different version is released, the only folk who can be sure they'll get their dues are the songs writers (unless you're a US writer & not registered with a UK publisher -- of honour). Lots of guys knew this from early on, thus all the songs credited to Deadric Malone. A guy who was ripped off in many different ways down the years was RUDY LOVE. He wrote songs for most of his career & recorded for labels, large & small. Until he started releasing his own stuff, he only ever got to enjoy 2 album releases in the Us (both on Calla -- 76 & 78). He also had 2 UK LP releases but neither of them included his Calla stuff. One of his UK releases was credited to Tyrone Davis and were in fact Rudy's cuts for Canyon Records. The 2nd here was released by the BBC and consisted of his tracks cut for Motown South in Muscle Shoals. To make matters even worse, most of the songs that appeared on the Manhattan LP credited to Tyrone Davis had been 'borrowed' by other writers to cut on other acts signed to the Roker / Canyon group of labels. Of course those other writers took the writers credits, so Rudy not only didn't get his 1970 album released but he didn't even get his rightful writers credits. It seems that the guys who ripped him off (who could have included Wally Roker / Dee Irwin / Barry Despenza) were the same bunch who licensed the Manhattan UK LP to President and presumably were rewarded for doing so. Just coz I can; I'm also posting up Rudy's 45 that was released right after Canyon went bust (on the Earthquake label which I seem to recall Rudy telling me had connections to Ray Charles) ... Dee Irwin also had a 45 out on the label.

The Traits Contact 45 dating of Nov 67 would seem to fit as it may have been that release that convinced ABC to sign Despenza to work for them in Dec 67. Boba interviewed the Traits / Center Stage on his SITTING IN THE PARK slot & that interview is still up on the net ... so they probably had lots to say about Despenza.

Steve G will give you the Wand rundown ... but till he answers ........ Barry Despenza ran his 2 labels in 1966/67. He then got a contract with ABC in Chicago, working with the likes of Wally Roker & others. In 1968 he signed Tyrone Davis to a deal with ABC and cut a number of tracks on him (incl "Can I Change My Mind" -- original version). He must have known his time at ABC was coming to an end as he then took Tyrone Davis to DAKAR, got him a deal there & recut "Can I Change My Mind". The Dakar version became a big hit in Dec 68. I guess Despenza was out in LA with Wally Roker & Monk Higgins in 68/69 as that's when Roker & Higgins were working together for Canyon Records (Roker's label). Soul Clock was another assoc label. They cut the likes of Irma Thomas for Canyon and had also signed Rudy Love to the label a while earlier (late 68?). Rudy had been convinced to sign with Canyon by the teaming of Roker / Higgins / Despenza who were (at the time) celebrating a big hit on Tyrone Davis -- which must have been around Xmas 1968. They convinced Rudy to sign with lots of BS about how they were a 'hit team' & would get him hits -- BUT REALLY they just wanted his songs to use on other of their acts. Roker & Higgins stayed in LA but I guess Despenza headed back to Chicago to mastermind Tyrone Davis's career. He soon re-signed the Traits, renaming them Center Stage, and cutting them for his Dispo label (Donny Hathaway working with him on their tracks). He then went on to get them a deal with RCA. So I'd say the Ivories on Despenza (& the Traits 45) were released ahead of him signing with ABC in Dec 67.

Back in time ...

Anyone know how you nominate a singer / group to get a plaque on the Camden MUSIC WALK OF FAME ?? Anyone been down there & seen any of the existing ones ?

Another sad loss. Went to see the Isley's in Vegas during our SOUL TRIP 98 ... they put on a really good show ..

When "Dance To The Music" came out here it was massive in UK soul clubs, right from the off on Columbia in March 68.

Lots of movies have also been made about soul stars .... Lots more have been proposed & abandoned though -- Otis Redding movie projects being started at least 3 times in the past, with one even getting as far as talking to Billy Ocean about him playing Otis. At present, a new movie is in the pipeline that will document the work of Earl Young & his mates in MFSB.

The trouble is that though Sly doesn't really regret being a drug addict, it had a bad effect on his music & his later career (as it did with most addicts). His creativity dropped off after 1974 & his unpredictability led to lots of missed / cancelled live shows. The Family Stone members got fed up with him & quit. He had to take guys on who could take up the slack & help him out a lot (Rudy Love & Keni Burke being two). He lost overseas gigs as he was caught with drugs at customs & even when old friends such as Bobby Womack added him as a support act, he still got caught with drugs & was refused entry into countries such as the UK. He lost many friends, all his support team & all his money, ending up living in an old van (it didn't help that his hits came in the period when record companies ripped off many acts). A sad tale really.

Lots of stage musicals are / have been around that celebrate soul music & the folk involved in it .... Dreamgirls, Ain't Too Proud To Beg, Motown; the Musical + others that focused on the careers of Doris Troy, Faye Treadwell, etc.

Some Cleveland related cuts on this album. Mainly via Lou Ragland (& his contacts), Numero has released lots of Cleveland soul tracks, lots being unreleased or rare items ahead of Numero's involvement. I like the Boddies 7" box set in particular that they put out a few years ago. Isn't one of 45's now going for a wad of cash ?

Lots of various music 'Hall of Fame' nominations for successful soul acts + of course the Hollywood Walk Of Fame stars ... Can anyone else post up similar items to the above ?

Not a singer or a musician, but a dancer; Cholly Atkins. After a distinguished career as a dancer, Cholly started to school acts appearing @ the NY Apollo with regard to their stage acts. From there, he was hired by Motown & became a member of their Detroit team. In the 70's, when the O'Jays wanted to become the 'next Temptations', they hired Cholly to tighten up their stage moves. He eventually settled in Vegas (still doing some dance tuition) but whenever Motown acts or the O'Jays played gigs in the city, he was always invited along to spend time with them backstage. I got to visit with him @ his home & his den there was full of mementoes -- His own awards & lots of backstage passes + many gold discs that had been gifted to him by the acts he'd helped. Below is a pic I took while with him (& Lou Ragland) in his den. It doesn't really display the scope of the treasures he had up on his den walls (which were all covered from floor to ceiling with such items). Unfortunately, after he passed , all were sold at auction to provide money for his wife (whole survived him). So his great collection of awards was broken up.

On here, unsung heroes of the soul world get 'paid their dues', mainly via our discussions on their old records. But lots are celebrated in other ways. UK guys (& some US, Spanish, etc.) have gone looking for unreleased gems & have recently made them available to purchase. Enterprising promoters have been bringing 'forgotten singers' to the UK to perform for many years now (BIG UPS to Ady C and his ilk). But not all who made the music we love have gone unrecognised. While Lots (both singers & musicians) went thru their careers without much recognition LUCKILY some got to enjoy loads of success & have the evidence to prove it ... An item in my possession ... of course Gladys got many more awards (both in the pop & soul worlds) ...

Mike Raven got into horror films after he left Radio 1 ... Later on he (& his family) moved to Cornwall, where he became a sheep farmer. His health made him give this up & so he turned to art (creating sculptures). He'd changed his name, which made him difficult to track down. Mike died in 1997, and was buried in a grave he had dug for himself on Bodmin Moor (which is where he was still living at the time).

Guess you mean this guy ... SEE PIC ... if so, he would have been about 6 years old when the 20th Century 45's were released ...