Geeselad

This is what I was really driving at with the 'when did it become about rarity?' Thread, there was shit loads of great cheap records played at all the great venues of the 70's, they don't get played now!

Playlists are the scourge of the scene, can't remember the last time I read one and it wasn't full of the same old, tired rarities. These lists sat nothing about the imagination of the DJs other than how much they've spent and how big there ego's are. The big problem with the upfront scene has become exactly the same, Willie Dale is the new John and the weirdest. 

5 hours ago, Twoshoes said:

I posted a link to Youtube some months ago about a guy digging for records in West Africa, albeit not soul but still very interesting. If you put in Record digging in West Africa it should come up.

German guy, ace documentary, next level digging. 

15 hours ago, Clee93 said:

Think this is a pretty cool little question...

Personally can't stand Judy Street - What (soz.) & I've been playing the flip of Nev Wherry's old spin from Cleethorpes & Sheffield KGB, Flamma Sherman - Where is he, for ages now. I don't even know if its really ever been played cos I'm too young to know. 

Properly off kilt for traditionalists I'd imagine but is a power dancer once it gets going that hardly anyone I've spoken to knows... Surely this must have been played at the Pier & the Winter Gardens??? I think its hardly known cos it has a 45 second intro and a long outro which might have put people off playing it out.

 

Great that

59 minutes ago, Solidsoul said:

I thought Soul Source was for people who actually liked Northern Soul records, not relish in pulling them down!

There are plenty of records I don't care for, but I don't come on and criticize them and spoil it for the people who do! 

It's half of the topic. I'd love to hear about all the records you don't like, go on a dare you! 

5 hours ago, Chalky said:

Jimmy Wensiora’s wall of sound, fabulous. 

Where was it used, chalky?

2 minutes ago, Jessie Pinkman said:

The new sound system at Keele University is the best one I've ever played on.

Although it did have a sound guy twiddling with the knobs of the console at the side of the stage.

It's unusual these days to find a big system that copes with vinyl so we'll. It is pretty impressive, probably the best I've heard at any current venue. 

21 hours ago, Eddiefoster said:

I wish I was qualified to comment on the Forgotten - I'm never sure if something I come across that catches my ears is a forgotten played out oldie, something the tape swappers shared, one that got a few spins somewhere but never quite made it or (now and again) a track that's largely unknown..........I would never class any record as rubbish, I've learned that it's all down to your own personal taste and that's what really matters!

However, as for Forgettable I'll be honest and most probably controversial by picking a monster tune I've never liked Lou Pride – I'm Com'un Home In The Morn'un (tin hat on LOL) even though I kinda get why it's an anthem it just doesn't do it for me! 

Interesting thread - every day a school day for me 

I wasn't around in the 70's but I find the bootleg factor indicates a tunes popularity. 

8 hours ago, Soul16 said:

Sound quality begins at the stylus tip of course, so everything after that, from turntable set up, mixing desk quality, good amplification & decent speakers all contribute to the end result. 

Rubbish in = Rubbish out

Quality in = Quality out

Room acoustics then need factoring in, which I guess can be difficult initially.

I recommend these

https://www.hanacartridges.com/products/hana-umami-red

2 hours ago, Soul16 said:

I can only really speak for the Keele all-nighters in the 80’s and 90’s.

Huge speakers hung up high on the wall, tilted down towards the dance floor. It was very loud and the sound quality was excellent, that was the first thing I noticed about the place. Bobby Valentin never sounded so good...

I still am something of a sound quality fanatic, which can be a curse at times.

 

I do remember a superior system at Keele 

Can't recall the quality of sound reproduction being discussed on here. Was it loud at Wigan? Good acoustics, decent system? How about the wheel, cats or torch? 

I know it's all relative to the era. but it's not something that folk talk about that much, unless it fails, every promotors nightmare, I can speak out of experience  

6 hours ago, Soulboy60 said:

I'll give you one,.. 'Tears - Lee Roye'. Controversial I know, I just find this tune weak and soulless. Burn it.

Can't agree with you there. I'd love a copy, but different tastes are crucial 

1 hour ago, Soulboy60 said:

Another couple I'd love to reactivate.

The Trip - Dave Mitchel and the Screamers, and 'So Is The Sun - World Column'.

Two banging 100mph dancers, though I'd probably slip a disc trying to dance to these now.

Played world column out to a good response, it's not that fast, I'm guessing around 115-120 bpm

On 23/08/2023 at 09:20, Ady Potts said:

Most likely Martyn. MB had sold it because it wasn't in his collection that I bought from him. I asked where it was, sadly I can't remember who he said he sold it to. That's how the information regarding the acetate came out, in that conversation.

 

I think Stef orlinski, of Biddulph had MB's copy, not sure who he sold it on to. 

9 hours ago, Modularman said:

I'd be more concerned about that Billy Arnell Tough Girl 45 selling for 2k, a truly awful record. Might be one for your rarity/obscurity thread. Sounds like a vanity club record to my ears tbh #vicreeves

I can't justify it but always had a weakness for BA. GJC, just played it again, and from those first horns, I think, muck fe! Two and a half minutes of this!

Can't believe that GJG has doubled thought people would get over it quickly, sadly not

https://jazzage.thelostestate.com/book/

Thought this might inspire an intrepid promotor to do a similar themed northern do, for the yoof'

"The Wigan age, flooded bogs, getting rolled and sold duff gear. Coming to a venue near you..."

On 16/08/2023 at 21:54, Benji said:

As this topic seems to go off-topic I will return to the original post.

Not sure what you mean by rarity? You mean collectors and/or punters more focused about the rarity of a record than its musical quality?

When it comes to exclusivity, I remember I once saw a pic of a late 1960's small ad of somebody offering 5 pounds (? not sure, pre-decimal times) for a copy of Chubby Checker - Discotheque on UK Cameo-Parkway. So even back then folks were willing to shell out to get tunes nobody or most didn't have.

I don't think the wheel or torch had a record bar, did they? When I started going nighters it seemed to me where the action was, as a music fan primary, obviously the dancefloor was important but perhaps less so than in the Wigan era. 

By rarity I do indeed mean more focused on rarity than quality at the expense of easily available but truly great northern records. Rarity+ quality, in terms of dancefloor appeal, seems to elevate a records status to mythical proportion. I've heard comments like; 'its just not rare enough to get played' hundreds of times over the years.

Since the 80's an unwritten rule seems to be; it has to be Rare, and good, obviously that's subjective ,so let say: good as in having dancefloor value, to get played at all on the scene. But it always starts with rarity or at the very least scarcity, it's a prerequisite. 

38 minutes ago, Chalky said:

To say punters weren't bothered isn't strictly true.  Most I know travelled to hear what they couldn't hear anywhere else, they followed Djs, they followed the music. They might not have been bothered about what the records costs but they knew they were rare and they knew know one else could play them.

The scene has always been centred around rare records, exclusive Dj plays, its always been elitist, its always had those above others but it has always been inclusive despite cliques.

Two different entry points here, that was my point initially, and two different experiences.

Rarity was certainly embedded when I started in '87, but the desire by everyone to DJ wasn't. Getting involved was through social aspects, collecting or dancing.

Exclusivity and rarity now mean practically the same thing, in 1972 I don't think they were. Someone must have been the first to play landside, but I can't have been long before most djs, playing decent size venues, had a copy, weeks? Due to its relative abundance as a nationally distributed record in the US, not quite the same with the mello souls was it? That's why I make the distinction between between rare and exclusive here. 

3 hours ago, Chalky said:

Hasn't it always ben about rarity and a Dj having records others didn't, certainly since the Torch from what I can see or the rise of imports rather than UK releases.

It's not always as straight forward as you might think, herb ward- honest to goodness, I know minshull first played it off the funky bottom congregation compilation on UK RCA. 

50 minutes ago, Wally Francis said:

I think it possibly started when Dj's started the covering up of tunes, they wanted that rare unknown trophy tune to play to the masses and possibly at the same time were scooping up numerous copies to sell on for inflated prices to the uneducated followers.

Tbh I hadn't considered this factor which in turn ties in with the rise of bootlegs 

4 minutes ago, John Hart said:

Quando ,Quando ? The clues in the question ,exactly When ( Maybe also where ) did rarity dominate to many on the scene?  As geese correctly states, nobody at the Room, Wheel ,Toptwenty, Cats Mecca etc  late sixties up to Casino 74,, would ask consider, expect , the DJ to discuss how rare, or the  number of copies or price, they where simply great dance sounds!

From mid seventies  perhaps,, exclusivity was born,   today rarity is cited  by main record suppliers as a big factor in quality and price.

Obviously I wasn't around but im speculating that the focus was in the music rather than the djs, and indeed the atmosphere, dancing and other pleasures.

I see parallels with Skate and BMX freestyle, that started around the same time, incidentally. Lots of coaching and training for these activities around now but I don't here the old school bemoaning the pursuit of excellence in kids through instruction.

I'd say it's more to do with the likely quality of instruction, in this case, sounds like an OAP's aerobics class tbh, rather than somewhere you could actually learn how to pull off gymnastic floor moves, in your 50's.

One beauty of 'the scene' is surely that's it's both inclusive and exclusive at the same time, once you start to break it down into technique you begin to lose expression and interpretation. Some of my favourite dancers have distinctive styles that would never win any competition but in terms of expression say so much. 

On 27/07/2023 at 18:22, Roburt said:

INFO FROM DISCOGS ...

The Imaginations (Fraternity) were an R&B vocal group from Dayton, Ohio 1966-1971. The group was lead by Robert Alvarez, who had been in the Del-Vikings. . After he left that group, he moved to Dayton (having been in the Air Force) and started this set of Imaginations. He found some younger singers, still in high school, to form the group. The other members were Dave Peoples, Freddie Williams, and Charles Smith. Williams and Peoples were students at Dunbar High School at the time.

The Imaginations (20th Century) were a Chicago soul vocal quartet, one of a number of Chicago groups produced by Clarence Johnson's Star-Vue Productions. The group's genesis was in the ashes of another Star-Vue act, Brighter Side Of Darkness: after "Love Jones" became a hit, most of the group was fired after a legal dispute with their label; Arthur Scales, Jesse Harvey, and Nathaniel Pringle were hired as replacements. After "Brighter Side"s breakup, Johnson hired Tyrone Stewart as lead singer, re-christening them as The Imaginations.

Love diet is a great to track by them on 20th century 

2 hours ago, Leicester Boy said:

White fist is ayran power symbol... really. Always regarded white/any colour fist as more to do with communism than fascist. Sorry to go of topic

Correct 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raised_fist