Len

AB'SOUL'UTELY!!! All the best, Len.

Doh! - Forgot I had a customer on Soul-source - Just been telling Val how busy I am, so need to delay the delivery of his Metal Trolley's - Caught red handed! lol Tomorrow Val, honest! Len.

Hi Carms, Everyone should feel they can say what they like and you’ve given your personal view , nothing wrong in that. I think comments about the way people dress are done tongue in cheek but I agree there’s no need for it. My original post was to find out why the difference in attendance and as I said, I have heard - ref to stuff like ’No compromise’ folk say - “It puts us off going” Silly things can put people off or give the wrong impression of a venue. A bit of modern was always played at The Embankment Club so some went away calling it a disco just because they didn’t like it. This put a few people off from going there which I was told about years later. Len.

I think 'Open minded' is a better description than 'Upfront'. We've heard a lot from the 'Open minded' 'camp' on this thread, it would be good to hear opinions of folk who consider themselves as staunch oldies fans or returnees who as yet haven't tried these events and to maybe state why. The Sandy Golden track - Absolutely Awesome! All the best, Len.

- That wasn't actually meant as a joke! Len.

Hi Paul, Yes, labeling doesn't help - One thing I often think is maybe it’s to do with people’s perception of what a night will be like. For example, I didn’t go to The 100 Club for years because people said to me - “It’s cr*p Len, they play all that rare sh*t down there”...I ended being taken in the mid 90’s by Shifty and Steve Chadwick (There’s a name from the past) as Shifty finally convinced me I’d love it....I was in absolute ‘music heaven’ and was pretty upset that I’d missed so many years. The pont I’m trying to make is I think some people may not realise that there are plenty of oldies included at the upfront venues and in contrast with everything else that’s played, they actually sound better!  So if you haven’t tried any of the upfront events, don’t rely on someone else’s opinion, find out for yourself - Who knows you may be pleasantly surprised! All the best, Len.

Hi Chalky, Yes, that's absolutelly right for us, I was just mixing it up to see if it would attract people who attend the big oldies venues. There would definatelly be a 'queue to get in and a queue to get out' though wouldn't there? Butch would set the theme and I'm sure Andy's finishing set would be a blnder. All the best, Len.

Yes, seriously. Be good if anyone out there considers themselves in that 'Camp' and can confirm this - as in someone who mainly attends the big oldies all-nighters but would welcome at leat a few more different sounds. All the best, Len.

Hi Win, I think your right, the split must have widened sinse the days of the the 90's, The Ritz in Manchester etc, pretty sure we were all dancing to upfront / oldies, the lot back then (You were there mate) All the best, Len.

Hi Kev, Not at all mate, the thread’s about why there is such a difference in attendance between the two events and is there anything about the upfront soul scene that stops more people attending (One extreme to another maybe?) Adding another all-nighter to the soul calenda is the last thing on my mind! Lol All the best, Len.

Yep, saw that coming! - At least you beat Terry to it! lol (Was meant tongue in cheek though) Len.

Hi Carms, Have you checked the calenda?...I bet it will still clash with another event! lol. Personal opiniun - I don't think it would work. Boxing day? - Yes, I remember in the 90's we all used to be 'chomping at the bit' to get toThe Ritz at Manchester on Boxing day it was a fantastic nighter with the added Christmas atmosphere. All the best, Len.

Ok, Back to the original post (Kind of!) Welcome to the All-nighter 'In my mind' Where we all get together 2000 plus people (@ £7.50 each to get in) D.J's under the instruction of play what you want of course! Would this 50 / 50 line up work for you? 10.30 -11.00 Me (Cos it's my do! lol) 11.00 - 12.00 - Butch (To get everyone there on time!) 12.-00 - 1.00 - Brian Rae. 1.00 - 2.00 - Dave Thorley. 2.00 - 3.00 - Mick .H. 3.00 - 4.00 - Ginger Taylor. 4.00 - 5,00 - Soul Sam. 5.00 - 6.00 - Andy Dyson. ... "A queue to get in...a queue to get out"...Just like the ol' days! ...It ain't gonna happen though is it?! lol...

DOH!!! - Damn you Mace! - I even got the record out to check, it's those silent 'Y's... Len. P.s - I still love Latin Soul (My guilty pleasure)

By Chr*st, I think we're amongst the most guilty to play Latin Soul Mace! Do you remember Bad Breath by Bobby Valentine on Fania I used to play?... I was so proud of that record! lol....Still got Joe Bataan - Gypysy Woman - Fania (and still play it!) lol ...So to summerise...I best put my 50 / 50 Alnighter on hold then aye? - Twas good market research anyhow. See y'all wherever you may choose to go... All the best, Len.

:( B*llocks!, B*llocks!, B*llocks! tis true and I REALLY concentrated this time! lol Len.

Hi John...Um, yeh point taken...Can I still have my lift to Burnley?....Will I still be allowed in?!!! Len.

lol - Hi Mace, I was in the loft at the weekend and came across a 'Wollaston Rythm and Soul' Club flyer from 1989 with you as the guest - Made me laugh! I've only just been able to log on as I've had computer / work trouble, so am still obsorbing this thread...It's Nina's birthday today aswell, but this is far more important! lol. Len.

Is The ‘Upfront’ Soul Scene Disappearing up It’s Own A*se? So why 1500 at Oldies v 300 tops at Upfront venues? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Strong title I know folks and in no way meant in a derogatory manner - I’ll explain… …I was reading Soul Sam’s article in Manifesto which was basically about this (My sub title) One point Sam made was that he couldn’t ‘Comprehend’ why on the same weekend most folk chose to go to a mainly oldies weekender over a very well known and established ‘Upfront’ all-nighter. He actually said ‘defies comprehension‘, so like many people who attend these upfront nights is very bothered by it. Putting aside the obvious reasons why lots of venues ‘in general’ are suffering (too many events, weekenders, politics etc) This thread is to ask for your views on why there is such a difference in attendance between the two. I hear certain things when I’m ‘Out and about’ for example, ref to stuff like ’No compromise’ I‘ve heard folk say - “It puts us off going” - I know a judgement can’t be made just off the back of a few comments so I’d like to know if ‘In general’ there is anything about the ‘Upfront’ side of the soul scene that stops some of you ‘returnees’ or staunch oldies fans from coming along and is there anything that you think could be done to attract more people to the upfront venues. Is it because there seems to be no happy medium between the two? In your eyes, do the two types of venue go from one extreme to the other? Personally I think more could be done at the huge oldies All-nighters to include more upfront sounds in the main rooms, rather than just an additional small room. Many times I’ve heard real oldies fans crying out for something a bit different. I suppose the promoters of these events have the attitude of ‘If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it’ which is a real shame (Especially when I hear ‘Philly Dog Around The World’ is played no less than three times!) Is there a ‘Superiority’ vibe that comes across from ‘Upfront’ soul fans? - As I said, this is purely based on what I’ve heard people say and I am not accusing anyone or any venue of this myself. Would putting someone like Brian Rae in the line up of an upfront event make it appeal to more people? I think most people like all types of soul music (In this case oldies and upfront) and whatever ‘Camp’ they may be in would welcome a night where it is evenly split, both complimenting each other. All this is just me ‘Thinking out loud’ and just to confirm, it’s not a case of - ‘Len get some sleep mush!’ :O) (Copyright Paul Donnelly) - Over to you guys, I‘m keen to hear others opinions. Remember the 90’s soul scene, The Ritz Manchester etc, oldies fans and upfront fans enjoying ‘Good soul music’ together in the same HUGE hall - Are them days really numbered?… Yours sincerely, Len.

Edit (Post not relevant to thread) Len.

I'm pretty sure Ian agrees it's an impossible wish. I suppose he's wishing for the excitement of the old days which is a lovely thought but it ain't gonna happen and everyone knows it. See you around at the smaller venues mate. Len. p.s - I'm 'the undisputed key current king of the DJ world' (In my 'deluded' mind!) lol - Ain't we all? lol

Here’s a thought - As I said earlier, years ago it didn’t cross many peoples minds to D.J let alone promote….Fast forward a few years then come the dance scene D.J’s like Fat Boy Slim (Shape) etc. At that point it became a massive ‘coup’ to be a D.J. I think that’s when the desire to be a D.J then became common all over and not just on the Soul Scene. I personally was D.Jing before that time and for the record, the reason I enjoyed it then and still do today is that I feel I do try my best to bring something at least a bit different to what some are playing. I just wouldn’t get any enjoyment playing the same records as lots of other D.J’s. I don’t see any point in that, may as well let someone else play them and get on that dance floor. I put my reasoning down as I’m interested in what others get from D.Jing - Or more importantly promoting as that’s a cr*p hobby especially if “Numbers were down” (Again!!!) Why carry on? All the best, Len. P.S - Lou, apologies if this is swaying ‘off thread’ - They usually do! Lol …I think my post is connected but I get carried away sometimes (Yep, by the men in white coats!) I’ll go read your original post again… :O) P.p.s - I feel our ‘Beloved Soul Scene’ has been trampled all over but I’ve now blocked that thought out as I’ve decided to stay positive and enjoy wherever I choose to go - Have I mentioned that? Sorry, it’s self therapy! x

Hi Dave, Yes I see the irony! (Irony is one of my specialist subjects) In saying that... ...A while back myself and Russ Vickers were at Life-line discussing how frustrating it is, that there's 'no room' to put on an event of our particular soul music taste and we both agreed it's just a waiting game and hopefully one day the time will be right to promote again. I've also had a similar conversation with Dave Vanner (He promoted a lot in the 90's and is also waiting / hoping for a 'space' one day) I don't think we are the only three who have taken a step back though. On the other side of the coin and kind of in peoples defence, I think a lot now only concentrate on their local scene rather than the national scene, that's why there's so many events on. When it gets to three or four events in the same vicinity - that's when it just beggars belief! All the best, Len.

..Meanwhile back in the real world...lol - Yes, great idea but as you say, defo "Easier said than done" lol Even on just a local level - For example, just one event in each town or better still each county. Say you manage to get all the said promoters to agree one united event only....Then the question is raised - Who's gonna D.J?....That's where the 'Meeting' would end..lol Len.

There must be something in the air as I have only just got my 'Northern Soul Mojo' back and am enjoying myself now more than I have for a long time. I think it's because I have stopped (Well almost!) moaning about what's wrong with the scene for me. Fact is, nothing stays the same so you have no choice but to embrace it and make the most of what's there now. I expect the people that went to the early music festivals are just as bitter as us, seeing what most of them have turned into, going all corporate and costing nearly £200.00 per ticket, those original lot used to turn up and just see what happens ...(He says as if he was there!) - You know what I mean. All the best, A very 'Positive' Len....At the minute anyway....mmmm...Now I've said that, it's got me thinking....