jocko

And what part of history of the scene did you get that it "just happens to be predominately Black music". You don't think that it is more than a coincidence based on the people who kicked this scene off and the style of music they chose to chase, you don't think it "just didn't" happen but that all these people you quote, (Paul Anka, Kiki Dee) were mimicking the style of Black music of it's day? In any dance scene there will always be crossovers between styles and borders that are crossed due to people chasing a beat only but that doesn't change the history and the motivation for that scene surely. I think you will find lots of people on this scene are into "a Black dance scene" or as history has called it Soul music, you seem to be defining Northern on a very narrow time in the 70's and people who probably were only around for a few years during that period. What about from 79-95 when it was almost completely a Soul based scene, with little of the type of stuff you mention, majority I knew on the scene in these days were fans of many of the genres within Soul not just the ones Northern "chose" to adopt.. What about from 65-74 when I believe, from what I have read, it was again almost all about Soul music or records trying to copy that style. Pete Smith has very eloquently argued the case that the records you mention above are a huge part of the history of the scene, certainly for most our age, but to deny that it is a Soul scene and say it's just a co-incidence that the majority of records are Soul is just a bridge too far for my sensitive self. And of course it's musical snobbery, I can't speak for Macca but I think it's a huge compliment to be called a musical snob, anyone that is not into the mainstream would consider themselves a music snob, surely that's what stops you listening to the same old crap as everyone else. Being a soul fan makes people the biggest musical snobs there are, it applies quality control to ensure that not every unrelated record with a beat is called a soul. Generally I ignore tosh like above but there is almost a backlash on here deriding anyone for being a soul fan these days or anyone who chooses to remember the Soul part Northern. I love Paul Anka as a record and a memory, but if I went to a venue and heard it now I would probably be incredibly disappointed, would show just laziness on a DJ's part IMO. It has no relevance to what I am interested in now. Doesn't mean I want to fire-bomb all venues that play stuff like that, of which I am sure there are 100's still out there every Saturday night, good for them, I know they are there and I know I can avoid them. If I heard it a local do one night out for a few beers, I would probably smile at the memory, but that's it. You choose to define yourself by a time in the scenes history rather than the music, great, but it's incredibly wrong to assume everyone else does. And lastly Soul music, (as a genre not a general term) which as I say is an integral part of Northern for many of us, is not about colour of the skin, it's about the sound, which for proper soul is predominately, not always, sung by an Afro-American. That's just History, not my opinion and well documented if you want to read people more qualified than I am to document it. And another one that's been argued enough on here IMHO.

Russ I have PM'd you mate, assume it is material suitable for playing out you are after? Try Fish at Simply Soul Records. www.firstexperiencerecords.com, not sure how many soundbites he has but he probably is the most consistent supplier of new music, lots of which is Gospel as well, There is a main site have lost its address that also does general christian music, but you have to wade through lots of rubbish unless you know what it is, search on Christian Music suppliers, think you get a few but I gave up after the 2nd bible offering I am afraid!! Probably wrong weekend to ask this as people like Roger Williams who pretty much lead the way in stuff like this these days are all away at the Birmingham weekender, so you may get a better answer when they have recovered.

Thats a fair point mate, I suppose I am comparing it to nearly 30 years ago which is quite scary, my ears and mind were very different then obviously. I just think that the evolution of the sounds I was lucky enough to witness in 80's/90's put stuff like this in the shade, doesn't mean that don't get an excited shiver thinking about dancing to this though, more about the time than the sound for me tho....

Do you really thinks so lads? Katie Love is a fantasic record (Mr Dawg wash your ears out) and one I always used to put on tape swaps, but have a listen to Millie and she kills it, often think I used to probably prefer Katy as it was a bit trendier and less known (in my young and easily influenced days ), but now starting to think Mille wins. Whatever, you should have both versions, fantastic singers, great song, what more could you want.

Cheers for that Bob, will look out for them, hopefully they will be as cheap as the Fairmount 45 was when I bought it.

Thank god I have no sound card, one of these records that just sounds so bad now but used to love this back at Clouds do's in Edinburgh.

Wow Mel, at last something I can 100% agree with you on!! :lol: The second paragraph particularly, thats why Mr Trouble is bigging up the Kings Go Forth single so he can make enough of the copies he has pre-ordered to retire off, he's bored of causing World Recessions with his dodgy derivitaves, City Boys, you can't trust them I tell you.....

Is Too Sweet To Be Lonely same as Internationals on D'ar? If so anyone have a soundclip (even though I have no sound card at moment!! I have a great ballad by Ray Lewis on Fairmount, is it same guy?

Slightly twisting the question - as usual when the place whose name should never be mentioned is brought up the same arguments happen, Forget the place the question to me that is more about what it would be like if everyone went to one venue, all the progressive crowd going to the same place, Butch djing weekly with all his records, and supported by the people likeminded (Mr Dyson, Mick H etc) then yes the records would be more accepted and the scene would be a million times better, it would be a scene which it isn't now. Mediocre flavour of the week records wouldn't be heard of other than in the local youth club nights (well if you can call gathering of 50 somethings a youth club!) The majority who say it is better with the million soul nights are generally wannabee DJ's more interested in thier own "fame" or the millions of local soul night DJ's that seem to think they are the saviour of "the scene" and aren't thinking logically. Actually that's not totally true as that description is not descriptive of Steve G - C'mon Mr G with all your records you could be one of the supporting cast at the same venue weekly!! Okay the logistics like are there enough records, do people go out enough, are all the people asking for this just armchair critics probably make it a pipe dream but anything less to me is not a scene, just a group of buddies playing records in their local pub. Okay back to my armchair for the next 3 days for me dreaming of a long gone youth...........

Great topic, been meaning to get something going for ages, think it would be good to highlight one for re-issue stuff (Kent & Soulscape), and maybe one for newer stuff for the more adventurous. Reissue wise mines currently is the Mary Gresham CD, fantastic stuff and needs to be supported to ensure these sort of labels continue to exist. Will add more details from home tonight.

I love it, another debate over a nice but not great record, I would agree it is by far the best new release record so far, by a long long way, however wouldn't have even got a second listen 40 years ago, would definitely only sold 500 copies or less then in the days of large vinyl sales. Anyone want to discuss the new Mitty Collier CD or does that not fit the trendy over taste criteria. I do love this thread, have found myself agreeing with most of what Mr Trouble has said in last year or so, at last an opportunity to shout him down. I feel much better now.

As I tried to say on the other thread just before Mike wisely locked it, the other view on this is if you have to ask you shouldn't be allowed within 100 miles of DJ decks. There are no laws, no rules just an understanding of how it always was and how many think it should be regarding playing out on the Northern scene. The original only debate, as f****ing mindnumbingly boring as it is now, has nothing to with the debate on youth coming into scene in my opinion, just another smokescreen for wanabee DJ's desperate for any route in. You either get it or you don't, you clearly don't. I appreciate there many scenes within the scene nowadays, and even more DJ's, do what you like at your local scenes for local people but don't try and belittle many years of peoples times and energy just because you don't get it.

What relevance is the radio part to hiding someone's identity?? Surely radio is about highlighting the artists and their work, I think on global sales it could make 100% of a difference if noone can get a copy due to the hiding of the identity.. I love cover ups, they are a huge, important and fun part of the Northern scene, but for new releases its a complete insult to the artist and to people buying new music, where the motivation (as well as getting good music) has to be different. If you choose to play new music then surely part of the role has to be to publicise it, increase sales, and threfore the likelihood of more new music being played and, most importabntly, being released. I don't get your argument at all.

Am I alone in thinking it sounds a very average record?

This just sums up how f***ed up the local scene for local people is. F**k sake a not very good record being covered up as by a very not good artist. I just scene (pun intended) a real soul record go past my window on a flying pig looking for a venue to stop at!! Anyone playing this covered should now confess and, after being only partially forgiven, be passed to Brett Franklin and his Ravens for suitable punishment. I am going back to my Jaheim CD, its more relevant to Northern Soul (and its not relevant at all in case you don't get the irony!!). FFS Another triple gin quick.

Have to agree with Mr Hampsey, its a very poor imitation. If you want a better "modern" psuedo-house record go for his earlier single Helping Hand, much better single and doesn't have to live up to the perfection that is the Staple singers. At least you didnt ask about the horrendous Way Of Life version that used to be played at early Southport which is possible the worst record ever (although there are many contenders for that!!)

I have no doubts there mate, lots passed through people like yourselves hands back then that is only slowly gaining favour now, to very little credit often! Just finished sorting out my 30 records for tomorrow, don't think I will be catching the 8am train somehow! See you tomorrow Mr Hampsey, really looking forward to it. Cheers Jock

Mossy mate might be worth checking with Mike as don't think they are too keen on direct MP3's on site. Think he was hoping for us to wait till Refosoul ready again. As said probably worth checking with Mike, just my assumption based on some things today. Cheers Jock

Didn't know it had been played then Sean, great record. It took me quite a while to get one to be honest, great record, revived by Andy Whitmore and now the rest of us are following Mr Whitmore (how many times has that been said - or should have been said more likely!!)

I have this on a Greek 45, it was found in among a bunch of Aretha/Don Covay 45's, all red and black design. Will try and put up a scan later.

Can't remember that Dave, just remember TML being the sound at main venues. Colin Law did play TRT at later stages a few times but it was well uncovered by then, can't actually remember it ever being covered up but somedays can't remember my middle name so it more than likely was covered up, anyone confirm!

Thanks for the comments, it was Make Love To Me on his Street Songs LP, a Gareth X tip on RSF, quite outstanding record.

Thanks John, really enjoyed it, my kind of all over the place show!! Thanks for then Johnny Adams tip, I actually have quite a few of his 45's so need to go and see if its there. Hope you are well.

Cheers Byrnie, did put it on here earlier but site was playing up so not sure if it dissapeared, Got a bit self indulgent, mostly 70's and slow stuff but really enjoyed it. Think George generally puts it up for download on his own site in a week or so, will let you know so you can laugh at my best Alan Partridge impersation!!

Bloody hell Russ, you have just said what I have always thought about then gave up as knew I wouldn't get the words right!! When I do say something I just sound bitter and narky, you have expressed it perfectly, and people won't want to recognise themselves but I do think you have described 90% of todays scene to a T. I always feel hypocritical in threads like this as I now am a part timer and realise that and am happy with that now, for a number of reasons, but one of the reasons my attendances dwindled in mid to late 90's was the disappearance of the type of scene you describe, it warms the cockles of my dodgy heart to hear someone still thinks like you do! We need to have a beer sometime and you and Steve C can re-energise me!!