jocko

How do you get that based on Gareths very reasonable response to the other guys comments. However I could understand it at my comments, and to be honest if thats the impact of my comments, good, job done, if it keeps some quality control around things. And whats your definition of an anorak, somebody who wants good quality music played and cares about keeping things progressive and challenging, (I was guilty as charged, now I am just a sad keyboard warrior that for some reason gets into debates with people who just don't get it) In my opinion it was these anoraks that kept a lot of people going when others were off doing something, sadly people like the dumbing it down now because (a) they can make some money off their local soul nights for local people with little effort around the music ( It allows them to be somebody with their local soul night. Not for me, thank you very much.

Gareth you need to give me lessons in being so succinct.

Again I repeat if sticking up for some quality control means being on my high horse then pass me the riding crop. And WTF has eclectic taste got to do with definition of a good Northern record, I think you assume too much, I am as likely to be listening to Amp Fiddler today as I am to Northern, probably more likely to be honest as I buy almost any soul related music other than Northern these days. I also listen to lots of house currently, all of which is completely irrelevant to my point, Yvonne Vernee is not a mid-tempo NS record. Another that has that extra undefinable something that very few NS records have. I give up part 2.

Yes they always did want to dance and in my 20 odd years of going they wanted to dance to things like this. I repeat a proper NS record with atmosphere and everything, it has that something very few records have in my opinion and it is a perfect all nighter record. WTF you include this with mid tempo and beat ballads I just dont get, that is another argument surely, by including this in this bracket is just underestimating your audience, the epitome of dumbing down in my opinion. As for all these beat ballads etc, I assume thats a dig at the 80's/90's, and I repeat for the 90th time on here, if you had been there, rather than on these mystical breaks I assume, you would have realised that they didnt get played all night its just a f*****g myth, perpetuated by those absent. I dont think anyone wants slow stuff all night, think it has been debated well on here that you need to keep a pace up particularly for a nighter at certain times, but to include records of this pace and quality says more about what you think of the quality of the people around the dancefloor than it does about the record, Ever wondered why so many of the taste makers and players of the 80's/90's cant be assed anymore?

First Yvonne Vernee is mid tempo and then this statement, I suspect from lots of comments on here we are just about heading back to the 70's and Muriel Day and other pop stompers are just around the corner (metaphorically speaking obviously as am young enough to have missed that period out, thankfully) Sorry Phil but that is just a f*****g unbelievable statement, it just proves to me what some people better qualified than I am have been telling me lately and that is the quality scene is f*****d in the majority. My retirement is confirmed, I suspect the 30 year off brigade have won and all evolution has been lost. It reminds me of Thatcherism "saving" the country. This sounds great out loud and to me is a proper NS record, if this tempo is no longer acceptable then its truly gone, I suspect the fact its a proper soul record is doing it no favours as well. I really do give up.

I second the wise Toad great idea. How about Original Silver Shiny Things Only -- stealing a little from Willy's idea there!

It wasn't just aimed at you, I do appreciate mistakes can happen, although the other side of the argument is delete only takes another second. Its just something that seems to be happening more and more despite sites comments. And if trying to show some support to people who give up their time freely to put up with crap for no thanks is being on your high horse then pass me another saddle, respect has not always been your strongpoint on here on more than one occassion has it........... As said it was a personal comment from me to you and others, I have nothing to do with site, for some unexplainable reason its just one of the many things people do on here with no thought to the excellent FREE platform they get that annoys me.

Am I the only one who thinks its rude, bad manners and sheer disrespectful to the guys that put their own time into this site, that despite their constant pleas, people just stick MP3s up with no thought to the sites policy. What makes it worse is how easy Refosoul is, sometimes I wonder why Mike puts up with crap that people on here throw at him Just to be clear this a purely personal opinion, I have nothing to do with site, I just hate people who take the pi**

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH I just watched it, somebody really needs to get these guys back, Cmon Ady C you know where their spiritual home for a weekender is. Although in all honesty would love to see them in a nice hall with seats just for the concert, no weekender, am I getting old Did someone say they still gig in the states, does anyone have details of their regularl gigs?

Catriona I have really gone off you for posting this, I refuse to watch as I can't bear to see what I missed. I completely blame Val!

And one of the worst records ever to be played, which is saying somthing, I really do hope they look like Derek and Clive, would make my year!!

Cheers everyone, results will be revealed on here soon, but I can promise its not another record playing soul night so breathe easy at the back.

Cheers Mace, will follow this up too.

Thanks for that, much appreciated. Has anyone done CD size flyers before? Not a lot I have seen offer it so far. Haven't said that haven't looked too much!! Will give them a call Andrew, cheers

Possibly off topic, if so apologies. I need to get some flyers printed, We want it printed as a CD size flyer with postcard style on back, can anyone recommend a good online source for quotes etc. And no don't worry I am not putting on my own night, honest Guv.

Fed up sticking up for you on here so over for some sparring. Get onto the 60's thread and you will hear about 200 records better than it for £25, its a reasonably exciting dancer on first or second listen but closer examination reveals a pretty awful singer, which isnt always a problem for Northern IMO, but it just becomes boring very quickly, and it was spun at Stafford was it not? Whenever it was opinion then was it was a fairly forgettable record and not much changed. R&B was all made in the 50's and Funk in the 70's weren't they so can't be either.

2 fantastic records and the Billy Floyd cheap at twice the price, proving quality can be bought very cheap Rob Marriot played it out a few times I remember, its actually a great double sider, pretty sure I put at least one side on Refosoul.

I gave this away with a load of boots in early 80's as always thought this was a boot then. OUCH!!!

Put both sides up in Refosoul last night, great double sider.

Would I being my usual grumpy churlish self I asked if any of you had bought the new Al Green CD, very accessible and believe it or not, quite like real soul!!

Okay, Russ Winstanley was a cheap dig for which I apologise, however rest of what I said stands, people who hold up local soul nights as "the scene" are missing the point, and it really does my head in here how peoples self desire to be a DJ ignores the work people like Butch have done in keeping any original ethos going. And thats my point Mark not all oldies are boring, by definition 99% of what you hear now, if you have been around as long as you have are all going to be oldies, its just the boring ones that seem to get played because they are easy on the ears and get people through the doors! And I think I may disagree about your last point, Butch packs up and takes his record the scene as I know it and we all got into is f***ked, it is then 100% of the rock and roll revivalist scene we keep denying it already is. If he sells his records then thats a different issue................. However I doubt it as a point many on here also miss is Butch actually likes this music, he buys stuff because he likes it and buys far more than we ever hear. Sadly another point too many of todays DJ only school don't understand. Not quite, but I am sleepy and grumpy for no real reason so nothing better than a good rant to wake me up. It is something I feel strongly about, it is what made me fall out of love with the scene and stop going so much in the mid 90's, I always thought there would be a correction like there was in the 80's but in reality that was niave, we are all too old to do it properly again, however it still gets me annoyed when I see things like the 2 Mark's posting, f**k knows why, its not exactly central in my life anymore, maybe I need to take up plane spotting or something else to get me equally excited!! The point I am making about Butch is that he is probably the last of finding real unknowns etc, and people particularly on here just wont give him credit, and I really don't know why, and to compare these "local heroes to him" is just wrong. He has done more than Searling ever did in reality, but your point about only hearing him so many times is the crux of the matter, and lots of this is because there are far too many local soul nights that just can't or in reality wouldnt book Butch, wonder why!! I think the other issue is who people now refer to as the Top DJ's are those who get most bookings not those who are playing the best or newest records, crazy or what. Also its not like Nick says below where everyone eventually ended up in the one place so these local discoveries made it national. Obviously there are guys out there finding different things, christ thats what it was all about for a couple of hundred of us all through the 80's, however due to internet now, these local discoveries become known about far too quickly, become far too expensive quickly and as result dissappear too quickly, these local discoveries are often gone and dissapeared in a matter of weeks, to then become the fodder for the next layer of the DJ food chain who play them off carvers etc for the next 20 years. And in reality often they aren't that good. Butch has found an unbelievable quality of unknowns consistently. I think the multitude of local soul nights with the attitude they are doing something different is 99% of the problem today, and thats not to say there isn't a place, more than anything these days I hate the travelling, but posts like Mark B's above comparing them to the Butch's is just crazy. Its back to the argument too many DJ's with no centralisation (Ah thats an idea Soul Socialists, could be the way forward! ) And that is really the point I am making Nick, people like Guy were on the verge of making it as a "Top DJ" (read Richards Wigan 6th anniversary notes and his tip for the top) and were feeding the top guys, thats always happened. It isn't now for a number of reasons, one of the main reasons is the equivelant today are putting on a night in a pub for their 30 mates saying look at what I found!! The whole nationwide scene hasn't really existed for over 10 years, maybe longer, and has been throttled willingly by the ego of these guys who want to DJ at any price. Definitely my last word or Butch is going to think I fancy him or something, thankfully he still has crap taste in cars to prove he is anything but perfect!

And these two unbelievably egotistical responses show why any progressive scene of any coherence is totally and unbelievable f***ed. No wonder Butch hardly dj's any more. Yes it would, with loads and loads of more soul nights playing loads and loads of more boring oldies, booking Russ Winstanley, just to get more people through the doors, feed their ego's to be dj's and let them slap them and their mates backs saying aren't we king of the castle. Without caring they had completetly killed the ethos of a scene they pretend they love. So Butch heard all about the 2 or 300 (or should that be thousand!) cover ups, one offs and just plain unknowns that he has broken over the last 20 years from these Innovaters at soul clubs did he, don't make me laugh, you mean people like you don't you! F**k sake, your lack of understanding and lack of respect is amazing Everyone moans about Troubles ego, and sometimes absolutely rightly so, but it doesn't compare with statements like the above. These "unsung heros" would do better going to the main progressive events and talking about these records, just like in the good old days, rather than playing them down the pub to their 30 mates, then you could compare them to the Manships/Andersons/Ashibendes/B Waddingtons/Brads etc etc of the old days, although in reality very few could remotely hope to match these people. I repeat again NOONE at soul nights can compete with Butch at the top end of the scale and stop pretending you can. These Top DJ's you refer to above shouldn't be included as such, thats just your narrow vision and your limited scope of what Northern scene should be, they are just followers, there are probably about 5 or 6 top DJ's around in the sense you quote of Searling back in the day, and they aren't chasing things like Lee Fields now. You may be happy in your own bubble but stop pretending you are anything other than an egotistical DJ who wants to say "I am an innovator". The sad things about this is you all moan about Mr Trouble (and sadly not for the many things he deserves to be moaned about) but he actually gets "it", the ethos of a progressive Northern scene which is what it was and should be all about, much more than guys like you lot and you just don't see it. Right definitely my last word on shit like this, I repeat again You either get it or you don't. Seems most nowadays don't, which should really be of little consequence to me, not quite sure why I care. Off to immerse myself in some early 90's House and a bottle of Cucumber Gin, soothe away the pain!

I know, I was being a bit cheeky. I would say even earlier than that, about the time I retired and went over to house clubs proper, it sounded just a little bit different in the hands of people like Trouble Anderson for some reason!!!

Cmon Pete, another 4779 words to explain why not, and you didn't mention that earlier you just said 4/4/ beat, you need to be clearer on what you dislike!

And what part of 4 copies makes it not rare, currently some records where there are 100's of copies on here alone are touted as rare. or should that be in demand Been around for a long time now, Colin Law gave both sides some welly in 80's (the Gene McDaniels c/u side after I nagged him to death, in fact think I borrowed it a couple of times to play that side) and wouldn't say there have been a lot turning up, still feel its pretty rare in today's market, and more importantly still sounds good to my ears!