Garethx

Fantastic!

Definitely and categorically not on a 45 anywhere in the world. You must be thinking of another Garland Green title.

I think Edu makes his point well. While some soulful funk classics are starting to make small inroads into some Northern Soul playlists, quality-wise you'd have to say Buddy Cantrell compares very poorly to Herman Hitson on Sweet Rose, Big Jay Bush on Vangee, Earl English etc. The three mentioned murder it from every conceivable musical perspective. Bottom line is that if Buddy Cantrell were on any other logo it wouldn't even be considered as a suitable candidate for playing out at any black music event. I've collected quite a bit of deep soul in my time and re-iterate that the ballad side is, for the money, woefully poor.

The Shout 45 is an Atlanta production (by Tee Fletcher I think) leased to New York's Shout label. Bear in mind that Richard Marks Funky 4 Corners was leased to Roulette and that getting picked up by a major or a larger independent with national distribution was pretty much the ideal scenario for many small local labels at the time.

An interesting theory Christian. Other side of the Shout 45 is excellent as well in the same vein as Did You Ever Lose Something without being quite as good. I'm guessing very few of these records will be posted as soundfiles Jock as they remain in the realm of the jealously guarded collector's item. John Ridley has presented a rundown of a few of the deeper sides via his great Sir Shambling site. Soundfiles of Buddy Cantrell and a couple of the Barbara Halls should be there.

You are completely correct George. I made this observation on the previous page.

Hermann is presumably grateful for us keeping his want on the front page. Or maybe he got one last year? I've changed my mind about Buddy Cantrell. It's now doper than smack.

Depends if you're buying or selling Dylan. If I were selling I'd say Barbara Hall is a masterpiece. If I were looking to buy I'd call it a number to fill the discography. Her other records on the label are pretty ordinary if you ask me. Still think the deep side of Buddy Cantrell is crap. The intrusive backing vocalists completely ruin what is otherwise an OK, generic deep soul ballad.

All a bit like a poker game.

Some interesting perspectives on the debate but I will say that the hardest part in creating a great record is transforming good songwriting with some kind of spark in the performance and arrangement. Generally speaking this is something which takes place with most power in the original released version of a song. Covers can be great records in their own right, but only when something is added which the original artist, arranger or producer failed to capture completely. Records like the Susan Maughan 45 are competent and polished copies of the US originals but in the main simply mimic the process of turning the base material to gold, as it were. For me maybe the best example of a UK artist taking an American original and actually improving it is Truly Smith's version of Carolyn Crawford's "My Smile Is Just A Frown" on Decca. I'm sure it will be a sacrilegious view to many but to my ears Ms. Smith's performance tweaks the melody and actually improves the whole thing hugely. Carolyn Crawford's version seems stiff and flat by comparison but I can't think of many other examples off the top of my head where this was the case.

To be honest I think the Jimmy Tig is one of the better records on the logo and represents an absolutely tremendous slice of Southern Soul. Difficult to price it in this condition so someone might end up with a bargain. I've always felt Buddy C. was overrated, alongside the Barbara Hall 45s. The good Richard Marks 45 (Did You Ever...) is completely brilliant though. Record labels like Tuska and Shrine which gain a mystique through the rarity of their output alone will always divide opinion and it's often difficult to look at the quality of each release on their respective merits through completely objective eyes. Having said all that I wouldn't hesitate to buy any of the releases for the right price.

Joe Matthews "She's My Beauty Queen" (Thelma 104). Two great records but the Joe Matthews shades it for me as it shows off his marvellously flexible voice to great effect, plus the flip of JM, "Is It Worth It All" is even better. Tempos is seriously rare on a WDJ though.

Demo shouldn't be too hard Liam. Good luck.

What About You.

If memory serves John Manship auctioned a reasonable copy of the Domestic Five for a bit less than this earlier in the year. I would agree with the theory that James Lately could be the lead voice. A good record.

Is it just me or is the Lovelites version of this on the same label a far better record? The flip of the Donny Mann version does have some potential if you can get past his voice, which I suppose has a love-it-or-hate-it quality.

'Tis Calvin Grayson "You Got To Be Willing" on In Records.

Sylvia Maddox "Vietnam Blues" on Duke. Into the bargain the other side "Got To Be Free" is a more explicit 'protest' song.

Agreed Chalky. I can't see the Jesse James record failing at any of the classic venues of the past: 100% definitive Northern Soul record of the very highest calibre and maybe one of the greatest ever discoveries.

I think James' last post sums up the current situation pretty well. The irony of this whole debate seems to me that James, Cliff and Jock are pretty much all in the same camp but their 'forum personalities' are preventing them from agreeing. Chorleysoul's prose tends to be so impenetrable that I can't actually work out what his position might currently be. To be honest I wonder if I would be that bothered by new discoveries which were in the mould of a 'traditional Northern stomper' anyway, outside of the current Tempests coverup. I'm currently more energised by less linear sounds on the whole: I can't be alone in this. The other thread running at the moment on which recent or current 'newies' would have been big at Wigan also feeds into this and I've started to wonder if it might not be more pertinent to ask how many Wigan monsters would appeal to me personally if I heard them for the first time next week.

Worth mentioning that this is of course Towanda Barnes of "You Don't Mean It" fame. The 45 is pretty rare but such is demand for the "Uptown" album on Maple that the single should be cheaper if you can find one. I would say that the horns definitely take this into funk territory. A tremendous record all round.

Last one I sold was £100 and took a while to shift. Very good record though.

I half-jokingly proposed the use of an Original Vinyl Only kitemark on promotional materials for events last year. An interesting thread. My own intuition is that the 'corporate' oldies-oriented event is far removed from the scene's roots, but that's not to say it's necessarily a bad thing. To me it is a by-product of everyone (promoters and paying customers) getting a lot older. Forty years ago there were no models for the way in which youth cults might develop and endure. I'm sure few people had any idea at the age of sixteen that they might still be interested in collecting records, travelling the country and staying up all night well into their fifties and sixties.

John Vincent and Richard Searling both owned the record while the Casino was open, but I don't know if it was actually played. Searling is rumoured to have offloaded the disc claiming it was "too good" for the NS scene of the time.

I was thinking about Lost In The Crowd. In fact I'm surprised John Manship's current auction of the 45 neglects to mention this side.