Northern Soul Live Project: Advice Please

[Guest]

Hi, this is my first post but I've enjoyed reading some of the threads.

I'm posting in the hope that the users of this board can help me with a project which I have been nurturing for a long while but would like to now try and move forward with.

Please indulge me while I explain a bit of context: I'm a Northern fan, but a long, long way from an expert- my knowledge of the music comes from the scooter scene from where it has got under my skin, and I now find myself in a position where I'm able to initiate a project which I think would be of great interest to the Northern scene, and something unique. I'm posting as a humble amateur hoping for some guidance!

My interest is in a live project for 2009. My belief, from my modest knowledge, is that although many soul artists have appeared live on the weekender and scooter rally circuit, it has typically been using musical arrangements which fit the capabilities of a (stripped down) band, sometimes with a US artist playing with a UK band for example. On record many of the greatest soul tunes are drenched in string, horn and percussion arrangements which the technical and budgetary constraints of weekender venues, promoters and budgets aren't able to accommodate.

My proposal is to work with an orchestral string and brass section (alongside a bass/ guitar/ drums / keys band) and two or three named soul singers to present a big scale Northern show which presents the music as it was recorded, and affords it the budget and credibility that it is sometimes denied The objective is not be to try and achieve a slavish reproduction of the recordings, but to actually use the original arrangements and instrumentation as the basis of the performance. There's no doubting that transcribing some of the arrangements is going to be ambitious but I think it's an effort worth making.

Obviously for the project to make sense the songs featured need to be (heavily) orchestrated rather than simply arranged, and there is then the issue that many of the original artists may have passed away or disappeared so you would need a few (male and female) singers who could handle the whole proposed set.

I guess the concept is something like The Northern Soul Songbook: Live (but that makes it sound very cheesy!) but it needs to be respectful, accurate and, well, soulful. I'm absolutely not talking about a dumbed-down West End style show: I'd like to present something that recognises soul music and it's importance in the UK's social history by putting it in the context of a "serious" music venue. (hope that doesn't sound too up itself!)

I'm looking for comments on what you think the best 15 or 20 songs that would fit the criteria above would be, and then, who would choose (that's still alive!) to perform them? I guess the question is, what would be your fantasy Northern soul show (setlist, and performers with original arrangements). I've got a few ideas but I would be really grateful for any contributions.

I should finally clarify that I'm not a wannabe impressario who wants to make a fast buck out of northern soul. I am almost certain that this will not be a profitable venture, but I am lucky enough to work in an organisation which has a wide remit for interesting musical projects and this is something I have wanted to get off the ground for a couple of years. I am involved in many genres of music - classical music being one - which receive substantial public subsidy and I now have the opportunity to "redress the balance" a little and initiate a project which probably couldn't happen in a purely commercial context. I hope that you will appreciate that my motives are sincere, and offer any advice in the same spirit.

I hope that I have posted this in the right place, but perhaps the moderators would move it if not.

Thanks for reading the rather windy post, and I look forward to any comments.

[45cellar]

Hi, this is my first post but I've enjoyed reading some of the threads.

I'm posting in the hope that the users of this board can help me with a project which I have been nurturing for a long while but would like to now try and move forward with.

Please indulge me while I explain a bit of context: I'm a Northern fan, but a long, long way from an expert- my knowledge of the music comes from the scooter scene from where it has got under my skin, and I now find myself in a position where I'm able to initiate a project which I think would be of great interest to the Northern scene, and something unique. I'm posting as a humble amateur hoping for some guidance!

My interest is in a live project for 2009. My belief, from my modest knowledge, is that although many soul artists have appeared live on the weekender and scooter rally circuit, it has typically been using musical arrangements which fit the capabilities of a (stripped down) band, sometimes with a US artist playing with a UK band for example. On record many of the greatest soul tunes are drenched in string, horn and percussion arrangements which the technical and budgetary constraints of weekender venues, promoters and budgets aren't able to accommodate.

My proposal is to work with an orchestral string and brass section (alongside a bass/ guitar/ drums / keys band) and two or three named soul singers to present a big scale Northern show which presents the music as it was recorded, and affords it the budget and credibility that it is sometimes denied The objective is not be to try and achieve a slavish reproduction of the recordings, but to actually use the original arrangements and instrumentation as the basis of the performance. There's no doubting that transcribing some of the arrangements is going to be ambitious but I think it's an effort worth making.

Obviously for the project to make sense the songs featured need to be (heavily) orchestrated rather than simply arranged, and there is then the issue that many of the original artists may have passed away or disappeared so you would need a few (male and female) singers who could handle the whole proposed set.

I guess the concept is something like The Northern Soul Songbook: Live (but that makes it sound very cheesy!) but it needs to be respectful, accurate and, well, soulful. I'm absolutely not talking about a dumbed-down West End style show: I'd like to present something that recognises soul music and it's importance in the UK's social history by putting it in the context of a "serious" music venue. (hope that doesn't sound too up itself!)

I'm looking for comments on what you think the best 15 or 20 songs that would fit the criteria above would be, and then, who would choose (that's still alive!) to perform them? I guess the question is, what would be your fantasy Northern soul show (setlist, and performers with original arrangements). I've got a few ideas but I would be really grateful for any contributions.

I should finally clarify that I'm not a wannabe impressario who wants to make a fast buck out of northern soul. I am almost certain that this will not be a profitable venture, but I am lucky enough to work in an organisation which has a wide remit for interesting musical projects and this is something I have wanted to get off the ground for a couple of years. I am involved in many genres of music - classical music being one - which receive substantial public subsidy and I now have the opportunity to "redress the balance" a little and initiate a project which probably couldn't happen in a purely commercial context. I hope that you will appreciate that my motives are sincere, and offer any advice in the same spirit.

I hope that I have posted this in the right place, but perhaps the moderators would move it if not.

Thanks for reading the rather windy post, and I look forward to any comments.

Now that sounds Interesting,

I'm sure following the recent spectacular performances

by various artists that this would be a worthwhile project.

[Guest Carl Dixon]

Interesting project with original arrangements. Remember many classic soul records did not have the luxury of lavish arrangements etc, which helped make them unusual enough to become danceable and collectable. Those that could afford them for example like Motown, had the cream of Detroits musicians writers, and arrangers which gave an edge.

This will take alot of organising and be costly. You could, if it was a one off and budget allowed, fly in bespoke musicians from back in the day to perform on the songs they helped make hits! Along with some original singers, it could make an interesting scenario.

PM me with your phone number and I will speak further. I too have a project, but in Detroit next month.

Edited February 2, 2008 by Carl Dixon

[Guest]

Thanks for the replies.

Carl - I'll be in touch.

Anyone else care to pitch in with a dream Northern setlist that they would like to hear live?

[Guest Carl Dixon]

Repoman -

Thanks. Look forward to it.

I am also in contact with some legendary Detroit and Philly producers/musicians. They would raise the profile of the project and put it into another dimension should they work on it. Also, exposure at this level would be a fitting tribute to those that have created soul music back then, but do not reap the glory so much as musicians/arrangers etc.

[Guest JJMMWGDuPree]

This sounds like something I attempted during the late 80s/early 90s, except I just wanted to recreate the sounds using Brit vocalists. Bearing in mind the problems I had I wish you the very best of luck trying to do it with the original artists who by now will probably have morphed into very different performers who will pretty much need to re-learn the way they sang way back in the day and who may, by now, sing in completely different keys.

If you're going to attempt anything like Motown or The Wall of Sound you'll need, at the very least, a six man rhythm section (Extra keyboards and a percussionist) in addition to the strings and brass, but even if you're doing really stripped down shoestring label stuff you'll often find that you need both piano and organ, so that's two keys again. We were up to 20 people in the band (Can't remember if that included the sound man...) before it all started to fall apart. Never managed to get all of them together at one time.

If you manage to get performers who are still 'doing it' you might find they already have their own arrangements, but if you have to crank them up yourself (Just a thought here, long shot, but depending upon who you get I may have some arrangements already written...) please check with the performer first. My brother got roped in to play the fiddle parts when Hardrock Gunther came over. The management sent him tapes of all the pieces he'd be doing. He learned everything spot on, then on the day discovered that Gunther now sang everything between one and two tones lower. There are some things that you just can't do two tones lower...

[Paul-s]

Hi, this is my first post but I've enjoyed reading some of the threads.

I'm posting in the hope that the users of this board can help me with a project which I have been nurturing for a long while but would like to now try and move forward with.

Please indulge me while I explain a bit of context: I'm a Northern fan, but a long, long way from an expert- my knowledge of the music comes from the scooter scene from where it has got under my skin, and I now find myself in a position where I'm able to initiate a project which I think would be of great interest to the Northern scene, and something unique. I'm posting as a humble amateur hoping for some guidance!

My interest is in a live project for 2009. My belief, from my modest knowledge, is that although many soul artists have appeared live on the weekender and scooter rally circuit, it has typically been using musical arrangements which fit the capabilities of a (stripped down) band, sometimes with a US artist playing with a UK band for example. On record many of the greatest soul tunes are drenched in string, horn and percussion arrangements which the technical and budgetary constraints of weekender venues, promoters and budgets aren't able to accommodate.

My proposal is to work with an orchestral string and brass section (alongside a bass/ guitar/ drums / keys band) and two or three named soul singers to present a big scale Northern show which presents the music as it was recorded, and affords it the budget and credibility that it is sometimes denied The objective is not be to try and achieve a slavish reproduction of the recordings, but to actually use the original arrangements and instrumentation as the basis of the performance. There's no doubting that transcribing some of the arrangements is going to be ambitious but I think it's an effort worth making.

Obviously for the project to make sense the songs featured need to be (heavily) orchestrated rather than simply arranged, and there is then the issue that many of the original artists may have passed away or disappeared so you would need a few (male and female) singers who could handle the whole proposed set.

I guess the concept is something like The Northern Soul Songbook: Live (but that makes it sound very cheesy!) but it needs to be respectful, accurate and, well, soulful. I'm absolutely not talking about a dumbed-down West End style show: I'd like to present something that recognises soul music and it's importance in the UK's social history by putting it in the context of a "serious" music venue. (hope that doesn't sound too up itself!)

I'm looking for comments on what you think the best 15 or 20 songs that would fit the criteria above would be, and then, who would choose (that's still alive!) to perform them? I guess the question is, what would be your fantasy Northern soul show (setlist, and performers with original arrangements). I've got a few ideas but I would be really grateful for any contributions.

I should finally clarify that I'm not a wannabe impressario who wants to make a fast buck out of northern soul. I am almost certain that this will not be a profitable venture, but I am lucky enough to work in an organisation which has a wide remit for interesting musical projects and this is something I have wanted to get off the ground for a couple of years. I am involved in many genres of music - classical music being one - which receive substantial public subsidy and I now have the opportunity to "redress the balance" a little and initiate a project which probably couldn't happen in a purely commercial context. I hope that you will appreciate that my motives are sincere, and offer any advice in the same spirit.

I hope that I have posted this in the right place, but perhaps the moderators would move it if not.

Thanks for reading the rather windy post, and I look forward to any comments.

IT SHOULD BE DONE. Im sick of seeing artists in UK with taped backing or a minimal down band. J.J. Barnes in Seattle had Full string and brass sections and a conductor....and it sounded INCREDIBLE! Good luck.