Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 (edited) Just soughting the boxes out for the Winsford Allnighter on Saturday and i'm so tempted to include Charles Diamond And The Inspirations - No One Else Can Take Your Place - Break Through B81582T - Can anyone confirm what the story is on this record? i picked it up several years ago for about £20.00 knowing of course it was not an authentic first generation copy as that is dog rare with maybe two or three reasonable condition originals out there? a record that has remained ultra rare and hard to find. Am i correct in thinking that the copy i have is a legit re issue dated 1977? put out by Joey Jefferson also am i correct that this is a slightly different mix? to the original and am i also correct that even the second issue goes for a few quid, bit of a dilema really as because of the lack of originals this fantastic record never hardly gets played and it's up there with the best of them, being from the 'when i DJ' i play authentic records camp and i'm not gonna start now or am i moving the goal posts here i just feel are there any circumstances where such tunes on a second issue should get the odd spin being that some attitudes have changed these days towards what format the tunes come via, i have played it on the show several times and stated it's the second press, i would be interested to know if there are any current DJ's who have an original of this record, i suspect Tim Brown, Kenny Burrell may have it but i'm not totally sure, is it best left to them to play it if the mood is right or do we give the 1977 copy a go? Regards - Mark Bicknell. Edited October 6, 2006 by Mark Bicknell Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Mick Smith's got it, he has Searling's old copy, it's a one sided disc with an orange label, Breakthrough is in a straight line across the top, I was looking at it about a month back. The reissue has a much fuller production and lasts a good 25 seconds longer. I persoanlly prefer the second version. I found Charles Diamond himself about 2 years back, his missus wrote to me for some reason, can't quite remember now. I put them in touch with Kev Roberts Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 Mick Smith's got it, he has Searling's old copy, it's a one sided disc with an orange label, Breakthrough is in a straight line across the top, I was looking at it about a month back. The reissue has a much fuller production and lasts a good 25 seconds longer. I persoanlly prefer the second version. I found Charles Diamond himself about 2 years back, his missus wrote to me for some reason, can't quite remember now. I put them in touch with Kev Roberts Cheers Pete, of course Mick Smith has it but i bet there are not many more out there, i knew it was an Orange original seen a scan of it, so the one i have is a legit re issue as i suspected then? Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Baz Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I cant see a problem if its a ligit second issue I mean plenty of people play the 'gold' four voices out, if every one i've herd play is the green one it aint as rare as its rated No differnt to playing a unissued thing then offering vinyl carvers jobbie and passing it around to your friends or what not, especially as the insperations is a land mark rarity, could do with more exposure, herd of a few people playing the primers of 'acetates' so whats good for the goose.............. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Godzilla Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Charles Diamond has a pic of the reissue on his site: https://www.charlesdiamond.indiegroup.com/photo.html Mind you the Sunlovers pic ooks pretty iffy too. you could always contact him through the site for more info. Godz Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 I cant see a problem if its a ligit second issue I mean plenty of people play the 'gold' four voices out, if every one i've herd play is the green one it aint as rare as its rated No differnt to playing a unissued thing then offering vinyl carvers jobbie and passing it around to your friends or what not, especially as the insperations is a land mark rarity, could do with more exposure, herd of a few people playing the primers of 'acetates' so whats good for the goose.............. Good points there Baz, as Pete said the second issue sounds much fuller in sound than the original, love the tune to bits me and i may consider the odd spin out and about but not if we are gonna get shot down in flames....lol Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Baz Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Mick Smith's got it, he has Searling's old copy, it's a one sided disc with an orange label, Breakthrough is in a straight line across the top, I was looking at it about a month back. The reissue has a much fuller production and lasts a good 25 seconds longer. I persoanlly prefer the second version. I found Charles Diamond himself about 2 years back, his missus wrote to me for some reason, can't quite remember now. I put them in touch with Kev Roberts I always thought (persummed) it was instrumental on one side and vocal on the other, so whats the really rare one the instrumental or the vocal then where did either or come from after that? Please dont tell me i've dreamed of a vocal side to this as the instrumental dont do nothing for me but the vocal kicks arse Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I always thought (persummed) it was instrumental on one side and vocal on the other, so whats the really rare one the instrumental or the vocal then where did either or come from after that? Please dont tell me i've dreamed of a vocal side to this as the instrumental dont do nothing for me but the vocal kicks arse Like I said, the original is one sided. The instrumental came along when the reissue came out Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest trickbag Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 We are they now! Background song playing on this page is "No One Else Can Take Your Place" Recorded by: Charles Diamond & The Inspirations mark you could try his home page hope this helps ricky. sock it to em shorty. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ted Massey Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I have Jim wensioras old copy paid £200 for it those were the days, it has a delta mark in the run out 69491 mine must have belonged to Ian Gilibrand at one time as that is scratched in grooves as well Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 I have Jim wensioras old copy paid £200 for it those were the days, it has a delta mark in the run out 69491 mine must have belonged to Ian Gilibrand at one time as that is scratched in grooves as well So that's Ted's, Mick Smith who has the other couple of copies then?, looks like Charles Diamond only has the second issue? and if Ted has it i might just put mine back on the shelf and enjoy it at home but not at the gigs, would be against the grain for me like i said, it was just a question and deep down i know the answer, thanks. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Chalky Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I cant see a problem if its a ligit second issue I mean plenty of people play the 'gold' four voices out, if every one i've herd play is the green one it aint as rare as its rated No differnt to playing a unissued thing then offering vinyl carvers jobbie and passing it around to your friends or what not, especially as the insperations is a land mark rarity, could do with more exposure, herd of a few people playing the primers of 'acetates' so whats good for the goose.............. a few? who? only heard of one dj playing a cut Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest hammy Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I think Mark Wilson's meant to have a copy as well. He posts on here from time to time. Hammy Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark B Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 ginger had one originally and sold it to m koppel i think then he bought it back first time martin sold up dont know if he has still got it though mark Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Jaco Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 So that's Ted's, Mick Smith who has the other couple of copies then?, looks like Charles Diamond only has the second issue? and if Ted has it i might just put mine back on the shelf and enjoy it at home but not at the gigs, would be against the grain for me like i said, it was just a question and deep down i know the answer, thanks. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Mark, understand where you are coming from with this but the second issue is still mighty fine and worth a spin for those who may never hear the original as it is in so few hands. Actually quite like the instrumental and was puzzled on first hearing as I always believed,as is the case, that the original was one sided. It was then explained to me that a second issue had been made by Joey Jefferson. Was this specifically in response to the buzz created at the time by the original? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
TEDDY EDDY Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 [/ last copy of this to turn up was kev barrett and his mate from texas they got it from bill osment s shop in kansas city ( i think tim brown bought it ) ian cunnliffe gave them the address in 86 or somewhere around then , idont think they cut him on the deal either;;;] Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Sean Hampsey Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Where did it all go wrong? In 1976 / 77 when the reissue first came about, every Northern DJ (including myself) in every club in the UK was playing this version / copy. How is it possible that... almost 30 years later... a DJ would risk getting 'shot down in flames' for playing such a FANTASTIC record! If anyone out there is so anally uptight that they'd complain or object they must be truly messed up. Jeez Mark.... damn the torpedoes and play the darn thing! Sean Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Bjorn Nilsson Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Where did it all go wrong? In 1976 / 77 when the reissue first came about, every Northern DJ (including myself) in every club in the UK was playing this version / copy. How is it possible that... almost 30 years later... a DJ would risk getting 'shot down in flames' for playing such a FANTASTIC record! If anyone out there is so anally uptight that they'd complain or object they must be truly messed up. Jeez Mark.... damn the torpedoes and play the darn thing! Sean Yes, and espescially when the second issue has a completely different (and better) mix! I think it's way better than the first issue. Would be sad if the only place you can hear it is at home. How much is this second issue worth? Can't remember seeing one for sale so it must be pretty rare as well? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
pikeys dog Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 How much is this second issue worth? £20 - that's how much i sold it for on eBay Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Then there`s the version i once owned,sold to mad Mikc Summers,for nothing as he never paid me,same music diffrant lyrics,asked MMS for it bakc,he said Tommo`,nikced his(my) records,thank`s Tommo looks like we`ll never see it again,and i cant prove it exsisted,played it out more than a couple of times. The title.let me lick your wound,the Insperations,if anybody knows owt,please let the people know i`m not bullshiting. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 Where did it all go wrong? In 1976 / 77 when the reissue first came about, every Northern DJ (including myself) in every club in the UK was playing this version / copy. How is it possible that... almost 30 years later... a DJ would risk getting 'shot down in flames' for playing such a FANTASTIC record! If anyone out there is so anally uptight that they'd complain or object they must be truly messed up. Jeez Mark.... damn the torpedoes and play the darn thing! Sean Good points Sean, i guess some of us set ourselves up way back, old school and all that, must collect and play originals, still we all know in the cold light of day that this is not always the case, i too remember it being played way back possibly this version? sometimes this purist attitude in playing original authentic records can be a negative aspect of the DJ thing, so load your torpedoes as i might bang it in The Winsford spot, a top tune. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 Good points Sean, i guess some of us set ourselves up way back, old school and all that, must collect and play originals, still we all know in the cold light of day that this is not always the case, i too remember it being played way back possibly this version? sometimes this purist attitude in playing original authentic records can be a negative aspect of the DJ thing, so load your torpedoes as i might bang it in The Winsford spot, a top tune. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Best we don't turn this thread into yet another 'Originals versus Boots' thing again, i was simply wishing to confirm my thoughts that this 45 is a legit re issue rather than an unofficial bootleg. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest FYLDECOAST Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Best we don't turn this thread into yet another 'Originals versus Boots' thing again, i was simply wishing to confirm my thoughts that this 45 is a legit re issue rather than an unofficial bootleg. Regards - Mark Bicknell. I was chatting to Brian Wakelin recently about what would be played at his mecca reunion night .I brought up the subject of this record and suggested that the re-recorded version could be considered an original in a roundabout sort of way . Brian played it last saturday resulting in many people enjoying a brilliant and rarely played out record Steve Mc Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 I was chatting to Brian Wakelin recently about what would be played at his mecca reunion night .I brought up the subject of this record and suggested that the re-recorded version could be considered an original in a roundabout sort of way . Brian played it last saturday resulting in many people enjoying a brilliant and rarely played out record Steve Mc I guess that's my whole point Steve, in instances like this perhaps the original only rule can be wavered, was it a total re record? i thought it was just a different mix, as Pete S stated also a longer version. Thanks for your comments. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I guess that's my whole point Steve, in instances like this perhaps the original only rule can be wavered, was it a total re record? i thought it was just a different mix, as Pete S stated also a longer version. Thanks for your comments. Regards - Mark Bicknell. For fukc`s sake,just play it man its real. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 For fukc`s sake,just play it man its real. Don't swear at me Ken...lol Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest FYLDECOAST Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I guess that's my whole point Steve, in instances like this perhaps the original only rule can be wavered, was it a total re record? i thought it was just a different mix, as Pete S stated also a longer version. Thanks for your comments. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Seem to recall that Neil Rushton related a story where the original master was lost ,so a new version was recorded for the pink copies . Anyone confirm ? Steve Mc Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter Richer Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Hi Mark, I tend to agree with the point indicated by 'Fyldecoast'. As I understand it, because the master tapes were lost, Joey Jefferson got the group back into the studio to re-record the track. Plus, as Pete Smith stated, the 1977 version of the song is different. On this basis I think (for us purists!), playing the record out CAN be justified on the basis that this version of the track is actually AN original. Think of it as being a similar situation to Minnie Jones doing a different version of Shadow Of A Memory to that of 21st Century. Except that in this case, of course, the first and second artists are the same people. And .... I fully intend to play it at Whitley Bay on 14th October!! Peter PS - one point of caution though, out of respect I wouldn't play it at a venue where I thought one of the other DJs had an orange Breakthrough copy with them to play. Soooo ... (you've guessed it) - 'Don't Say That I've Been Unfair, ... '!!! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Baz Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Any one got a clip of both versions? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest martyn Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Hi Mark, I tend to agree with the point indicated by 'Fyldecoast'. As I understand it, because the master tapes were lost, Joey Jefferson got the group back into the studio to re-record the track. Plus, as Pete Smith stated, the 1977 version of the song is different. On this basis I think (for us purists!), playing the record out CAN be justified on the basis that this version of the track is actually AN original. Think of it as being a similar situation to Minnie Jones doing a different version of Shadow Of A Memory to that of 21st Century. Except that in this case, of course, the first and second artists are the same people. And .... I fully intend to play it at Whitley Bay on 14th October!! Peter PS - one point of caution though, out of respect I wouldn't play it at a venue where I thought one of the other DJs had an orange Breakthrough copy with them to play. Soooo ... (you've guessed it) - 'Don't Say That I've Been Unfair, ... '!!! The 77 cut is superb & as discussed is an original in its own right........What a shame if people were denied hearing this due to there only being 3 orange copies,which (if my memory serves me right) isnt as 'polished' as the second recording Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 Hi Mark, I tend to agree with the point indicated by 'Fyldecoast'. As I understand it, because the master tapes were lost, Joey Jefferson got the group back into the studio to re-record the track. Plus, as Pete Smith stated, the 1977 version of the song is different. On this basis I think (for us purists!), playing the record out CAN be justified on the basis that this version of the track is actually AN original. Think of it as being a similar situation to Minnie Jones doing a different version of Shadow Of A Memory to that of 21st Century. Except that in this case, of course, the first and second artists are the same people. And .... I fully intend to play it at Whitley Bay on 14th October!! Peter PS - one point of caution though, out of respect I wouldn't play it at a venue where I thought one of the other DJs had an orange Breakthrough copy with them to play. Soooo ... (you've guessed it) - 'Don't Say That I've Been Unfair, ... '!!! Ok. however, the original was cut around 1966 was it not? if it is a re record then they nailed it really well, some 11 years on if the re record was done in 1977, i'm gonna try and email Mr Diamond and see if he can give the full story, see what happens? Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Simon T Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 INSPIRATIONS - JOHNNY H - NO ONE - BREAKTHROUGH - 1 SIDED Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Simon T Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 INSPIRATIONS - CHARLES D - NO ONE - BREAKTHROUGH + INSTR. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Codfromderby Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 INSPIRATIONS - JOHNNY H - NO ONE - BREAKTHROUGH - 1 SIDED is that the original one, cause my goldmine lp version dont sound like that Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 INSPIRATIONS - CHARLES D - NO ONE - BREAKTHROUGH + INSTR. Thanks Simon for posting both versions, i don't have the tecnology to do that nor the original version....lol Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Simon T Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 is that the original one, cause my goldmine lp version dont sound like that Just taken it from a 20+ year old tape from Ted Massey to PC to mp3 to site....... Ted, it looks like Jim W sold you a goldmine single Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Nocker Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Hey Mark I am one of your punters, used to go to the Witchwood in AUL. I don't care if you play the '77 version. as its an original in its own right. Remade or remixed whatever! its a differant version of a know track. It happens on the Nothern scene, just play it. Its a top sound. Everyone know you are a originals only d.j anyway so I for one wouldn't be critial it you gave this a well needed spin. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ted Massey Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Heres the 60's version Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 Heres the 60's version Wow! forgot Ted that's a bit good mate, still the other mix holds it own....what you reckon musically a draw? both versions are the dogs bollocks i think...lol and different so perhaps not a bootleg against original debate more of two versions of a fantastic song. Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ted Massey Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Wow! forgot Ted that's a bit good mate, still the other mix holds it own....what you reckon musically a draw? both versions are the dogs bollocks i think...lol and different so perhaps not a bootleg against original debate more of two versions of a fantastic song. Mark Bicknell. Hi Mark I have the other version on tape somewhere and i seem to remember really liking it, sound file any one Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 Hi Mark I have the other version on tape somewhere and i seem to remember really liking it, sound file any one Has Simon not posted both versions above Ted. Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ted Massey Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Just taken it from a 20+ year old tape from Ted Massey to PC to mp3 to site....... Ted, it looks like Jim W sold you a goldmine single he sold me a few, gold i mean Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ted Massey Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Has Simon not posted both versions above Ted. Mark Bicknell. that will teach me to read the full thread dont seem to be able to get the 70's one to work Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Sean Hampsey Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Good points Sean, i guess some of us set ourselves up way back, old school and all that, must collect and play originals, still we all know in the cold light of day that this is not always the case, i too remember it being played way back possibly this version? sometimes this purist attitude in playing original authentic records can be a negative aspect of the DJ thing, so load your torpedoes as i might bang it in The Winsford spot, a top tune. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Thanks Mark, I like your style and fully understand and appreciate why you asked the original question. Personally, I've seen more than a few re-issues on the decks over the years, but I honestly believe that there needs to be a dotted line (at least) between the purist aspirations of the collector and the entertainment role of the DJ, who's main purpose should be to enlighten, delight and involve the crowd with good quality music. It would be pitiful if such a great record were excluded from your playlist (particularly when you have the seasoned 'good taste' to want to play it) on the basis that it's a 're-recording' or such. At a gig quite Recently I played the 21st century re-recording of Lou Pride's "I'm Coming Home In The Morning" to critical and quite positive acclaim. Hey, if it's good enough for Lou pride who am I to ignore it? But I don't give much of a damn about the 'knockers' particularly when the dancefloor were clearly having a great time and enjoying the track... because, I've always believed that as a Soul Music DJ... giving people a good time is what I'm paid to do. And sometimes (if not always ) that's what I'm about! Cheers Mark... and give it to 'em loud at the weekend! Sean Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 4, 2006 Author Share Posted October 4, 2006 Thanks Mark, I like your style and fully understand and appreciate why you asked the original question. Personally, I've seen more than a few re-issues on the decks over the years, but I honestly believe that there needs to be a dotted line (at least) between the purist aspirations of the collector and the entertainment role of the DJ, who's main purpose should be to enlighten, delight and involve the crowd with good quality music. It would be pitiful if such a great record were excluded from your playlist (particularly when you have the seasoned 'good taste' to want to play it) on the basis that it's a 're-recording' or such. At a gig quite Recently I played the 21st century re-recording of Lou Pride's "I'm Coming Home In The Morning" to critical and quite positive acclaim. Hey, if it's good enough for Lou pride who am I to ignore it? But I don't give much of a damn about the 'knockers' particularly when the dancefloor were clearly having a great time and enjoying the track... because, I've always believed that as a Soul Music DJ... giving people a good time is what I'm paid to do. And sometimes (if not always ) that's what I'm about! Cheers Mark... and give it to 'em loud at the weekend! Sean Thanks Sean for your well thought out and very constructive comments here, like i said i'm not trying to move the goal posts here just trying to i guess justify the inclusion of a different and what seems to be a legit re - record, different mix or whatever, many unissued recordings have found there way onto the scene in recent years be it directly from a master tape via the likes of Ady Croasdell and Kent Records for example or from Dubs taken from CD's etc. with or without the consent or knowledge of the source of the material, the 'Chris Clark' track taken form the Universal Anthology springs to mind and was out there pretty quickly when the CD was issued......why? it's a top track is the answer, yes you could simply play it directly from the CD rather than a disc dub but that's the choice i guess of the person and the Northern ethic or playing something that resembles a record, stuff like Al Williams - 'Try Them' and The Servicemen - 'I'll Stop Loving You', Eddie Holman - 'Hold Me In Your Arms' put out by Grapevine are just three examples here of outstanding unissued material that simply need playing off any format simply again because this music needs playing, it gives the scene a different dimension, more music to go at and enjoy and is a seperate issue to the original versus bootleg debate i think. I have been DJ'ing on this scene for about twenty six years from about 1980/81 and after being pulled up one night at Hinckley way back for playing Jimmy Mack - 'My World Is On Fire' on Soul Galore from a well known DJ who was due on just after me and who is still around today who basically said "Why are you playing that as I have it on Palmer"????? For me the penny dropped and from that day to this i have never played anything less than a record on it's first generation USA Original at a live venue, out of respect to the point raised by the DJ, being true to myself as a Rare Soul DJ, basically if i wanted to continue DJ'ing then it had to be done correctly from my own personal perspective and i choose to do it the most authentic way i know how, i guess the point here is that in the main most DJ's if they are totally honest would rather play original 45's it's the nature of the game.Yes it's about entertainment, filling the floor and doing the best you can, but in the Northern Soul DJ world it's a lot to do with reputaion, depth and quality of collection, time served and yes original records i'm sorry but i don't care what anyone says this fact plays a major part and i'm sorry but saying it don't matter is simply a poor excuse and a way to justify cutting corners....bugger i did'nt want to turn this into what i've turned it into...lol I'm not talking about being anti bootleg here as this conversation and debate will continue as long as the scene lasts, i guess it's a personal issue. And this is why i basically asked the question on the Charles Diamond 45? is it authentic? it would seem yes, is it legit? it would seem yes, so do i play it out? maybe yes, or do i wait until 'Ted' sells me his first generation 60's Orange BreakThrough copy which will be when hell freezes over....lol or do i simply stick with the purist attitude and ethic and play something else? Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Gene-r Posted October 4, 2006 Share Posted October 4, 2006 (edited) Ok. however, the original was cut around 1966 was it not? if it is a re record then they nailed it really well, some 11 years on if the re record was done in 1977, i'm gonna try and email Mr Diamond and see if he can give the full story, see what happens? Regards - Mark Bicknell. Hi Mark, Judging by the delta matrix Ted supplied (69491), it would date it to approximately November-December 1967. And yes, I agree - what a stonking record! May play mine at Kent on the 14th and London on the 20th! Gene Edited October 4, 2006 by Gene-R Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 4, 2006 Share Posted October 4, 2006 (edited) Hi Mark, Judging by the delta matrix Ted supplied (69491), it would date it to approximately November-December 1967. And yes, I agree - what a stonking record! May play mine at Kent on the 14th and London on the 20th! Gene Will you have time Gene before you come to Solid Hit ? At the risk of being shot down in flames (by some) yes Mark I think it's a case of moving the goalposts & I take the point that you're only asking opinions. Yes there's only a couple of originals (?) but then thats the thing with Northern.(You've been doing this a lot longer than me I don't need to tell you) Maybe Butch is playing a one off, do we turn around & say well it's a great record but you can only hear it if you attend an event that Butch is at. I want to hear it in Gravesend so somebody tapes his set & releases a boot. A bit different to your original question perhaps but you get my drift. To be honest if you didn't know the answer you wouldn't have asked the question. IMO a vinyl carver pressing of a totally unreleased items is fair game. It's all about opinions isn't it ? Edited October 4, 2006 by Dave G Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Trev Thomas Posted October 4, 2006 Share Posted October 4, 2006 Good points there Baz, as Pete said the second issue sounds much fuller in sound than the original, love the tune to bits me and i may consider the odd spin out and about but not if we are gonna get shot down in flames....lol Mark Bicknell. ============================================================= at the end of the day mark, if its an official release & a different mix then in reality its a totally different record..you go ahead & play it mate Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted October 4, 2006 Author Share Posted October 4, 2006 ============================================================= at the end of the day mark, if its an official release & a different mix then in reality its a totally different record..you go ahead & play it mate It would seem that most of us agree on this that it's a different mix from the original 66/67 'BreakThrough' issue and a bloody good one at that, not heard back from Mr Diamond with his comments, might not even get a reply....lol i think the comments raised about a disc dub from a tape of an exclusive record or one off is a very different issue? and does this go on? lol. I'm simply just trying to play by the rules if there are any? Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Dave Moore Posted October 4, 2006 Share Posted October 4, 2006 I'm simply just trying to play by the rules if there are any? Regards - Mark Bicknell. Mark, The "rules" for Rare Soul have never changed. Just the people who are involved in it. You know the answer to your question otherwise you wouldn't be sort of "seeking approval", you'd just do it. "Thin edge of the wedge" comes to mind....but then you know that, that's why you asked the question in the first place eh? Sorry to buck the general trend of the thread but there you go. Regards, Dave www.theresthatbeat.com www.hitsvillesoulclub.com www.soulclub.org www.deancourtney.com Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
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