Northern Soul Snob's

[Barry]

The ones that mind don't matter... and the ones that matter don't mind, Barry.

Sean

Sean, you are a very wise man.

[Guest soulboy]

Isn't original vinyl collecting more about the money these days? It's a rich man's sport isn't it?

For sure, everyone can amass a collection of £10-20 cheapies but I doubt they'll fill a dancefloor or create much excitement in collectors circles or on a dancefloor as a large boxful of mega expensive rarities.

I think money has transformed the scene into something that's become almost a caricature of what it used to be about - a bit like the Premier League really, namely, that only a handful of people can afford the big rarities, like only the richest teams can afford the best players.

The Salvadores made sense to me when I had two or three copies in the 70's first time around for less than £20 apiece. The record doesn't sound any better now @ £3,516 and I don't think I could justify paying the additional £3,496 for a copy now. Multiply that times all the conceivable big money tunes that I might fancy owning again at some point and there wouldn't be much change out of £500,000.

So, yes, for sure there's a large element of snobbery about Northern Soul except that these days you have to be in a position to afford it!

I quite often wonder if when I make my next million will I be likely to amass yet another top-notch collection of originals? I'm not so sure these days. I've heard everything a zillion times, I've owned virtually everything I've ever wanted on O.V. at some stage or another and I already have multiple copies of everything I want on numerous formats anyway, so I guess the only reason I'd need 'em all again would be ego/snobbery related.

People wear their record collections like badges of honour nowdays and it seems that everyone has the mandatory few boxes of big money items in their homes. Surely anyone with a spare £250K can whip together a heart-stopping collection pretty quickly these days can't they?

So is it possible to be a serious O.V. collector if you're in a low paid job, broke, paying for a trail of divorces, supporting numerous children or been recently made redundant?

If anyone can advise how I can replace my entire 70's collections on O.V. for less than £250K then let me know!

Answers on a postcard please......

Ian D

SPOT ON !

[Guest]

Jesus! Northern Soul bras. Now there's an idea. Any pics knocking around.........?

Ian D

[Dave Rimmer]

I've owned virtually everything I've ever wanted on O.V. at some stage or another

Ian D

Ian

Sorry to edit your post so harshly, but it was the above sentence that grabbed my eye.

Why did you buy them all on original vinyl in the first place ? I suspect it was because you could, and didn't want bootlegs.

So does that make you any different from the original vinyl collector of today ? I think not.

I don't think the issue is about collecting OV or bootlegs, it's about the playing of bootlegs by DJs. It's an easy one to solve. If you are a DJ, don't put any bootlegs or second issues in your DJ box. Problem solved

[Steve G]

Do they still play Mel Britt at Northern Soul nights, Steve?

FFS, no wonder everyones getting lathered up!

I thought it was a played out record 30 odd years ago. I don't think I've been anywhere where I'm likely to have heard that particular track since the 70's.

Lovely tune, but I'm with you all the way... if some Northern Soul 'DJ's' really are playing the likes of Mel Britt pressings, as opposed to the tens of thousands of alternative originals available then its a sorry (nay laughable) state of affairs!

Sean

Hi Sean, I am trying to think of a northern venue I have been to recently that HASN'T played Mel Britt . Seriously it's everywhere you go. My copy is now cracked so I couldn't play it if I wanted to.....which is a shame because I genuinly like the record. I haven't set about replacing it either - because I don't want a boot, and I don't want to join the clamour of trophy hunters all trying to outdo each other for the next available needle burnt copy. As I say (and as I think you agree) there are plenty more records out there.

And I don't think it all has to be rare either, for example I've heard Chalky play some great £5-£10 records at Northern nights and at Blue Skies we play a number of cheap and cheerful 'greats' like Chuck Bernard doing his David Ruffin impression - the best £7 any aspiring DJ could ever spend. Steve

Edited March 18, 2009 by Steve G

[Guest gordon russell]

playing boots allows people who have no place behind the decks to get behind the decks,dosn't happen at quality nighters...cause they won't allow it.Happens mostly on a local level where they are there to massage their egos (they don't realise it has the opposite effect,they're seen for what they are twats!!.We might also observe these type of djs..never venture further than the county they live in and never venture out as a soul fan to other folks venues

[Ian Dewhirst]

Ian

Why did you buy them all on original vinyl in the first place ? I suspect it was because you could, and didn't want bootlegs.

So does that make you any different from the original vinyl collector of today ? I think not.

Actually it's a bit simpler than that Dave. I did the bulk of my O.V. collecting in the early 70's when a rare record was but one week's wages at the most. The most I think I ever paid for a record was probably £100. I actively made the decision to go to the U.S. and find 'em myself in 1975 when I got outbid on a Bernie Williams. I would have been comfortable paying £40 but it got bid up to £120 and 2 x £15 swaps making it £150 and that's when I lost interest as I saw the way things were going even in 1975.

Additionally, I've always been a notorious tightass who divides his money pretty equally between wine, women and song, and the costs of the songs would have started impacting on the wine and women front!

I've replaced my original collection no less than 3 times since the 70's and never paid more than $1 a record but I did spend a massive amount of time in the U.S. in the 80's which is where the bulk of my 2nd and 3rd collections came from.

Also, lest anyone get the wrong idea, I was a notorious snob back then and would get very sniffy about some prat playing a boot. However, these days I think the O.V.O. philosophy misses the point except for the newer discoveries. I actually wouldn't play O.V. out regularly on different decks as I know only too well the damage that you can do to 'em by repeated plays on different decks and certainly I'd never play a styrene pressing out (anyone who plays Billy Woods or Mel Britt on different decks is asking for trouble IMO). This point was amplified recently when I looked through a 'name' jocks box and saw that he carried an original and a boot of virtually everything in his box - one for actually playing and the other to assert his O.V.O. credentials!

Also, everyone seems obsessed with getting mint O.V. copies these days which is also nuts. How are you ever gonna find a mint rarity of anything when the O.V.O. brigade is around?

These days my philosophy has changed a lot. I've got everything I've ever owned or wanted on multiple formats. The days of me having a couple of hundred grand's worth of stuff gathering dust on my shelves have gone only to be replaced with 100 times the amount of music I've ever had in my life. I'm listening to more music these days than ever and I always have a few thousand tunes on hand that I haven't even had time to listen to. Anytime I want to examine the beauty of an O.V. which I don't own I can nip round to a mates or dip in a DJ's box at a gig and w*nk over the label for a minute or two.

Also, O.V. was a seriously long extended phase for me which lasted the best part of 30 years or so - a serious addiction every bit as compulsive as drugs IMO. I started to break the addiction sometime in the mid 1980's when I was looking at houses purely for their vinyl storage capabilities and since then it's been a long hard road to recovery. One step at a time.......it's also worth pointing out that I collect numerous genres of music and there's not a house big enough to store everything I need on vinyl.

Also times are changing my friends. I had 30,000 tunes with me @ Prestatyn - ten times more than all the DJ's and Dealers put together. I kinda like having a wide choice and I had a couple of listening sessions where I could choose anything I wanted to play to someone within seconds. That is handier for me in this day and age than trailing around a lorry LOL....

Still nothing beats the beauty of holding a 7" piece of magic in your hands and glorying at the minutiae of a label but @ a couple of grand a pop it's an expensive luxury rather than a necessity for me these days.

Ian D

[Guest johnm]

I'd like to think i'm inbetween

I play original vinyl only(bar the odd unreleased boot) but i'm not a twat about people who don't...each to their own...I think a lot of people come across as utter dicks on here but when you meet them in real life most tend to be pretty cool (Me being a prime example hahaha)

Isn't this part of the problem - you say you play OVO but then mention you play the odd boot...

....isn't this a contradiction i.e you don't just play OVO?

[Guest Beeks]

Isn't this part of the problem - you say you play OVO but then mention you play the odd boot...

....isn't this a contradiction i.e you don't just play OVO?

No it's not...only boot I have is Tammi Terrell - All I Do Is Think About You which is unreleased...so i'm not so far up my own arse that I won't play a record on boot if it is not available on an original release

[Mace]

they're seen for what they are twats!!.

don't mince your words mate, say it as you see it

[Mace]

I had 30,000 tunes with me @ Prestatyn - ten times more than all the DJ's and Dealers put together. I kinda like having a wide choice and I had a couple of listening sessions where I could choose anything I wanted to play to someone within seconds. That is handier for me in this day and age than trailing around a lorry LOL....

Ian D

So how many of the 30,000 did you actually manage to listen to over the weekend?

Hope there wasn't any repeats

[Ian Dewhirst]

No it's not...only boot I have is Tammi Terrell - All I Do Is Think About You which is unreleased...so i'm not so far up my own arse that I won't play a record on boot if it is not available on an original release

The Brenda Holloway version's better Beeks. Also check out the 'b' side of Stevie Wonders "That Girl" for the Modern Soul version by the master himself!

Ian D

[Roger Williams]

don't mince your words mate, say it as you see it

When in truth, the real twats are the twats calling others twats.

[Ian Dewhirst]

So how many of the 30,000 did you actually manage to listen to over the weekend?

Hope there wasn't any repeats

Yeah but I HAD 'em all there at my constant whim and disposal 24/7 from Thursday to Sunday with enough backup and firepower to deal with anything! If Eula Cooper had proposed to me I could have left there and then with my whole collection!

Ian D

[Ian Dewhirst]

When in truth, the real twats are the twats calling others twats.

I'm lost Rog. Who are the real twats and who are just the wanna-be twats?

Ian D

[Simsy]

I went to a soul night recently and it was pressings a go go. I can't remember if it was more than £5 to get in, but I think it was. Thinking back I should have asked for a refund. Taking more than a fiver from people and playing them records that are not real is a con.

[Guest Beeks]

The Brenda Holloway version's better Beeks. Also check out the 'b' side of Stevie Wonders "That Girl" for the Modern Soul version by the master himself!

Ian D

I've heard both of those versions Ian and beg to differ...Tammis version is far superior than either of them IMHO

[Little-stevie]

The Brenda Holloway version's better Beeks. Also check out the 'b' side of Stevie Wonders "That Girl" for the Modern Soul version by the master himself!

Ian D

Is that... you think its better Ian or should we all think that... Snob

[KevH]

I've heard both of those versions Ian and beg to differ...Tammis version is far superior than either of them IMHO

only one way to sort it out...................

FIGHT...............

[Guest Beeks]

only one way to sort it out...................

FIGHT...............

Kev ye shit stirring little bastard ye

Edited March 18, 2009 by Beeks

[KevH]

Kev ye shit stirring little bastard ye

NOT ME YOUNG SIR .

Was going to apologise for being off topic,,,,but not sure what the question was.

[Ian Dewhirst]

only one way to sort it out...................

FIGHT...............

We don't wanna do that Kev. My weapons collection is up-to-the-minute, state-of-the-art concealed weaponry of the highest order - including some nice new industrial strength grade 3 mace and a remote electric-shocker which I'm dying to try out.....I'm afraid there's no O.W.O. policy here mate, so tell 'em to leave their cutlasses and sling shots at the door before I pick 'em off early..........

Snob? Moi........?

Ian D

[Steve G]

The name Steve Chadwick springs to mind.

ROD

Yes I actually agree with you there Rod, Chadwick was the classic case of a trophy hunter, who JUST needed to have a box of rare records. Don't think he'd even heard of Bobby Womack or Sam Dees or Bettye Swann, and yet he got booking after booking on the Northern scene because of his box of "Trophy records". £250,000 sure can buy you a collection, but people like Chadwick don't make up the majority of todays DJ's do they?.

Surely serious DJ's must have a balanced and broad based collection which encompasses both rare and not so rare (and more than one beat/ style). Serious DJs take years to build their collections, there is no instant fix - Levine tried it in the late 90s hoovering up everything in sight, and it didn't really work for him and he sold them all off again.

The reality is as Terry says - far to many wannabe DJ's who don't have the goods and hide behind excuses like "the punters don't care", or "It's only a few mixed in with a few originals" etc etc. I won't even bother going to a place where I know that boots will be played, even if it's just up the road. Did the DJs at Wigan or Stafford play boots? I don't think so! So what makes it right now? At least in Herts and Beds we still have some soul night venues that stick to the principles of playing northern without resorting to bootlegs.

And hey Ian - £20 for the Salvadores in the 70's - I couldn't have afforded that if I wanted it. It was never any more "available" to the ordinary guys on 7/6d a week than it is now, although that 3k price tag does seem extreme - more trophy hunters I guess.

[Ian Dewhirst]

Is that... you think its better Ian or should we all think that... Snob

I think the evocative background vocals, Brenda's heartfelt phrasing and tones plus the song itself do it for me Stevie. Besides, Tammi's far too obvious as any self-respecting snob will tell ya........

Ian D

[KevH]

I think the evocative background vocals, Brenda's heartfelt phrasing and tones plus the song itself do it for me Stevie. Besides, Tammi's far too obvious as any self-respecting snob will tell ya........

Ian D

That's interesting Ian,you obviously "listen" to soul music.Instead of "just" hearing it.

Do soul snobs "listen" and non snobs just "hear" it.

Or to simplify......OVO=LISTEN..........BOOTS=HEAR.

[Ian Dewhirst]

Yes I actually agree with you there Rod, Chadwick was the classic case of a trophy hunter, who JUST needed to have a box of rare records. Don't think he'd even heard of Bobby Womack or Sam Dees or Bettye Swann, and yet he got booking after booking on the Northern scene because of his box of "Trophy records". £250,000 sure can buy you a collection, but people like Chadwick don't make up the majority of todays DJ's do they?.

Surely serious DJ's must have a balanced and broad based collection which encompasses both rare and not so rare (and more than one beat/ style). Serious DJs take years to build their collections, there is no instant fix - Levine tried it in the late 90s hoovering up everything in sight, and it didn't really work for him and he sold them all off again.

The reality is as Terry says - far to many wannabe DJ's who don't have the goods and hide behind excuses like "the punters don't care", or "It's only a few mixed in with a few originals" etc etc. I won't even bother going to a place where I know that boots will be played, even if it's just up the road. Did the DJs at Wigan or Stafford play boots? I don't think so! So what makes it right now? At least in Herts and Beds we still have some soul night venues that stick to the principles of playing northern without resorting to bootlegs.

And hey Ian - £20 for the Salvadores in the 70's - I couldn't have afforded that if I wanted it. It was never any more "available" to the ordinary guys on 7/6d a week than it is now, although that 3k price tag does seem extreme - more trophy hunters I guess.

The average wage back then was £18-25 I seem to remember Steve. 7/6d a week was pocket money and enough to buy a couple of chart singles and a sherbert dab. I started at work in 1972 and my first wage was about £18.00 I think, so that £20.00 for the Salvadores was still a hefty investment. DJ's fees were about £2 for a week night, so 10 of those gigs = 1 x Salvadores.

I guess it would be aprox 10-20 weeknight gigs @ £50-100 apiece to even get you HALF of a Salvadores these days!

Ian D

[Guest johnm]

No it's not...only boot I have is Tammi Terrell - All I Do Is Think About You which is unreleased...so i'm not so far up my own arse that I won't play a record on boot if it is not available on an original release

been released on CD

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Cellarful-Motown-V...s/dp/B00005V1AY disc #1

[Simsy]

only one way to sort it out...................

FIGHT...............

>On topic one off bit of a laff type deal ...<

[Ian Dewhirst]

That's interesting Ian,you obviously "listen" to soul music.Instead of "just" hearing it.

Do soul snobs "listen" and non snobs just "hear" it.

Or to simplify......OVO=LISTEN..........BOOTS=HEAR.

I hear it first and then, if I start loving it, I'll track the bastard down and ANALYSE it! You get to know what you like after a while. I only really listened to Brenda Holloway last year whereas I'd heard it a couple of times before and the sheer brilliance of it didn't sink in at the time. It's since become virtually my favourite Motown track of the last year or so, although there's some INCREDIBLE Motown 60's remixes/re-arrangements which I heard at the weekend which will be challenging it shortly..........

And I've never heard the Brenda Holloway off vinyl, so that scuppers the O.V.O. arguement right there. Was it ever issued on vinyl anyway?

Ian D

[KevH]

>On topic one off bit of a laff type deal ...<

Ian,meant generally not just refering to BH

Edited March 18, 2009 by KevH

[Paul-s]

People who slag you off if your not playing of an original record because its a second issue total tossers.

I remember some years ago when I was 15/16 just getting into northern down at a soul do in Birmingham. I was just starting to collect records and I was talking to this older fella about it I think he was pissed and he said to me ( unless yer payin over £ 100 pound for records you dont know what your on about ) looking back what a total DICK

He was a total dick, cos thee are thousands of great tunes that cost a tenner. BUT you shouldnt be djing with second issues. Play em at home and leave the djing to the ones who show it respect. I pay to go into a venue with 'real money' and expect 'real' records not some half arsed guy having a stab at djing with second issues (sound quality can be very bad on these) or boots....

[Guest Beeks]

been released on CD

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Cellarful-Motown-V...s/dp/B00005V1AY disc #1

Of course I knew about that Ian

But i'm not going to bring a box full of records and 1 CD am I?

[Guest]

I think anything that gets kids listening to the music will keep it alive, so if they want to buy cds, I say fair play as who has the money to be shelling out on OV

[John Elias]

People who slag you off if your not playing of an original record because its a second issue total tossers.

I remember some years ago when I was 15/16 just getting into northern down at a soul do in Birmingham. I was just starting to collect records and I was talking to this older fella about it I think he was pissed and he said to me ( unless yer payin over £ 100 pound for records you dont know what your on about ) looking back what a total DICK

He was a total dick, cos thee are thousands of great tunes that cost a tenner. BUT you shouldnt be djing with second issues. Play em at home and leave the djing to the ones who show it respect. I pay to go into a venue with 'real money' and expect 'real' records not some half arsed guy having a stab at djing with second issues (sound quality can be very bad on these) or boots....

If this had been said at the very start of this thread then it would have been done and dusted long ago instead of wasting everyone's time

Truth is,there is no such thing as Soul Snobs just like minded soulies that believe that once dj's start playing anything other than 100% original then it will mean the fast decline of our scene,let's face it loads have become dissilusioned 'cos of the bullshitters an con merchants!

Let's not bring this argument up again,ORIGINAL OR NOWT,ta ra.

[Ian Dewhirst]

Of course I knew about that Ian

But i'm not going to bring a box full of records and 1 CD am I?

Why not?

Ian D

[Modernsoulsucks]

Yes I actually agree with you there Rod, Chadwick was the classic case of a trophy hunter, who JUST needed to have a box of rare records. Don't think he'd even heard of Bobby Womack or Sam Dees or Bettye Swann, and yet he got booking after booking on the Northern scene because of his box of "Trophy records". £250,000 sure can buy you a collection, but people like Chadwick don't make up the majority of todays DJ's do they?.

Surely serious DJ's must have a balanced and broad based collection which encompasses both rare and not so rare (and more than one beat/ style). Serious DJs take years to build their collections, there is no instant fix - Levine tried it in the late 90s hoovering up everything in sight, and it didn't really work for him and he sold them all off again.

The reality is as Terry says - far to many wannabe DJ's who don't have the goods and hide behind excuses like "the punters don't care", or "It's only a few mixed in with a few originals" etc etc. I won't even bother going to a place where I know that boots will be played, even if it's just up the road. Did the DJs at Wigan or Stafford play boots? I don't think so! So what makes it right now? At least in Herts and Beds we still have some soul night venues that stick to the principles of playing northern without resorting to bootlegs.

And hey Ian - £20 for the Salvadores in the 70's - I couldn't have afforded that if I wanted it. It was never any more "available" to the ordinary guys on 7/6d a week than it is now, although that 3k price tag does seem extreme - more trophy hunters I guess.

Im sure you're correct in your character assassination critique of Mr Chadwick and his ill-fated dj career. Who could not be moved by the soul stylings of Ms Swann. I especially like the duet "Hippopotamus Song" with that Flanders guy.

Whilst I respect your stance not to attend nights featuring bootlegs I would suggest that the decision is based on the music policy rather than the actual bootleg. Is there a cut-off point? One bootleg is too many? I can't imagine you hang around the decks checking so you must have made the choice on the dj rosta and the type of event advertised before deciding whether to go. Now I and maybe others dont go to R&B events but that doesn't mean you shouldn't play R&B. It's just a personal preference as is yours.

Bandying about the term "twat" [not you!!] to describe non-OVO people is rather OTT in my view as is ascribing the basest of instincts to them whilst portraying the OVO breed as beyond reproach. We've already mentioned Mr. Chadwick. The lack of passion and commitment on the part of the non-OVO is frequently cited and yet Im sure we can all think of other OVO djs and collectors who have dropped off whilst, to use Sean's Biffo,he is still doing it albeit with a mixture of boots,re-issues and carvers, long after these other guys have gone. Who has the long-term dedication there?

I don't think we should be sneering at those who buy boots. Family Tree made a very good point that these fans don't set out to buy boots as a snub to the OVO mob. They buy what they like as cheap as possible and if they've been into it as long as the rest of us, which they have,they've ended up with a large collection that will include legit re-issues and originals. The problem some have on here is when these people fancy sharing their collections with like-minded folk in a club but then they're not guesting at Burnley,Lifeline, Middleton etc.

I understand the rationale behind discouraging boots/carvers from becoming acceptable outside of an oldies night but again I think it's more to do with moving the scene on and not getting stale. Im sure someone like Paul S would think the same of the OVO dj who played safe. If it's upfront then it will be OVO anyway and there's no need for self-appointed guardians to enforce the rule. And if as Gasher mentioned someone is there playing Grapevine re-issues that you have on original to play then maybe time to get a couple of new tunes.

A couple of bits of your "evidence" that I didn't really agree with. The odd Emi was played at Wigan and Stafford but you're right exception rather than the rule. As for "serious dj's" back in the day Im not so sure it was like that. Rather than build a collection wasn't it more play the latest sound and unload when word got out re imminent pressing and buy something on the up. No doubt Ian will have input on that.

Finally I think it's Darcy who has been one of the most vocal on here in criticising the non-OVO attitude but he does tend to bring up the same comments time and time again and whilst generalising I have a suspicion that he's got somebody definite in mind but I think he may be stereotyping everybody on the basis of just the one ego-tripper.

ROD

[Guest familytree]

that not me... im better looking!

[Guest gordon russell]

the original thread was about SOUL SNOBS everyone has taken that to mean OVO v boots the fella might have had other thoughts in mind

[Ian Dewhirst]

A couple of bits of your "evidence" that I didn't really agree with. The odd Emi was played at Wigan and Stafford but you're right exception rather than the rule. As for "serious dj's" back in the day Im not so sure it was like that. Rather than build a collection wasn't it more play the latest sound and unload when word got out re imminent pressing and buy something on the up. No doubt Ian will have input on that.

ROD

Yep, it was a pretty fast turnaround even back then with Selecta sometimes bringing out 8-10 boots a month. If you only had a limited budget you'd almost invariably go for a decent unknown or lesser-played tune rather than an established biggie on the basis that you'd have longer to play the unknown record. I quite often had the appalling job of having two or three available records to buy but only a realistic budget for one of 'em, so hard choices had to be made. Everyone knew the "Cigarette Ashes" tale by then but James Fountain and the Anderson Brothers continued to raise the same problem.

Also, is it my imagination but was there a faster turnover of tunes back then anyway? A big record could get 'played out' pretty quickly I seem to remember. Some records only seemed to be around for a few weeks before they arrived in quantity. I used to chase down leads every week and deliberately keep back a couple of big goodies for potential swap deals as the buying scene got more complicated. I'd say that by circa '75/'76 people were really getting an idea of which records were generally rare although it was still possible to pick up some fantastic Detroit bargains for a few quid apiece - something that I don't think could ever happen these days. The Perigents for £3 anyone? Detroit Executives for 35p on a list? Not any more........

Ian D

[Ian Dewhirst]

that not me... im better looking!

I'm sure Family Tree. Also if I was gonna make a Northern Soul bra, I'd almost certainly use an original Tomagoes rather than a UK Soul City re-press! Bloody amateurs.......

Additionally I also think that U.S. 7"'s with the bigger centre are much more appropriate for that 'Peek-A-Boo' effect although obviously size of the nipple and surrounding area should be taken into consideration too.

Ian D

[Guest]

that not me... im better looking!

I've no doubt you are..........unfortunatly I didn't have the original of you in yours, so had to use the re-issue

[Guest]

the original thread was about SOUL SNOBS everyone has taken that to mean OVO v boots the fella might have had other thoughts in mind

not everyone mate.

if you go back and read my post from earlier I do say something like 'take the OVO v boot argument out of it'

[Soulfool]

I hold my hands up and proudly announce I am a soul snob, O.V.O. and always will be for me. I am on a very low income due to not being able to work in full-time employment and have been collecting O.V.O. since 1993 and have NEVER, nor will I EVER buy a bootleg. I wasn't even tempted when one of the local clubs at the time invited DJ's to play the first 1-2 hours anything allowed, no f***ing way, I was even against that!! I would rather sell my records to buy more than buy a few cheap boots and try to pass myself off as a DJ, I'll try to pass myself off as a DJ with the little I own!!

Yours spiffingly,

David (Div) Miller

[Steve G]

Finally I think it's Darcy who has been one of the most vocal on here in criticising the non-OVO attitude but he does tend to bring up the same comments time and time again and whilst generalising I have a suspicion that he's got somebody definite in mind but I think he may be stereotyping everybody on the basis of just the one ego-tripper.

ROD

Yup I think he has "issues" with certain promotors of certain soul nights . But our D'Arcy tends to like the really fast stuff too.

And I did talk to Chadwick at Leeds - one of Pat Brady's niters at the Griffin - that's how I know about Bobby Womack, Sam Dees etc - you could see the eyes glaze over with complete dis-interest when the names came up....

Yes I agree a few emis have always been played, can't deny that. And who knows maybe Russ played some of the bootlegs he was selling - that damn stage was so high I couldn't be bothered to climb up there too often.

Maybe we should move off OVO then and DJs, other snobbish elements? - decent beer, comfy surroundings, good sound system, good dancefloor, all traits of the "soul snob"?

Edited March 18, 2009 by Steve G

[Steve G]

The average wage back then was £18-25 I seem to remember Steve. 7/6d a week was pocket money and enough to buy a couple of chart singles and a sherbert dab. I started at work in 1972 and my first wage was about £18.00 I think, so that £20.00 for the Salvadores was still a hefty investment. DJ's fees were about £2 for a week night, so 10 of those gigs = 1 x Salvadores.

I guess it would be aprox 10-20 weeknight gigs @ £50-100 apiece to even get you HALF of a Salvadores these days!

Ian D

Hey Ian then I was still in schol and earning £7 a week at Tescos. So the Salvadors would have been nearly 3 weeks wages.

Steve

[Ian Dewhirst]

Hey Ian then I was still in schol and earning £7 a week at Tescos. So the Salvadors would have been nearly 3 weeks wages.

Steve

Well I'm sorry mate! That's what you get for being a snotty-nosed 16 year old kid trying to compete with the big boys LOL.....but what year was that Steve? I'm sure you're a few years younger than me........?

I'm comparing my Saturday job @ a clothes shop in Bradford in 1971 which paid me £2.50 which was enough for 2 Bostocks Soul packs @ 20 records for a quid each. I reckon those Soul Packs would be worth more like £300-500 apiece now judging by the quality of the stuff in 'em.

That's what I mean. No wonder I'm a tightass. I was spoiled. O.V.O. was the cheapest game in town back then! They virtually GAVE the stuff away..............

Ian D

[davidwapples]

so far in this thread we have had ovo v boots , cds v vinyl , a mention of ian levine and the benefits of mp3s , seems like it now contains every regular thread that get posted on here

get all your posts in one place all we need now is for someone to ask whatever happened to simon soussan and this thread can be locked lol

[Jez Jones]

Yep, it was a pretty fast turnaround even back then with Selecta sometimes bringing out 8-10 boots a month. If you only had a limited budget you'd almost invariably go for a decent unknown or lesser-played tune rather than an established biggie on the basis that you'd have longer to play the unknown record. I quite often had the appalling job of having two or three available records to buy but only a realistic budget for one of 'em, so hard choices had to be made. Everyone knew the "Cigarette Ashes" tale by then but James Fountain and the Anderson Brothers continued to raise the same problem.

Also, is it my imagination but was there a faster turnover of tunes back then anyway? A big record could get 'played out' pretty quickly I seem to remember. Some records only seemed to be around for a few weeks before they arrived in quantity. I used to chase down leads every week and deliberately keep back a couple of big goodies for potential swap deals as the buying scene got more complicated. I'd say that by circa '75/'76 people were really getting an idea of which records were generally rare although it was still possible to pick up some fantastic Detroit bargains for a few quid apiece - something that I don't think could ever happen these days. The Perigents for £3 anyone? Detroit Executives for 35p on a list? Not any more........

Ian D

Thats certainly how I remember it and some of these are now placed solidly in the'Top 500' Not bad after a months airing!

Rod's point about 'serious dj's' getting rid because of imminent pressings was also true --but applied to the collector as well

From what I remember there were many folk who probably had a collection of say 100 and this was 'fluid' ie possibly 25-50 of these would change monthly just to keep up.

apologies I digress.......................

[Steve G]

Well I'm sorry mate! That's what you get for being a snotty-nosed 16 year old kid trying to compete with the big boys LOL.....but what year was that Steve? I'm sure you're a few years younger than me........?

I'm comparing my Saturday job @ a clothes shop in Bradford in 1971 which paid me £2.50 which was enough for 2 Bostocks Soul packs @ 20 records for a quid each. I reckon those Soul Packs would be worth more like £300-500 apiece now judging by the quality of the stuff in 'em.

That's what I mean. No wonder I'm a tightass. I was spoiled. O.V.O. was the cheapest game in town back then! They virtually GAVE the stuff away..............

Ian D

1976/77 I was in the 6th form at school (snob ).....Tescos financed trips to Wigan, girlfriends, clothes and records.........so no chance of the Salvadores, I was buying the 50p stuff. Most expensive one I got was on my first night at wigan Sam & Kitty for £4. Only years later found out it was an early fcuking bootleg!!!

[Gasher]

who are you talking about when you keep refering to people who play boots only?!.... are there such people and if there are would ANY of us on here go to the event?... you make extreme comparissons that dont exsist on the real scene surely?..

Im not speaking of a BOOTS ONLY nights Im speaking about promoters and dj's who condone playings them in their set.

Of course they exist and Im not naming names they know who they are..and how can you tell me I make extreme comparisons when you obviously dont even understand what Im saying. AND IM SURE YES some on here would go to ther events..not feckin me though

gman