Northern Northern Soul V

[Simsy]

Ian, have you a very attractive blonde girlfriend/wife who is a good dancer?

If yes, I think I saw youse at the 100 Club recently.

I was the one standing at the corner of the stage looking like a miserable old bag.

Anyway, if 'twas you, then I recognise you both from another time and place (and maybe even dimension), but memory is completely shot, so if you know, then please share. 

link

Yes above true, though she's not been to the 100 in a while and she's not really that much of a soul fan either Although she's a nice mover. I'm still wearing her down on the soul thing, but it's taking a while - 14 years She likes Robbie & Marroon 5

Anyway you and I met at Luton, if you remeber? Was it last year, outside?

And whad'ya know about those Hertford all dayers run by Dave Crabtree - Sundays, every month ???

[Guest Trifle]

Yes above true, though she's not been to the 100 in a while and she's not really that much of a soul fan either   Although she's a nice mover.  I'm still wearing her down on the soul thing, but it's taking a while - 14 years She likes Robbie & Marroon 5

Anyway you and I met at Luton, if you remeber?  Was it last year, outside?

And whad'ya know about those Hertford all dayers run by Dave Crabtree - Sundays, every month ???

link

Told you the memory's shot. Yes, course I know you and yer mate. :fool:

I am most embarrassed that I have never been able to make it to Dave's Do. Every single time he's put one on, it has been the Sunday after a nighter or a scooter rally. Poor excuse I know.

[Guest CapitolSC]

Was that the Water Rats the place with heavy wood panelling on the walls?

Bit like dancing in the Adams Family* living room?

Col.

*anyone know where the 's should go!

link

Eh!?

Plus there is more upfrontness played in our indoors than outdoors most of the time !

Sx

[Soulsmith]

Stuart,

Much as I admire your Southern sociability & would love to discuss the merits (or otherwise) of chip-shops South of the North/South dividing line,I feel it my duty to remind you that this IS actually Northern Soul forum/thread and we must adhere vigilantly to the topic in question......Er,somebody remind me what it was?!?

link

The subject was........is it perfectlly accepatable to sell a Mars bar (crafted in down town Slough) & cover it in batter & sell it to Joe Public oop north.

[Maark]

If you are north of Watfod Gap mate, that's still north.  Southern ruling

link

When you say north of Watford GAP, is this what you mean, or do you mean Watford? There is a difference and it's about 50 miles. The Watford Gap, so named after the village of Watford, Northants, and the gap in the Northamptonshire Uplands. The other Watford is a big town just north of London, Herts. If you DO mean the Watford Gap, then I live 1 mile north of the Gap, if you draw a line across the country, in Irthlingborough. I am therefore, a hard as nails whippet owning pidgeon fancier, where as Glyn -W, Lisa Vanner and Bazbond, 2miles down the A6 in Rushden are Soft southern shandy drinking bed wetters. The north/south thing is pertinent to N. Soul so I don't consider this off topic...off tangent maybe..........

[Simsy]

When you say north of Watford GAP, is this what you mean, or do you mean Watford? There is a difference and it's about 50 miles. The Watford Gap, so named after the village of Watford, Northants, and the gap in the Northamptonshire Uplands. The other Watford is a big town just north of London, Herts. If you DO mean the Watford Gap, then I live 1 mile north of the Gap, if you draw a line across the country, in Irthlingborough. I am therefore, a hard as nails whippet owning pidgeon fancier, where as Glyn -W, Lisa Vanner and Bazbond, 2miles down the A6 in Rushden are Soft southern shandy drinking bed wetters.      The north/south thing is pertinent to N. Soul so I don't consider this off topic...off tangent maybe..........

link

Lighten. The term "north of Watford Gap" is an expression that has been around for donkey's. It's an expression Southerner's use to express fear of travelling North. Or at least lack of Knowledge on venturing anywhere remotely North. Think it's kind of last turn off from the south.

https://www.stackridge.com/north_of_watford_gap.htm 1st 3 lines mate, says it all

[Maark]

Lighten.  The term "north of Watford Gap" is an expression that has been around for donkey's.  It's an expression Southerner's use to express fear of travelling North.  Or at least lack of Knowledge on venturing anywhere remotely North.  Think it's kind of last turn off from the south.

https://www.stackridge.com/north_of_watford_gap.htm  1st 3 lines mate, says it all

link

And I would argue that people say "north of the Watford Gap", when they mean north of Watford. I bet most people don't even know where the Watford Gap is or are we allowed to generalise about the loaction of specific places?

[Simsy]

And I would argue that people say "north of the Watford Gap", when they mean north of Watford. I bet most people don't even know where the Watford Gap is or are we allowed to generalise about the loaction of specific places?   

link

I refer the honourable gentleman to the statement I gave earlier

[Dave Abbott]

Sorry if any of my following points have been covered already, I am replying to Ian's first post and havent read all the replies.

Firstly, has anyone decided where north ends and south starts? I live in Portsmouth and everything is north from me (fcuk off Isle of Wight) so when I saw Sean Chapman had a do called 'talk of the south' I was a bit miffed!! (Hi Sean)

Any way I have been traveling north (I'm talking north of London) for many months now and there is a difference.

Firstly the dos north are far better attended - obviously due to greater number of people into NS than down south.

Is there different music to be heard north or south? Yes, but as with most nites now the music is as good as the guesting DJ's. Darn sarf there is a venue called Bisley, probably the best attended venue south of the M4 with a regular 300-400 people attending. If I go its cos nothing else is on, its very oldies orientated (not a bad thing please understand, just not my cup of tea) and it is as good as the guest DJ's on.

And no one has to travel that far these days to hear a favorite DJ, why travel miles and hours to hear someone who will be in your area the following week?

As for upfront - it does depend on the venue. I went to the Brighouse Ritz to see Ginger sometime late last year. An oldies orientated venue (and it was brilliant and packed) and Carl W came on and played out and out oldies e.g. wade in the water - Carl obviously done his homework and knew the crowds expectations. Heard Carl a month or so later at Bury and a completely different set. Both up north one oldies one 'upfront' (and a sign of a good DJ IMO).

And to move that on...on the same night as going to Gingers do I went afterwards to the allniter at Wilton. A few miles up the road and another packed(ish) venue! Ok so the music policy between the two is different but that could not happen down south. I used to co-promote a soul nite in Portsmouth, quite 'upfront' compared to the other dos down here - no one in this area and I am talking Brighton to Bournemouth and up to London will clash, to maximize people through the door - and we used to wonder why people wouldn't travel down to our nites. Think it was Russ Vickers who said to me that we could have an all-niter down here with Butch, Fenn, Sam, Smith, Dyson etc DJing and still we wouldn't get the numbers. Well after going up north its quite clear - they don't have to!! There is so much going on up north they don't have to travel down south, no point especially as the good DJ's can be caught almost any where.

For consistency my favorite venue has to be the 100 club and then niter wise Keele - the best venues musically (and I mean I have heard better sets elsewhere, but for the whole nite) I've attended recently have been Scenesville in London and Drunken Monkey in North Wales. All IMO of course and literally miles apart.

I really don't think that I've answered Ian's question at all have I? LOL

[Simon T]

Sorry if any of my following points have been covered already, I am replying to Ian's first post and havent read all the replies.

Firstly, has anyone decided where north ends and south starts? I live in Portsmouth and everything is north from me (fcuk off Isle of Wight) so when I saw Sean Chapman had a do called 'talk of the south' I was a bit miffed!! (Hi Sean)

Any way I have been traveling north (I'm talking north of London) for many months now and there is a difference.

Firstly the dos north are far better attended - obviously due to greater number of people into NS than down south.

Is there different music to be heard north or south? Yes, but as with most nites now the music is as good as the guesting DJ's. Darn sarf there is a venue called Bisley, probably the best attended venue south of the M4 with a regular 300-400 people attending. If I go its cos nothing else is on, its very oldies orientated (not a bad thing please understand, just not my cup of tea) and it is as good as the guest DJ's on.

And no one has to travel that far these days to hear a favorite DJ, why travel miles and hours to hear someone who will be in your area the following week?

As for upfront - it does depend on the venue. I went to the Brighouse Ritz to see Ginger sometime late last year. An oldies orientated venue (and it was brilliant and packed) and Carl W came on and played out and out oldies e.g. wade in the water - Carl obviously done his homework and knew the crowds expectations. Heard Carl a month or so later at Bury and a completely different set. Both up north one oldies one 'upfront' (and a sign of a good DJ IMO).

And to move that on...on the same night as going to Gingers do I went afterwards to the allniter at Wilton. A few miles up the road and another packed(ish) venue! Ok so the music policy between the two is different but that could not happen down south.  I used to co-promote a soul nite in Portsmouth, quite 'upfront' compared to the other dos down here - no one in this area and I am talking Brighton to Bournemouth and up to London will clash, to maximize people through the door - and we used to wonder why people wouldn't travel down to our nites.  Think it was Russ Vickers who said to me that we could have an all-niter down here with Butch, Fenn, Sam, Smith, Dyson etc DJing and still we wouldn't get the numbers.  Well after going up north its quite clear - they don't have to!! There is so much going on up north they don't have to travel down south, no point especially as the good DJ's can be caught almost any where.

For consistency my favorite venue has to be the 100 club and then niter wise Keele - the best venues musically (and I mean I have heard better sets elsewhere, but for the whole nite) I've attended recently have been Scenesville in London and Drunken Monkey in North Wales.  All IMO of course and literally miles apart.

I really don't think that I've answered Ian's question at all have I? LOL

link

Edited May 14, 2005 by Simon T

[Guest Johnny One Trout]

Dave, your problem is that you're 10 - 15 years too young

link

To qualify for his bus pass??

[Guest rachel]

And no one has to travel that far these days to hear a favorite DJ, why travel miles and hours to hear someone who will be in your area the following week?

Depends where you live and who your favourite DJ is!! Think most people travel for music policies/ line-ups rather than one specific DJ anyway.

[Simsy]

I really don't think that I've answered Ian's question at all have I? LOL

link

Well you make some interesting points Dave. Bearing in mind your locale etc.

General consensus seems to be that national dj's do not purposefully adapt their sets according to their geographical dispositions.

Have to agree with Dave on 100 Club being fave venue. Twenty years in attendance, only missed one nighter in last six years and the best bit, it's on tonight and I'm going - wer ho!

[Guest alison]

Joe Jama. Joseph Webster, Margaret Little etc etc.....they're forgotten oldies are they?

link

Playing Devils Advocate here but actually Jospeh Webster IS a forgotten oldie. One from Dave Greet from many moons back , and my goodness - he's a Suvverner And Pete Shirley used to play this at Thorne apparently.

[Chalky]

Well you make some interesting points Dave. Bearing in mind your locale etc. 

General consensus seems to be that national dj's do not purposefully adapt their sets according to their geographical dispositions.

Have to agree with Dave on 100 Club being fave venue.  Twenty years in attendance, only missed one nighter in last six years and the best bit, it's on tonight and I'm going - wer ho!  

link

I'll be there Ian, see ya at the bar mate

Edited May 14, 2005 by chalky

[Simsy]

I'll be there Ian, see ya at the bar mate   

link

[Simsy]

Thought this thread had gone for good!

ps, some of the points raised in post 1 are complete cods! Either that or the vid I was watching was that of an oldies night?

Edited September 9, 2009 by Simsy

[barney]

Where's that then?

Midlands is great, but not aware of any rare soul clubs advertised there, and if there are and as im first to say so we will claim them as part of the Souths

yer can av em matey every brummie black country notts or derby and uncle midland tom cobbly an all

coz they are not northern and never will be

[Raremusicdirect]

I always feel the North was defined of old when Londoners (and the South) did indeed think Watford Gap and beyond was truly North.

However if you look at the regions :

Regions

East Midlands

Derbyshire

Nottinghamshire

Lincolnshire

Rutland

Leicestershire

Northants

West Midlands

Herefordshire

Worcestershire

Warwickshire

West Midlands

Staffordshire

Shropshire

North East

Northumberland

Durham

Tyne and Wear

Tyneside

North West

Cumbria

Lancashire

Merseyside

Greater Manchester

Cheshire

Yorkshire

North Yorkshire

South Yorkshire

East Yorkshire

E Riding

South West

Cornwall

Devon

Somerset

Dorset

Wiltshire

Gloucestershire

South East & London & Greater London

Greater London

Oxfordshire

Buckinghamshire

Berkshire

Hampshire

Surrey

Kent

East Sussex

West Sussex

East Anglia

Bedfordshire

Hertfordshire

Essex

Suffolk

Norfolk

Cambridgeshire

The East and West Midlands combined cover a vast expanse and it can be argued (?) are at least as important as the North East and West combined.

[Raremusicdirect]

Lifeline, is in Wolverhampton = West Midlands, therefore Midlands and not the North, is that correct ?

[Supercorsa]

Lifeline, is in Wolverhampton = West Midlands, therefore Midlands and not the North, is that correct ?

Pretty sure you'll find that back in 2005, Lifeline was held at a club called Sheridans somewhere in Yorkshire.

PS Whatever happened to Bladeforlife?

[Guest]

Playing Devils Advocate here but actually Jospeh Webster IS a forgotten oldie. One from Dave Greet from many moons back , and my goodness - he's a Suvverner And Pete Shirley used to play this at Thorne apparently.

Yeah it is an old shout from GREETY who certainly is a southerner and one of the very best Northern Soul DJ's in the UK, up there with any of the supposed big names from 'oop north' and above a fair few of them in taste and quality.

[Maark]

I always feel the North was defined of old when Londoners (and the South) did indeed think Watford Gap and beyond was truly North.

However if you look at the regions :

Regions

East Midlands

Derbyshire

Nottinghamshire

Lincolnshire

Rutland

Leicestershire

Northants

West Midlands

Herefordshire

Worcestershire

Warwickshire

West Midlands

Staffordshire

Shropshire

North East

Northumberland

Durham

Tyne and Wear

Tyneside

North West

Cumbria

Lancashire

Merseyside

Greater Manchester

Cheshire

Yorkshire

North Yorkshire

South Yorkshire

East Yorkshire

E Riding

South West

Cornwall

Devon

Somerset

Dorset

Wiltshire

Gloucestershire

South East & London & Greater London

Greater London

Oxfordshire

Buckinghamshire

Berkshire

Hampshire

Surrey

Kent

East Sussex

West Sussex

East Anglia

Bedfordshire

Hertfordshire

Essex

Suffolk

Norfolk

Cambridgeshire

The East and West Midlands combined cover a vast expanse and it can be argued (?) are at least as important as the North East and West combined.

And to continue being pedantic from four years ago, I still think people mean north of Watford and not north of the Watford GAP! If you look at a map, the most northerly part of the London metropolis is Watford. Beyond Watford is fields, cows, trees, tractors and scary non cockerneys who talk funny. If the most northerly point of the metropolis happened to be, say, Enfield, the expression would be 'North of Enfield', I believe.

If the north as you and Simsy say, does begin north of the Watford GAP (that place in Northamptonshire) can someone please tell me why this point in particular and say not the Northamptonshire/Leicestershite border for instance. Sorry to be so picky! Lol

[Raremusicdirect]

LOL, I wasn't and aren't too fused about where is and what constitutes THE Watford Gap, my point was more that many of the events are actually in the Midlands....as well as the North................

Edited September 11, 2009 by RareMusicDirect

[Paul-s]

What's the difference?

One to ponder on this. I don't travel up north as much as I'd like to, or as much as I used to (Age, time, family etc). But is there a difference between a typical Northern set (ie played in the North) as opposed to that played at a Southern do? Same dj's travel the length and breadth of the country to do their sets right? So it should be the same. I can't help thinking it's not though somehow.

Couple of things made me think this over a period of time. As I know some Southerner's who think that the South is cutting edge in some respects, in terms of new sounds broken etc. But hang on I thought, this must be hooey, as it's NORTHERN soul we're into right!?

I did see some (quite lengthy) clips on the NCSC website the other day, of the Manchester nighter - main room etc and It seemed I knew almost every track. Whereas perhaps, in my soft southern existence do's wise at least, it's common for twenty minutes or so, (less and more) sometimes to go by without having heard of a single number. Why is that? Does Geography play a part or what?

I know I can't use the website thing as a basis for this query, but it was just that small point coupled with those Southern rural myths over time, that lead me to think - I wonder what views others might have on the subject?

FOOT NOTE:

1. Patriot first an foremost, love every inch of England's green and pleasant land.

2. Without Northern Northern Soul, there wouldn't be any Northern Soul.

"LESS AVE YA"

Dont really understand....go to Wilton, or retrospectively the North had Soul or Nothing (still has) or DDA. Three Greyhounds, Greatstone?! etc, All playing unknown , rare, cheap/expensive and semi-unknown stuff.

Everytime ive been to Southern events, 100 club, Bedford, etc, its an oldies night to me. Its not really a location thing, its a dj and punter thing and both the North and Southern have clubs that are Oldies clubs and vice versa. I do think its a fact that Southern soul fans, particularly Londoners, think they are cutting edge, when really they aren't and need to get travelling more (not just Ken!see him everywhere! ) and not just to big nighters twice a year....and also, need to book a broader and more adventurous range of dj's, not just their mates, or the same old same old!

Lastly what the f--k is Northern Soul? a misnomer i think.

Peace across the borders...

Edited September 13, 2009 by paul-s

[Ged Parker]

Dont really understand....go to Wilton, or retrospectively the North had Soul or Nothing (still has) or DDA. Three Greyhounds, Greatstone?! etc, All playing unknown , rare, cheap/expensive and semi-unknown stuff.

Everytime ive been to Southern events, 100 club, Bedford, etc, its an oldies night to me. Its not really a location thing, its a dj and punter thing and both the North and Southern have clubs that are Oldies clubs and vice versa. I do think its a fact that Southern soul fans, particularly Londoners, think they are cutting edge, when really they aren't and need to get travelling more (not just Ken! ) and not just to big nighters twice a year....and also need to book a broader and more adventurous range of dj's, not just their mates, otr the same old same old!

Lastly what the f--k is Northern Soul? a misnomer i think.

Peace across the borders...

Nail - Head - Hit

There's differences in the same town let alone North and South.