Is Motown Any Good?

[Guest Bicks]

I had to rebuke myself yesterday. I saw the advert on TV for the Motown 50th Annivesary cd and I must admit I groaned. My first thought was how can they churn out the same old best of CD that comes out virtually every year around Christmas time when they have such a brilliant back catalogue that hardly ever gets played. On reflection, and having looked at the playlist, I realise I was wrong, (nearly) every song on there is a winner and is on there because it is so loved by a much wider audience than you'll find on this forum. The only 'fault' with these songs is being overplayed and over familiar simply because they are so good.

It did get me thinking though, is there such a thing as a bad Motown record, I know it's a slightly subjective question but there must be at least one song that has a concensus of nastiness.

Can I start the ball rolling with a very, very obvious one "I Just Called to Say I love You" by Stevie Wonder (all the more disappointing as he's such a genius), even by eighties Motown standards this wasn't good. It would be interesting to find some 'bad' sixties tunes though.

P.S. don't anybody even consider voting for Charlene's "I've never Been to Me", it is a great record and I challenge anybody not to sing along to it in the car.

P.P.S. apologies for the rather contentious topic title but I just thought it might get people to look.

Edited December 14, 2008 by Bicks

[Guest vinylvixen]

I had to rebuke myself yesterday. I saw the advert on TV for the Motown 50th Annivesary cd and I must admit I groaned. My first thought was how can they churn out the same old best of CD that comes out virtually every year around Christmas time when they have such a brilliant back catalogue that hardly ever gets played. On reflection, and having looked at the playlist, I realise I was wrong, (nearly) every song on there is a winner and is on there because it is so loved by a much wider audience than you'll find on this forum. The only 'fault' with these songs is being overplayed and over familiar simply because they are so good.

It did get me thinking though, is there such a thing as a bad Motown record, I know it's a slightly subjective question but there must be at least one song that has a concensus of nastiness.

Can I start the ball rolling with a very, very obvious one "I Just Called to Say I love You" by Stevie Wonder (all the more disappointing as he's such a genius), even by eighties Motown standards this wasn't good. It would be interesting to find some 'bad' sixties tunes though.

P.S. don't anybody even consider voting for Charlene's "I've never Been to Me", it is a great record and I challenge anybody not to sing along to it in the car.

P.P.S. apologies for the rather contentious topic title but I just thought it might get people to look.

Smugly patting myself on the back :

Soul Satisfaction 2

Soul Satisfaction 3

Soul Satisfaction 4

Soul Satisfaction 5

I have got Soul Satisfaction 6,7 & 8 compiled and ready to go....but we'll see what happens with my Motown releases over the next couple of years

[chrissie]

is there such a thing as a bad Motown record,

Yes..................Charlene, I've Never Been To Me.......what's that all about

QoFxx

[Guest]

Three Times a Lady - The Commodores

This has got to be one of the worst records in the world - let alone 'bad Motown'

[Dave Moore]

Three Times a Lady - The Commodores

This has got to be one of the worst records in the world - let alone 'bad Motown'

But also their, (Motown's), biggest selling vinyl single as far as I remember!

[chrissie]

But also their, (Motown's), biggest selling vinyl single as far as I remember!

still poo but nowhere as close to doggy doos as bloody charlene....wish she had found herself and stayed there

QoFxx

[Guest]

Yes..................Charlene, I've Never Been To Me.......what's that all about

QoFxx

The song was originally written from a male perspective , but was rewritten by Ron Miller for Charlene . The use of the line

" I've been to crying for unborn children " was not written about abortion. The line refers to a woman who is at a point in her life that she wished she had taken the time to have children .

There are many misconceptions about this song . The spoken bridge in the song was not about , or did it mention abortion - it was deemed too feminist and when Charlene's first album was re - released in 1977, the spoken bridge had been deleted . When the song became an unexpected hit in 1982 , it was the version WITH the spoken bridge intact that was released . It has also been widely reported that the 1982 single was a re - recording , it is not .

Malc Burton

[chrissie]

The song was originally written from a male perspective , but was rewritten by Ron Miller for Charlene . The use of the line

" I've been to crying for unborn children " was not written about abortion. The line refers to a woman who is at a point in her life that she wished she had taken the time to have children .

There are many misconceptions about this song . The spoken bridge in the song was not about , or did it mention abortion - it was deemed too feminist and when Charlene's first album was re - released in 1977, the spoken bridge had been deleted . When the song became an unexpected hit in 1982 , it was the version WITH the spoken bridge intact that was released . It has also been widely reported that the 1982 single was a re - recording , it is not .

Malc Burton

Its still the most rubbish motown record ever and I am one of the biggist supporters of female vocals and not just soul............in fact at this moment in time I am listening to Parallel Lines album.

QoFxx

Edited December 14, 2008 by chrissie

[Richard]

"I Just Called to Say I love You" by Stevie Wonder (all the more disappointing as he's such a genius)

The Woman In Red from the same album In fact the whole album

[chrissie]

The Woman In Red from the same album In fact the whole album

Infact most things SW recorded after about 1975

Oh and while we are being mr/mrs angry Ben, never did for me either................there are enough rats of the human male form with out singing to the rodent furry kind

QoFxx

[Guest]

Its still the most rubbish motown record ever and I am one of the biggist supporters of female vocals and not just soul............in fact at this moment in time I am listening to Parallel Lines album.

QoFxx

I was just answering your question , not avocating it to be a record of any merit ........

Up there with Charlene in respect of bad / dire motown records , must be Billy Preston & Syreeta's " Tonight I Sellotape My Glove To

You "

Pass the sick bucket .........

Malc Burton

Edited December 14, 2008 by Malc Burton

[Richard]

Infact most things SW recorded after about 1975

Oh so sadly true did he get to mid-1975 and say "right that's me done with the good un's, lets see what cack I can get away with?"

[chrissie]

I was just answering your question , not avocating it to be a record of any merit ........

Up there with Charlene in respect of bad / dire motown records , must be Billy Preston & Syreeta's " Tonight I Sellotape My Glove To

You "

Pass the sick bucket .........

Malc Burton

That sorted, I've been playing female soul all afternoon so I am going back to my Blondie moment........not soul but wow what a performer. Charlene v Debbie Harry......no brainer

QoFxx

[Jem Britttin]

Surely though a lot of the so called bad records were aimed at a mainstream "pop" audience, so unsuprising that they would not appeal to soul fans ...Motown was /is a major label and all the other major labels did the same

[Pete S]

Yes

[The Yank]

I think anybody versus Charlene is a no brainer .

[Davetay]

Three Times a Lady - The Commodores

This has got to be one of the worst records in the world - let alone 'bad Motown'

God, thats a bad one! come back The Zoo all is forgiven

How about Hello is it me your looking far, I think he was still at Motown with that Shocker.

[Davetay]

That sorted, I've been playing female soul all afternoon so I am going back to my Blondie moment........not soul but wow what a performer. Charlene v Debbie Harry......no brainer

QoFxx

Just tell you when me & Ian Gillabrand went into Smack Water Jacks (Burnley Pub) in the early 80s and they were having a Blondie night.

So we try tap up two girls telling them we,re big Blondie fans, one of them says something about Debbie Harry.

What did i say who the f++k is Debbie Harry. they soon f++ked us off. how was i to know

Edited December 14, 2008 by davetay

[Dave Moore]

Just tell you when me & Ian Gillabrand went into Smack Water Jacks (Burnley Pub) in the early 80s and they were having a Blondie night.

So we try tap out two girls telling them we,re big Blondie fans, one of them says something about Debbie Harry.

What did i say who the f++k is Debbie Harry. they soon f++ked us off. how was i to know

You smooooothie!

You out on Saturday at The Kestral Suite?

[chrissie]

Just tell you when me & Ian Gillabrand went into Smack Water Jacks (Burnley Pub) in the early 80s and they were having a Blondie night.

So we try tap out two girls telling them we,re big Blondie fans, one of them says something about Debbie Harry.

What did i say who the f++k is Debbie Harry. they soon f++ked us off. how was i to know

Were you brought up in a monestary by any chance

QoFxx

[chrissie]

God, thats a bad one! come back The Zoo all is forgiven

How about Hello is it me your looking far, I think he was still at Motown with that Shocker.

Don't get me on that one

QoFxx

[Davetay]

You smooooothie!

You out on Saturday at The Kestral Suite?

I hope so. depends how i go on wednesday at the hospital.

Broke my arm the other week, slipped on ice in Barrowford.

[Dave Moore]

I hope so. depends how i go on wednesday at the hospital.

Broke my arm the other week, slipped on ice in Barrowford.

OUCH!

Hope it goes well Matey. Hopefully see you Sat.

[Davetay]

Were you brought up in a monestary by any chance

QoFxx

Just never took notice of any other music back than.

[Jumpinjoan]

Have to say I hate just about everything Stevie Wonder has ever done.

There's only 'Nothing's Too Good For My Baby' that I can just about stomach.

Anyway, as for Motown being any good?

ABSOLUTELY.

But boy did they turn out some dross in later years.

[Guest Bicks]

Three Times a Lady - The Commodores

This has got to be one of the worst records in the world - let alone 'bad Motown'

Or "Three Times Wi' Bits On" as we sing in the chip shop round here.

Edited December 14, 2008 by Bicks

[Soul Shrews]

Yes..................Charlene, I've Never Been To Me.......what's that all about

QoFxx

I like it by Nancy Wilson tho

earlier version than Charlene

Cheers Paul

[paup-ine]

Have to say I hate just about everything Stevie Wonder has ever done.

There's only 'Nothing's Too Good For My Baby' that I can just about stomach.

Anyway, as for Motown being any good?

ABSOLUTELY.

But boy did they turn out some dross in later years.

I agree with you totally, and never liked Diana Ross later stuff, ugh! Upside Down? it was!!

P

[Guest yorks old boy]

well i love motown but the worst one for me is albert finney those over men time 3 30 1977 still good backing music

[Epic]

Is Motown Any Good?

Of course it is - warts & all.

Think just about everybody on this site discovered soul music via Motown & it's influences on the music we all love is immense & should never be underestimated.

[Guest gfarrington]

Yes..................Charlene, I've Never Been To Me.......what's that all about

QoFxx

always thought it was titled 'ive never been to leigh'

[Jumpinjoan]

I agree with you totally, and never liked Diana Ross later stuff, ugh! Upside Down? it was!!

P

I've never rated Diana Ross either.

Going to quote my old pal Robbo here... he once said "without Motown we'd be fcuked"...and he's not wrong.

[paultp]

I remember chatting to Andy Rix a few years ago about Motown v the-rest-of-northern-soul-put-together and we agreed that Motown p*ss*s all over anyone elses output.

Good distribution does not make for a bad record, bad distribution may make a good record rare and thus valuable.

For all the rubbish releases there are about 100 good tunes for each of them and the stuff in their unreleased catalogue beats most other released stuff on its own.

If Berry Gordy had been a crap businessman then Motown records would have been more collectable and playable than any other label due to their quality. If they hadn't have been hits they would all have been £1000 floor fillers.

Is Motown any good? What a stupid question!

Cheers

Paul

[Guest Bicks]

I remember chatting to Andy Rix a few years ago about Motown v the-rest-of-northern-soul-put-together and we agreed that Motown p*ss*s all over anyone elses output.

Good distribution does not make for a bad record, bad distribution may make a good record rare and thus valuable.

For all the rubbish releases there are about 100 good tunes for each of them and the stuff in their unreleased catalogue beats most other released stuff on its own.

If Berry Gordy had been a crap businessman then Motown records would have been more collectable and playable than any other label due to their quality. If they hadn't have been hits they would all have been £1000 floor fillers.

Is Motown any good? What a stupid question!

Cheers

Paul

Whoooaaagghhh there boy, calm down. Did you actually read any of the original post or did the red mist descend on reading the Topic Title?

Humour bypass anybody??????

Edited December 15, 2008 by Bicks

[Guest vinylvixen]

Whoooaaagghhh there boy, calm down. Did you actually read any of the original post or did the red mist descend on reading the Topic Title?

Humour bypass anybody??????

York Ringroad - that's a good bypass - is it built yet Bicks, don't rely on the opinions of others - you are the only one who can decide whether Motown is any good for you or bad for you. Ask for the Complete Motown Singles series Vols 1-10 for Christmas....you know you want them

BTW - I took you up on your challenge "don't anybody even consider voting for Charlene's "I've never Been to Me", it is a great record and I challenge anybody not to sing along to it in the car" - I ripped the Harry Moss out of the dashboard........and had to pull over to compose myself. What a load of cack lol

Edited December 15, 2008 by vinylvixen

[Guest gordon russell]

Love motown,indeed l collect british stuff.....time and a place though,agree with some other people,HATE stevie wonder except CASTLES IN THE SAND.Heres a funny that kinda crosses over from the soul scene to the wider audience.Once went to a local do where a couple of mates were djing (in a pub) nothing serious,the landlord had billed it northern/motown evening,the place was packed with handbaggers....mainly there for the motown tunes,nowt wrong with that,but heres the funny,when my pal started playing the unissued stuff.....reconsider ect ect ...the punters kept asking for him to play some motown...when he said it was motown...they chorused...PLAY STUFF WE KNOW,priceless lol ...they loved motown ,but only motown they knew ya gotta smile...tezza

Edited December 15, 2008 by gordon russell

[Guest Bicks]

York Ringroad - that's a good bypass - is it built yet Bicks, don't rely on the opinions of others - you are the only one who can decide whether Motown is any good for you or bad for you. Ask for the Complete Motown Singles series Vols 1-10 for Christmas....you know you want them

BTW - I took you up on your challenge "don't anybody even consider voting for Charlene's "I've never Been to Me", it is a great record and I challenge anybody not to sing along to it in the car" - I ripped the Harry Moss out of the dashboard........and had to pull over to compose myself. What a load of cack lol

Don't know Harry Moss, what label was he on? Is it on Refosoul?

[Soulsmith]

Back in the old days I had a tune called 'Hang On Pearl' which was really awful.

It was a comedy record about a girl called Pearl who was drowning. It may have been on Gordy?

[The Yank]

I think you're referring to "Hold On Pearl" by Bob Kayli (aka Bob Gordy).

That one is not one of the best on the Gordy label.

[Guest vinylvixen]

Don't know Harry Moss, what label was he on? Is it on Refosoul?

Priceless.....for those of a certain generation, Harry Moss was the only in-car entertainment system available if you were on a tight budget....the cassette chewing monster from Woolies. You don't see the streamers of brown tape hanging from trees anymore where people used to lob them out of the window in desperation....and as my car is from 1970, it has a matching Harry Moss. So I listened to Charlene and both me and Harry were of the same opinion

Edited December 15, 2008 by vinylvixen

[Spacehopper]

ofcourse motown is good...im sure every music lover in the world has at least one motown track they like, soulie or not !...

but as with every label, they released their share of shit !...actually could start another thread,anyone know of a label that didnt release 'some' shit tunes ?

as for stevie aswell as 'nothings too good' what about 'asking for trouble' quality northern imo

[Dave West]

ofcourse motown is good...im sure every music lover in the world has at least one motown track they like, soulie or not !...

but as with every label, they released their share of shit !...actually could start another thread,anyone know of a label that didnt release 'some' shit tunes ?

as for stevie aswell as 'nothings too good' what about 'asking for trouble' quality northern imo

Stevie...what about. "every time i see you i go wild", have you heard his version of "Respect" its wonderful ....Motown is great Bruce Willis etc not so good

Westy (motown DJ and collector)

[Kev Moore]

Stevie...what about. "every time i see you i go wild", have you heard his version of "Respect" its wonderful ....Motown is great Bruce Willis etc not so good

Westy (motown DJ and collector)

Stevie Wonder has made more great recordings than any of us have had hot dinners and his influence on modern music has been phenomenal.

Kev

[Suzannek]

Well I for one love "Lois" by Little Stevie Wonder. I also love "Stay Gold" the theme from the 80s film "The Outsiders".

I also like "Harmonica Man" by Stevie Wonder and "Contract on Love" (quite like Martha and the Vandellas version of "Contract on Love" too).

Suz

x

[Guest familytree]

Stevie Wonder has made more great recordings than any of us have had hot dinners and his influence on modern music has been phenomenal.

Kev

Was about to defend the great man myself but you beat me to it... was quite shocked at the comments but each to their own i guess.... .................. and what about 'AS' (aka 'always') for a tune?... brilliant! 'if you really love me' (is it called that?!) LOVEDTHE BOY LOVE THE MAN! ... And I cannot imagine life without Tamla Motown.

[Kev Moore]

Was about to defend the great man myself but you beat me to it... was quite shocked at the comments but each to their own i guess.... .................. and what about 'AS' (aka 'always') for a tune?... brilliant! 'if you really love me' (is it called that?!) LOVEDTHE BOY LOVE THE MAN! ... And I cannot imagine life without Tamla Motown.

Don't forget Another Star.

Would still put a lot of today's music to shame.

Kev

[Jumpinjoan]

Well I think Stevie Wonder is rubbish.

You say you don't know how I can say that. I say I don't know how you can't say that.

Motown's great though!

[Chalky]

Stevie Wonder has made more great recordings than any of us have had hot dinners and his influence on modern music has been phenomenal.

Kev

I bet I've had more hot dinners than he has great recordings He is good though

[Guest Bicks]

I have to say people this is a bit of a shock. I never expected (or wanted) a Stevie Wonder backlash but he appears to have split the nation. I have to say I'm in the 'LOVE' camp right up to and including Hotter Than July, as for the hot dinners thing I must admit to having had more hot dinners than Little Stevie has made great records, I am however quite fat.

Just remembered another one that I always have to turn off when I hear it "Goodnight Irene" by The Originals.

[Jumpinjoan]

I have to say people this is a bit of a shock. I never expected (or wanted) a Stevie Wonder backlash but he appears to have split the nation.

Behave!

You are joking? Please tell me you're not serious?