I Rate This As One Of The Rarest 45's I've Ever Had

[Pete S]

There's an interesting story behind this one. Back in 1991 I was running a magazine called Beatin Rhythm and was also at the peak of my UK label collecting phase, and I was contacted by this chap John Ritson who was the original lead singer of Chapter Five. He was after a copy of One In A Million, which I had, but didn't want to part with really. Anyway he sent me lots of great cuttings and we had a good chat and one of the things he told me was that the band's manager, the apparently aptly named Mervyn Conn, had asked him to leave the band and go solo and call himself John St. John. This suggestion didn't go down too well and the band stayed together for a while longer and then split.

Anyway a couple of years ago, to my and several other peoples astonishment, a German copy of You Can't Mean It backed with One In A Million was turned up, complete with picture sleeve and credited to John St. John! At the weekend I was browsing Ebay and lo and behold, there's another copy of John St. John but this time on an Italian label called GTA records.

It was described as VG- with a small edge crack but I thought I'd go for it anyway. So I won it at £118 (I bid £350) and I've now got it and not only does it play near mint with no sound from the crack, the sound quality is unbelievable, it's better than the UK CBS copy (which I also have). Note that they've mixed the composers up too.

The point of all this is - I've had hundreds and hundreds of rare records over the years, going up to £2500 on one thing I sold, but I rate this particular record as being up amongst the rarest of them all. How many copies are known? Can't be that many. And I know it's a love or hate record but I absolutely love it!

[Supercorsa]

I thought for a minute it was going to be a copy of The Carstairs that you hadn't smashed into a million pieces!

[Kelboy]

Wow Pete that is a rare one. Ive been collecting things like that on and off for 30 years and have never heard of it on that label, i knew someone who had a South-African copy once but i dont think it was backed with One in a million.

Edited November 20, 2008 by KELBOY

[Pete S]

Wow Pete that is a rare one. Ive been collecting things like that on and off for 30 years and have never heard of that, i knew someone who had a south-african copy once.

Yes I've had the South African one through my hands, tri centre which makes it look really weird

[Benji]

Been trying to find a german copy for years now w/out any luck. I consider it to be among the rarest Euro soul releases.

I wish I had either a german or italian press, both Chapter Five goodies on one 45, wow!

[Simsy]

I know it's a love or hate record but I absolutely love it!

So do I.

Closest I've ever come to having a copy was a broken (CBS) demo 18 years ago.

That GTA thing looks super rare.

[Pete S]

Been trying to find a german copy for years now w/out any luck. I consider it to be among the rarest Euro soul releases.

I wish I had either a german or italian press, both Chapter Five goodies on one 45, wow!

What was the German label Benji, was it Ariola or Artone, something like that?

[Prophonics 2029]

Interesting design on that label Pete it still has the CBS eye logo in the middle.

[Benji]

What was the German label Benji, was it Ariola or Artone, something like that?

Don't know if it's wise to let the cat out of the bag on Soul Source but it's Ariola ...

[Pete S]

£460 last year

[Benji]

£460 last year

Wasn't aware of that , the last copy I've seen went for 60 Euros...

[Sean Hampsey]

Also on a GTA 8 track EP

[Sean Hampsey]

One here finished t'other week!

https://cgi.ebay.es/CHAPTER-FIVE-you-cant-m...emZ180299987848

Sean

[Guest]

There's an interesting story behind this one. Back in 1991 I was running a magazine called Beatin Rhythm and was also at the peak of my UK label collecting phase, and I was contacted by this chap John Ritson who was the original lead singer of Chapter Five. He was after a copy of One In A Million, which I had, but didn't want to part with really. Anyway he sent me lots of great cuttings and we had a good chat and one of the things he told me was that the band's manager, the apparently aptly named Mervyn Conn, had asked him to leave the band and go solo and call himself John St. John. This suggestion didn't go down too well and the band stayed together for a while longer and then split.

Anyway a couple of years ago, to my and several other peoples astonishment, a German copy of You Can't Mean It backed with One In A Million was turned up, complete with picture sleeve and credited to John St. John! At the weekend I was browsing Ebay and lo and behold, there's another copy of John St. John but this time on an Italian label called GTA records.

It was described as VG- with a small edge crack but I thought I'd go for it anyway. So I won it at £118 (I bid £350) and I've now got it and not only does it play near mint with no sound from the crack, the sound quality is unbelievable, it's better than the UK CBS copy (which I also have). Note that they've mixed the composers up too.

The point of all this is - I've had hundreds and hundreds of rare records over the years, going up to £2500 on one thing I sold, but I rate this particular record as being up amongst the rarest of them all. How many copies are known? Can't be that many. And I know it's a love or hate record but I absolutely love it!

Docrobert(Rob Bailey) on here as one,i said on here sounds much better.

Edited November 20, 2008 by ken

[Sean Hampsey]

Docrobert(Rob Bailey) on here as one,i said on here sounds much better.

Soundfile for both sides here!

https://www.goear.com/listen.php?v=feb9614

Sean

[Guest KEN-SOUL]

this record has haunted me for years. now you tell me this!!!

[Mick Holdsworth]

There's an interesting story behind this one. Back in 1991 I was running a magazine called Beatin Rhythm and was also at the peak of my UK label collecting phase, and I was contacted by this chap John Ritson who was the original lead singer of Chapter Five. He was after a copy of One In A Million, which I had, but didn't want to part with really. Anyway he sent me lots of great cuttings and we had a good chat and one of the things he told me was that the band's manager, the apparently aptly named Mervyn Conn, had asked him to leave the band and go solo and call himself John St. John. This suggestion didn't go down too well and the band stayed together for a while longer and then split.

Anyway a couple of years ago, to my and several other peoples astonishment, a German copy of You Can't Mean It backed with One In A Million was turned up, complete with picture sleeve and credited to John St. John! At the weekend I was browsing Ebay and lo and behold, there's another copy of John St. John but this time on an Italian label called GTA records.

It was described as VG- with a small edge crack but I thought I'd go for it anyway. So I won it at £118 (I bid £350) and I've now got it and not only does it play near mint with no sound from the crack, the sound quality is unbelievable, it's better than the UK CBS copy (which I also have). Note that they've mixed the composers up too.

The point of all this is - I've had hundreds and hundreds of rare records over the years, going up to £2500 on one thing I sold, but I rate this particular record as being up amongst the rarest of them all. How many copies are known? Can't be that many. And I know it's a love or hate record but I absolutely love it!

Saw this, think I might have bidded on it, but the crack put me off - There was talk on here a few months ago when some other John St John variation turned up on Ariola, probably the one pictured above.

Cheers

Mick Holdsworth

https://northern-soul-records.com

https://motownsound.co.uk

[harpo1]

Peter,

Personally any copies of Chapter five that turn up just increase my potential misery factor, and by that i mean there might be even more chance of me having to hear it ever again

The abriged version with 4 chapter sounds good to me

But as you are well aware its just my opinion, as is yours relating to my all time fave. the Carstairs

See ya soon

Paul

[Sunnysoul]

Looks like there's plenty of 'em around ... in one form or another.

[Pete S]

Looks like there's plenty of 'em around ... in one form or another.

Yeah, 2 non-Chapter 5 copies. Wow. That's plenty alright.

[Pete S]

Peter,

Personally any copies of Chapter five that turn up just increase my potential misery factor, and by that i mean there might be even more chance of me having to hear it ever again

The abriged version with 4 chapter sounds good to me

But as you are well aware its just my opinion, as is yours relating to my all time fave. the Carstairs

See ya soon

Paul

Speechless.

That anyone could actually enjoy listening to The Carstairs I mean.

Might as well get a group of singing dogs and make them howl into a microphone.

[Guest julesp1905]

Always remember back in the late 80's the aptly named Lee Bates from Kent placed an ad in the local Barrow in Furness paper looking for a copy of Both Chapter 5 Singles, think he got 5 copies of YCMI and 8 OIAM before the said local rag run a story detailing the value of the records and the offers then ran out.

[Pete S]

Always remember back in the late 80's the aptly named Lee Bates from Kent placed an ad in the local Barrow in Furness paper looking for a copy of Both Chapter 5 Singles, think he got 5 copies of YCMI and 8 OIAM before the said local rag run a story detailing the value of the records and the offers then ran out.

Thats a true story but the figures are wrong, I don't think he got any OIAM which would make sense seeing as it never got into the shops but he did get a few YCMI. My mate Gary White got me one using the same method, though he did live in Barrow. He actually worked with the songwriter of YCMI, Dave McGerty, who was a security guard at the Vickers establishment. Come to think of it, it was me who put D McG in touvh with Goldmine to get the record reissued, did I get a thank you, did I b*llocks

[Guest sandi]

Speechless.

That anyone could actually enjoy listening to The Carstairs I mean.

Might as well get a group of singing dogs and make them howl into a microphone.

PMSL, l swear to god l'm gonna bang your heads together

[Mike]

Thats a true story but the figures are wrong, I don't think he got any OIAM which would make sense seeing as it never got into the shops but he did get a few YCMI. My mate Gary White got me one using the same method, though he did live in Barrow. He actually worked with the songwriter of YCMI, Dave McGerty, who was a security guard at the Vickers establishment. Come to think of it, it was me who put D McG in touvh with Goldmine to get the record reissued, did I get a thank you, did I b*llocks

the local newspaper clip may be up here somewhere ?

defintely a recent photo of them reformed in the gallery

[Guest julesp1905]

Thats a true story but the figures are wrong, I don't think he got any OIAM which would make sense seeing as it never got into the shops but he did get a few YCMI. My mate Gary White got me one using the same method, though he did live in Barrow. He actually worked with the songwriter of YCMI, Dave McGerty, who was a security guard at the Vickers establishment. Come to think of it, it was me who put D McG in touvh with Goldmine to get the record reissued, did I get a thank you, did I b*llocks

Almost certain he got some OIAM Demos, Think he claimed he was a band member after his recording's which is why there was a front page story about the scam he was pulling.

[Anoraks Corner]

I may have mentioned it before (or was it on RareSoulForum.com?), that there is also an original acetate of the Chapter 5's backing track of OIAM, but with Kenny Bernard singing the song! The link is that they had the same manager (or was it producer - been a while since I checked!) at the time. A right thumping version it makes too, but still not as good as MaxineB, naturally!

[Pete S]

Almost certain he got some OIAM Demos, Think he claimed he was a band member after his recording's which is why there was a front page story about the scam he was pulling.

I've got the article - well maybe I haven't actually still got the original I but I did print it and I've got a copy of the magazine I printed it in - and it just explains that the record has been 'discovered' by someone from kent and now everyone is looking for a copy, and it shows a battered no centre copy of the record

[Pete S]

I may have mentioned it before (or was it on RareSoulForum.com?), that there is also an original acetate of the Chapter 5's backing track of OIAM, but with Kenny Bernard singing the song! The link is that they had the same manager (or was it producer - been a while since I checked!) at the time. A right thumping version it makes too, but still not as good as MaxineB, naturally!

I heard you play it at Brighton Dave - it was a great version - the link being Mervyn Conn the manager

[Pete S]

Any more turned up yet?

[burt weedon]

There's an interesting story behind this one. Back in 1991 I was running a magazine called Beatin Rhythm and was also at the peak of my UK label collecting phase, and I was contacted by this chap John Ritson who was the original lead singer of Chapter Five. He was after a copy of One In A Million, which I had, but didn't want to part with really. Anyway he sent me lots of great cuttings and we had a good chat and one of the things he told me was that the band's manager, the apparently aptly named Mervyn Conn, had asked him to leave the band and go solo and call himself John St. John. This suggestion didn't go down too well and the band stayed together for a while longer and then split.

Anyway a couple of years ago, to my and several other peoples astonishment, a German copy of You Can't Mean It backed with One In A Million was turned up, complete with picture sleeve and credited to John St. John! At the weekend I was browsing Ebay and lo and behold, there's another copy of John St. John but this time on an Italian label called GTA records.

It was described as VG- with a small edge crack but I thought I'd go for it anyway. So I won it at £118 (I bid £350) and I've now got it and not only does it play near mint with no sound from the crack, the sound quality is unbelievable, it's better than the UK CBS copy (which I also have). Note that they've mixed the composers up too.

The point of all this is - I've had hundreds and hundreds of rare records over the years, going up to £2500 on one thing I sold, but I rate this particular record as being up amongst the rarest of them all. How many copies are known? Can't be that many. And I know it's a love or hate record but I absolutely love it!

Hi pete. cud you ,tell me woy Don Gardner.my baby likes to boogaloo.(tru-glo-town) costs. thanks;burt.(hicky)

[Pete S]

Hi pete. cud you ,tell me woy Don Gardner.my baby likes to boogaloo.(tru-glo-town) costs. thanks;burt.(hicky)

Went a bit mad a few years back but now should be £30 or so

[Jim Elliott]

Always remember back in the late 80's the aptly named Lee Bates from Kent placed an ad in the local Barrow in Furness paper looking for a copy of Both Chapter 5 Singles, think he got 5 copies of YCMI and 8 OIAM before the said local rag run a story detailing the value of the records and the offers then ran out.

Lee got 5 copies of YCMI. ( Well, thats the laugh we always have about it anyway, eh mate?) Chemicals??

Edited May 11, 2009 by Jim Elliott

[dthedrug]

There's an interesting story behind this one. Back in 1991 I was running a magazine called Beatin Rhythm and was also at the peak of my UK label collecting phase, and I was contacted by this chap John Ritson who was the original lead singer of Chapter Five. He was after a copy of One In A Million, which I had, but didn't want to part with really. Anyway he sent me lots of great cuttings and we had a good chat and one of the things he told me was that the band's manager, the apparently aptly named Mervyn Conn, had asked him to leave the band and go solo and call himself John St. John. This suggestion didn't go down too well and the band stayed together for a while longer and then split.

Anyway a couple of years ago, to my and several other peoples astonishment, a German copy of You Can't Mean It backed with One In A Million was turned up, complete with picture sleeve and credited to John St. John! At the weekend I was browsing Ebay and lo and behold, there's another copy of John St. John but this time on an Italian label called GTA records.

It was described as VG- with a small edge crack but I thought I'd go for it anyway. So I won it at £118 (I bid £350) and I've now got it and not only does it play near mint with no sound from the crack, the sound quality is unbelievable, it's better than the UK CBS copy (which I also have). Note that they've mixed the composers up too.

The point of all this is - I've had hundreds and hundreds of rare records over the years, going up to £2500 on one thing I sold, but I rate this particular record as being up amongst the rarest of them all. How many copies are known? Can't be that many. And I know it's a love or hate record but I absolutely love it!

Hi Pete as a UK collector I know you have had a UK demo of this.( IT LOOKS LIKE ROCKING HORES SHIT WOULD I BE CORRECT IN THIS ASUPTION) DAVE KIL

[burt weedon]

Went a bit mad a few years back but now should be £30 or so

cheers mate,sos just managed to sit down,wot about this;found out ov one of me box,s;

[burt weedon]

cheers mate,sos just managed to sit down,wot about this;found out ov one of me box,s;

found these as well;wiv this bag from about 79 i tink..ha.

[Pete S]

You need to find the macro button on your camera so you can proper close ups - is that hesitations on the Kapp label from Holland? Very nice. Not sure about the Thompson Twins picture disc though

[Jim G]

Uk Demo on Ebay

https://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Chapter-Five-You-Can...%3A1%7C294%3A50

[burt weedon]

found these as well;wiv this bag from about 79 i tink..ha.

yeah sos pete,aint too gud at this bloody pc eeva.its a dutch,copy,woz in sealed bag etc.ill try n work macro etc out.ive got a lot ov other stuff,few thousand i bought few yrs back.just started gettin out me lock ups.;;;it woz barcley james-harvest as well..cheers m8 x.

[Lee Bates]

Almost certain he got some OIAM Demos, Think he claimed he was a band member after his recording's which is why there was a front page story about the scam he was pulling.

Well Jules, dont believe all that you hear....I infact only got 5 copys of "You can't mean it" one of which still sits in my collection, the rest are long gone. No "One in a million" demos.

And as for being a band member... lolol a 38 year old Kentish one...no, where the hell did that come from? Actually I never saw the article but would be keen on seeing it if anybody has a copy.

[Lee Bates]

Lee got 5 copies of YCMI. ( Well, thats the laugh we always have about it anyway, eh mate?) Chemicals??

I did indeed Mr Elliott....always laugh about the fact that when Jim and I were at the 100 Club some waster offered to do an exchange for "chemicals" for a copy :wanker: . No ta and I wasnt even wearing a lab coat!

[Pete S]

Uk Demo on Ebay

https://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Chapter-Five-You-Can...%3A1%7C294%3A50

Got a feeling thats going to cost me an awful lot of money - outbid at £444 !

[Samplat]

Pete, don't keep upping the amount i'll have to pay. I'll let you have your old issue back instead

[Benji]

I still think my german picture sleeve copy looks much much better than either the UK or the italian one...

[Pete S]

Pete, don't keep upping the amount i'll have to pay. I'll let you have your old issue back instead

Seriously?

I've got an issue though..

[Sheldonsoul]

Seriously?

I've got an issue though..

i was the first bidder on ebay copy you must have outbid me sat lunchtime pete, you say you have an issue for sale

[Samplat]

i was the first bidder on ebay copy you must have outbid me sat lunchtime pete, you say you have an issue for sale

if i win the demo then i will have an issue for sale.

[Pete S]

if i win the demo then i will have an issue for sale.

If I win the demo then I will also have an issue for sale

[Samplat]

If I win the demo then I will also have an issue for sale

this could get silly pete

[Pete S]

this could get silly pete

Probably will