Complete Beginners Guide To Northern Soul

[Guest andyrattigan]

Let the music speak for itself. Some great tunes on that comp and it doesn't matter who compiled it.

However, Drizabone aint Northern. Its a good Soul record, but a nineties one at that and I dont see the point of it on a beginners guide to Northern Soul.

Edited November 15, 2008 by andyrattigan

[Mak]

I wonder who will admit to getting one for xmas , I'd like to think my family have got better taste , it's shite

[Steve G]

Well I will buy it, but that maybe because I am vain and think I am on the cover

Otherwise it wouldn't be for me, but hey it's a release, it may have nothing to do with todays scene, but nor do many releases that come out and it's not like it's the first "basic NS" CD to ever come out.

So I'd ordinarily be pretty neutral about it.

[Simon M]

Dear me Drizabone , an Essex boys record , ends up on this comp ?!

Have a good half century Steve

Edited November 15, 2008 by Simon M

[Lindsay]

My advice to a newcomer? Put ya headphones on and listen to the music so you can't hear everyone on the scene arguing

[Chalky]

Let the music speak for itself. Some great tunes on that comp and it doesn't matter who compiled it.

However, Drizabone aint Northern. Its a good Soul record, but a nineties one at that and I dont see the point of it on a beginners guide to Northern Soul.

Drizabone has had plenty of plays at Northern Soul venues with a good floor reaction most times so how can you say it ain't Northern? Is it because it doesn't have the "traditional" northern beat? There's plenty of records that ain't in the traditional northern style. If it's played at a northern venue its northern irrespective of someone's personal taste.

[Guest in town Mikey]

Some good thoughts on here, from both sides.

What I was getting at was why would you introduce anybody to a music scene by giving them records to listen to that they wont hear when they go out. Or are less likely to hear really. IMO that gives new guys a sense of being on the outside looking in, while everyone in the room is in on something. That would lead to more people walking away probably

The music on there is fine. its our heritage. But would you take a budding pilot and tell him all about the Sopwith Camel, if he wants to fly a Jumbo Jet? This CD is like Soul with Gossamer wings. Why not give new guys the jet engine of todays club sounds?

And Pete. Yes I'd probably be singing Ady's praises if he did it, because he'd as usual, do a far better job. It would be a nightmare task, but surely a beginner needs to be gotten into the club, and comfortable with the thought that the stuff they are playing in their kitchen, is the stuff they are going to hear.

In its first home the Capitol lads would give out tapes of the stuff you'd hear in their club. (Well actually Vinylvixen would hand them out) And the results were clear for all to see. A far younger crowd, enthusiastic, and up for a dance all night. It can be done. They proved it.

Mind you I could be wrong and -Its Better To Have And Dont Need, could be filling the floors all over the UK tonight.

Edited November 15, 2008 by in town Mikey

[Guest James Trouble]

Yes well unfortunately for you moaning sods who are never happy about anything, the records played 30 years ago were in general way better than those played today, so thats why classics keep turning up on cd's isn't it...and not the latest gospel r&b rock & roll record someones playing - because the problem here is that you are all slagging off because of who has put it out. IF it's Roberts or Levine, it's slagged off, if Ady or Richard Searling had put this out, you'd all be brown nosing and back slapping, and don't say you wouldn't.

Do you defend anything they do, just because it is them that do it?

I think a lot of what is wrong with the world is that people consume without thinking. To consume mediocrity without question is very dangerous. Why shouldn't things be questioned? Why shouldn't motives and quality be examined? People who these kind of things are aimed at shouldn't be allowed to consume blindly and form badly conceived ideas about what it represents. If this thread is stumbled on by one person who consumed a copy of this CD without any consideration and somehow found themselves on this thread and by reading this thread they stop and think again about what or how they are exploring their interest then the world is a better place.

I'm not saying this CD is good or bad, but Pete, I am saying your outlook is dangerous and flawed. People should make an informed choice about everything in life and not blindly consume crap.

[funkyfeet]

It's aimed at the TESCO buyers don't get upset about it, if they are original cuts then there's some good tunes on there, and if it educates the general public about Soul tunes it can't be bad, or would you rather they listen to Abba.

[BrianB]

I wonder who will admit to getting one for xmas , I'd like to think my family have got better taste , it's shite

Its shite? I take it you don't like Northern Soul and Motown then?

Or were you lucky enough to miss the early/mid/late seventies?

[Paul Shirley]

Well, the Snake did it for me in 1971 when I went to my local youth club and discovered this brilliant music. And IMHO it still sounds great on the rare times that I play it. I'm sure that there a lot of other people on this site that started their time dancing to it. Great record, great lyrics, and by a great artist.

Not one for the soul snobs though. Not country enough.

Paul

i rimember it being hamerd in mr Mms back inthe day what people now call a floor filler you got crushed in the rush to dance to it, along with the exiters and yet today they are considerd divi tunes could never understand why the same people hate them with such vengence ,

[Ian Dewhirst]

I think people are getting a little bit carried away here.

The package is called "A Complete Introduction To Northern Soul", is culled mostly from the Universal archives and was compiled by a guy who came up in the formative years of Northern Soul and then went on to run the biggest and most popular all-nighter in the scene's history. It's 100% logical that Universal should have approached Russ to put this together. Anyone would have leapt at the opportunity believe me.

I'm no apologist for Russ. I hadn't even seen him for 35 odd years until last week and I could be famously snitty about some of the tunes he played back in the day, but I won't decry him for his choice of music on this box set, which I think does exactly what it says on the tin. It IS an introduction to Northern Soul and many of these tunes are available on a legit CD for the first time so in my view there's nothing to really moan about in my opinion. In fact, as soon as I became aware that the release was imminent I was the first to ring Universal and get a copy. It's a great package!

What I think many people on here are missing, is that it's being aimed fairly and squarely at a much wider market than the majority of many more contemporary Northern Soul CD releases, which have a much more limited sales potential. As an example, the four volumes of The Northern Soul Story which I compiled for Sony-BMG last year have now collectively sold over 100K units in the first year of release because they were aimed at a similar market. 'The Complete Introduction To Northern Soul' package wasn't necessarily designed for the S.S. audience, who, by and large, are not the sort of people who will be rushing into HMV or Asda for the latest Northern Soul reissue CD's anyway, but rather for the 30-40,000+ people out there who are looking for packages of this nature. If it's anything like the same audience who bought Goldmine's "The Wigan Casino Story" (rumoured to be over 60K) then both Universal and Russ will be very happy.

It's a different market to the hardcore S.S. audience and, as such, probably won't find many fans reading this particular thread. However, there is a huge audience out here who will love this package and that's the market who this is aimed for.

As Russ said t'other night, when he was agonising over what to call the package, he realised that he'd be damned whatever he did so he went for the least offensive title he could think of. I for one think he got it exactly right and I told him so.

If it had been me I'd have called it something like "100 Monsters From The Golden Age Of Northern Soul" or something equally crass.

So stop bloody moaning and listen to the music instead! It's got pretty much all of the Motown killers and lots of the lesser-known ones on one package along with decently mastered goodies from Cameo Parkway, Kapp, Chess, MGM, ABC, Phillips etc, etc and manages to not replicate several earlier packages and put 'em all in a beautiful 4 x CD package with a beautifully constructed 38 page booklet.

Anyone who seriously collects music on CD would be more than happy to have this in their collection believe me!

Ian D

[Mike]

whats with all the comments about moaning ?

place is all about discussion, aint that whats happening here ?

[Ste Henderson]

i rimember it being hamerd in mr Mms back inthe day what people now call a floor filler you got crushed in the rush to dance to it, along with the exiters and yet today they are considerd divi tunes could never understand why the same people hate them with such vengence ,

Its always been a massive tune on the scene, I wouldn't call it a "divi" tune ( btw i thought that saying went out in the 70s )

I just dont like it, the lyrics for one and the musical arrangement is annoying to the ears IMHO

Steve (tin hat on)

[Pete S]

whats with all the comments about moaning ?

place is all about discussion, aint that whats happening here ?

About 50-50 discussion/moaning

[Ian Dewhirst]

whats with all the comments about moaning ?

place is all about discussion, aint that whats happening here ?

True Mike. I just felt there was some unjustified criticism and some nasty jibes going on. It's not like there's that many Northern releases on CD these days, so when a decent package comes out I think it should be applauded not derided.

What I meant by moaning was comments like:-

"Nothing new their then,same old, same old".

"Hardly going to set the world on fire is it does beg the question....WHY? you can get most of these tracks free with a packet of cornflakes these days"

"I'd like to think my family have got better taste , it's shite."

But I guess yer right. Everyone's entitled to an opinion. But, on the other hand, most people don't know how difficult it is to get these projects together. I first heard about this project 18 months ago and I knew that it would have involved some torturous licensing/master/contractual hassles for many of the tracks on here. Saying you can get most of these tracks free with a packet of cornflakes is disingenious to say the least!

When was the last time you got a free Patti & The Emblems or Spyder Turner with yer cereal LOL?

Ian D

Edited November 15, 2008 by Ian Dewhirst

[Paul Shirley]

Its always been a massive tune on the scene, I wouldn't call it a "divi" tune ( btw i thought that saying went out in the 70s )

I just dont like it, the lyrics for one and the musical arrangement is annoying to the ears IMHO

Steve (tin hat on)

nah people stil come out with it , i live close to liverpool and i seem to rimember it was acomon saying in liverpool i think thats where it originated from

[Epic]

When was the last time you got a free Patti & The Emblems or Spyder Turner with yer cereal LOL?

Ian D

Never - but I've got a few records that go Snap, Crackle & Pop!!!!!

[Mike]

About 50-50 discussion/moaning

i thought it was 50/50 the other way

True Mike. I just felt there was some unjustified criticism and some nasty jibes going on. It's not like there's that many Northern releases on CD these days, so when a decent package comes out I think it should be applauded not derided.

What I meant by moaning was comments like:-

"Nothing new their then,same old, same old".

"Hardly going to set the world on fire is it does beg the question....WHY? you can get most of these tracks free with a packet of cornflakes these days"

"I'd like to think my family have got better taste , it's shite."

But I guess yer right. Everyone's entitled to an opinion. But, on the other hand, most people don't know how difficult it is to get these projects together. I first heard about this project 18 months ago and I knew that it would have involved some torturous licensing/master/contractual hassles for many of the tracks on here. Saying you can get most of these tracks free with a packet of cornflakes is disingenious to say the least!

When was the last time you got a free Patti & The Emblems or Spyder Turner with yer cereal LOL?

Ian D

I know what you're saying Ian

but there's a wide range of members on here and always gonna get a bit of that no matter what gets pushed out

reckon myself that say the original post had a bit of blurb posted with it, press release or something, saying what the thinking behind the release and selection of tracks was and all that sort of thing, then maybe might have avoided a few of the sharpest comments such as the first two you quoted

mike

[Guest mel brat]

4. I Want To Go Back There Again - Chris Clark

25. California Soul - Marvin Gaye, Tammi Terrell

Since when were these two ever considered to be "Northern" Soul???

Edited November 15, 2008 by mel brat

[Ian Dewhirst]

Never - but I've got a few records that go Snap, Crackle & Pop!!!!!

I think your coat's hanging up in the hall innit Epic!

Ian D

[scunnyjack]

4. I Want To Go Back There Again - Chris Clark

25. California Soul - Marvin Gaye, Tammi Terrell

Since when were these two ever considered to be "Northern" Soul???

My introduction into the scene was in 1968 when I was regular at a club playing rare soul/motown records. The main DJ (Fred Benson) nearly always finished off with It's So Hard Being a Loser, I Want To Go Back There Again and I'm Gonna Miss You. California Soul maybe not,but the likes of Chris Clark set me off on a musical trail that included Blackpool, Wigan and Cleethorpes and some of the best days/nights of my life.

Steve

[soulAdequateNP]

I'm with Ian D on this one - for an "introduction" package (especially one designed for longevity, as I get the impression this is), it's best really to concentrate on evergreen classics (such as Yvonne Baker, Bobby Hebb, Patti/Emblems etc) - sounds that you'll hear out, or tracks sounding very much like them, maybe not every week but certainly every so often.

The trouble with going for current in-demanders - as some posters here are suggesting should have been done - is that they're likely to fall out of favour just as quickly - case in point, 12-24 months ago DJ Genesis "Tonight" was unavoidable - now it's forgotten: likewise only 5 years or so ago Bettye Swann "Kiss My Love Goodbye" was a guaranteed spin at most soul nights, now it's back to forgotten oldie status and hardly ever heard anymore.

As always - this is my opinion, I'm not always right

[Guest mel brat]

My introduction into the scene was in 1968 when I was regular at a club playing rare soul/motown records. The main DJ (Fred Benson) nearly always finished off with It's So Hard Being a Loser, I Want To Go Back There Again and I'm Gonna Miss You. California Soul maybe not,but the likes of Chris Clark set me off on a musical trail that included Blackpool, Wigan and Cleethorpes and some of the best days/nights of my life.

Steve

I like and have these records, but I have never, ever regarded them as "Northern Soul". Classic Motown perhaps, but not "Northern Soul" in my book. I recall The Contours "It's So Hard Being A Loser" (which I adore) being an in-demand side around the time Dave Godin coined the term.

Edited November 16, 2008 by mel brat

[good angel]

I can see it now,winding up in a few Xmas stockings brought by grannys and Auntys,saying I know you like that northern thingy.

Lets hope they dont have any Tv adverts,like all the Best of CDs for Xmas.

Kev

[Guest soul city]

believe this C.D compilation has been put together by Russ Winstanley

(need you say more!)

[Guest]

believe this C.D compilation has been put together by Russ Winstanley

(need you say more!)

There are several interesting press / promotion blurbs for the set , one stating the following .......

" Compiled by Wigan Casino DJ Russ Winstanley, it's a four-disc set, each with its own theme - Motown Memories, Motown's Hidden Nuggets, Northern Floorshakers and Northern Anthems. For the serious collector, there's probably little new - although some tracks have made it out of the Motown archives for the first time. But for the less obsessive, it promises a mix of dancefloor staples and rare gems from the 60s to the present day - yes, even Frank Popp makes an appearance "

Whilst another states this gem ........

" Curated by Wigan Casino Russ Winstanley "

CURATED ? Can someone please explain this term ? I know " Curator " is the defination of / for " the custodian of a museum or library , and that " curative " is likened to the curing of a disease , but " Curated " ? ........

Malc Burton

[vaultofsouler]

" Compiled by Wigan Casino DJ Russ Winstanley, it's a four-disc set, each with its own theme - Motown Memories, Motown's Hidden Nuggets, Northern Floorshakers and Northern Anthems. For the serious collector, there's probably little new - although some tracks have made it out of the Motown archives for the first time. But for the less obsessive, it promises a mix of dancefloor staples and rare gems from the 60s to the present day - yes, even Frank Popp makes an appearance "

I reckon if just this bit of info had been included in the very first post, by way of an intro as to what it is about, then these 2 pages of "debate" would never have happened ....

[Guest]

I reckon if just this bit of info had been included in the very first post, by way of an intro as to what it is about, then these 2 pages of "debate" would never have happened ....

Exactly - does anyone not read the publicity for interesting projects such as this release , when it is brought to the attention of the soul / allied fraternity ? ........

The contents of the set are a good indication / reference to recordings that have graced , and were popular on the scene , and the end product is a credit to all the hard work undertaken in compiling / releasing it , but I feel that a better title could have been given to it .......

Malc Burton

Edited November 16, 2008 by Malc Burton

[Ric-tic]

The contents of the set are a good indication / reference to recordings that have graced , and were popular on the scene , and the end product is a credit to all the hard work undertaken in compiling / releasing it , but I feel that a better title could have been given to it .......

Malc Burton

to be fair to russ hes said for the last couple of weeks the title of this set wasnt really his idea, and ive just noticed universal are doing a whole series of motown c.ds -An Introduction to......the temptations marvin gaye etc so everybody stand in line and say sorry to russ

[Soul Shrews]

Al Kents wife was Norma Toney.

She wrote the wonderful "You're The Best In The World" Johnnie Taylor

"One More Hurt" David Ruffin

"Unwanted Company" Jeannie Reynolds

"Holding on" Detroit Emeralds

"Someday We'll Have A Better World" Eddie Kendricks

"Deeper And Deeper" Freda Payne

"You Gave Me Something" Bobby Taylor

N. Toney on a record label always denotes a mark of quality to me.

A wonderful lyricist!

Sean

Very good call on all these sounds Mr H................."Unwanted Company" always sends me into a "soul" trance

Now, a CD comp of Norma Toneys work would be top of my shopping list

Cheers Paul

[Guest]

to be fair to russ hes said for the last couple of weeks the title of this set wasnt really his idea, and ive just noticed universal are doing a whole series of motown c.ds -An Introduction to......the temptations marvin gaye etc so everybody stand in line and say sorry to russ

No problem - as long as he tells me what " Curated " means ( reference my earlier posting / reply - " Curated by Wigan Casino Russ Winstanley " ) .........

Malc Burton

[Guest bazrico]

No problem - as long as he tells me what " Curated " means ( reference my earlier posting / reply - " Curated by Wigan Casino Russ Winstanley " ) .........

Malc Burton

Verb

Simple past tense and past participle of curate.

Adjective

Produced by curatorial process; reviewed by a curator Literature-based knowledge vendors often claim to lease various products, including algorithmically extracted facts, and human-curated literature references.hope this will help

[Guest]

No problem - as long as he tells me what " Curated " means ( reference my earlier posting / reply - " Curated by Wigan Casino Russ Winstanley " ) .........

Malc Burton

Verb

Simple past tense and past participle of curate.

Adjective

Produced by curatorial process; reviewed by a curator Literature-based knowledge vendors often claim to lease various products, including algorithmically extracted facts, and human-curated literature references.hope this will help

My thanks for that : I thought I was educated , but when the term " curated " came up on one of the publicity blurbs for the set , it baffled me , as I had not come across it before ........

Malc Burton

[SteveM]

No problem - as long as he tells me what " Curated " means ( reference my earlier posting / reply - " Curated by Wigan Casino Russ Winstanley " ) .........

Malc Burton

He's told you Malc. its a clever word that means Russ has picked them of a list supplied by Universal.

But i still don't see why anybody needs to get worked up about it (or the Russell Watson cd) to be honest. Does anybody really think that there is going to be an influx like the seventies because of releases like this? More likely students or whatever who do get into the music (as opposed to the scene) are more likely to play the music at their own venues rather than be seen dead dancing with their grandparents drug addled friends.

[SteveM]

My thanks for that : I thought I was educated , but when the term " curated " came up on one of the publicity blurbs for the set , it baffled me , as I had not come across it before ........

Malc Burton

If Lady B finds out you haven't admitted you thought it was a typo, you'll be in trouble

[Guest]

If Lady B finds out you haven't admitted you thought it was a typo, you'll be in trouble

She knows , and has made me do 500 lines - the ones on paper , not the ones to travel up my nose .......

Malc Burton

[SteveM]

She knows , and has made me do 500 lines - the ones on paper , not the ones to travel up my nose .......

Malc Burton

those were the days

[Guest]

those were the days

Aye , that was when your nostrils were so wide , that people thought your sunglassses had slipped down your nose .....

Malc Burton

[Guest]

Aye , that was when your nostrils were so wide , that people thought your sunglassses had slipped down your nose .....

Malc Burton

Disclaimer :

In reference to the above , and to earlier postings / replies in this thread from my esteemed Credibilty Police collegue , Steve Mannion , and myself . we would like to make it clear , that despite our comments appearing to advocate their usage , we do not condone the cavalier use of recreational drugs in any form .........

Malc Burton

[Ian Dewhirst]

Disclaimer :

In reference to the above , and to earlier postings / replies in this thread from my esteemed Credibilty Police collegue , Steve Mannion , and myself . we would like to make it clear , that despite our comments appearing to advocate their usage , we do not condone the cavalier use of recreational drugs in any form .........

Malc Burton

I thought that was the whole point of 'em!

Ian D

[Richard Bayley]

Disclaimer :

, we do not condone the cavalier use of recreational drugs in any form .........

Malc Burton

Never heard the expression "snorts like a Roundhead"?

[Guest bazrico]

Disclaimer :

In reference to the above , and to earlier postings / replies in this thread from my esteemed Credibilty Police collegue , Steve Mannion , and myself . we would like to make it clear , that despite our comments appearing to advocate their usage , we do not condone the cavalier use of recreational drugs in any form .........

Malc Burton

why not i ask myself