Ian Levine, Motorcity, Centre City, Blackpool Mecca, And Swons

[Guest James Trouble]

this thread will still be going in 2 months time...

I don't think 2 months will be long enough to full document and sort all the valuable historical information being contributed to this thread

Ian, can you tell us some information about your relationship with Les Cockell? From my studys that you gave me I think you probably met him around 1969, 1970? What was he like as person, how did you meet him, what was the nature of your relationship around this time. Specifically in the months that led up the rise of the Torch?

Edited August 25, 2008 by James Trouble

[Chris L]

He's here for one thing and one thing only to sell more of his crap.

And you know this to be a fact ?? Can you show us the irrefutable evidence (just in case

you don't know it, saying IMHO doesn't mean it's a fact) have you copies of faxes, e-mails,

taped conversations proving it ???

[Guest]

Only if he avoids certain questions that are put to him. If he comes out all guns blazing you'll get to see the REAL reason he's on here and the bubble will burst. I joined this thread because I thought this guy had something to offer still and i respected his past output (Still do). But his stubborn attitude to anything other than his own opinion can't be that of a sensible person living in this day & age. Not in the industry he works in not unless there is a hidden agenda. It took a while but the only conclusion I can come to is the same as others sussed out earlier than me. He's here for one thing and one thing only to sell more of his crap. Don't have a problem with that just would like that posted up front so everyone can see for themselves. All the shenanigans avoiding this is down right wrong.

All my life I was called a Soul Rebel, because in the early 1970s, I championed the music I loved, not what Radio and the Media said I should champion.

I did my own thing. I was my own boss. I did it my way. No-one else could change that.

As Bobby Hebb said

YOU WANT TO CHANGE ME

REARRANGE ME

WHY DON'T YOU TAKE ME AS I AM.

I am now over fifty and still the same.

You are NOT going to change me now, no matter how much you try.

[Pete S]

I don't think 2 months will be long enough to full document all the valuable information we have here.

Ian, can you tell us some information about your relationship with Les Cockell? From my studys that you gave me I think you probably met him around 1969, 1970? What was he like as person, how did you meet him, what was the nature of your relationship around this time. Specifically in the months that led up the rise of the Torch?

Do you even know who Les Cockell was James?

[Pete S]

As long as an overzealous Mod doesn't ban me for not toeing the line.

No you're toeing the line and handling everyone very well I reckon. It's also a good idea using the 'this user is being ignored' thing, you'll have to show me how to do it so I don't have to read half the sh*t some of these people write.

[Mike]

just to clear things up

this thread is just a thread on the site

in theory same as any other

due to things have sort of adopted a let everyone "have their say"

however now at point where think may be worthwhile saying the below

the title, the wide scope and such does appear to be working ok to a certain degree at the moment and imo there's no reason to change things

but do need to ask all to lets lay off or avoid the wind ups, personal abuse, and all the rest of the games

mods will step in if feel needed as with any other thread , but if all avoid the above then that shouldn't be necessary

sure that some members do find it enjoyable/interesting and sure that some may not

however it is just one thread and as with any thread on here if you dont like it then dont view it

any concerns etc on this or any other thread, site matters or whatever then ask please post in feedback not on the actual thread

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/index.php?showforum=41

thanks

off back to the bank holiday

mike

[chrissie]

Why are you so determined to stop me from making the music that I want to make ???

Nobody can stop you making the music you want (god knows enough have tried and failed ) but it's your attitude that your opinion is the right one and that you completely dismiss anyone who disagrees with you that gets up peoples noses.

QoFxx

Edited August 25, 2008 by chrissie

[Guest James Trouble]

And you know this to be a fact ?? Can you show us the irrefutable evidence (just in case

you don't know it, saying IMHO doesn't mean it's a fact) have you copies of faxes, e-mails,

taped conversations proving it ???

Too right Chris, how anyone can question Ian's motives is beyond me.

Edited August 25, 2008 by James Trouble

[Guest]

I don't think 2 months will be long enough to full document and sort all the valuable historical information being contributed to this thread.

Ian, can you tell us some information about your relationship with Les Cockell? From my studys that you gave me I think you probably met him around 1969, 1970? What was he like as person, how did you meet him, what was the nature of your relationship around this time. Specifically in the months that led up the rise of the Torch?

I met him in 1970.

He was my best friend.

In 1971 they wanted me to DJ at the Mecca in his place but we ended up doing alternate weeks, till Tony Jebb left to do the Torch. Then we did it together till I left to do The Torch.

We fell out in 1994. He died in 1998. We fell out over something silly and stupid but it involved me not breaking my word to someone else, and I had actually sworn on my life. I would never break that oath, so wouldn't give Les what he wanted, and we fell out. I will never ever ever swear on my life about anything ever again.

I don't believe that remembering a great friend, a very special and unique person, and my greatest musical influence, could cast me in a bad light so I answered your question.

[Guest]

It took a while but the only conclusion I can come to is the same as others sussed out earlier than me. He's here for one thing and one thing only to sell more of his crap.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the title of this thread is "Ian Levine, Motorcity, Centre City, Blackpool Mecca, And Swons"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Motorcity, Centre City, and Swons, are all actual professional projects and record labels that I have made, yes ???

[Guest James Trouble]

Do you even know who Les Cockell was James?

Pete, how could I not know who Ian Levine's greatest musical infuence is?

[Pete S]

Pete, how could I not know who Ian Levine's greatest musical infuence is?

[Koolkat]

Didn't say it was did I, I was commenting on the large amount of people involved in it, you see I don't know if you know this but 50 is a number which is larger than the usual 5 people who watch normal threads

[Chris L]

Too right Chris, how anyone can question Ian's motives is beyond me.

Thank you kind sir !! Your wise

words will assist me in my tea gulping moments later tonight.

[Mike]

just to clear things up

this thread is just a thread on the site

in theory same as any other

due to things have sort of adopted a let everyone "have their say"

however now at point where think may be worthwhile saying the below

the title, the wide scope and such does appear to be working ok to a certain degree at the moment and imo there's no reason to change things

but do need to ask all to lets lay off or avoid the wind ups, personal abuse, and all the rest of the games

mods will step in if feel needed as with any other thread , but if all avoid the above then that shouldn't be necessary

sure that some members do find it enjoyable/interesting and sure that some may not

however it is just one thread and as with any thread on here if you dont like it then dont view it

any concerns etc on this or any other thread, site matters or whatever then ask please post in feedback not on the actual thread

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/index.php?showforum=41

thanks

off back to the bank holiday

mike

[Mak]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the title of this thread is "Ian Levine, Motorcity, Centre City, Blackpool Mecca, And Swons"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Motorcity, Centre City, and Swons, are all actual professional projects and record labels that I have made, yes ???

Thats subject to debate , anyway it seems like your getting a lot of free PR very professional

[Guest James Trouble]

I met him in 1970.

He was my best friend.

In 1971 they wanted me to DJ at the Mecca in his place but we ended up doing alternate weeks, till Tony Jebb left to do the Torch. Then we did it together till I left to do The Torch.

We fell out in 1994. He died in 1998. We fell out over something silly and stupid but it involved me not breaking my word to someone else, and I had actually sworn on my life. I would never break that oath, so wouldn't give Les what he wanted, and we fell out. I will never ever ever swear on my life about anything ever again.

I don't believe that remembering a great friend, a very special and unique person, and my greatest musical influence, could cast me in a bad light so I answered your question.

Yeah, yeah I know that already. What's the point of sending me off to study the history books if you can't provide me with more detailed information when I crave it?

Tony left, that was with Colin, Keith, Alan and Martin wasn't it? I'm able to provide more detailed information than you now it seems!

How did you relationship with those men develop after they left?

This promise you swore on your life with, was it with Tony?

Tell me more about Tony and how you saw him, what was the nature of your relationship?

Edited August 25, 2008 by James Trouble

[Koolkat]

Quick question Ian. Did you actually find/ discover Doni Burdick......Bari Track? That is my one abiding memory of the Mecca. Covered up of course as Lebaron Strings....I miss my baby. I can remember its first play at the Casino still covered up.

[Guest Paul]

Hello Nik Mak,

Everything is relative and subjective. An artist or a producer has the right to make whatever music they like. They can even be totally self-indulgent or experimental if they can afford it.

As for being "outdated", isn't almost everything "outdated" these days???

I like Sharon Jones, Eli Reed, Amy Winehouse, Duffy etc. They are all very retro-influenced by vintage pop, soul, jazz and even blues. Their influences go from Billie Holiday and Dusty Springfield to Phil Spector, Motown and Stax.

And many house tracks are still influenced by Philadelphia International, Salsoul and disco. Some producers have been using the very same sounds, patterns and loops for years.

Nothing is very new or original so you can apply your "oudated" tag to almost anything.

Best regards,

Paul Mooney

[Prophonics 2029]

Didn't say it was did I, I was commenting on the large amount of people involved in it, you see I don't know if you know this but 50 is a number which is larger than the usual 5 people who watch normal threads

Sorry Pete if I took your line the wrong way 50 out of 240 isn't bad.

[Haydn]

Hi Ian,

Good to have you on board!

It does seem nowadays that everybody and their aunt are out there Dj'ing, and was wondering about the detriment to the scene.

Does being a collector justify a good DJ because of the rarity of records they have, or the justification of a good DJ because of the formats/issues they have available in their box(OVO)? You probably know the route I mean with British releases sometimes championing a USA release due to scarcity.

Also,

What are you're views on present day DJ's and their attitude towards the "scene" and do you have any views at all on old school DJ's that have apparently sold off their collections but still doing occasional gigs.

Yours in thanks,

Haydn

[Pete S]

Sorry Pete if I took your line the wrong way 50 out of 240 isn't bad.

[Guest]

sure that some members do find it enjoyable/interesting and sure that some may not

however it is just one thread and as with any thread on here if you dont like it then dont view it

I'm very appreciative that you said this, Mike, as it echoes my own sentiments exactly.

I would be REALLY enjoying this thread if a small number of people (I can count them on one hand) would stop baiting me.

[Guest James Trouble]

Hi Ian,

Good to have you on board!

It does seem nowadays that everybody and their aunt are out there Dj'ing, and was wondering about the detriment to the scene.

Does being a collector justify a good DJ because of the rarity of records they have, or the justification of a good DJ because of the formats/issues they have available in their box(OVO)? You probably know the route I mean with British releases sometimes championing a USA release due to scarcity.

Also,

What are you're views on present day DJ's and their attitude towards the "scene" and do you have any views at all on old school DJ's that have apparently sold off their collections but still doing occasional gigs.

Yours in thanks,

Haydn

Is this relevent to the thread, or shoudl we wait untill we get the All About The Levine up and running with all the related sub forums?

[Guest Nik Mak]

Why are you so determined to stop me from making the music that I want to make ???

It's not hurting you in any way.

And if I'm so far off the mark, how come Expansion Records, who created their YouTube page around the same time as I did mine, had sixteen thousand views at the same time as I reached three million, and they released your precious Sam Bostic record.

I think it's YOU who is so far off the mark, I'm afraid.

Sam Bostic is selling tho your not it's as simple as that. You can have a trillion hits doesn't do a damned thing for the artist if it doesn't sell. These people I would imagine are trying to make a living at their art. It comes across that you are useing your PAST successes to gain favour with these people and then producing nothing that will promote them in todays market place other wise why isn't the music your creating selling? Your cover versions do them no favours as all you've done is copied note for note other producers creativity and added virtually nothing to garner record sales in todays market (Good for your self esteem tho?). Your present day musical output hankers after a past glory that cannot be recreated just by churning out what has gone before. Then is then this is now. If you truely cannot see this you need help to realise the effort your waisting and the illusion your living under. No one is stopping you from writing the music you love. It's the smoke & mirrors around it all that pisses me off. Drop the facade & we don't have a problem keep up this pretence & I will make my comments wether you like it or not. These Artists deserve more from you. Your a fucking ICON in some peoples eyes for christs sake.

[soulAdequateNP]

Out of interest, Ian, what do you think of the recent hit "Mercy" by Duffy which has actually been played at Northern events?

[Pete S]

I'm very appreciative that you said this, Mike, as it echoes my own sentiments exactly.

I would be REALLY enjoying this thread if a small number of people (I can count them on one hand) would stop baiting me.

They'll bugger off eventually. Don't take any notice of them, Nobody else is.

[Haydn]

Is this relevent to the thread, or shoudl we wait untill we get the All About The Levine up and running with all the related sub forums?

I think so, the man has done all this and more.

H

[Pete S]

Out of interest, Ian, what do you think of the recent hit "Mercy" by Duffy which has actually been played at Northern events?

Don't know what Ian thinks but I heard another one of her singles today and it was so boring...hadn't got a hook, chord change, anything. Sorry can't remember what it was called. Mercy was a fairly good novelty hit though.

[Guest Hunnymon]

How do you know about that ??

It was going to be a single till Simon Cowell decided he only wanted covers and no new songs.

It has never been released to this day.

I must have read it somewhere!

I would love to hear Steves version?

Was Steve's version recorded at the same session as Ebonys version was with the orchestra?

Maybe the timings not right at the moment for it's release.

[Guest Matt Male]

And herein lies the whole problem that I personally, as a newcomer, have with this scene. No one actually seems to be able to agree on what IS Northern Soul.

Rather than being a problem, i personally think that's the beauty of the scene and probably the reason why it's lasted so long, longer than say the Rock and Roll scene. It's pretty easy to assess what is rock and roll (so i suspect) but what is Northern Soul is harder. Sometimes it seems pretty much anything you can dance to in that style of ours.

Ian has his views on might constitute northern soul, I have mine, most everybody else has theirs. We might disagree on certain records that may or may not be northern soul, or even whole sub-genres we might also disagree on whether they are soulful but at the end of the day the scene keeps on throwing up dancable records which keep it going, some new, some forgotten and some not even soul, but there you go.

Like i say diversity is what has kept it going in my opinion. If you are a newcomer then welcome to the most vibrant, changable and long lived underground music scene this country has ever produced.

[Guest inspirations001]

Are you bonkers Dean Barlow ain't white.

my mistake i just presumed he was, cos he sounds white ala tommy sands, and that sort of singer. plus he was in the crickets wasn't he,so again wrongly thought he was white. still a terrible record tho you have to admit.

[SteveM]

They'll bugger off eventually. Don't take any notice of them, Nobody else is.

Ian is the person who's prolonging it by replying. He's having the p*ss taken, he knows it, but still won't/can't let go. I effectively asked him why and didn't get a relevant reply.

[SteveM]

my mistake i just presumed he was, cos he sounds white ala tommy sands, and that sort of singer. plus he was in the crickets wasn't he,so again wrongly thought he was white. still a terrible record tho you have to admit.

Different Crickets

[Iancsloft]

Ian who?

==========================================

CUNLIFFE

[Guest]

Ian, can you tell us some information about your relationship with Les Cockell? From my studys that you gave me I think you probably met him around 1969, 1970? What was he like as person, how did you meet him, what was the nature of your relationship around this time. Specifically in the months that led up the rise of the Torch?

It was Cokell, not Cockell.

I'm thinking about whether I should keep answering your questions, when I know they're designed to humiliate.

But discussing a dead friend like Les Cokell and being honest and open, can't possibly do me any harm surely, now can it ???

And then we have the probing questions about memories of guys in white gym shorts having an affect on my early days on the Northern Soul Scene....

Certainly not as innocent as they are made out to be

Well, my being openly gay means that I am not ashamed to discuss who I am. If people don't like it then it's their problem not mine. In fact it's making you almost come across like a bigot, if you're trying to use that against me, especially probing into my most deep and personal coming of age memories, and people don't like bigots.

I don't suppose you ever liked the old Mecca classic "There But For The Grace Of God Go I", but these lines say it all.

LETS FIND A PLACE THEY SAY

SOMEWHERE FAR AWAY

WITH NO BLACKS NO JEWS AND NO GAYS

BUT FOR THE GRACE OF GOD THERE GO I.

[Guest James Trouble]

Out of interest, Ian, what do you think of the recent hit "Mercy" by Duffy which has actually been played at Northern events?

Again, maybe worth keeping this all on topic or else it will all become too sprawling.

But, it's Ian's call, it is after all his thread, about him and everything that he wants it be, and it's his organic rules structure. You happy to answer this one, Ian? Just keep us all up to date on the current thread guide lines please.

Edited August 25, 2008 by James Trouble

[Guest Matt Male]

The meaning of many things/genres changes over time. And for different people it means different things depending when, how and who you got into with. I don't think it means anyone has got it wrong. From where i stand Northern Soul these days refers to a scene rather than a specific type of music. It may have been coined for something specific but does not mean that is set in stone. The person who coined it has the right to control and dictate its meaning it just evolved into something more general.

Bang on

[Sean Hampsey]

my mistake i just presumed he was, cos he sounds white ala tommy sands, and that sort of singer. plus he was in the crickets wasn't he,so again wrongly thought he was white. still a terrible record tho you have to admit.

First singer on the left!

[Guest]

Too right Chris, how anyone can question Ian's motives is beyond me.

So please explain to me, James Trouble, how you can make bitchy sarcastic comments like this, and then expect me to just ignore them and answer your serious questions as if you were a fan, or at least were interested ???

It merely tells me that every question you ask is designed to make you look like the Big Shot and me the butt of a joke.

But I don't believe my answers have done that, so why keep asking the questions, if you don't give a shit about the answers anyway ???

[Mike]

Again, maybe worth keeping this all on topic or else it will all become too sprawling.

But, it's Ian's call, it is after all his thread, about him and everything that he wants it be, and it's his organic rules structure. You happy to answer this one, Ian? Just keep us all up to date on the current thread guide lines please.

read my last post

thats the score

if want to talk about anything site related then do it in feedback

[SteveM]

So please explain to me, James Trouble, how you can make bitchy sarcastic comments like this, and then expect me to just ignore them and answer your serious questions as if you were a fan, or at least were interested ???

It merely tells me that every question you ask is designed to make you look like the Big Shot and me the butt of a joke.

But I don't believe my answers have done that, so why keep asking the questions, if you don't give a shit about the answers anyway ???

Are you two sure you're not in this together ? Master and protege?

Plenty of publicity for both of you.

[Guest dundeedavie]

No I would prefer just soul music .

Plenty of other forms of music can produce 'emotion in your soul' but soul music they are not .

Dean Barlow , Larry Trider and others like it are nothing to do with soul music as we want it .

who is this we? how many people dance to those records ? don't they have a say ?

this thread is almost turning into a stalkers paradise and it's pretty obvious who the main stalker is .......welcome to soul source Ian

[Guest realsoulfan]

I'll keep this very brief ! Like him or loathe him what ever your reasons Ian Levine is and will allways be part of the history of Northern Soul

[Koolkat]

Ian. See post 882. Quick question.

[chrissie]

Again, maybe worth keeping this all on topic or else it will all become too sprawling.

But, it's Ian's call, it is after all his thread, about him and everything that he wants it be, and it's his organic rules structure. You happy to answer this one, Ian? Just keep us all up to date on the current thread guide lines please.

Thought you were going to bed about 3 hours ago

Look what you've done now, theres JT been out souling all night and you are keeping him from his slumbers, he needs his beauty sleep you know

QoFxx

[Guest]

Quick question Ian. Did you actually find/ discover Doni Burdick......Bari Track? That is my one abiding memory of the Mecca. Covered up of course as Lebaron Strings....I miss my baby. I can remember its first play at the Casino still covered up.

We both had copies but it was one record that Colin "bagsed" for himself. We were a great team together, so had to respect each other's wishes, and agree amicably as to who played what.

[Guest]

Hello Nik Mak,

Everything is relative and subjective. An artist or a producer has the right to make whatever music they like. They can even be totally self-indulgent or experimental if they can afford it.

As for being "outdated", isn't almost everything "outdated" these days???

I like Sharon Jones, Eli Reed, Amy Winehouse, Duffy etc. They are all very retro-influenced by vintage pop, soul, jazz and even blues. Their influences go from Billie Holiday and Dusty Springfield to Phil Spector, Motown and Stax.

And many house tracks are still influenced by Philadelphia International, Salsoul and disco. Some producers have been using the very same sounds, patterns and loops for years.

Nothing is very new or original so you can apply your "oudated" tag to almost anything.

Best regards,

Paul Mooney

One of the best and fairest and most reasonable guys that I know, and trust.

I really admire you.

[Koolkat]

We both had copies but it was one record that Colin "bagsed" for himself. We were a great team together, so had to respect each other's wishes, and agree amicably as to who played what.

. Out of that 4000 disc haul which was the rarest that has stayed the rarest? If you know what I mean.

Edited August 25, 2008 by Koolkat

[Guest]

Hi Ian,

Good to have you on board!

It does seem nowadays that everybody and their aunt are out there Dj'ing, and was wondering about the detriment to the scene.

Does being a collector justify a good DJ because of the rarity of records they have, or the justification of a good DJ because of the formats/issues they have available in their box(OVO)? You probably know the route I mean with British releases sometimes championing a USA release due to scarcity.

Also,

What are you're views on present day DJ's and their attitude towards the "scene" and do you have any views at all on old school DJ's that have apparently sold off their collections but still doing occasional gigs.

Yours in thanks,

Haydn

We of the old school knew that it was a combination of having the records and showmanship.

Far too many DJs nowadays are just collectors.

We were professional DJs and we had to keep a full floor, while still introducing new sounds.

My abject horror in the 2000s when I saw Soul Sam clear huge dancefloors time and time again went so against the grain of everything I ever championed. But times have changed and the collectors still clapped at the end of a record even if 1000 dancers walked off the Ritz floor to it.

Not in my day.

If the manager of Blackpool Mecca had walked into the Highland Room in the peak of the night and seen a floor with not one person dancing on it, we would have been fired on the spot.