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Kings Go Forth Next Big Thing ?


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Your taste in music and listening history would have to be pretty limited to not realise what a powerful club tune it is, but maybe not one for the chin strokers, hey? No one has said it is the 'best thing ever', but it's up there with the best examples of that style. You say it's "really great tune", but then you say it's not one of the best. What a weird thing to say, Cliff.

Here are some dictionary definitions for "great"

3. unusual or considerable in degree, power, intensity, etc.: great pain.

4. wonderful; first-rate; very good: We had a great time. That's great!

5. being such in an extreme or notable degree

And "one of the best" is described in the dictionary as:

20. "with the best", on a par with the most capable: He can play bridge with the best.

Maybe it's you who needs some perspective Cliff?

I'd be very surprised if it's not the most requested record on the northern scene this time next year. But hey, let's be honest, it may not be the first time that the northern soul scene ignores things for weird or perverse reasons, like, shock horror, it's a new recording. Not that it matters, where ever it gets played it will rock the dance. Northern scene, London trendy club or at a barn dance.

So James, you still persist in demomstrating what a complete arse you are. I don't need a lesson in diction, so try to use your time better to understand that there are 1,000's of great records instead of continually ramming your opinon at every opportunity and trying, but regularly failing to be smart with it.

KGF great sides, but not some the best ever or even close. As I said it's a matter of perspective, I suggest you build one.

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And thank goodness there are DJs like Soul Sam..............with the taste and vision to promote great new recordings.

I guess this is new recordings in the context of SS and the Northern Scene JT.........don't say this on EMS now you've joined..........that would really light the blue touch paper :unsure:

Cheers,

Mark R

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Guest James Trouble

So James, you still persist in demomstrating what a complete arse you are. I don't need a lesson in diction, so try to use your time better to understand that there are 1,000's of great records instead of continually ramming your opinon at every opportunity and trying, but regularly failing to be smart with it.

KGF great sides, but not some the best ever or even close. As I said it's a matter of perspective, I suggest you build one.

Hey Cliff, there are a few tunes in your sets that could do with being replaced with records of the calibre of KGF. That's the truth.How's that for perspective ;)Now, I'm sure there's a feature on here where I can block anything you write. I suggest you do the same to me.

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Hopefully the Kings Go Forth material will recieve much wider recognition than getting plays on the northern soul scene which whether it does or not is pretty irrelevant in the great scheme of things

So irrelevant that the 45 seems to be aimed directly at us!!!

I gotta agree with James that this is a great record. As is "One day" too. As Cliff says there are thousands of great records but just because it doesn't fall into some imaginary Top whatever as alluded to by Chalky doesn't diminish the quality or the obvious effort that has gone into the production to recreate IMO an authentic late 60's/early 70's sound.

There are plenty of quality 60's records that have been forgotten or don't do it on the dance floor but that doesn't mean they were a novelty at the time.

Im sure James is not considering playing this six times a night in his spot but his enthusiasm has led to hyperbole and he's completely correct in saying that there are records getting aired now that could be dropped in favour of this 45.

I don't know about Cliff's spots but I notice that Sam appears to be playing some instr. to "Backstabbers" . Wow!!! I bet that's a gem!!

ROD

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Tis interesting, back in the old Wigan days new releases were played every week and as a new single you could buy it in the shops for 35p or 1.20 for an import, it wasn't rammed down your throat, that's the thing about this underground scene we like to do some of the work as well you hear a track then hunt it down, good luck to the DJ who plays it first, EG Dells Your Song Laura Lee, Prince Philip I am So Happy, Pebo Bryson Why Don't Ya

post-6504-1211637786_thumb.jpg

Edited by Prophonics 2029
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One of the last things Curtis did before he died i'm led to believe.

Rich

Curtis could do no wrong.

Whereas this thread has plunged into a slanging match.Pity.

Slagging off another's playlist on a thread with no connection to playlists is not on.

Its all a matter of......."IMHO" in the end chaps.

Edited by KevH
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Guest Ollie Lailey

Kings Go Forth ?

Might as well play this one at the same time.

Not really...............The only good thing about that branflake van 200 record is the fact they have curtis mayfield on it, apart from that its utter turd. KGF is a very good record and deserves to be played. I know i'll be on the floor when it is.

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I'd be surprised if it gets played at all this time next year. It's a pleasant enough track, but if you keep playing it three times a night people will soon get very sick of it.

In addition, if it becomes widely available, the people who want a copy will all get one, and then stop asking for it when they are out, and if it doesn't become available, it's not good enough to become that much of an in demand record.

We'll have to wait and see though.

James, I'm most put out. I disagreed with you and you didn't have the decency to reply and insult me.

You must try harder.

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There's a lot to like about Kings Go Forth. As soundalikes go they do a very decent job. Their reggae, funk and ska soundalikes are very good as well. Obviously a lot of hard work and attention to detail goes into their appropriation of vintage music styles. I'm sure they're an extremely entertaining live act as well.

However, and this is obviously in my very humble opinion - hype aside - where's the originality?

Part of the reason I gravitate towards Rare Soul and other related musical fields is the fact that we witnessed a plethora of artists, producers, songwriters etc. at the top of their game - truly some of the greatest musical talents of their generation pushing at boundaries and doing things that just hadn't been done before. By no means was all of it successful either artistically or commercially, maybe that's part of it's perverse and enduring appeal.

Kings Go Forth merely pays lip service to the achievements of all those that went before without actually bringing anything new or exciting to the mix. This is no criticism of KGF as a group, I'm sure they're not trying to claim that they're offering anything other than good time party music in a vintage style.

But I fail to see how a recording which is bereft of the very originality and sheer mindblowing qualities that Rare/Northern Soul can be capable of at its very best can be described as "one of the best Northern Soul records ever made". Sorry.

Again - this is IMHO etc. etc.

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It's very good indeed, but not in the Northern top 100. Possibly about # 776 but that might be because my faves would be mainly mid 60s sounds not this slightly later influenced period. I like hearing it out, but I do think the vocal backing hook, which is what makes it for me, is nicked off another pop record, but I can't remember which. Tony Rounce would know.

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To me whats happened here is we were asked our opinion about this record, and when those who didn`t like it aired there opinion, they were told they should like it and then it turned into a slanging match, as ive said earlier in posts, the question was asked on an open forum on an opinion on this tune, and opinions were given for and against it, i appluad james`s enthusiasm on this record but some very suspect remarks were made to those who didn`t like it, it is a very well put together record, and as ive said i wish the band every success in this venture, but for me its not a great record, probably i`ll be slated again for these comments, but i refuse to have something i don`t like rammed down my throat until i do like it, the last comment i made accused me of being a part of why the northern scene is on its arse, i don`t know where the author of said comments is going, but i find the scene at the moment as fit and well as it has ever been, some great progressive venues, great oldies venues, over my life long involvement with the scene ive seen it go through pits and troughs but has bounced back due to mainly the dedication of its members :D

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To me whats happened here is we were asked our opinion about this record, and when those who didn`t like it aired there opinion, they were told they should like it and then it turned into a slanging match, as ive said earlier in posts, the question was asked on an open forum on an opinion on this tune, and opinions were given for and against it, i appluad james`s enthusiasm on this record but some very suspect remarks were made to those who didn`t like it, it is a very well put together record, and as ive said i wish the band every success in this venture, but for me its not a great record, probably i`ll be slated again for these comments, but i refuse to have something i don`t like rammed down my throat until i do like it, the last comment i made accused me of being a part of why the northern scene is on its arse, i don`t know where the author of said comments is going, but i find the scene at the moment as fit and well as it has ever been, some great progressive venues, great oldies venues, over my life long involvement with the scene ive seen it go through pits and troughs but has bounced back due to mainly the dedication of its members :D

Yeah I don't know where the "on it's arse" came from it's pretty groovy in my little corner. I think James is originally from a less polite scene than ours usually is, but I think the banter is used to get points across or just publicity. I must admit I was a bit surprised at some of the stuff on the Modern sites too.

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Yeah I don't know where the "on it's arse" came from it's pretty groovy in my little corner. I think James is originally from a less polite scene than ours usually is, but I think the banter is used to get points across or just publicity. I must admit I was a bit surprised at some of the stuff on the Modern sites too.

My thought exactly adey, think its just a verry clever publicity stunt that after 150 replies has worked!!! as for on its arse, as ive said guys like yourself and others picked this scene up when it WAS on its arse, and fair play to you and others, god i remember go into do`s in the mid-eighties, with a hand ful of die hards in attendance, its allways been a super ball effect this scene and allways will be, and no one man or tune will change that :D

Edited by HARRY CROSBY
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Guest James Trouble

Yeah I don't know where the "on it's arse" came from it's pretty groovy in my little corner. I think James is originally from a less polite scene than ours usually is, but I think the banter is used to get points across or just publicity. I must admit I was a bit surprised at some of the stuff on the Modern sites too.

I think that comment may have been deleted, did I say it is on it's arse, or did I say it will put it on it's arse? I'm sure I said 'put it on it's arse'? Maybe I'm wrong, maybe playing good new tunes will kill the northern scene. The world's a funny place. Who knows...

Anyway, no matter, it's not clever to say you don't care about good records, just old records. That is a pretty sad attitude. I guess it's no different to some folk who are only interested in new music, and dismiss old tunes because they are old.

Just my opinion, I like good music, becasue it's good. Not because it's old or new. For me there is no other reason for 'this thing'...

Sure, if you don't like KGF, because you don't like it, great. But to dismiss it because it is new. That's plain bizaar.

Edited by James Trouble
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having read through this hilariously heated and 'rattle out of pram if you don't like the record I like' type stuff - i think this is the return of ANS in disguise and it's not actually James Trouble posting but Monsieur Levine, and it's one of his 4 vandals jobbies again wacko.gif:lol:

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Guest James Trouble

having read through this hilariously heated and 'rattle out of pram if you don't like the record I like' type stuff - i think this is the return of ANS in disguise and it's not actually James Trouble posting but Monsieur Levine, and it's one of his 4 vandals jobbies again wacko.gif:P

Nah mate, I think you are misreading this thread. That doesn't happen on here very often! :lol:

There's a few groups.

One group think it's excellent. Full stop.

There are those that think it's good but not in the top 1000 of all time but probably wouldn't put it on their play list.

There are those that don't like it, because it's not to their taste.

There are some who take offence to me thinking it's one of the 'best', which could put it somewhere in the top 1000. It's a matter of definition here, 'excellent' or 'one of the best' is a pretty fine line.

And there are those that couldn't care if it's good, excellent or the best piece of music since Mozart put pen to paper, because they don't think new records should be played on the northern soul scene.

No one is throwing toys because some folk don't like it. The only toys being thrown are from those who think I'm a knob for declaring it's "one of the best", and some toys being thrown from those who think it's daft to dismiss it because it is new. Both of these groups of dummy spitters have got some pretty solid ground to stand on :):)

Edited by James Trouble
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I missed all this debate as I've been away for 5 days but having now read it all, I think James has been pretty polite to be honest, he hasn't been particularly rude to anyone who doesn't like it, don't know what people are moaning about. When you're really 100% for something it's hard not to fight fire with fire. I listened to both sides, they were okay, I thought they'd sound pretty good played out. I've forgotten how they went now though.

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I think both sides are very good but what i don't understand is given that all 500? copies have been preordered already, why they have no plans to press up more? I'm sure many artists of all types of music would be thrilled at such a good response and would be getting more pressed up as soon as possible.

Baffled of Horley

Edited by blackwhite
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Guest Trevski

Like it! Just caught up on this thread and I must admit, it's a very exciting tune, inasmuch as it sparked my interest! One of those that if I had heard it played out, I would be rushing to find out what it was! Very instantly grabbing. nice one! (PS anyone else think the opening lines are reminicsent of Delegates of Soul?)

PS Would much rather this got played out than bloody Duffy! :lol:

Edited by Trevski
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I think that comment may have been deleted, did I say it is on it's arse, or did I say it will put it on it's arse? I'm sure I said 'put it on it's arse'? Maybe I'm wrong, maybe playing good new tunes will kill the northern scene. The world's a funny place. Who knows...

Anyway, no matter, it's not clever to say you don't care about good records, just old records. That is a pretty sad attitude. I guess it's no different to some folk who are only interested in new music, and dismiss old tunes because they are old.

Just my opinion, I like good music, becasue it's good. Not because it's old or new. For me there is no other reason for 'this thing'...

Sure, if you don't like KGF, because you don't like it, great. But to dismiss it because it is new. That's plain bizaar.

And i quote from post 93, its attitudes like this that are causing the northern scene to fall on its ARSE, i personally would like to know where its falling on its ARSE, as ive said in numerous posts on this thread it is a well put together record, but not my thing, and the comparisons that were made were regarding the new release concept, if the northern scene is falling on its arse so to speak i don`t know where? its as healthy today as it has ever been, progressive forward thinking venues in all genre`s of the music usually full to capacity, weekenders sold out, so all i`m awaiting is when it picks up if this is falling on its arse :lol:

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Guest James Trouble

And i quote from post 93, its attitudes like this that are causing the northern scene to fall on its ARSE, i personally would like to know where its falling on its ARSE, as ive said in numerous posts on this thread it is a well put together record, but not my thing, and the comparisons that were made were regarding the new release concept, if the northern scene is falling on its arse so to speak i don`t know where? its as healthy today as it has ever been, progressive forward thinking venues in all genre`s of the music usually full to capacity, weekenders sold out, so all i`m awaiting is when it picks up if this is falling on its arse :lol:

Ok, maybe a little harsh, but depends how you read into it. If you want to read into it that I'm saying the northern scene is shit, you will. But I'm not saying that. If you want to read into it that I'm saying the northern scene is fantastic and standing tall, but the sort of attitudes like "it's new so there's no place for it no matter how good it is" are making the northern soul scene look stupid to folk looking in, you can read that into it as well. And you'd be right.

Let's be honest, it's not a good look to dismiss something because it is new. A bit like falling on your arse.

Edited by James Trouble
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Guest Trevski

Regardless of the "It's new so it can't be played' or the "Lots of quality 60's soul that doesn't' etc

I would play this, but then again, I'm old enough to remember when some now classic northern tracks were played as new releases. Old, new, matters not to me, only that it is good, and fits the criteria of a 'northern tune' which is why I have played Nicole Willis and Sharon Jones. They fit the bill, like KGF. Tunes that deserve to be heard because they are good, unlike Duffy which isn't. KGF certainly isn't the best tune I've heard, but it aint the worst by a long chalk, and better than a lot of things I've heard recently. I like to hear something new, that I don't know, and I like it. Wether I will tire of it just as quickly, time will tell!

Edited by Trevski
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Guest gordon russell

Bit argumentative and unnecessary that Trev imo.

Tis an exciting track and could see folk rushing to the floor for it. Bit frantic for my dance style, but it's shuffletastic, I'll give it that. 'One Day' is a goodie n'all imo. Can record to mp3 using Freecorder from myspace clip.

leave trev alone........he's my mate

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Ok, maybe a little harsh, but depends how you read into it. If you want to read into it that I'm saying the northern scene is shit, you will. But I'm not saying that. If you want to read into it that I'm saying the northern scene is fantastic and standing tall, but the sort of attitudes like "it's new so there's no place for it no matter how good it is" are making the northern soul scene look stupid to folk looking in, you can read that into it as well. And you'd be right.

Let's be honest, it's not a good look to dismiss something because it is new. A bit like falling on your arse.

Hello its a forum thats my opinion!!!!!!!!! am not dismissing it its just not for me, and i bellieve in my opinion thats why i posted it on an open forum, each to there own james thats my opinion and if you can read into that then your a very clever man :lol:

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I think there's a lot of mileage in embracing tunes such as KGF et al not just on the northern scene exclusively but on the various scenes that exist around the UK Europe and the rest of the world. I think one PLUS for incorparating tunes such as KGF is the introduction/interest of more young and/or new folk to the scene. Which can be only a GOOD thing I'm sure all would agree (Or not!)

The scene in Europe seems to be very youthful in parts and the musical policy seems to reflect that be it northern/crossover/funkysoul crossover. The UK scene has a history of splitting off and arguing amongst itself which has in turn spawned the various sub genres and post appreciation of crossover/70s tunes for example. Are we to see this again with another metamorphasis and 'new branches' of the UK Soul scene being nurtured? The scene in the UK has lasted as long as it has due to either dedication to the original format or those who have chosen to seek a new path. I for one applaud anyone who dedicates years to either and hope that in the 21st century it continues to do so. Some of us will stay on the route we know while others will venture off onto a new track.However we all come to a common juntion its just that some of us will turn left and others right!!

Its a love of MUSIC that keeps us all here right?

Best regards

Rich

(Listening to his deep 45s all day & now some deep funk mixes on Soulstrut.com!)

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I think there's a lot of mileage in embracing tunes such as KGF et al not just on the northern scene exclusively but on the various scenes that exist around the UK Europe and the rest of the world. I think one PLUS for incorparating tunes such as KGF is the introduction/interest of more young and/or new folk to the scene. Which can be only a GOOD thing I'm sure all would agree (Or not!)

The scene in Europe seems to be very youthful in parts and the musical policy seems to reflect that be it northern/crossover/funkysoul crossover. The UK scene has a history of splitting off and arguing amongst itself which has in turn spawned the various sub genres and post appreciation of crossover/70s tunes for example. Are we to see this again with another metamorphasis and 'new branches' of the UK Soul scene being nurtured? The scene in the UK has lasted as long as it has due to either dedication to the original format or those who have chosen to seek a new path. I for one applaud anyone who dedicates years to either and hope that in the 21st century it continues to do so. Some of us will stay on the route we know while others will venture off onto a new track.However we all come to a common juntion its just that some of us will turn left and others right!!

Its a love of MUSIC that keeps us all here right?

Best regards

Rich

(Listening to his deep 45s all day & now some deep funk mixes on Soulstrut.com!)

Well said that man, great post ive been looking for that for a few days now, but have not been able toput it into words :lol:

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Hey Cliff, there are a few tunes in your sets that could do with being replaced with records of the calibre of KGF. That's the truth.How's that for perspective ;)Now, I'm sure there's a feature on here where I can block anything you write. I suggest you do the same to me.

I would hope there is not a feature that you can block Cliff from givin his opion that clearly differs from yours...because the respect amongst the long term collectors on the scene far out ways any thing you could purchase.

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Quite an exciting, well produced record that deserves playing IMHO... maybe not three times a night though. Not completely my cup of Earl Grey, because as Ady said it is more early 70s in style than 60s, and not in the same league as Joseph Webster.

And i quote from post 93, its attitudes like this that are causing the northern scene to fall on its ARSE, i personally would like to know where its falling on its ARSE, as ive said in numerous posts on this thread it is a well put together record, but not my thing, and the comparisons that were made were regarding the new release concept, if the northern scene is falling on its arse so to speak i don`t know where? its as healthy today as it has ever been, progressive forward thinking venues in all genre`s of the music usually full to capacity, weekenders sold out, so all i`m awaiting is when it picks up if this is falling on its arse :D

Harry, musically the scene is on its arse! For every forward looking event like Lifeline, 100 club, Burnley, DKOF etc that attract up to a couple of hundred lovers of the music, there are 25 oldies/"ATB" events EVERY weekend which each attract 100 lovers of nostalgia. And heaven forbid anyone should play a bit of R&B! On a recent "Lookbacks" thread, some goon was lamenting the fact that The Champion and Afternoon of the Rhino were not played instead of "southern soul", which meant the sort of records you tend to hear at the aforesaid nighters.

Regardless of the "It's new so it can't be played' or the "Lots of quality 60's soul that doesn't' etc

I would play this, but then again, I'm old enough to remember when some now classic northern tracks were played as new releases. Old, new, matters not to me, only that it is good, and fits the criteria of a 'northern tune' which is why I have played Nicole Willis and Sharon Jones. They fit the bill, like KGF. Tunes that deserve to be heard because they are good, unlike Duffy which isn't. KGF certainly isn't the best tune I've heard, but it aint the worst by a long chalk, and better than a lot of things I've heard recently. I like to hear something new, that I don't know, and I like it. Wether I will tire of it just as quickly, time will tell!

Good post from the pulpit there! :lol:

Which Sharon Jones record do you mean? I haven't had the nerve yet to play 100 Days, 100 Nights out.

I would hope there is not a feature that you can block Cliff from givin his opion that clearly differs from yours...because the respect amongst the long term collectors on the scene far out ways any thing you could purchase.

Did you mean out-weighs?

Interesting post that, because a few of us long term punters on the scene, a lower species than you serious collectors, I know, would not agree with your view.

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Guest James Trouble

I would hope there is not a feature that you can block Cliff from givin his opion that clearly differs from yours...because the respect amongst the long term collectors on the scene far out ways any thing you could purchase.

Hey, man. You've made 6 posts in the past year. Nice going :lol:

:D

Edited by James Trouble
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I like both sides - two very good efforts imho

To me, one sounds like it's built around the riff from the break in the long version of 'Curtis's Move on up' and the other sounds like it's based roughly around the Delegates of Soul 'I'll come running back'. They are not in any way straight copies of those records but to me that's what they remind me of?

As it happens i played them both early doors at The Orwell on Sunday BUT I played them without any introductions. Both were well received with a few people asking what the tracks were. People were astonished that they were new recordings! (I also played the forthcoming Sam Dees track in between them too and that was also well received!)

A couple of people said they were perhaps a tad 'too Northern' for their taste but I think most agreed that they are two pretty good tunes and fair play to anyone who can create a sound like this in 2008!

Cheers

Steve

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I would hope there is not a feature that you can block Cliff from givin his opion that clearly differs from yours...because the respect amongst the long term collectors on the scene far out ways any thing you could purchase.

Spot on.

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Guest soulkitchen

Just to be clear, this record wasn't really made specifically for the Northern scene. It's just a band made up of young guys and some older soul singers who used to perform in their own right back in the 60s - performing/recording out of love for this type of music and sound.

The release has just as much excitement going on with funk fans, people with hip hop backgrounds etc etc and what's going on here is not a clever hype strategy or anything like that. I think some reactions are coming off the back of James's promotion of the record as a Northern record - which you have to take with a grain of salt because he's also using it to promote himself. That's all fine mind you, it equals exposure to the record anyway, even if it was pre-sold out pretty much before he started hammering it four times a night (to get as many plays in before anyone else gets a copy, ha).

Edited by soulkitchen
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Guest James Trouble

Just to be clear, this record wasn't really made specifically for the Northern scene. It's just a band made up of young guys and some older soul singers who used to perform in their own right back in the 60s - performing/recording out of love for this type of music and sound.

The release has just as much excitement going on with funk fans, people with hip hop backgrounds etc etc and what's going on here is not a clever hype strategy or anything like that. I think some reactions are coming off the back of James's promotion of the record as a Northern record - which you have to take with a grain of salt because he's also using it to promote himself. That's all fine mind you, it equals exposure to the record anyway, even if it was pre-sold out pretty much before he started hammering it four times a night (to get as many plays in before anyone else gets a copy, ha).

That is the leg end Nick Cope in a secret disguise, isn't it? Good effort lad, you almost got me wound up there! I'll see you on the funk forum boyo! :lol::wave:

But first paragraph, yeah, that's what's so laughable about the 'it's a taylor made and has no place here' attitude.

Edited by James Trouble
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Guest julesp1905

Read that all 500 copies have been reserved,

I take it not all from individuals, so come on resellers what priced are you going to retail this at?

£4.49 I think is the UK bench mark for a 7", £5.99 for a 7" import.

Is this record about making money, or highlighting the profile of the band for a major record deal

Look forward to any constructed points on why it should sell for any more.

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Guest soulkitchen

That is the leg end Nick Cope in a secret disguise, isn't it? Good effort lad, you almost got me wound up there! I'll see you on the funk forum boyo! :lol::wave:

But first paragraph, yeah, that's what's so laughable about the 'it's a taylor made and has no place here' attitude.

Yup that's me.

It is great that KGF is getting attention over there though. Putting them on live at a Northern event - now that would be outstanding. They're playing locally next weekend, gonna see if work will permit me to fly over to Milwaukee...

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Guest Trevski

Good post from the pulpit there! :wave:

Which Sharon Jones record do you mean? I haven't had the nerve yet to play 100 Days, 100 Nights out.

I have played "What condition" of course, but I meant "Keep on looking' from t'album. :lol:

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