Mods "v" Scooterists

[ImberBoy]

Nobody But Me - Human Bienz

[Guest]

Nobody But Me - Human Bienz

OK................IT WAS ME..................I saved the Soul Scene with a pair of Hipsters and MY Lambretta!

Mace n Messer were employing 60s beat (speed) and crap fecking mod djs from London ( 2 Tobys) at the time !

Betty LLoyd, Jessie Davies, Freddie Houston......etc. ALL IN OUR BOXES at the time

We used to attend the 100 club every month..............then Keele............Bradford Queens hall...........The Raven in Whitchurch

BLA ........... BLA.................THEN DRIVE HOME!

YUP.................WE SAVED YOU

MODS 4 EVA

Edited February 20, 2008 by mossy

[ImberBoy]

Mossy I found a picture of you saving the Northernsoul Scene

[Guest Pete Griffin]

Mossy I found a picture of you saving the Northernsoul Scene

the spitting image of the man.

[Reg]

Yea it was Mark Johnson ( died of aids) if i remember right, he was a bit dodgy ( liked his men and boys,but dont quote me on the boys bit

Pete Griff.

I can remember Mark Johnson well from the CCI rallies, an ex of mine was on the committee with him at one point....he seemed like a mystical character in that he seemed to be everything that being a mod wasn't and it was like he appeared out of nowhere.

Facts about him

a. He was American...don't say you can be a mod and be American...You can't

b. He had an eerie persona...sort of ghost like way to him. It's hard to describe but he used to sort of appear around events like an apparition....very odd character

c. he had absolutely no idea about mod culture

d. He died in Turkey I think.

Very odd,,,relied on Tony Class a lot and his "committee" for the running of the Phoenix Society.

OOps...sorry ssers...thought I was on modculture then for a minute, ha ha

Edited February 20, 2008 by reg

[Guest Stuart T]

I can remember Mark Johnson well from the CCI rallies, an ex of mine was on the committee with him at one point....he seemed like a mystical character in that he seemed to be everything that being a mod wasn't and it was like he appeared out of nowhere.

Facts about him

a. He was American...don't say you can be a mod and be American...You can't

b. He had an eerie persona...sort of ghost like way to him. It's hard to describe but he used to sort of appear around events like an apparition....very odd character

c. he had absolutely no idea about mod culture

d. He died in Turkey I think.

Very odd,,,relied on Tony Class a lot and his "committee" for the running of the Phoenix Society.

Canadian wasn't he? That'd be the same Tony Class who banned people from wearing jeans to his club to keep scooter boys out who now makes his money from scooterists at scooter rallies will it? In his sheepskin and three versions of Wade In the Frickin' Water played back to back.

You're right, Johnson was wierd, and always wore a fred perry sweater and Jam shoes if I remember correctly. Didn't he get slung off a pier?

I preferred Hallam and Shirley's events but was away too much at University and the like to go to anything that often but I do remember all the so called mods in my town in 1982 blowing out to becoming scooterboys when they were 15 and then dumping Northern Soul for King Kurt and I guess nowadays Nellie The Elephant.

The two scenes have lots of connections to the northern scene but I don't think that either is really important to it.

As for point (a), all I can say is how mod is Herbie Hancock on the cover of Inventions and Dimensions?

[Reg]

Canadian wasn't he? That'd be the same Tony Class who banned people from wearing jeans to his club to keep scooter boys out who now makes his money from scooterists at scooter rallies will it? In his sheepskin and three versions of Wade In the Frickin' Water played back to back.

You're right, Johnson was wierd, and always wore a fred perry sweater and Jam shoes if I remember correctly. Didn't he get slung off a pier?

I preferred Hallam and Shirley's events but was away too much at University and the like to go to anything that often but I do remember all the so called mods in my town in 1982 blowing out to becoming scooterboys when they were 15 and then dumping Northern Soul for King Kurt and I guess nowadays Nellie The Elephant.

The two scenes have lots of connections to the northern scene but I don't think that either is really important to it.

As for point (a), all I can say is how mod is Herbie Hancock on the cover of Inventions and Dimensions?

Canadian, American.....same continent, lol!

Yes he did get slung off a pier I think. Like you I drifted across to the "pirate" dos when The Phoenix dos went a bit tits up. Although I did hear a lot of 100club inspired northern tunes on the Phoenix rallys-things like Sammy Ambrose, Darrow Fletcher and Johnny Nash. (Well, somewhere in between a lot of latin and dodgy mod bands like The Threads).

[Guest Ste Brazil]

Sounds like an excellent post/discussion thread to plug my newly published book !! (£9.99 + £1.50 P&P) "TIME TROUBLE AND MONEY"

I was a scooterboy pre 1979 "Mod Revival" and beyond. I got into the scooter scene in 1974 while still at school and was road legal in 1976 and attending "Runs" all over the UK (North & South) up until marriage, kids etc etc prompted my leaving it in 1984. (I'm now back amongst it and known as a "born again" by some but not all !!)

As a Northerner by birth & location Northern Soul music was very much a catalyst for the early 70t's scooterclubs - the original 60t's Mod scene had faded and Northern Soulies naturally progressed into riding scooters as this was a similar underground movement with a huge essence of "cool". Scooter riders attended Northern nites and recruited Soulies and vice versa

My story and that of the Scunthorpe Roadrats SC and other big northern clubs of the time is all in the book, a majority (but not all) also attended Northern do's and collected vinyl - the two scenes ran hand in hand up until 1979.

We first encountered Mods (the second generation) at Southend in 1978, these were non scooter riders but true to the Mod fashion, they numbered very few and were generally from the south and London, they were obviously ahead of the rest of the country fashion wise becasue of their London base.

Scooter riding Mods (ie wearing the clothes and riding Mod styled scoots etc) especially those from the North did not appear until late 1979/1980. Although we classed ourselves as scooterboys these new Mods were readily accepted into the scene (because they rode scooters). When the shortlived Mod revival died out and firstly Ska/Two Tone and lastly New Wave/New Romantic music killed off the new Mod sound (that was basically undanceable) these Mods stayed within the scooter scene as it was a better bet for longevity.

Several of our particular club were lifelong Northern Soul followers who graduated with age thro' the oldies and 60t's genres thro 70t's dancers and into crossover/modern. Its funny but we once got the s**t ripped out of us by some "Mods" for riding our scoots wearing 40" patchwork denim jeans (remember them ??) now what was all that about

All above is just my opinion ................. the books a good read though ............... honest

Try it and see ............... b.brough1@ntlworld.com

I received my copy of this book ('Time trouble an money') yesterday and have barely put it down since! Great stories and pictures, will definately appeal to anybody with an involvement in the scoot / soul scene, especially those who have been involved for a number of years - buy it, you wont regret it!

Ste.

[Guest Stuart T]

Canadian, American.....same continent, lol!

Yes he did get slung off a pier I think. Like you I drifted across to the "pirate" dos when The Phoenix dos went a bit tits up. Although I did hear a lot of 100club inspired northern tunes on the Phoenix rallys-things like Sammy Ambrose, Darrow Fletcher and Johnny Nash. (Well, somewhere in between a lot of latin and dodgy mod bands like The Threads).

I feel sorry for the Canadians, beautiful country but next door to the Americans and amongst the French....(no, its not my joke)

Certainly my taste in music was very informed by those sort of sounds, and two tapes that Paul Hallam did in about 84 for 65 pence each Stacked with good stuff. Luckily missed out on the Threads , bands like The Moment just about finished me off with British music until Weller got good again.

I always hated going away to sh#tty places by the sea. Rather stay at home and save the money for records and shoe polish.

[Guest]

Mossy I found a picture of you saving the Northernsoul Scene

Right ................... Naked pics of SI will be making another appearance on Soul Source............you have been warned!!!

here we go!!

Edited February 21, 2008 by mossy

[Guest Pete Griffin]

Right ................... Naked pics of SI will be making another appearance on Soul Source............you have been warned!!!

here we go!!

now i reconise you

[ImberBoy]

I can explain that! I was walking through the shower, it was re hot so I took all my clothes off I then lost my footing on the slippery floor and fell. I then decided to bum my mate.

Soul content...... Carstairs - It Really Hurts Me Girl

[Guest Pete Griffin]

I can explain that! I was walking through the shower, it was re hot so I took all my clothes off I then lost my footing on the slippery floor and fell. I then decided to bum my mate.

Soul content...... Carstairs - It Really Hurts Me Girl

Stop stop, Mossy and i are on the phone pissing our selves laughing here r u sure its not hurting because you ride a gt brum brum up and away comuter moped

[Guest rachel]

Can we keep the thread on the musical side please - those photos have put me off my lunch..

[Guest Carrie Mehome]

Ditto...

[ImberBoy]

Love slipped through my fingers!!!

[ImberBoy]

How many Soul Sourcers still have scooters? this is one of mine, https://www.tafsc.com/Simon_Cuerden_profile.htm you can see my others here

[Guest ScooterNik]

Funnily enough I do...

P2 on the road, Mk1 T5 waiting for me to introduce it to the angle grinder and a 210 engine I'm having built, and my 'one day the bugger will get built' P range chop with a difference.

Did anyone mention:

Major Lance - Investigate

Uniques - Not Too Long Ago

Reflections - Romeo and Juliet/Like Adam And Eve

Jimmy McFarland (?? memory's shot!) - Lonely Lover

All played off boot/album sadly

Looking through some of the tracks mentioned I feel a scooterist oldies hour coming on next time I get invited to DJ

(and now they're all on CD )

[ImberBoy]

Funnily enough I do...

P2 on the road, Mk1 T5 waiting for me to introduce it to the angle grinder and a 210 engine I'm having built, and my 'one day the bugger will get built' P range chop with a difference.

Did anyone mention:

Major Lance - Investigate

Uniques - Not Too Long Ago

Reflections - Romeo and Juliet/Like Adam And Eve

Jimmy McFarland (?? memory's shot!) - Lonely Lover

All played off boot/album sadly

Looking through some of the tracks mentioned I feel a scooterist oldies hour coming on next time I get invited to DJ

(and now they're all on CD )

F.B I see you have a Gordon's Fly Screen, I need a set of brackets for mine. If you have a spare set can I buy then off you or could you fabricate me some please?

I always get the angle wrong and the screen fouls on the head set.

[Guest Pete Griffin]

My other Scoots are on page one on this thread, and here is my other one.

[Guest]

I received my copy of this book ('Time trouble an money') yesterday and have barely put it down since! Great stories and pictures, will definately appeal to anybody with an involvement in the scoot / soul scene, especially those who have been involved for a number of years - buy it, you wont regret it!

Ste.

Cheers Ste - much appreciated mate ta ! Down to my last 80 copies now out of the 500 printed in Jan - if you wannna cracking read for any rallies or while chillin at any soul weekenders this season then get in touch !!

b.brough1@ntlworld.com or 01724 348812 or 07919005713

[Guest ScooterNik]

F.B I see you have a Gordon's Fly Screen, I need a set of brackets for mine. If you have a spare set can I buy then off you or could you fabricate me some please?

I always get the angle wrong and the screen fouls on the head set.

Its not a Gordon, its a Utah. The brackets are a bugger to make, one of mine snapped through and a mate whos a professional metal worker had a nightmare trying to get it just right

I'll ask him if he made any notes and if he can knock some more up?

[ImberBoy]

Its not a Gordon, its a Utah. The brackets are a bugger to make, one of mine snapped through and a mate whos a professional metal worker had a nightmare trying to get it just right

I'll ask him if he made any notes and if he can knock some more up?

Cheers mate

[Simsy]

Vespa 50 Spesh FVX 146Y

Vespa 100 A146 MWC

Animals - Don't let me be misunderstood

Small Faces - Sorry she's mine

Stevie Wonder - Uptight

The Action - I'll keep on holding on

Kinks - Sittin on my sofa

? & The mysterions - 96 Tears

Kingsmen - Louie Louie

Rolling Stones - Come on

Lambretta SX 200 VUU 98G

Lambretta SX 150 NEG 117E

Dobie Gray - Out on the floor

7 Dwarfs - Stop Girl

David & The Giants - Ten miles high

Fantastic Johnny C - Don't depend on me

Ellingtons - I'm not destined to become a loser

Mel Wynn - Stop Sign

Outsiders - Time won't let me

Mel Hayes - Lady lady lady

[Guest outonthefloor]

Lambretta LI 150 Series 3 (my baby)

Vespa Px200 (under sufferance)

Can't believe no one has said Lorraine Silver - lost summer love

Helen

XXX

If a magnet dont stick to it it aint a scooter......

[ImberBoy]

Lorraine Silver - lost summer love

love that tune, one I cut my teath on , brilliant

[Guest Bearsy]

How many Soul Sourcers still have scooters? this is one of mine, https://www.tafsc.com/Simon_Cuerden_profile.htm you can see my others here

here is one of mine, ts1 shitter

2 runners for the long journeys to save me back and a GS 160 mk1 waiting to be finished and a p200 stripped and selling of bits now

[sister dawn]

ah i see ...

lammy boys!!!!!

whos naked???? cant see as me glasses ave steamed up a tad!

hey by the way ( lovely line there!)

soul girls do it on on vespas .. lurve u all ... peace out xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[Munchkin]

here is one of mine, ts1 shitter

2 runners for the long journeys to save me back and a GS 160 mk1 waiting to be finished and a p200 stripped and selling of bits now

Bearsy thought you saig you had a couple og scooters can only see one (Lamby) lol

Veps dont count..........

[Munchkin]

My other Scoots are on page one on this thread, and here is my other one.

tidy bike pete

[ImberBoy]

Sister Dawn if ya like Lammy boys this is my pride and joy.

[ImberBoy]

Does any one know, and this is not a trick question, how Scootering and Northernsoul became linked?

[Guest Pete Griffin]

Mods from the Sixties, it was called soul music then. You knew that anyway

Edited February 23, 2008 by Pete Griffin

[Munchkin]

Sister Dawn if ya like Lammy boys this is my pride and joy.

scooter looks famiular simon so does your name, i was admin sec for lcgb for about ten years late eighties through ninties

[Munchkin]

heres my scooter, still got it and still sprayed the same

[Joefromupnorth]

"When the dust from the 1979 Mod revival settled there was a cringe of embarrassment as thousands of lambretta and Vespa riding youths saw their association with "Mod" as shallow and contrived. This spawned the monster offspring we now know as "Scooter Boys" that later became "Scooterists".

Think the scooterboys were active long before '79. I remember lines of scooters outside do's in york in '70-'71. A lot of the early wheel/torch goers in York, and the original '69 skins rode lammies. Deffo didn't class themselves as mods. We uses to call 'em 'Smoothies' or 'Scooter boys'

Have'nt read right through this thread yet so somebody may have already seconded what Trevski's said here , had my first lambretta in 73.........We were called by others " Scooter Boys" ( see my 66 Tv 200 on my profile taken in 75)......minor point but important to me as i did cringe in 79 with Quadrephenia etc etc......most who jumped on the back of that did'nt get further than listening to the beat , specials , etc etc.....obviously some stayed the distance and are still to be seen today at scooter rallies.

[ImberBoy]

Hi Munchkin, I have done the odd bit for scootering magazine and Jetset over the last few years. My Lambretta won best of show at the Hamburg custom show in 2001. I'm the No1 of the Armed Forces Scooter Club and we organised and ran Holiday in Holland during the last three years along with The Speed Demons SC.

But you may have just seen my name pop up on crime watch.

JOE of course the term "Scooter Boy" had been used before but there was a definite and forceful distancing from those who sought credibility in 1980/81, the machine was all important and the association between "Jam shoes" "Tonic suits" and the fading fashion that became very embarrassing very fast after the dust settled was real.

"I'm not a fookin Mod, I'm a Scooter boy" was the mantra for those who stayed the distance.

Like the northernsoul scene in the eighties there was a desperate need to disassociate our selves from the "Baggy trouser brigade". I was part of the "Second wave" and I hated the associated smirks from mates when they found our I was going to nighters, "where's your Polyveldts? Shouldn't you have casino Bags on?"

The music had changed and so had the dress, most on this forum will be born again Soulies, when I go to Middleton it seams to be the only place where I see the old guard and the second wave boys n girls all in a oner. It's the same for me seeing the faces on the Nationals, I have been living in Germany and on their scooter scene for the last 12 years but I'd regularly return and do as many Nighters and Nationals as I could, this I suspect was more than most who live here?

But I digress.

For those on the scooter scene and who cross over from one to another, here is my take on what has just happened with events clashing. We have just had a Soul source thread on Soul Nights clashing and the scooter scene mirrors this... have a read and tell us what you think? This was from me as The AFSC president to our AFSC Membership; it caused quite a good debate.....

Nationals Runs v Alliance Runs

Gonna dip my toe into a little bit of controversy now and before you continue to read my ramblings I want to make it quite clear that this is just aimed at a discussion and as soon as it gets hot and bothered I'll delete the topic as I believe it could get personal.

Ok here goes......Bit of history first, not just to bore you but there are some facts that may or may not be relevant.

In the beginning there was Mod, we all know this, and we all know that in 1979 there was a mod revival and lets face it this is why most of us are here reading this? We also know that the numbers dwindled as people entered into crucial times where with family, relationships and careers had to take top priority, we also know that the scene carried on smaller than once before and evolving due to various influences.

As silly as it sounds, those who stayed on the scene can be or should I say will be, categorised as either hard corps enthusiasts or sad individuals who need to grow up and accept responsibility for family, relationships and careers and the like. But there were also those who sensibly juggled family, relationships and careers yet maintained their scootering life style.

Life style is a very strong and potent phrase that will mean great pride to some and scoffs of amusement to others but the key factor is responsibility. I don't think it is a hard act to do and my family certainly didn't go with out just because I chose a "life style" and I would never judge any one who ditched their scooter due to commitment priorities, but I digress......

(Day off today so the key board takes a bashing)

The British Scooter Scene is thriving at the moment and certainly this year we see some absolutely fantastic scooter related events that offer more choice than ever before. But there is a down side, we now see two three and some times even four scooter related events clashing every weekend. How do we chooce? Should we make any decisions based on loyalty to event organisers? To our club? Or are the choices made based solely on geography and finances? We all have a budget and most of us are getting to the age where very long journeys have to be considered wisely due to the ravages of middle and dare I say old age?

Loyalty, now this is just my own very personal opinion. Loyalty choices for me are based first and foremost on The Armed Forces Scooter Club, I would never even consider another scooter related event other than our Annual Thrash at Whitby this year and I personally think it would be a very poor show indeed for any AFSC Member to go some where else instead of with us, I think this would be highly unlikely and I have never heard of any one doing this.

Staying on the loyalty issue I have great respect for the lads of the VFM who I strongly feel should be supported. Now the cynical amongst us may yap on that they are a commercial venture but I remember the miners strike giving us the "Public Order Act" and I remember how we where harassed with the same aggression and understanding given towards the New Age Travellers, not too much fun being stopped at a police road block for ridding a Lambretta and turned back because a town council had no tolerance I was serving my Queen and country for fooks sake!

Thank fook there was a group of dedicated and organised Scooterists who worked hard and long to give us the right to do our thing, The National Runs Committee (NRC) then later the National Scooter Riders Association (NSRA) This collapsed as it ran its course and we now have the British Scooter Rallies Association (BSRA).

Now days its very easy to do scootering stuff, we have scooter clubs popping up all over the place and they always seam to follow the same old predictable path as in form a club, usually broken away from an established and well run club due to some clash with new blood, then they make a patch and the next thing we see is their advert in "Clubs do's and events". Makes me chuckle at best and my fookin blood boil at worst but I am an old miserable git who should know better.

We also have relatively new phenomena and that is the alliances. The alliances were formed in early 2001 to bring all the local county scooter clubs together. The original concept was to give those people who cannot get along to BRSA/VFM rallies for whatever reason a local alternative.

Great sentiment but sadly this has now evolved into its own sub culture and we now see events that actually compete with BRSA/VFM rallies. My own personal opinion again, you'll get a chance for yours in a mo, I thinks its discussing that the YSA have chosen Scarborough to clash with a BRSA run to Great Yarmouth.

Great Yarmouth is a cul de sac and not convenient for most but that's the rub; the locations are chosen by the BRSA at the beginning of the year where events are voted for and "National" status is given to events that can cater for our numbers.

Scarborough is a very potent location for scooterists and I believe this is going to harm the national at Yarmouth. Many years ago the NSRA nearly went bankrupt due to numbers falling and I am fearful that if we loose the BRSA/VFM rallies it will mark the end of scootering.

Choice and loyalty big words that conjure up different things to different people and people must be free to make their own choices...... what's yours and why?

I am as hypocritical as the next man and I will enjoy many of the alliances scooter events that are local to me, the ride outs on both sides of the Pennines are absolutely amazing but the choice of Scarborough to clash with the first national of the year is insensitive.

When the Rhine Army Summer Show (RASS) was on you wouldn't see many regiments competing with their own fun days? Why? Because it would not be the done thing to do.

Would I be going to Scarborough it didn't clash with a national yes I would but I want to support those who supported us during the lean years but would I ride past Scarborough from Newcastle or Scotland on my way to Great Yarmouth..... Would I fook! I'd be at Scarborough in a flash.

Did you know that Scarborough and Whitby are to alternate each year now as nationals? Scarborough is on in 2009 as a BRSA/VFM National..... The real boys will be back in town.

[Guest Bearsy]

Bearsy thought you saig you had a couple og scooters can only see one (Lamby) lol

Veps dont count..........

thats why the vespa is still unrestored , i keep meaning to strip the Lammy down and do something drastic with it but i hate polishing so i will probably leave it to rot as it is

[Joefromupnorth]

Hi Munchkin, I have done the odd bit for scootering magazine and Jetset over the last few years. My Lambretta won best of show at the Hamburg custom show in 2001. I'm the No1 of the Armed Forces Scooter Club and we organised and ran Holiday in Holland during the last three years along with The Speed Demons SC.

But you may have just seen my name pop up on crime watch.

JOE of course the term "Scooter Boy" had been used before but there was a definite and forceful distancing from those who sought credibility in 1980/81, the machine was all important and the association between "Jam shoes" "Tonic suits" and the fading fashion that became very embarrassing very fast after the dust settled was real.

"I'm not a fookin Mod, I'm a Scooter boy" was the mantra for those who stayed the distance.

Like the northernsoul scene in the eighties there was a desperate need to disassociate our selves from the "Baggy trouser brigade". I was part of the "Second wave" and I hated the associated smirks from mates when they found our I was going to nighters, "where's your Polyveldts? Shouldn't you have casino Bags on?"

The music had changed and so had the dress, most on this forum will be born again Soulies, when I go to Middleton it seams to be the only place where I see the old guard and the second wave boys n girls all in a oner. It's the same for me seeing the faces on the Nationals, I have been living in Germany and on their scooter scene for the last 12 years but I'd regularly return and do as many Nighters and Nationals as I could, this I suspect was more than most who live here?

But I digress.

For those on the scooter scene and who cross over from one to another, here is my take on what has just happened with events clashing. We have just had a Soul source thread on Soul Nights clashing and the scooter scene mirrors this... have a read and tell us what you think? This was from me as The AFSC president to our AFSC Membership; it caused quite a good debate.....

Nationals Runs v Alliance Runs

Gonna dip my toe into a little bit of controversy now and before you continue to read my ramblings I want to make it quite clear that this is just aimed at a discussion and as soon as it gets hot and bothered I'll delete the topic as I believe it could get personal.

Ok here goes......Bit of history first, not just to bore you but there are some facts that may or may not be relevant.

In the beginning there was Mod, we all know this, and we all know that in 1979 there was a mod revival and lets face it this is why most of us are here reading this? We also know that the numbers dwindled as people entered into crucial times where with family, relationships and careers had to take top priority, we also know that the scene carried on smaller than once before and evolving due to various influences.

As silly as it sounds, those who stayed on the scene can be or should I say will be, categorised as either hard corps enthusiasts or sad individuals who need to grow up and accept responsibility for family, relationships and careers and the like. But there were also those who sensibly juggled family, relationships and careers yet maintained their scootering life style.

Life style is a very strong and potent phrase that will mean great pride to some and scoffs of amusement to others but the key factor is responsibility. I don't think it is a hard act to do and my family certainly didn't go with out just because I chose a "life style" and I would never judge any one who ditched their scooter due to commitment priorities, but I digress......

(Day off today so the key board takes a bashing)

The British Scooter Scene is thriving at the moment and certainly this year we see some absolutely fantastic scooter related events that offer more choice than ever before. But there is a down side, we now see two three and some times even four scooter related events clashing every weekend. How do we chooce? Should we make any decisions based on loyalty to event organisers? To our club? Or are the choices made based solely on geography and finances? We all have a budget and most of us are getting to the age where very long journeys have to be considered wisely due to the ravages of middle and dare I say old age?

Loyalty, now this is just my own very personal opinion. Loyalty choices for me are based first and foremost on The Armed Forces Scooter Club, I would never even consider another scooter related event other than our Annual Thrash at Whitby this year and I personally think it would be a very poor show indeed for any AFSC Member to go some where else instead of with us, I think this would be highly unlikely and I have never heard of any one doing this.

Staying on the loyalty issue I have great respect for the lads of the VFM who I strongly feel should be supported. Now the cynical amongst us may yap on that they are a commercial venture but I remember the miners strike giving us the "Public Order Act" and I remember how we where harassed with the same aggression and understanding given towards the New Age Travellers, not too much fun being stopped at a police road block for ridding a Lambretta and turned back because a town council had no tolerance I was serving my Queen and country for fooks sake!

Thank fook there was a group of dedicated and organised Scooterists who worked hard and long to give us the right to do our thing, The National Runs Committee (NRC) then later the National Scooter Riders Association (NSRA) This collapsed as it ran its course and we now have the British Scooter Rallies Association (BSRA).

Now days its very easy to do scootering stuff, we have scooter clubs popping up all over the place and they always seam to follow the same old predictable path as in form a club, usually broken away from an established and well run club due to some clash with new blood, then they make a patch and the next thing we see is their advert in "Clubs do's and events". Makes me chuckle at best and my fookin blood boil at worst but I am an old miserable git who should know better.

We also have relatively new phenomena and that is the alliances. The alliances were formed in early 2001 to bring all the local county scooter clubs together. The original concept was to give those people who cannot get along to BRSA/VFM rallies for whatever reason a local alternative.

Great sentiment but sadly this has now evolved into its own sub culture and we now see events that actually compete with BRSA/VFM rallies. My own personal opinion again, you'll get a chance for yours in a mo, I thinks its discussing that the YSA have chosen Scarborough to clash with a BRSA run to Great Yarmouth.

Great Yarmouth is a cul de sac and not convenient for most but that's the rub; the locations are chosen by the BRSA at the beginning of the year where events are voted for and "National" status is given to events that can cater for our numbers.

Scarborough is a very potent location for scooterists and I believe this is going to harm the national at Yarmouth. Many years ago the NSRA nearly went bankrupt due to numbers falling and I am fearful that if we loose the BRSA/VFM rallies it will mark the end of scootering.

Choice and loyalty big words that conjure up different things to different people and people must be free to make their own choices...... what's yours and why?

I am as hypocritical as the next man and I will enjoy many of the alliances scooter events that are local to me, the ride outs on both sides of the Pennines are absolutely amazing but the choice of Scarborough to clash with the first national of the year is insensitive.

When the Rhine Army Summer Show (RASS) was on you wouldn't see many regiments competing with their own fun days? Why? Because it would not be the done thing to do.

Would I be going to Scarborough it didn't clash with a national yes I would but I want to support those who supported us during the lean years but would I ride past Scarborough from Newcastle or Scotland on my way to Great Yarmouth..... Would I fook! I'd be at Scarborough in a flash.

Did you know that Scarborough and Whitby are to alternate each year now as nationals? Scarborough is on in 2009 as a BRSA/VFM National..... The real boys will be back in town.

Well put across mate , i enjoyed reading......i should have read the whole thread before posting but jumped in early.......Had some great times at scarborough back in the 70's...always wish i still had my lamby now !!!!......it was stolen in about 78/9 by a " new kid " got it back after much detective work and some menacing but sadly it was stripped and wrecked , that just finished it for me......besides many had left the fold due to marriage etc so in a way that was my full stop.

Now , jesus i was gobsmacked when i first went to a rally.......you lads today have my total admiration and respect.......the cash spent , the miles travelled......amazing stuff , one thing that spoils it for me though is the clobber worn.......but have to say more practical than an open face helmet and a pair of driving gloves !!!!

anyone at winsford tonight fancy a crack about scooters give me a shout lol.

[Guest]

Does any one know, and this is not a trick question, how Scootering and Northernsoul became linked?

I can only offer an opinion from my personal experience, but do agree with Pete Griffin and the Sixties Tamla/Soul/Mod connection. I also believe the link occurred as both scenes co-existed underground "up North" and had the same "stand out from the crowd, cool thing".

In the early/mid 70t's we chose our lifestyle path during the last years of senior school - Soul, Glam Rock or Heavy Rock and the associated fashion etc etc that went with it. The northern scooter clubs after years of decline were beginning to recruit and grow (the Lammy GP model contributed big time), mostly from soul loving working class lads who naturally linked scooters with soul, whereas the heavy rock followers naturally bought and rode bikes.

In our particular town all the scooter boys attended the weekly Northern Soul nite, I presume much the same happened across the north of England. We wanted to be seen and we also got into the music. We recruited Soulies into the scooter ranks and the northern soul scene recruited followers from the scooter clubs, mutual respect all round.

Apologies for waffling - this is just my personal opinion !!

[Joefromupnorth]

I can only offer an opinion from my personal experience, but do agree with Pete Griffin and the Sixties Tamla/Soul/Mod connection. I also believe the link occurred as both scenes co-existed underground "up North" and had the same "stand out from the crowd, cool thing".

In the early/mid 70t's we chose our lifestyle path during the last years of senior school - Soul, Glam Rock or Heavy Rock and the associated fashion etc etc that went with it. The northern scooter clubs after years of decline were beginning to recruit and grow (the Lammy GP model contributed big time), mostly from soul loving working class lads who naturally linked scooters with soul, whereas the heavy rock followers naturally bought and rode bikes.

In our particular town all the scooter boys attended the weekly Northern Soul nite, I presume much the same happened across the north of England. We wanted to be seen and we also got into the music. We recruited Soulies into the scooter ranks and the northern soul scene recruited followers from the scooter clubs, mutual respect all round.

Apologies for waffling - this is just my personal opinion !!

Agree , my last couple of years at school , it had a uniform but not compulsory.....i went in levi sta prest , ben sherman , red socks , oxford shoes lol....what a uniform !!!!.....many of us dressed alike ,we seemed to cause alarm at school , one day the deputy head gathered us all dressed the same in the hall from where he began to tell us we were wearing the uniform of " thugs who kicked peoples teeth in at football matches"......this was 71/2......the music was limited at that time to the usual motown fair and just one or two "classics" as they are now known....on leaving school those i still hung about with watched these older lads in the local town with interest , they had been going to a club called the "torch" and now went to another called "wigan casino"....they had the clothes and the lambretta's.....and a group of us living within yards of each other in our village all bought one , among us we had 2 gp 200's , 1 gp 150 , 1 gp 125 , an sx 200 and an sx 150........sadly all but myself dropped em after a short time......i then had to ride into the local town and knock about with the many lads who were fast buying em......trips to len's of shipley or lambretta land bradford on a weekend for spares were common.....in a car of course lol.....to quote tyronne davis.......wish i could "turn back the hands of time"

waffle over.

[ImberBoy]

anyone at winsford tonight fancy a crack about scooters give me a shout lol.

[Munchkin]

Hi Munchkin, I have done the odd bit for scootering magazine and Jetset over the last few years. My Lambretta won best of show at the Hamburg custom show in 2001. I'm the No1 of the Armed Forces Scooter Club and we organised and ran Holiday in Holland during the last three years along with The Speed Demons SC.

But you may have just seen my name pop up on crime watch.

JOE of course the term "Scooter Boy" had been used before but there was a definite and forceful distancing from those who sought credibility in 1980/81, the machine was all important and the association between "Jam shoes" "Tonic suits" and the fading fashion that became very embarrassing very fast after the dust settled was real.

"I'm not a fookin Mod, I'm a Scooter boy" was the mantra for those who stayed the distance.

Like the northernsoul scene in the eighties there was a desperate need to disassociate our selves from the "Baggy trouser brigade". I was part of the "Second wave" and I hated the associated smirks from mates when they found our I was going to nighters, "where's your Polyveldts? Shouldn't you have casino Bags on?"

The music had changed and so had the dress, most on this forum will be born again Soulies, when I go to Middleton it seams to be the only place where I see the old guard and the second wave boys n girls all in a oner. It's the same for me seeing the faces on the Nationals, I have been living in Germany and on their scooter scene for the last 12 years but I'd regularly return and do as many Nighters and Nationals as I could, this I suspect was more than most who live here?

But I digress.

For those on the scooter scene and who cross over from one to another, here is my take on what has just happened with events clashing. We have just had a Soul source thread on Soul Nights clashing and the scooter scene mirrors this... have a read and tell us what you think? This was from me as The AFSC president to our AFSC Membership; it caused quite a good debate.....

Nationals Runs v Alliance Runs

Gonna dip my toe into a little bit of controversy now and before you continue to read my ramblings I want to make it quite clear that this is just aimed at a discussion and as soon as it gets hot and bothered I'll delete the topic as I believe it could get personal.

Ok here goes......Bit of history first, not just to bore you but there are some facts that may or may not be relevant.

In the beginning there was Mod, we all know this, and we all know that in 1979 there was a mod revival and lets face it this is why most of us are here reading this? We also know that the numbers dwindled as people entered into crucial times where with family, relationships and careers had to take top priority, we also know that the scene carried on smaller than once before and evolving due to various influences.

As silly as it sounds, those who stayed on the scene can be or should I say will be, categorised as either hard corps enthusiasts or sad individuals who need to grow up and accept responsibility for family, relationships and careers and the like. But there were also those who sensibly juggled family, relationships and careers yet maintained their scootering life style.

Life style is a very strong and potent phrase that will mean great pride to some and scoffs of amusement to others but the key factor is responsibility. I don't think it is a hard act to do and my family certainly didn't go with out just because I chose a "life style" and I would never judge any one who ditched their scooter due to commitment priorities, but I digress......

(Day off today so the key board takes a bashing)

The British Scooter Scene is thriving at the moment and certainly this year we see some absolutely fantastic scooter related events that offer more choice than ever before. But there is a down side, we now see two three and some times even four scooter related events clashing every weekend. How do we chooce? Should we make any decisions based on loyalty to event organisers? To our club? Or are the choices made based solely on geography and finances? We all have a budget and most of us are getting to the age where very long journeys have to be considered wisely due to the ravages of middle and dare I say old age?

Loyalty, now this is just my own very personal opinion. Loyalty choices for me are based first and foremost on The Armed Forces Scooter Club, I would never even consider another scooter related event other than our Annual Thrash at Whitby this year and I personally think it would be a very poor show indeed for any AFSC Member to go some where else instead of with us, I think this would be highly unlikely and I have never heard of any one doing this.

Staying on the loyalty issue I have great respect for the lads of the VFM who I strongly feel should be supported. Now the cynical amongst us may yap on that they are a commercial venture but I remember the miners strike giving us the "Public Order Act" and I remember how we where harassed with the same aggression and understanding given towards the New Age Travellers, not too much fun being stopped at a police road block for ridding a Lambretta and turned back because a town council had no tolerance I was serving my Queen and country for fooks sake!

Thank fook there was a group of dedicated and organised Scooterists who worked hard and long to give us the right to do our thing, The National Runs Committee (NRC) then later the National Scooter Riders Association (NSRA) This collapsed as it ran its course and we now have the British Scooter Rallies Association (BSRA).

Now days its very easy to do scootering stuff, we have scooter clubs popping up all over the place and they always seam to follow the same old predictable path as in form a club, usually broken away from an established and well run club due to some clash with new blood, then they make a patch and the next thing we see is their advert in "Clubs do's and events". Makes me chuckle at best and my fookin blood boil at worst but I am an old miserable git who should know better.

We also have relatively new phenomena and that is the alliances. The alliances were formed in early 2001 to bring all the local county scooter clubs together. The original concept was to give those people who cannot get along to BRSA/VFM rallies for whatever reason a local alternative.

Great sentiment but sadly this has now evolved into its own sub culture and we now see events that actually compete with BRSA/VFM rallies. My own personal opinion again, you'll get a chance for yours in a mo, I thinks its discussing that the YSA have chosen Scarborough to clash with a BRSA run to Great Yarmouth.

Great Yarmouth is a cul de sac and not convenient for most but that's the rub; the locations are chosen by the BRSA at the beginning of the year where events are voted for and "National" status is given to events that can cater for our numbers.

Scarborough is a very potent location for scooterists and I believe this is going to harm the national at Yarmouth. Many years ago the NSRA nearly went bankrupt due to numbers falling and I am fearful that if we loose the BRSA/VFM rallies it will mark the end of scootering.

Choice and loyalty big words that conjure up different things to different people and people must be free to make their own choices...... what's yours and why?

I am as hypocritical as the next man and I will enjoy many of the alliances scooter events that are local to me, the ride outs on both sides of the Pennines are absolutely amazing but the choice of Scarborough to clash with the first national of the year is insensitive.

When the Rhine Army Summer Show (RASS) was on you wouldn't see many regiments competing with their own fun days? Why? Because it would not be the done thing to do.

Would I be going to Scarborough it didn't clash with a national yes I would but I want to support those who supported us during the lean years but would I ride past Scarborough from Newcastle or Scotland on my way to Great Yarmouth..... Would I fook! I'd be at Scarborough in a flash.

Did you know that Scarborough and Whitby are to alternate each year now as nationals? Scarborough is on in 2009 as a BRSA/VFM National..... The real boys will be back in town.

good read simon, few reasons in here vwhy i kicked in going to rallies, too many newbies ruling the roost, money always talks....

[Guest Pete Griffin]

anyone at winsford tonight fancy a crack about scooters give me a shout lol.

I will be there, I'm going to The Northern Aces Scooter Club do at Shotton Lane Social Club70 Shotton Lane Shotton Deeside CH5 1QW, never been before and I just want to show my face for an hour before the nighter.

I will be at the Nighter wearing my "official Imber Shorts" and AFSC T-Shirt, come and say hello but not while I'm dancing coz fook off always seams to offend?

Only Joking, I'd love to meet and Soul Sourcers

You better get your dancing shoes on mate, Mossy and and I are the djs for the Northern Aces night. If i dont see you first, come to the stage, will buy you a drink.

Pete Griff

[Guest ScooterNik]

Good post Simon but have to disagree hugely with you on the importance of vfm. End of the day neither they or BSRA matter.

Clubs will organise rallies regardless, for the last three or four years I've done less and less 'nationals' and more and more club/alliance organised rallies as, in short, they are much more relaxed, cheaper and you can get away with a lot of behaviour that you can't wandering around pubs in a rundown seaside town.

On average, over the last 5 years, I've done around 8 rallies a year. Last year the only nationals I did were Shires (I think that was one?) and Brid (end of season, would take a lot for me to miss that one) and TBH Shires has never felt like a National - except its full of people who turn up in cars. And don't get me started on that one!

Scootering is danger of stagnating with the same dozen or so rallies that are promoted as 'important' by the very people who organise them. Incidently VFM only organise a handful of the nationals, other organisations such as Mansfield Monsters SC/Olympics SC organise Skeggy, SWS organise Exmouth, AFAIK Kelso is organised with the help of Scottish scooterists etc. Contrary to popular belief, even the pile of shite is organised by the IoW scooterists to a very large extent. VFM just run one small part of it.

At the end of the day there will always be a scooter scene of some description, having been there through the so called 'dead years' of the early nineties I think the big rallies are too big now. Small ralies are the way forward, pretty much the same as the bike scene, with a handful of major events for those who feel safest in a crowd.

Oh, and before I forget... sorry mate, no notes were made for those brackets

[Guest outonthefloor]

Good post Simon but have to disagree hugely with you on the importance of vfm. End of the day neither they or BSRA matter.

Clubs will organise rallies regardless, for the last three or four years I've done less and less 'nationals' and more and more club/alliance organised rallies as, in short, they are much more relaxed, cheaper and you can get away with a lot of behaviour that you can't wandering around pubs in a rundown seaside town.

On average, over the last 5 years, I've done around 8 rallies a year. Last year the only nationals I did were Shires (I think that was one?) and Brid (end of season, would take a lot for me to miss that one) and TBH Shires has never felt like a National - except its full of people who turn up in cars. And don't get me started on that one!

Scootering is danger of stagnating with the same dozen or so rallies that are promoted as 'important' by the very people who organise them. Incidently VFM only organise a handful of the nationals, other organisations such as Mansfield Monsters SC/Olympics SC organise Skeggy, SWS organise Exmouth, AFAIK Kelso is organised with the help of Scottish scooterists etc. Contrary to popular belief, even the pile of shite is organised by the IoW scooterists to a very large extent. VFM just run one small part of it.

At the end of the day there will always be a scooter scene of some description, having been there through the so called 'dead years' of the early nineties I think the big rallies are too big now. Small ralies are the way forward, pretty much the same as the bike scene, with a handful of major events for those who feel safest in a crowd.

Oh, and before I forget... sorry mate, no notes were made for those brackets

Thats why I love the European scooter rallies, not euro Lambretta/vespa but the club rallies

Me n Mark went to the Bear Run in Linz Austria, rode all the way btw friendly up4 it bunch of guys that couldnt do enough for us.

Also been to Bosel - Tourtured Maniacs scoter rally and a few more in Germany and France and Holland.

Theres no politics, no vans (cept back up vehicles) n no cheque book scooterists just real enthusiasts out for a good time.

Would love to go to Sweden as i hear they are gr8 to

Small rallies are certainly the way to go IMVHO

Helen

XXXX

[Guest the dukester]

Hi Munchkin, I have done the odd bit for scootering magazine and Jetset over the last few years. My Lambretta won best of show at the Hamburg custom show in 2001. I'm the No1 of the Armed Forces Scooter Club and we organised and ran Holiday in Holland during the last three years along with The Speed Demons SC.

But you may have just seen my name pop up on crime watch.

JOE of course the term "Scooter Boy" had been used before but there was a definite and forceful distancing from those who sought credibility in 1980/81, the machine was all important and the association between "Jam shoes" "Tonic suits" and the fading fashion that became very embarrassing very fast after the dust settled was real.

"I'm not a fookin Mod, I'm a Scooter boy" was the mantra for those who stayed the distance.

Like the northernsoul scene in the eighties there was a desperate need to disassociate our selves from the "Baggy trouser brigade". I was part of the "Second wave" and I hated the associated smirks from mates when they found our I was going to nighters, "where's your Polyveldts? Shouldn't you have casino Bags on?"

The music had changed and so had the dress, most on this forum will be born again Soulies, when I go to Middleton it seams to be the only place where I see the old guard and the second wave boys n girls all in a oner. It's the same for me seeing the faces on the Nationals, I have been living in Germany and on their scooter scene for the last 12 years but I'd regularly return and do as many Nighters and Nationals as I could, this I suspect was more than most who live here?

But I digress.

For those on the scooter scene and who cross over from one to another, here is my take on what has just happened with events clashing. We have just had a Soul source thread on Soul Nights clashing and the scooter scene mirrors this... have a read and tell us what you think? This was from me as The AFSC president to our AFSC Membership; it caused quite a good debate.....

Nationals Runs v Alliance Runs

Gonna dip my toe into a little bit of controversy now and before you continue to read my ramblings I want to make it quite clear that this is just aimed at a discussion and as soon as it gets hot and bothered I'll delete the topic as I believe it could get personal.

Ok here goes......Bit of history first, not just to bore you but there are some facts that may or may not be relevant.

In the beginning there was Mod, we all know this, and we all know that in 1979 there was a mod revival and lets face it this is why most of us are here reading this? We also know that the numbers dwindled as people entered into crucial times where with family, relationships and careers had to take top priority, we also know that the scene carried on smaller than once before and evolving due to various influences.

As silly as it sounds, those who stayed on the scene can be or should I say will be, categorised as either hard corps enthusiasts or sad individuals who need to grow up and accept responsibility for family, relationships and careers and the like. But there were also those who sensibly juggled family, relationships and careers yet maintained their scootering life style.

Life style is a very strong and potent phrase that will mean great pride to some and scoffs of amusement to others but the key factor is responsibility. I don't think it is a hard act to do and my family certainly didn't go with out just because I chose a "life style" and I would never judge any one who ditched their scooter due to commitment priorities, but I digress......

(Day off today so the key board takes a bashing)

The British Scooter Scene is thriving at the moment and certainly this year we see some absolutely fantastic scooter related events that offer more choice than ever before. But there is a down side, we now see two three and some times even four scooter related events clashing every weekend. How do we chooce? Should we make any decisions based on loyalty to event organisers? To our club? Or are the choices made based solely on geography and finances? We all have a budget and most of us are getting to the age where very long journeys have to be considered wisely due to the ravages of middle and dare I say old age?

Loyalty, now this is just my own very personal opinion. Loyalty choices for me are based first and foremost on The Armed Forces Scooter Club, I would never even consider another scooter related event other than our Annual Thrash at Whitby this year and I personally think it would be a very poor show indeed for any AFSC Member to go some where else instead of with us, I think this would be highly unlikely and I have never heard of any one doing this.

Staying on the loyalty issue I have great respect for the lads of the VFM who I strongly feel should be supported. Now the cynical amongst us may yap on that they are a commercial venture but I remember the miners strike giving us the "Public Order Act" and I remember how we where harassed with the same aggression and understanding given towards the New Age Travellers, not too much fun being stopped at a police road block for ridding a Lambretta and turned back because a town council had no tolerance I was serving my Queen and country for fooks sake!

Thank fook there was a group of dedicated and organised Scooterists who worked hard and long to give us the right to do our thing, The National Runs Committee (NRC) then later the National Scooter Riders Association (NSRA) This collapsed as it ran its course and we now have the British Scooter Rallies Association (BSRA).

Now days its very easy to do scootering stuff, we have scooter clubs popping up all over the place and they always seam to follow the same old predictable path as in form a club, usually broken away from an established and well run club due to some clash with new blood, then they make a patch and the next thing we see is their advert in "Clubs do's and events". Makes me chuckle at best and my fookin blood boil at worst but I am an old miserable git who should know better.

We also have relatively new phenomena and that is the alliances. The alliances were formed in early 2001 to bring all the local county scooter clubs together. The original concept was to give those people who cannot get along to BRSA/VFM rallies for whatever reason a local alternative.

Great sentiment but sadly this has now evolved into its own sub culture and we now see events that actually compete with BRSA/VFM rallies. My own personal opinion again, you'll get a chance for yours in a mo, I thinks its discussing that the YSA have chosen Scarborough to clash with a BRSA run to Great Yarmouth.

Great Yarmouth is a cul de sac and not convenient for most but that's the rub; the locations are chosen by the BRSA at the beginning of the year where events are voted for and "National" status is given to events that can cater for our numbers.

Scarborough is a very potent location for scooterists and I believe this is going to harm the national at Yarmouth. Many years ago the NSRA nearly went bankrupt due to numbers falling and I am fearful that if we loose the BRSA/VFM rallies it will mark the end of scootering.

Choice and loyalty big words that conjure up different things to different people and people must be free to make their own choices...... what's yours and why?

I am as hypocritical as the next man and I will enjoy many of the alliances scooter events that are local to me, the ride outs on both sides of the Pennines are absolutely amazing but the choice of Scarborough to clash with the first national of the year is insensitive.

When the Rhine Army Summer Show (RASS) was on you wouldn't see many regiments competing with their own fun days? Why? Because it would not be the done thing to do.

Would I be going to Scarborough it didn't clash with a national yes I would but I want to support those who supported us during the lean years but would I ride past Scarborough from Newcastle or Scotland on my way to Great Yarmouth..... Would I fook! I'd be at Scarborough in a flash.

Did you know that Scarborough and Whitby are to alternate each year now as nationals? Scarborough is on in 2009 as a BRSA/VFM National..... The real boys will be back in town.

I AM ONE OF THE ORGANISERS OF THE SCARBOROUGH EASTER BOYS ARE BACK IN TOWN WEEKEND AND THE YSA HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH IT ? (IF BY YOUR COMMENT YOU MEAN DISGUSTING AND NOT DISSCUSSING ABOUT THEM BEING PART OF IT ?) THE EVENT IS BEING RUN BY THE SCARBOROUGH CASTLE COASTERS SCOOTER CLUB AND YES IT WILL HAVE MANY SUPPORTERS WHO ARE IN THE YSA, BUT ITS THERE CHOICE WHERE THEY GO. I HAVE PUT ON MANY AN EVENT THAT CLASHES WITH OTHER EVENTS EVEN WHEN VFM ARE IN THE SAME TOWN, THEY WELCOME IT, AS IN THEIR WORDS "IT TAKES PRESSURE OFF OF THEM". IT IS NOT DONE TO TAKE PRESSURE OFF THEM, IT IS DONE BECAUSE SCOOTERISTS ASK FOR OTHER DO'S TO BE PUT ON. SCOOTERING BECAME FRAGMENTED A LONG LONG TIME AGO NOT JUST SINCE THE MILLENNIUM, I HAVE OWNED/RIDDEN A SCOOTER SINCE 1978 BEEN THERE, SEEN THAT, BOUGHT EVERY FOOKIN T SHIRT THERE WAS TO BUY, THEN I GOT INTO ORGANISING DO'S UNDER THE DELIRIUM BANNER AND HAVENT LOOKED BACK SINCE, I THINK YOU ARE WRONG IN YOUR COMMENT THAT IT WILL HARM YARMOUTH, THERE IS ENOUGH TO GO ROUND, SCARBOROUGH NATIONAL LAST EASTER THE SPA AND THE FIRST BOYS ARE BACK IN TOWN BOTH DO'S PACKED OUT!! WHITBY THIS YEAR IN JUNE, YSA PUTTING A DO ON AT THE METROPOLE JUST UP FROM THE PAVILLION PROBLEM? THERE IS NO PROBLEM.

AS FOR YOUR LAST COMMENT......."REAL BOYS"..........I THINK YOU WILL FIND THEY LIVE HERE IN THE TOWN

DUKESY

[Hold Tight]

How many Soul Sourcers still have scooters? this is one of mine, https://www.tafsc.com/Simon_Cuerden_profile.htm you can see my others here

Heres mine at Isle of Man 03 - still in the garage and gets taken out occasionally - bit like the wife! Must have had this one for 15 or so years and resprayed it in 2001.