Soul Night Disgrace

[Pauldonnelly]

There are some great cheap origonals to paly, I played a £10 origonal at the DKOF "The Need to Itch" by the Haemorrhoids, Andy Dyosn enquired where I got it from...

"John Anderson he's got Piles of em"

I had record by the Wellingtons many years ago though that was not a boot.

Anyone remember Gary Rushbrookes After Eights c/up I have a Mint copy for sale..

[Guest Trevski]

Don't know the event in question, but a couple of points,

Though these events predominantly play the tried and tested, they still play stuff that was a couple of years earlier being broke at the more upfront/nighter scene, usually when its been booted/carved, IMO these 'tunes' help keep even the most oldies orientated events a little fresh and help stop even the keenest oldies 'soulie' getting bored, even if they don't really know it,

If then EVERYBODY went down this road and decided the best option is to open events whereby 'mates' with records will play top 500/current top 20, and adopted the attitude 'its what comes through the speakers that counts' how long before,A theres no current top 20? and B everybody is bored shitless?

Also at even accross the board soul nights its always nice to hear something new (although this isn't a must for me but nice if i do) is it not a case of a tune having to reach a certain popularity to warrant being booted? Which then means a DJ playing mainly 'boots' you can rest assured you aint gonna hear anything remotely fresh, just a DJ waiting for some other mug to 'break' the next 'biggie' get the boot and play it to a probably bigger audience and genuinly think its clever,

Unfortunately, i doubt theres a solution,

Check the York Soul Club playlists. Something for everyone, popular oldies, something new, current spins, rarities and cheapo tunes side by side, played to an enthusiastic crowd who in the main, appreciate something new. I don't suppose the majority of punters at York care if it's original vinyl or not, they just wanna dance, but the DJ's care, and still provide a good dance floor reaction, without boots. Depends on which way the promoters want to go, but I think Tony & Tracy have got it right.

Edited January 12, 2008 by Trevski

[MarkWhiteley]

not at all relivent, a metophor that just does not scan.... there's only one man utd but, other than frank wilson they are more than one...... etc etc

Course its not relevant, the eleven 'fellas'dressed in Man Utd Shirts cant play like the first team

But the Frank Wilson Boot dressed in a look- a- like 'soul' label sounds just like Kennys Copy

M.

Edited January 12, 2008 by MarkWhiteley

[Guest]

Yes I am but we're talking about people enjoying a night out here and if the colour of a label affects peoples ability to enjoy themselves then I think they have a problem and should see someone

Round ov applause Pete my sentiments exactly Luv Di xxxx

[Guest]

i think it was funny angel, it's just that i laugh inside, that way i can't get hung for laughing

Ah thanx hunny just a bit ov lighthearted banter to lighten the mood and you really should see my SHOES Di xxxx

[Pete Eccles]

Check the York Soul Club playlists. Something for everyone, popular oldies, current spins, rarities and cheapo tunes side by side, played to an enthusiastic crowd who in the main, appreciate something new. I don't suppose the majority if punters at York care if it's original vinyl or not, they just wanna dance, but the DJ's care, and still provide a good dance floor reaction, without boots.

Apologies if i came accross as meaning ALL accross the board events adopt this boot policy, far from it

[Guest]

Hmm - here's a cheap original, £10 jobbie - shall I empty the floor with this or shall I play a pressing of a top sound and keep everyone dancing.

If you answer yes to the first option, you need to get a life and get your head out of your arse and realise that 90% of people go to venues to dance and enjoy themselves and not stare at record labels like some sort of vinyl pervert.

well said pete

stevie g

[Pete S]

Would just like to add, if you're attending a cutting edge mainly newies venue then yes, original vinyl would be the order of the day, but at the hundreds of local soul nights I can't see why anyone would get upset about it

[Catriona]

Yes I am but we're talking about people enjoying a night out here and if the colour of a label affects peoples ability to enjoy themselves then I think they have a problem and should see someone

Have to agree to differ on this one then! I m in the ten pound camp,with the pretty labels, seeing the shrink!

Personally I would rather listen to an hour or more of a Dj sharing their personal taste and enthusiasm than listen to an hour of dancing by numbers, top 500 tunes played by the promoters mate/ girlfriend or boss s sister.

Which is why I m staying at home tonight, polishing my lp s

[Sean Hampsey]

There are some great cheap origonals to paly, I played a £10 origonal at the DKOF "The Need to Itch" by the Haemorrhoids, Andy Dyosn enquired where I got it from...

"John Anderson he's got Piles of em"

Careful.

I think you're risking this thread getting a bit anal, Paul.

[Guest]

Hmm - here's a cheap original, £10 jobbie - shall I empty the floor with this or shall I play a pressing of a top sound and keep everyone dancing.

If you answer yes to the first option, you need to get a life and get your head out of your arse and realise that 90% of people go to venues to dance and enjoy themselves and not stare at record labels like some sort of vinyl pervert.

hit the nail on the head there bud

[Pete S]

Have to agree to differ on this one then! I m in the ten pound camp,with the pretty labels, seeing the shrink!

Personally I would rather listen to an hour or more of a Dj sharing their personal taste and enthusiasm than listen to an hour of dancing by numbers, top 500 tunes played by the promoters mate/ girlfriend or boss s sister.

Which is why I m staying at home tonight, polishing my lp s

Well what do you do about the atmosphere that an hour of empty floortime generates? People would walk in, and walk straight out again.

[MarkWhiteley]

Have to agree to differ on this one then! I m in the ten pound camp,with the pretty labels, seeing the shrink!

Personally I would rather listen to an hour or more of a Dj sharing their personal taste and enthusiasm than listen to an hour of dancing by numbers, top 500 tunes played by the promoters mate/ girlfriend or boss s sister.

Which is why I m staying at home tonight, polishing my lp s

Yes Cat but as you say 'Rather Listen To' most local Night punters go to Dance and prefer what they know.

[MarkWhiteley]

3 Pages and 111 quotes/replies and Smithy sorts it in 3 small goes!

TOP MAN PETE

[Catriona]

Yes Cat but as you say 'Rather Listen To' most local Night punters go to Dance and prefer what they know.

I listen when I dance too, I m a woman, I can do two or more things at once

[Pete S]

3 Pages and 111 quotes/replies and Smithy sorts it in 3 small goes!

TOP MAN PETE

Why thank you Mark.

I await the inevitable abuse.

[Ady Croasdell]

Well what do you do about the atmosphere that an hour of empty floortime generates? People would walk in, and walk straight out again.

This and your first analogy are daft Pete. Why should the person who was on instead only have £10 floor clearers in their box. The point a lot of people have made is that great sets can be done for all types of punter without using boots.

[Guest Fatius Bumius]

Ok Pete, here's a bit of abuse haha, well not abuse as such, but how would you feel being the DJ on at 11 oclock and the DJ before you doing the 10-11 spot had played all boots of records you have in your playbox ? (the U Tube playbox ????)

I think you would be a bit nobbed off.... ??

[Guest Trevski]

Well what do you do about the atmosphere that an hour of empty floortime generates? People would walk in, and walk straight out again.

Why is it that people think unless the playlist is top 500 popular oldies, anything else will clear the floor? Lots of great tunes under £50 that are well known and would fill a dance floor. Lots of DJ's out there with tunes that were £10 sounds when they first bought 'em that are worth a lot more now too, and can be played to a full floor. I just think, (and I fully understand the punters not giving a shite angle) that someone who has put in the work, time and money to build a decent collection, whatever the price, should be head and shoulders above someone playing boots. I just don't believe they deserve to be behind the decks, IMHO, and that won't change.

Edited January 12, 2008 by Trevski

[Pete S]

Ok Pete, here's a bit of abuse haha, well not abuse as such, but how would you feel being the DJ on at 11 oclock and the DJ before you doing the 10-11 spot had played all boots of records you have in your playbox ? (the U Tube playbox ????)

I think you would be a bit nobbed off.... ??

Doesn't bother me that much, there's still enough decent records in that box to do five or six different sets...and I'd just once again point to whether people were dancing and enjoying themselves, if so, I wouldn't say anything

[Guest Fatius Bumius]

I bet you wouldn't say anything pmsl.... but you say enough about people selling boots on EBay

no offence meant before someone jumps down my throat, it's sore enough as it is

[Sean Hampsey]

Might be a bit off thread, but I can hardly believe that people still go to venues where they'd listen to a playlist that even had the likelihood of being booted. Personally, I'd rarely set foot in a place playing oldies in the first place.

If you go along to a night with a 20 - 30 year old playlist it's almost inevitable you're gonna hear reissues, EMI's and boots.

You'll never hear a Boot at Yarmouth (for example) because the DJ's are playing an entire weekend of 'fresh' material thats under the Bootleggers radar.

Its interesting how nobody here seems to be bothered about the moral issue, in this instance, of playing Bootlegs. Many seem more concerned that the DJ's in question were insulting their intelligence.

Just doesn't seem too smart to me to go to a gig that plays the 'same old same old' regardless of whether its 'original' vinyl or not!

[Pete Eccles]

If a DJ is faced with the dilemma, shall i play this £10 floor clearer or this pressing of a floor filler, WTF are they doing up there in the first place? whatever the type of event if they can't pull up 20 odd floor friendly legit tunes, then why bother in the first place?

[MarkWhiteley]

Im just sat here wondering, does the poor girl who initiated this great debate know anything about it?

Is she on here? Be great to here her views

M.

[Catriona]

Might be a bit off thread, but I can hardly believe that people still go to venues where they'd listen to a playlist that even had the likelihood of being booted. Personally, I'd rarely set foot in a place playing oldies in the first place.

If you go along to a night with a 20 - 30 year old playlist it's almost inevitable you're gonna hear reissues, EMI's and boots.

You'll never hear a Boot at Yarmouth (for example) because the DJ's are playing an entire weekend of 'fresh' material thats under the Bootleggers radar.

Its interesting how nobody here seems to be bothered about the moral issue, in this instance, of playing Bootlegs. Many seem more concerned that the DJ's in question were insulting their intelligence.

Just doesn't seem too smart to me to go to a gig that plays the 'same old same old' regardless of whether its 'original' vinyl or not!

Shhhhhh Sean, dont say that or someone will remember that Gavin once played The Carstairs at Essence at it ll all go off.

[Pete S]

I bet you wouldn't say anything pmsl.... but you say enough about people selling boots on EBay

no offence meant before someone jumps down my throat, it's sore enough as it is

What the f*ck has that got to do with anything, if you haven't got anything sensible to come back with then whats the point of continuing the conversation? I don't like seeing people selling boots as originals, is that plain enough for you to understand?

[Sean Hampsey]

Shhhhhh Sean, dont say that or someone will remember that Gavin once played The Carstairs at Essence at it ll all go off.

Yeh you're right Dave.

I'm saying nothing!

[Pete S]

You'll never hear a Boot at Yarmouth (for example) because the DJ's are playing an entire weekend of 'fresh' material thats under the Bootleggers radar.

And is also uninteresting to the majority of people attending northern soul events and not worth bootlegging as they would only sell 3 copies...

[sister dawn]

Feckin' Hell thought I was reading bout me for a nano second there!!!! intial of D has a tattoo and a large pair of norks!

Female DJ's encroaching on yer patches now boyz? filling the dance floors multi tasking by speaking on the mike, cueing up, playing requests and not talking nads about how much the sacred vinyl is worth and the only copy in existance belongs to you....... this aint a bootleg versus an original debate this is a battle of the sexes .... bring it on boyz us ladies are ready

[Guest Fatius Bumius]

come off it Pete, you seriously telling me you wouldn't bat an eyelid if a DJ before you played 90% boots of stuff you would likely to be playing/owned/saved up hard for/sourced/broke ??

That was my question,,,,oh and those size 10's u jumped down my throat with didn't half bloody hurt

[Guest Bearsy]

perhaps this may be a rare instance when a 'boot' (or pair of boots) is better than an original......

I got to agree with you on that Coops and they are a couple of boots i would definately play with

[Harry Crosby]

Check the York Soul Club playlists. Something for everyone, popular oldies, something new, current spins, rarities and cheapo tunes side by side, played to an enthusiastic crowd who in the main, appreciate something new. I don't suppose the majority of punters at York care if it's original vinyl or not, they just wanna dance, but the DJ's care, and still provide a good dance floor reaction, without boots. Depends on which way the promoters want to go, but I think Tony & Tracy have got it right.

Although i as yet havn`t been, totally agree with what you are saying here trev, suppose its down to the promotors to advertise correctly, and as they say do exactly what it says on the TIN, as i was discussing with tony these things don`t happen overnight and its a case of sticking to a formula through thick and thin, me and diane dj`d the other week played away from what you would call the "NORM" nothing super elusive infact many of the records in the set were underplayed oldies ie ones that have escaped the bootleggers and whilst we got rave reviews and comments from most of the more open minded of the crowd, a small section of the crowd actually heckled us between every record? The two lads who dj`d before us played out & out oldies inc boots and filled the floor no disrespect to them in anyway,DJ`S, COLLECTORS, DANCERS,LISTENERS.as pete smith says an atmosphere should be provided by dj`s for dancers

who don`t really care what label it`s on anyway and i do suppose it`s about going out and enjoying yourselves anyway, to me if one dj`s set spoils your night whats the point in making the effort to go out, YOU CAN PLEASE SOME OF THE PEOPLE SOME OF THE TIME,BUT NOT ALL OF THE PEOPLE ALL OF THE TIME

[Guest andyrattigan]

Hmm - here's a cheap original, £10 jobbie - shall I empty the floor with this or shall I play a pressing of a top sound and keep everyone dancing.

If you answer yes to the first option, you need to get a life and get your head out of your arse and realise that 90% of people go to venues to dance and enjoy themselves and not stare at record labels like some sort of vinyl pervert.

Hilarious

Do you think there are people going up to the decks staring at the label of a record for a minute and drooling and then nipping into the toilet for some "Soul Self Satisfaction". I wouldnt be surprised to be honest.

[Guest Trevski]

Feckin' Hell thought I was reading bout me for a nano second there!!!! intial of D has a tattoo and a large pair of norks!

Female DJ's encroaching on yer patches now boyz? filling the dance floors multi tasking by speaking on the mike, cueing up, playing requests and not talking nads about how much the sacred vinyl is worth and the only copy in existance belongs to you....... this aint a bootleg versus an original debate this is a battle of the sexes .... bring it on boyz us ladies are ready

Not in my book Dawn. Female Dj/Male Dj, couldn't give a toss, as long as the music is right and they have a collection that warrants being played out. Val Palmer, greatest female Dj in my book, could outdo many a bloke behind the decks (and in front of 'em) Would choose Val over many blokes if I were sorting out a DJ lineup.

[sister dawn]

Not in my book Dawn. Female Dj/Male Dj, couldn't give a toss, as long as the music is right and they have a collection that warrants being played out. Val Palmer, greatest female Dj in my book, could outdo many a bloke behind the decks (and in front of 'em) Would choose Val over many blokes if I were sorting out a DJ lineup.

You can have a goldstar

[Soulcarp]

got to have my two pence worth i think we are going of the beaten track here dj.s shouldn't play boots end of story, lets not confuse the issue if they play boots its for there own ego to look good,at the end of day the promoters are just as bad they have a good idea what djs have in there boxs, christ i didn't play boots at the youth club when i was a kid. as ethics gone out of the window?

[Guest andyrattigan]

Im just sat here wondering, does the poor girl who initiated this great debate know anything about it?

Is she on here? Be great to here her views

M.

I'd say she is at home counting the days in excitement to her next Dj session at the aforementioned venue now that she knows the Soul police will be waiting for her.

Whilst I don't agree with the playing of boots at venues I think there are far more important things in life to worry about and I certainly wouldn't hold it against anyone.

Did someone stand there and analyse every record she played? Jesus Im usually to busy dancing or having the crack to be trying to read matrix numbers revolving at 45 rpm when Im out.

[Pete S]

come off it Pete, you seriously telling me you wouldn't bat an eyelid if a DJ before you played 90% boots of stuff you would likely to be playing/owned/saved up hard for/sourced/broke ??

That was my question,,,,oh and those size 10's u jumped down my throat with didn't half bloody hurt

size 8, not 10

honestly - what business of mine is it to tell someone what they can and cannot play?

[Guest SteveC]

After the last 100 club I went to I gave 2 ladies a lift to their car at greenwich and another lady to her home in Surrey. We had a conversation regarding music policy etc as I was interested in their views of Karl Heards spot (his and my tastes/views are very similar) and as regular attendees/punters of events (remember they'd just been to the 100 club) their reply was one which I openly admitted frustrated and bewilderment.

They stated that they preferred to listen and dance to sounds that were familiar to them and that Karls spot was "OK". Now I'm a great believer in each to their own and nothing is "shite", just not to your taste, and there are many superb soul tracks that just don't float my boat BUT do people ever remember the 1st time they heard a tune that they now class as "familiar and OK to dance to"? Did they like it straight away or was it over a period of time when bah bah bah they followed the crowd and the general consensus?

The link up with this thread is that those ladies typify the standard punter (no disrespect meant - they're great girls) who would not care what format the familiar or unfamiliar tunes were played from and would be happy if there was never a new discovery made. Scares me to death that the people who think like that (and there must be many) would be content to have a fixed number of soul tunes in their soul world.

I'm afraid that the conclusion from this scenario points in one direction only as Terry and others have stated - pick and choose where you go carefully which is why many travel further afield than the do's on their doorstep. Is it so difficult though for promoters to clarify in their advertising what format sounds would be delivered on. Surely that would assure all needs for all types of punters were catered for and would reduce this type of debate (or do we thrive on it ).

For me it should be orig format (US or UK) only with very few exceptions but it ain't gonna happen. So stipulate the format seeing as it's an important issue to both sides of the debate.

As for the standard of semi-unknowns that get played - I can't believe DJ's buy records coz they are solely unheard to most. Unless you're a collector of labels/artists then I fail to see how anyone, DJ or not, can purchase something, regardless of price, which they don't love and feel and consequently their set is one which reflects their taste in soul music.

With all due respect Pete, you surely don't think its impossible to play a fresh and exciting dance friendly set with a box of £10-30 sounds on orig labels?

[Pete S]

christ i didn't play boots at the youth club when i was a kid. as ethics gone out of the window?

You must have been the only person in the country who didn't then, aged 14 I got 50p pocket money a week, how did you manage to get all the top "non boot" sounds?

[NEV]

if its who i think it is then i was once told "shes a good dj because shes good on the mike"

MORE LIKE TAKING THE "MIKE"

[Pete S]

With all due respect Pete, you surely don't think its impossible to play a fresh and exciting dance friendly set with a box of £10-30 sounds on orig labels?

No I'm saying if you were to try it, you would lose the floor for a good period of time, especially if they were uknowns

[Spacehopper]

surely its horses for corses....i cant afford most of the top 500 on original so if im playing at a scooter rally or with no other djs in a local pub do where i know thats what they wanna hear and they dont give a shit about the format then the reissues and boots get played...if im playing at a "proper" soul nite with other djs i have more self respect AND respect for the other djs with the big tunes and play £50 and under originals (with a handful of big money tunes)...aslong as they are still good dancers !!...dont play an original just because it is one....at the end of the day every dj should have an hours worth of good originals at least

[sister dawn]

someone is bound to mention cd's soon

[Guest]

someone is bound to mention cd's soon

NICE ONE

[Ady Croasdell]

After the last 100 club I went to I gave 2 ladies a lift to their car at greenwich and another lady to her home in Surrey. We had a conversation regarding music policy etc as I was interested in their views of Karl Heards spot (his and my tastes/views are very similar) and as regular attendees/punters of events (remember they'd just been to the 100 club) their reply was one which I openly admitted frustrated and bewilderment.

They stated that they preferred to listen and dance to sounds that were familiar to them and that Karls spot was "OK". Now I'm a great believer in each to their own and nothing is "shite", just not to your taste, and there are many superb soul tracks that just don't float my boat BUT do people ever remember the 1st time they heard a tune that they now class as "familiar and OK to dance to"? Did they like it straight away or was it over a period of time when bah bah bah they followed the crowd and the general consensus?

The link up with this thread is that those ladies typify the standard punter (no disrespect meant - they're great girls) who would not care what format the familiar or unfamiliar tunes were played from and would be happy if there was never a new discovery made. Scares me to death that the people who think like that (and there must be many) would be content to have a fixed number of soul tunes in their soul world.

I'm afraid that the conclusion from this scenario points in one direction only as Terry and others have stated - pick and choose where you go carefully which is why many travel further afield than the do's on their doorstep. Is it so difficult though for promoters to clarify in their advertising what format sounds would be delivered on. Surely that would assure all needs for all types of punters were catered for and would reduce this type of debate (or do we thrive on it ).

For me it should be orig format (US or UK) only with very few exceptions but it ain't gonna happen. So stipulate the format seeing as it's an important issue to both sides of the debate.

As for the standard of semi-unknowns that get played - I can't believe DJ's buy records coz they are solely unheard to most. Unless you're a collector of labels/artists then I fail to see how anyone, DJ or not, can purchase something, regardless of price, which they don't love and feel and consequently their set is one which reflects their taste in soul music.

With all due respect Pete, you surely don't think its impossible to play a fresh and exciting dance friendly set with a box of £10-30 sounds on orig labels?

But I bet those girls were happy to hear some of the 100 Club anniversary singles and Butch's biggies that were all brand new and unheard of prior to their debuts (obviously). So though they don't think they like new sounds, I'm sure they'll actually be benefitting from some of those that have been discovered since they first started on the scene.

You are of course right that even in a relatively "upfront" club like t'Hundred, there are plenty of people who aren't just into the latest newies or rareties and come for a good night out. That's always been the case and was one of the reasons we never went as far out on a limb as Stafford did in the 80s but always tried to maintain a balance between new and old.

[Pete S]

surely its horses for corses....i cant afford most of the top 500 on original so if im playing at a scooter rally or with no other djs in a local pub do where i know thats what they wanna hear and they dont give a shit about the format then the reissues and boots get played...if im playing at a "proper" soul nite with other djs i have more self respect AND respect for the other djs with the big tunes and play £50 and under originals (with a handful of big money tunes)...aslong as they are still good dancers !!...dont play an original just because it is one....at the end of the day every dj should have an hours worth of good originals at least

Exactly!

[Jimmy A]

someone is bound to mention cd's soon

CDs.....just thought i'd mention them

[Guest SteveC]

No I'm saying if you were to try it, you would lose the floor for a good period of time, especially if they were uknowns

In all honesty I see your point Pete but it really does depend where you are and who the punters are. Burnley is proof of that - been a long time since I heard a set which at least 50% of the tunes were fresh to my ears, in a couple of sets BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, FOR ME, splendid dancers which more than appealed to me as much as any oldie I love. All points towards accurate marketing/advertising as I really can't see boot spinning being eliminated.

[Ady Croasdell]

No I'm saying if you were to try it, you would lose the floor for a good period of time, especially if they were uknowns

You could play Motown, Mirwood, Okeh, Atalntic, Ric Tic etc for an hour without the hint of a boot or anything over £50, all solid Northern and keep the floor rammed. We all agree that you can't with unknowns but no one apart from you has suggested that.