Pete S Posted December 30, 2007 Author Share Posted December 30, 2007 Read my quote above and you will see why, why should people be allowed to say such things with no comeback, and why the hell would you make such an opinion based on him on that documentary alone, that is the definition of ignorance alone and ultimately proves my point. Because you are assuming that everyone on here is au fait with all types of music - many are, but some just aren't interested so there must have been a fair proportion of people who didn't even know who he was when that documentary played. To the layman, Soul II Soul's music is just dismal nightclub pap Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted December 30, 2007 Author Share Posted December 30, 2007 whether he's a c*ck or not, whether he deserves a gong or not, if you base your opionions on that appearance alone then you are ignorant to the full facts, nothing difficult to understand there IMHO. and once again, why would you expect everyone who watched it to even know who he is? And therefore thats all they do have to go on. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest nubes Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 do not know any of jazzy b's music, so no comment.however I did see his interview some time ago and I remember taking a dim view of his obvious racist remarks concerning his visit to the casino. At one point he said (not word for word) one of the things that struck him at the time was that there were no black people at the venue and that he felt very intimidated, the inferance being that black people did'nt go because the white folk did'nt want them there.What a load of tosh say I.In those early wigan days and before,when you went to the allnighter IT PAID YOU to know just who was who, black or white cause there were some very nasty chaps there .....who,shall we say were not there for the music.To hint that black folk were scared,don't make me laugh,who remembers black robbo and fenton from WOLVERHAMPTON or that nasty little crew who stood near the down stairs bogs at wigan...a nastier bunch you could'nt find any where along with some equally nasty white chaps...smokey,larry lightning.paul roberts and terry thompson to name just a few.black people never went CAUSE THEY DID'NT LIKE THE MUSIC thats all, plain and simple just like I never went to reggae clubs in london (do like the music though) that were frequented by mainly black people.the fact of the jazzy b matter is good old jazzy went up north on a whim and did'nt like it and the t.v company did what they always do..get some fool who knows nowt about the subject they are making a prog about and get them to talk about it. should jazzy get an honour?...why not they hand em out to any old tom, dick or jazzy these days Do you know Terry....this must be one of the few times that i actually agree with everything you have just posted....and it bloody pains me but yes you are 100% spot on.....Delxxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
chrissie Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 do not know any of jazzy b's music, so no comment.however I did see his interview some time ago and I remember taking a dim view of his obvious racist remarks concerning his visit to the casino. At one point he said (not word for word) one of the things that struck him at the time was that there were no black people at the venue and that he felt very intimidated, the inferance being that black people did'nt go because the white folk did'nt want them there.What a load of tosh say I.In those early wigan days and before,when you went to the allnighter IT PAID YOU to know just who was who, black or white cause there were some very nasty chaps there .....who,shall we say were not there for the music.To hint that black folk were scared,don't make me laugh,who remembers black robbo and fenton from WOLVERHAMPTON or that nasty little crew who stood near the down stairs bogs at wigan...a nastier bunch you could'nt find any where along with some equally nasty white chaps...smokey,larry lightning.paul roberts and terry thompson to name just a few.black people never went CAUSE THEY DID'NT LIKE THE MUSIC thats all, plain and simple just like I never went to reggae clubs in london (do like the music though) that were frequented by mainly black people.the fact of the jazzy b matter is good old jazzy went up north on a whim and did'nt like it and the t.v company did what they always do..get some fool who knows nowt about the subject they are making a prog about and get them to talk about it. should jazzy get an honour?...why not they hand em out to any old tom, dick or jazzy these days I rest my case my lord........ QoFxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
chrissie Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 (edited) Because you are assuming that everyone on here is au fait with all types of music - many are, but some just aren't interested so there must have been a fair proportion of people who didn't even know who he was when that documentary played. To the layman, Soul II Soul's music is just dismal nightclub pap To be honest pete, I had never heard of him until the doco, but then thought "who is this guy" and looked into and tried to listen to quite a bit of what he had supposedly done etc and have spoken to people who were about at that time, and quite frankly if that was how it was in the 80s and early 90s I am quite pleased to know that I was doing my punk/alarm/mod thing and well away from the scene that I loved in the early 70s. People say I am narrow minded because I don't like modern soul, I say that it is them that are narrow minded for dismissing anything that isn't soul. QoFxx Edited December 30, 2007 by chrissie Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Sutty Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 To the layman, Soul II Soul's music is just dismal nightclub pap I think you'll find that the layman finds northern soul to be dismal pap (if they've even heard it), and soul 2 soul to be the people that had a worldwide hit with 'back to life' and other tracks. JB did an awful lot to promote and increase awareness of UK soul, you can't judge him on a 2 min documentary comment on NS, which if I remember was slated as being a pretty awful documentary all round. In fact the whole series was dubious. This 'debate' is laughable, JB has done more than anyone on this forum to promote soul music around the world, it's just not the small period of soul music most people on here seem attached to. For the record, I like NS and JB! cheers Paul Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter99 Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 To be honest pete, I had never heard of him until the doco, but then thought "who is this guy" and looked into quite a bit of what he had supposedly done etc and have spoken to people who were about at that time, and quite frankly if that was how it was in the 80s and early 90s I am quite pleased to know that I was doing my punk/alarm/mod thing and well away from the scene that I loved in the early 70s. People say I am narrow minded because I don't like modern soul, I say that it is them that are narrow minded for dismissing anything that isn't soul.QoFxx That'll make you and Pete narrow minded then Chrissie! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
chrissie Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 That'll make you and Pete narrow minded then Chrissie! and I am honoured to be in such company as Mr Smith QoFxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Do you know Terry....this must be one of the few times that i actually agree with everything you have just posted....and it bloody pains me but yes you are 100% spot on.....Delxxx Not far short of what i said first time we had this arguement,as somebody you used to frequent dives(me mam used to take me) in the 7ts and 8ts Blues clubs and stuff unless you knew somebody forget it,nock on the door type places not very welcoming places but if ya`knew someone they where ok infact. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest gordon russell Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Do you know Terry....this must be one of the few times that i actually agree with everything you have just posted....and it bloody pains me but yes you are 100% spot on.....Delxxx don't know why it pains you, the truth is there are many people on this site who mis-represent themselves,change the past and worst of all as they get to their late 40's or early 5o's develope this roses round the door veiw to the soul scene now and in the past. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted December 30, 2007 Author Share Posted December 30, 2007 I think you'll find that the layman finds northern soul to be dismal pap (if they've even heard it), and soul 2 soul to be the people that had a worldwide hit with 'back to life' and other tracks. JB did an awful lot to promote and increase awareness of UK soul, you can't judge him on a 2 min documentary comment on NS, which if I remember was slated as being a pretty awful documentary all round. In fact the whole series was dubious. This 'debate' is laughable, JB has done more than anyone on this forum to promote soul music around the world, it's just not the small period of soul music most people on here seem attached to. For the record, I like NS and JB! cheers Paul I don't mind Soul II Soul either but as I keep trying to explain, if you played their music to a die hard Northern Soulie who didn't listen to much else, they would think it was just ordinary club music, which it is Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Sutty Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 I don't mind Soul II Soul either but as I keep trying to explain, if you played their music to a die hard Northern Soulie who didn't listen to much else, they would think it was just ordinary club music, which it is I agree Pete, die hard NS fans are not laymen though. Soul II soul created a uniquely British soul sound that became massive in the UK and was exported worldwide, which is rare. JB didn't create this alone but he was the figure elevated in the promotion of it and seen as the 'leader', if anyone was going to get any awards for the music it was always going to be him. 'fairplay', 'keep on movin' and 'back to life' were classic UK soul sounds, they were innovators not followers along with other people at that time (nellie hooper, simon law, etc). Whether anyone here personally sees them as that coming from the NS perspective is irrelevant IMHO, they did it. That's why he got the award, and he deserves it IMHO. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
chrissie Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 I don't mind Soul II Soul either but as I keep trying to explain, if you played their music to a die hard Northern Soulie who didn't listen to much else, they would think it was just ordinary club music, which it is As I appreciate your comment pete, its time to come out of the closet, I am nota die hard soulie, I love NS (preferably 60s) more than any music I have ever experienced but also decent RnB, some SKA etc but I also love other types of music including Bob Dylan, The Alarm, Jam, Clash, Boy on A Dolphin, Siouxsie & THe Banshees (who do you think christine strawberrygirl was ) Guns & Roses, Bowie, Meat Loaf, Dolly Parton, Patsy Cline, Roy Orbison, Floggin Mollys, Amy Winehouse, Saw Doctors, I could go on for ever. Even was found banged to rites playing an Elvis CD the other day, I just cant get disco/modern/jazz funk. I can't get round people who think that because I don't like what they like that I am some sort of moron but the most important think is I DONT think they are morons because they don't like the non soul music I like. I just have always had the opinion that peoples music tastes differ as do their football teams and we are all entitled to our opinions. QoFxx Hey someone fetch me a tin hat Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted December 30, 2007 Author Share Posted December 30, 2007 As I appreciate your comment pete, its time to come out of the closet, I am nota die hard soulie, I love NS (preferably 60s) more than any music I have ever experienced but also decent RnB, some SKA etc but I also love other types of music including Bob Dylan, The Alarm, Jam, Clash, Boy on A Dolphin, Siouxsie & THe Banshees (who do you think christine strawberrygirl was ) Guns & Roses, Bowie, Meat Loaf, Dolly Parton, Patsy Cline, Roy Orbison, Floggin Mollys, Amy Winehouse, Saw Doctors, I could go on for ever. Even was found banged to rites playing an Elvis CD the other day, I just cant get disco/modern/jazz funk. I can't get round people who think that because I don't like what they like that I am some sort of moron but the most important think is I DONT think they are morons because they don't like the non soul music I like. I just have always had the opinion that peoples music tastes differ as do their football teams and we are all entitled to our opinions. QoFxx Hey someone fetch me a tin hat No I'm absolutely with you - I like and collect all kinds of music myself from the 40's onwards but the only music I really dislike is modern soul and dance music (Ibiza type stuff). Oh and the stuff they've beencalling reggae since about 1980 onwards. I do like the old 70's chart soul records - it's just 70's onwards soul in the Northern context that I can't stand. After listening to all 50 eipsodes of Bob Dylans Theme Time Radio Hour I also now like Western swing and a bit of country too. Meat Loaf is sh*t though. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Simon Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Siouxsie & THe Banshees (who do you think christine strawberrygirl was ) Christine sees her faces unfurl... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Scarborosoul Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Whatever the argument for or against his gong NO ONE on this scene should forget that he paid us the insult of all insults " I wouldnt go to those parties because they were ALL RACIST"!!!!! Whatever you think of this GIANT of Brit black music, we should not forget the absolute BULLSHIT he spouted on Soul Brittania! RICK Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest nubes Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 don't know why it pains you, Er not in the way that you are thinking pal...i just met to be humouros that's all the truth is there are many people on this site who mis-represent themselves,change the past and worst of all as they get to their late 40's or early 5o's develope this roses round the door veiw to the soul scene now and in the past. Do you mind if i can ask a question here????....wasnt you on the Jazz funk scene during the late 70s yourself for a while???just curious thats all....Delxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest outonthefloor Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 As I appreciate your comment pete, its time to come out of the closet, I am nota die hard soulie, I love NS (preferably 60s) more than any music I have ever experienced but also decent RnB, some SKA etc but I also love other types of music including Bob Dylan, The Alarm, Jam, Clash, Boy on A Dolphin, Siouxsie & THe Banshees (who do you think christine strawberrygirl was ) Guns & Roses, Bowie, Meat Loaf, Dolly Parton, Patsy Cline, Roy Orbison, Floggin Mollys, Amy Winehouse, Saw Doctors, I could go on for ever. Even was found banged to rites playing an Elvis CD the other day, I just cant get disco/modern/jazz funk. I can't get round people who think that because I don't like what they like that I am some sort of moron but the most important think is I DONT think they are morons because they don't like the non soul music I like. I just have always had the opinion that peoples music tastes differ as do their football teams and we are all entitled to our opinions. QoFxx Hey someone fetch me a tin hat Were we seperated at birth? must talk punk wen i see ya on the 11th xxxxx Lookin forward to it xxxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
chrissie Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Christine sees her faces unfurl... Siouxsie and I worked together in the mid 70s and I blame her for everything.............................................. QoFxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter99 Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Whatever the argument for or against his gong NO ONE on this scene should forget that he paid us the insult of all insults " I wouldnt go to those parties because they were ALL RACIST"!!!!! Whatever you think of this GIANT of Brit black music, we should not forget the absolute BULLSHIT he spouted on Soul Brittania! RICK Not heard from you for a while mate! No point in mincing yer words. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Scarborosoul Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Not heard from you for a while mate! No point in mincing yer words. Hiya Pete im still out and about and as you say m8 im not a mincer Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Simon Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Siouxsie and I worked together in the mid 70s and I blame her for everything.............................................. QoFxx Blimey! i'm a big Banshees fan myself, so that record was actually written about you? Simon Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
chrissie Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Blimey! i'm a big Banshees fan myself, so that record was actually written about you? Simon I'll tell you the story sometime. QoFxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest gordon russell Posted December 30, 2007 Share Posted December 30, 2007 Do you mind if i can ask a question here????....wasnt you on the Jazz funk scene during the late 70s yourself for a while???just curious thats all....Delxx not in a million years,so no misrepresentation here....I was out and about on the soul scene. starlight room, london were ady's 6t's scene started....the start of the mighty yate era and so on...where were you? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted December 30, 2007 Author Share Posted December 30, 2007 Blimey! i'm a big Banshees fan myself, so that record was actually written about you? Simon Not unless she was a schizo with 22 different personalities Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Carrie Mehome Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 Love in a void does it for me everytime! Maybe Siouxsie should have got a gong instead! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
chrissie Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 Not unless she was a schizo with 22 different personalities Not 22 exactly , but there is a story behind it . QoFxx Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mike Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 please start a new topic in relevant forum if wish to continue any of the many discussions that were occuring ta mike Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
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