Coasters - Crazy Baby. Boot/original?

[Guest]

According to JMs boot guides the reissue was on styrene delta 95372. I've got one that is on vinyl, no delta number with 65L-9290-1 scratched into the deadwax. Deadwax is quite pitted...I've always assumed that this is a boot of some kind but can anyone confirm for me?

Cheers

Adam.

[John Al]

According to JMs boot guides the reissue was on styrene delta 95372. I've got one that is on vinyl, no delta number with 65L-9290-1 scratched into the deadwax. Deadwax is quite pitted...I've always assumed that this is a boot of some kind but can anyone confirm for me?

Cheers

Adam.

Only bootlegged once to my knowledge mate and very early on. Boot had Monarch Records stamp (MR) and delta you mention above with triangle in front of it. Was styrene too.

You could be in luck.

John.

[Guest]

Only bootlegged once to my knowledge mate and very early on. Boot had Monarch Records stamp (MR) and delta you mention above with triangle in front of it. Was styrene too.

You could be in luck.

John.

Cheers John. Not normally that lucky though! Scan below if anyone else has any info?

[pikeys dog]

Cheers John. Not normally that lucky though! Scan below if anyone else has any info?

Doesn't look right....

Any chance that this is Canadian?

[Guest]

Doesn't look right....

Any chance that this is Canadian?

I didn't think it looked quite right either which is why I assumed it was a boot, but as John said I thought this had never been booted on vinyl?

Nothing on the label mentions Canada so I'm assuming it's not a Canadian press.

[pikeys dog]

What's the sound quality like on the flip? - the styrene boots were atrocious..

Could it be a much more recent boot?

[Pete S]

Sorry but it was booted twice. My own copy is identical to the one Adam describes and it is a boot. This is one of the toughest of all counterfeits to recognise and I always try to buy it as a white demo just to be safe.

[Garethx]

The clue is in the quality of vinyl. It seems a lot like the bootlegs of US soul 45s done for the Jamaican market from the late 70s onwards.

[45cellar]

Sorry but it was booted twice. My own copy is identical to the one Adam describes and it is a boot. This is one of the toughest of all counterfeits to recognise and I always try to buy it as a white demo just to be safe.

Unfortunately it Looks like Petes already confirmed your suspicion

Here is a >>> LINK <<< to a previous thread about this record.

Contains Matrix details etc.

Edited October 6, 2007 by 45cellar

[Guest]

Cheers everyone, as I expected it's a boot then. On the bay it goes!

[Mark Bicknell]

I alway's thought the difference between the original and the boot was simply sound quality? as the styrene boots sound awful.

Mine has 65C-9290 - 1 scratched out in the dead wax and not 65L, this number has not been altered or changed, authentic 1965 Atco vinyl issue, also has small drill hole, sound quality excellent despite age wear and tear. I would say if the first example scan here has the 65C number and is vinyl then it's authentic anything else then possibly not.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

[Pete S]

I alway's thought the difference between the original and the boot was simply sound quality? as the styrene boots sound awful.

you may have just had one thats been played with a rough stylus Mark, both the vinyl and the styrene boots are of excellent quality, honestly!

I used to have a one sided emidisc of this that just said Freddie Jones - My Hearts Wide Open on the label. Used to carry around at school for no reason whatsoever, well ok, so that when people came up to you and asked what the record was you instantly became Charlie Big Potatoes

[Mark Bicknell]

you may have just had one thats been played with a rough stylus Mark, both the vinyl and the styrene boots are of excellent quality, honestly!

I used to have a one sided emidisc of this that just said Freddie Jones - My Hearts Wide Open on the label. Used to carry around at school for no reason whatsoever, well ok, so that when people came up to you and asked what the record was you instantly became Charlie Big Potatoes

Yes Pete I must have heard a rough copy of the boot, I think my other information is correct though on this.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

[Platters 81]

attached scan of "hard to tell" vinyl boot...sound is good and the scratched in dead wax number is virtually identical BUT...look for the "AT"scratched elsewhere in the deadwax....(a common feature on many Atlantic 45s (and distributed 45s)......this is absent on the boot......this was one of the best counterfeits ever........i'm not even sure there are east coast originals without the AT....but if it has the AT its orig.....

[Paul McKay]

The clue is in the quality of vinyl. It seems a lot like the bootlegs of US soul 45s done for the Jamaican market from the late 70s onwards.

Definitely a vinyl boot. The lighting shop in Petticoat Lane in London was selling them around 74-75. Sound quality was OK if I remember rightly. Sold mine a few years ago when I got a DJ copy.

[Ged Parker]

I was given a copy of this in 77/ 78 as one of the first 100? into an all-dayer at the Ritz. It was vinyl but had the labels reversed. Can't remember anything else about it though. I always assumed it was a boot unless someone had turned up a load which I doubt and if they had why give them away? So there must have been a late 70's vinyl boot as well.

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

The clue is in the quality of vinyl.

The even bigger clue is that you can hear someone dropping the needle onto the record at the beginning. Lots of crackle on the opening bars, too, that's patently on the record that it's been booted from rather than on the boot itself.

I bought one of these from Brownie about 15 years ago. He swore that it was an original and told me then that it couldn't be a boot becuse all the boots were styrene. He wouldn't take it back and I've never been able to bring myself to play the record again...

[Mark Bicknell]

The even bigger clue is that you can hear someone dropping the needle onto the record at the beginning. Lots of crackle on the opening bars, too, that's patently on the record that it's been booted from rather than on the boot itself.

I bought one of these from Brownie about 15 years ago. He swore that it was an original and told me then that it couldn't be a boot becuse all the boots were styrene. He wouldn't take it back and I've never been able to bring myself to play the record again...

Crazy Tony....I'll get my coat....lol

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

[Northern Soul Uk]

I have read all the points above, but still cannot come to the conclusion whether I have a boot or an orig of this? Some of the above points don't comply to my copy. There is a scan attached, and the runout lettering are as follows:
45-6379     65C-9290-REPL      A tiny' NR or MR   A triangle and 95372
There is no dropping of needles at the start, and this was bought from someone who wasn't sure themselves.

 

Sorry for dragging up an old thread.

 

Just thinking about it the 'REPL' might be a bit suss?? also has the 'MR' stamp so most likely a boot.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Northern Soul UK

[Mike Lofthouse]

I have read all the points above, but still cannot come to the conclusion whether I have a boot or an orig of this? Some of the above points don't comply to my copy. There is a scan attached, and the runout lettering are as follows:

45-6379     65C-9290-REPL      A tiny' NR or MR   A triangle and 95372

There is no dropping of needles at the start, and this was bought from someone who wasn't sure themselves.

 

Sorry for dragging up an old thread.

 

Just thinking about it the 'REPL' might be a bit suss?? also has the 'MR' stamp so most likely a boot.

IMAG05071.jpg

'MR' in itself does not indicate a boot but the Delta number 95372 does.   It was released in 1965 so would have a Delta number in the range of 55681 thru 55910 if it was legitimately pressed at Monarch.  95372 indicates it was pressed in the 70's.  Mine is like yours - it is styrene ? - and was bought on my first visit to Wigan in Sep '74 off Winstanleys stall - so it must be a boot.

 

Mike

[Northern Soul Uk]

'MR' in itself does not indicate a boot but the Delta number 95372 does.   It was released in 1965 so would have a Delta number in the range of 55681 thru 55910 if it was legitimately pressed at Monarch.  95372 indicates it was pressed in the 70's.  Mine is like yours - it is styrene ? - and was bought on my first visit to Wigan in Sep '74 off Winstanleys stall - so it must be a boot.

 

Mike

Yes It is styrene I think, and I think it is a boot from what you say. Plays well though, good, loud and clear.

Edited September 12, 2014 by Northern Soul UK

[soulperson]

mine has 65c-9290-21 mr stamp in circle triangle 58721, m&7 sideways, then at.........that was so difficult to see even with my specs on!!!!! old age.who'd have it.hope this helps.sue

[JOE TORQUAY]

I alway's thought the difference between the original and the boot was simply sound quality? as the styrene boots sound awful.

Mine has 65C-9290 - 1 scratched out in the dead wax and not 65L, this number has not been altered or changed, authentic 1965 Atco vinyl issue, also has small drill hole, sound quality excellent despite age wear and tear. I would say if the first example scan here has the 65C number and is vinyl then it's authentic anything else then possibly not.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

as with marks mine has the same numbers plus about two inches to the right what looks like ( a t   ) as well,

i've had this a lot of years now butnot sure when it came out.

[JOE TORQUAY]

as with marks above but lable is off center and also has the letters (  a t )  as well

[Pete S]

The vinyl boot also has little spots in the run off groove

[JOE TORQUAY]

The vinyl boot also has little spots in the run off groove

as has mine

[dthedrug]

 HI ALL....We have had this debate before, but here's my thoughts on the 45, all DEMOS are proper, Styrene snide,

Plastic vinyl copy iffy, However as the Coaster spent most of the year in Jamaica the copy looks very much like it ws made at FEDERAL RECORDS, so it may well be a Feddy special  DAVE K 

[Northern Soul Uk]

There are so many markings of Boots or originals here it's getting hard to follow.
Can we get a difinitive list of what is what i.e. What markings to look for in a boot and what to look for in an orig'?
So that anyone looking at this thread in the future won't have to ask again as I did.
Is there anyone who could do that please?

[Dave Fleming]

I have read all the points above, but still cannot come to the conclusion whether I have a boot or an orig of this? Some of the above points don't comply to my copy. There is a scan attached, and the runout lettering are as follows:

45-6379     65C-9290-REPL      A tiny' NR or MR   A triangle and 95372

There is no dropping of needles at the start, and this was bought from someone who wasn't sure themselves.

 

Sorry for dragging up an old thread.

 

Just thinking about it the 'REPL' might be a bit suss?? also has the 'MR' stamp so most likely a boot.

IMAG05071.jpg

This is the early 70s styrene reissue done by Atlantic,this has the Rockefeller Plaza address,

The vinyl boot has 65L in the runout,bootleggers mistook this for 65C as on the vinyl orig.

[Northern Soul Uk]

This is the early 70s styrene reissue done by Atlantic,this has the Rockefeller Plaza address,

The vinyl boot has 65L in the runout,bootleggers mistook this for 65C as on the vinyl orig.

Ah cool, so it's an official 70s re-press then not a boot?

[Jim G]

I had a styrene copy eons ago and thought it was a boot! 

 

On a side note, if they had booted as the cover up name "My Hearts Wide Open" by Freddie Jones, it would be easier to spot!

 

Also off topic, saw the comment below on YouTube

 

"Point of Northern history here. This was discovered in 1974 ish by the late Nick Washer, a soul man responsible for supplying many legendary tunes to the scene. The first play at a northern soul club was in fact down South at the legendary (for some) Shades of Green club in Camberley Surrey. That was on a Friday night, on the Saturday Nick gave it to Dave Burton, who I believe invented the Freddie Jones cover-up name, he took it to the Mecca and the rest is history."

 

AND, the Temptones "Bang, Bang, Bang" sounds a lot like it Crazy Baby. See  in the video below from the hit US comedy in the '90's - This is from Series 3 Episode 9. AFAIK, it was never released.

 

Edited September 19, 2014 by jim g

[St James]

mine has 65c-9290-21 mr stamp in circle triangle 58721, m&7 sideways, then at.........that was so difficult to see even with my specs on!!!!! old age.who'd have it.hope this helps.sue

Eyes are ok...it's me friggin memory! Every time the Crazy Baby boot question is discussed, I have to go and check... A T in the run out  ...so it's still legit    

[Ian]

Can anybody post a sound clip of the male vocal with the same backing, think its a acetate.

 

Ian

[Pete S]

Can anybody post a sound clip of the male vocal with the same backing, think its a acetate.

 

Ian

 

Still not heard this

[Dave Fleming]

Eyes are ok...it's me friggin memory! Every time the Crazy Baby boot question is discussed, I have to go and check... A T in the run out  ...so it's still legit 

Ric is it a vinyl copy you have?,orig 65C,boot 65L.

[Geoff]

Can anybody post a sound clip of the male vocal with the same backing, think its a acetate.

 

Ian

 

I guess you mean the acetate that Andy Dyson plays, he announces it as Jimmy Sherman's My Heart's Wide Open.

[St James]

Dave...it's a vinyl issue with the following on the run out:

 

W at 8 O'clock 

65C - 9290 -  1 at 5 O'clock 

a mark that looks like a strawberry with an s in it at 4 O'clock

faint L W at 3 O'clock

A T at 2 O'clock

 

clock face based on my copy as label position would vary...lovely copy and I'm pretty sure I bought it via SS sales

[Douglaschip]

I guess you mean the acetate that Andy Dyson plays, he announces it as Jimmy Sherman's My Heart's Wide Open.

 

Think Ady Pountain plays a copy of this as well.

[Ian]

That's the one never heard it but would like to.

 

Ian

[Guest Reggie Anderson]

Having owned and still own Crazy Baby - The Coasters the 1970's re-issue has Rockefeller Plaza within the address on the label. Easy !

[Guest Reggie Anderson]

On ‎11‎/‎09‎/‎2014 at 21:47, Northern Soul UK said:

I have read all the points above, but still cannot come to the conclusion whether I have a boot or an orig of this? Some of the above points don't comply to my copy. There is a scan attached, and the runout lettering are as follows:
45-6379     65C-9290-REPL      A tiny' NR or MR   A triangle and 95372
There is no dropping of needles at the start, and this was bought from someone who wasn't sure themselves.

 

Sorry for dragging up an old thread.

 

Just thinking about it the 'REPL' might be a bit suss?? also has the 'MR' stamp so most likely a boot.

This is NOT a Bootleg, it is a 1970's Re-issue....

 

[Northern Soul Uk]

Apparently it has been said that apart from the recent (2015) boots, these were official Reissues by Atlantic records

[Northern Soul Uk]

Also strange about this, just noticed 2 years on, that the cat number on my copy is 65c-9290-MO? Why the 'MO'? the others I have seen don't have this?

[45cellar]

MO = Monarch press

BW = Bestway press

SP = Specialty records

PL  = Plastic products

As used by Atlantic denoting pressing plant.

There is a full list at Anoraks Corner

[Northern Soul Uk]

Excellent, thank you Roger. Good to know that the one I have is not an original, but not a boot either , but an official reissue

Edited September 15, 2016 by Northern Soul UK

[Ez]

On 9/12/2014 at 02:31, soulperson said:

mine has 65c-9290-21 mr stamp in circle triangle 58721, m&7 sideways, then at.........that was so difficult to see even with my specs on!!!!! old age.who'd have it.hope this helps.sue

Is this a boot? styrene copy like the one above 65c-9290-21 (mr) Δ58721, m&7 sideways, then at. found for cheap in the US, just hoping there is an original styrene copy. probably not but then how did they get a 1965 delta number?

[Rick Scott]

Just jumping on the thred with this one, Many years ago i had a copy of this and it was more of a Browny Yellowy  colour where the Yellow is on the Atco label, it was an issue, was this one the Jamaican copies as mentioned i wonder ? The copy i still own now is a White Demo (Vinyl) It Has Paul Rowans Name Scratched on the run out ( I traded a few records off him backing in the day)  he put his name on a lot of his records,The record number on the run out is scratched out both sides and i understand from Paul it was  done at the time it was played covered up (The Levers - "My hearts wide open" i think it was) It has all the correct markings left on it, Strawberry with an s in it, an AT and an M or W depending on what way up you look at it and a small LW, It also has PLUG SIDE on the A Side Label for " Bell Bottom Slacks" etc.

[Ez]

is this original styrene copy 65c-9290-21 (mr) Δ58721, m&7 sideways, then at, delta number appears to be 1965. i've gotten mixed input, thanks

Edited April 12, 2018 by ez

[Chris Barr]

On ‎06‎/‎10‎/‎2007 at 14:49, John Al said:

 

 

Only bootlegged once to my knowledge mate and very early on. Boot had Monarch Records stamp (MR) and delta you mention above with triangle in front of it. Was styrene too.

 

You could be in luck.

 

John.

 

On ‎06‎/‎10‎/‎2007 at 19:31, Pete S said:

 

 

you may have just had one thats been played with a rough stylus Mark, both the vinyl and the styrene boots are of excellent quality, honestly!

I used to have a one sided emidisc of this that just said Freddie Jones - My Hearts Wide Open on the label. Used to carry around at school for no reason whatsoever, well ok, so that when people came up to you and asked what the record was you instantly became Charlie Big Potatoes

Covered up as Freddie Jones - My Hearts Wide Open

 

[Frankie Crocker]

Stop. Stop. Stop... Crazy Baby... Will this thread never end? Great record, but best bought as a white demo on vinyl if you want an original. As Charlie Big Potatoes informs us, the disc was booted on vinyl as an issue. The original issue has been booted/reissued so lookalike styrene discs appear very similar at a glance, but closer inspection reveals significant differences highlighted in this thread and Manship’s fifth edition. A cursory look at Popsike will also clarify the key details.