Youngsters On The Northern Scene A Good Thing?

[Guest soul99 easylay]

I have a 14 year old daughter who has grown up listening to my Northern (and Mod) sounds and has moved throught the phases I'm sure most kids of NS fans do starting at hating moving to tolerating and finally to accepting / liking.

She has pretty mainstream tastes (Frank Wilson, most Jackie Wilson, a lot of the played out stuff - in fact Dobie Gray's "The In Crowd" is her favourite), she has even asked if she can come to a Northern night to see what all the fuss is about (and has even promised not to laugh at me cutting a rug!). She recently told me about one of her mates who is a massive 14 y/o NS fan.

Nothing pleases me more than seeing youngsters coming to NS nights and getting up and doing a bit of leg waving to their favourite tracks.

But there are drawbacks - witness the attached!

Moving with the times or sacrilege? Discuss.

Don't panic it's only a one minute clip

Freemasons___Nothing_But_A_Heartache_CLIP.mp3

[Codfromderby]

thought i was on to a loser with my three kids, my oldest likes this new rnb stuff and when ive pointed out that the backing to 50 percent or whatever kenyas west is actually a classic soul tune, she replies so what i dont care, however my middle one aged nearly 11 asked for a cd for his ps2 in his room, on it he wanted the ramones and picture me gone and i,m stepping out of the picture, my youngest aged nearly 7 asked at a freinds house if they had had "albeta" when having a disco, yes she wanted these memories a tune played a lot in our ouse,

also to those who mentor students, northern is mentioned in some social study type courses and the odd track played at a student night, although the students looked on in either wonder or horror as two late 40,s bald big blokes took over the whole dance floor whilst dancing to judy street

[Guest soul99 easylay]

thought i was on to a loser with my three kids, my oldest likes this new rnb stuff and when ive pointed out that the backing to 50 percent or whatever kenyas west is actually a classic soul tune, she replies so what i dont care, however my middle one aged nearly 11 asked for a cd for his ps2 in his room, on it he wanted the ramones and picture me gone and i,m stepping out of the picture, my youngest aged nearly 7 asked at a freinds house if they had had "albeta" when having a disco, yes she wanted these memories a tune played a lot in our ouse,

also to those who mentor students, northern is mentioned in some social study type courses and the odd track played at a student night, although the students looked on in either wonder or horror as two late 40,s bald big blokes took over the whole dance floor whilst dancing to judy street

I know what you mean, it does my head in when my daughter tells me she's heard a new song in the charts she likes, then I'll play her the original that they have either sampled or covered - she was amazed when I played her The Just Brothers "Sliced Tomatoes" after she'd been listening to Fat Boy Slim.

The thing that gets me - is that I expected a bigger response to this thread than it's got, it has had 75 views and only your reply, I reckon that there have been a few listens of the track and that some of these old Soulies are secret trance fans and don't mind the fact that The Flirtations are now "larging" it!

[Guest Carl Dixon]

When I first collected my soul records in 1973, my dad used to listen to them and commented on occassion. He always managed to get the subject matter back to the war days where he danced his nights way to big band stuff. 'Proper musicians' he used to say. 'Up right bass' and and all that . He was 50 then. Now I am that age and do the same. It does not surprise me that the children of today are not interested in old material. However, when they are in their 40's they will be begging to hear those old melodies, just like I am now to hear big band and stuff my parents liked when I was a kid. It is all relevant. Nostalgia is a thing of the past and as long as we still go there and pay our respects, that is all that matters. I think we expect too much from others with our passion. They just don't get it....or worse still, do not feature in any of those memories we all have stored away within us, that come to life when we hear a particular song.

I quite like The Flirtations re mix. It is refreshing and different. A bit like a new fizzy drink from Tesco, but you cannot beat The Real Thing!

[Guest mel brat]

...the students looked on in either wonder or horror as two late 40,s bald big blokes took over the whole dance floor whilst dancing to judy street...

Edited September 26, 2007 by mel brat

[Mike]

I know what you mean, it does my head in when my daughter tells me she's heard a new song in the charts she likes, then I'll play her the original that they have either sampled or covered - she was amazed when I played her The Just Brothers "Sliced Tomatoes" after she'd been listening to Fat Boy Slim.

The thing that gets me - is that I expected a bigger response to this thread than it's got, it has had 75 views and only your reply, I reckon that there have been a few listens of the track and that some of these old Soulies are secret trance fans and don't mind the fact that The Flirtations are now "larging" it!

maybe muted response as sure its been posted up before ?

on similar sort of recent thing there's a post here regarding new release by group called casino which drew a bit of flak

here are

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/index.p...6&hl=casino

anyone ever tried doing a list of recent covers ?

think be quite lengthy as seems to be at least one popping up every 6 months or so

[Guest kent soul club]

Both our girls love Northern. Probably cos they 've been hearing it since in the womb!

They're 10 & 13 now, and I keep expecting the older one to move on to other things , but she doesn't. Although they listen to other stuff (and so do we) they just know that soul is special.

Jo (the 13 year old) went to a school disco at the end of last term, and she phoned me to come and get her early 'cos the music was crap. Respect!

[Guest andyrattigan]

Am I a youngster? I am only 33. Compared to a lot of you grandads on the scene I'm a spring chicken .

[Guest soul99 easylay]

I quite like The Flirtations re mix. It is refreshing and different. A bit like a new fizzy drink from Tesco, but you cannot beat The Real Thing!

Good on you Carl, having the bottle to say that you actually like it - when I posted this thread it was done kind of tongue in cheek -when I furst heard it I was aghast, I thought it was sacrilige, but after hearing it more and more I lightened up - I was telling Godzilla about this track and said "It's so bad I actually am starting to like it now", but, well I am actually ok with it completely now, mainly because I love the Flirtations (and most female soul vocal groups actually), so hearing it tranced up with extra horns isn't such a bad thing after all?

I don't know, I'm just so capricious I suppose?

Re the age thing - I'm 38, so I suppose I'm kind of a youngster on the soul scene aren't I? (Or is that me just desperately trying to remain young???)

[Spacehopper]

i think the remix sounds good if you like new dance music and overall its a good thing lets face it its not the first time and wont be the last time...music has always looked back and stole bits of quality tunes...and as little roy says in reggae "imitation wont live long,origination will be strong !"...at least if you play a crap venue/pub full of "normal" people you can play the original instead of a boring motown classic like baby love !!

i think its good when youngsters get into northern..ive seen them look on dancers at soul nites like theyre from mars but a bit later they are tryin to copy there moves and even doin break dance moves some of which are not all that different...and its great at a nighter seeing grown up kids of soulies doin the right moves..

[Guest johnm]

This is th track list of a CD my boy (22) plays in the car

Phillip Mitchell's his favourite

Vernon Greene & Medalions Look At Me Look At Me

The O'Jays Hold On

The Invitations Look On The Good Side

The Temptations I want a love I can see

Supremes He's All I've Got

Rosebuds Say youll be mine

Melvin Davis Find A Quiet Place

Martha Jean Love How To Succeed In Love

Joe Murphy So Blue (Without You)

Joy Lovejoy In Orbit

Gladys Knight & the pips BABY BABY DON'T WASTE MY TIME

Vivian Carroll Oh Yeah Yeah Yeah

Brenda Holloway Think It Over Before You Break My Heart

Vernon Garrett If I Could Turn Back The Hands

Venicia Wilson This Time I'm Loving You

The Temptations There's A Definite Change In You

Prince Phillip Mitchell I'm So Happy

SOUL GENERATION HOLD ON

Eula Cooper Standing by love

Frankie Beverley & Butlers If That's What You Wanted

Modern Redcaps Never Too Young

Showmen Our Love Will Grow

Willie Hutch love runs out

Jackie Trent You Baby

Barbara Lewis I Remember The Feeling

[Guest Dawnie]

I have a 14 year old daughter who has grown up listening to my Northern (and Mod) sounds and has moved throught the phases I'm sure most kids of NS fans do starting at hating moving to tolerating and finally to accepting / liking.

She has pretty mainstream tastes (Frank Wilson, most Jackie Wilson, a lot of the played out stuff - in fact Dobie Gray's "The In Crowd" is her favourite), she has even asked if she can come to a Northern night to see what all the fuss is about (and has even promised not to laugh at me cutting a rug!). She recently told me about one of her mates who is a massive 14 y/o NS fan.

Nothing pleases me more than seeing youngsters coming to NS nights and getting up and doing a bit of leg waving to their favourite tracks.

But there are drawbacks - witness the attached!

Moving with the times or sacrilege? Discuss.

Don't panic it's only a one minute clip

I quite like it and can't wait for my lil one (22yrs) to be listening to it and hear his old mom singing along in the background

Luv Dawniedingle xx

[macca]

If we're to believe what imberboy says, children shouldn't be listening to their parents' music, otherwise we'd have seriously iconic urban tribes like chavs listening to whatever chav progenitors listen to. Perish the thought. On a more serious note, I never had kids, so I can't comment.

[Wally Francis]

When i had my 40th i asked my 2 kids if they wanted to bring a few friends along with them and told them that it was going to be an across the board northern soul night, they both agreed and it was great to watch 6 kid's aged between 11 & 15 dancing to everything played they were drenched in sweat and thought it was fantastic, and so did many of the other people who had been invited, many commenting on how great it was to see young un's dancing to soul music. And subsequently i have taken them to Piercebridge in the past and they thought that was great aswell, so come on get your young un's out with you it's fantastic to see there faces as they watch and try to copy the people dancing.

[Billy Freemantle]

I think we expect too much from others with our passion. They just don't get it....or worse still, do not feature in any of those memories we all have stored away within us, that come to life when we hear a particular song.

Spot on. Carl.

Nobody really hears what we hear when we listen to music. Each generation has to have its own sound and I'd be worried if younger people just wanted what we listened to. This is not to say that all music is of equal value. "Sugar Sugar" by the Archies was exactly that. Just another Jonathan King confection . (Like the Nosmo King thing!) As you say, Carl, the Bing Band stuff can be astounding. Incidentally, did your old man like the 'real' Fletcher Henderson and Benny Carter stuff or the more erzatz white sound of people like Harry James?

Edited September 27, 2007 by Billy Freemantle

[Billy Freemantle]

If we're to believe what imberboy says, children shouldn't be listening to their parents' music, otherwise we'd have seriously iconic urban tribes like chavs listening to whatever chav progenitors listen to. Perish the thought.

Can't find imberboy's post, macca, and Imberboy is probably dealing with Chabby Dodds at the moment. But he's probably got it pretty right.

[Guest Carl Dixon]

JWVB - Thanks.

I remember the change in the 1970's when the 45rpm became a 12", which I did not like. I think it halved the number of songs I heard on the dance floor in one fell swoop. Plus, the synth became of age and worse still, it was soul music using it more and more. The open hi hat I hated, especially if all the way through the song. Becuase 60's music was perfomed without the aid of too many electronics, it sounds dated to some ears these days. To me, I like that feel and can live with it. We all percieve the music of our youth to be the best and are hopeful we can influence others to enjoy it the same as us. But, like I said earlier, there are so many memories tied up with these songs that reak havoc with our emotions when we hear them. Right now I am on my nostalia trip - caused by my overnight shift at work. Prior to soul music, I bought what some would consider cheesy music - songs that had melody and clever arrangments. Songs written by Roger Cook and Roger Greenaway for example. Things like 'My baby loves lovin'/The White Plains, or 'Who do you think you are/Candlewick Green'. Those songs made me who I am well before I knew American soul. Some of my firends used to laugh at me, but with conviction, they are good songs and deserve respect. I try and arrange my songs with those early days in mind. The same with my soul compositions. I want to hear arrangments like I heard and that influenced me, because I know deep down they have a pedigree, No matter how old or young we are, we find it difficult to accept new music unless it has some remnants of what we understand to be good music. And there lies the question: what is the definition of good music? I am sure Mozart would have an issue with Lennon/McCartney songs....maybe.

I guess on this site we have a wide variety of ages and experience which I am sure will be at conflict some time. I know Pearly Gates from The Flirtations and I am convinced she will be thrilled to hear this updated version of a 60's number which was recorded in London. Trivia: she told me when they arrived in the UK, they went straight to Decca records and met Wayne Bickerton (who I think was a member or wrote for The Rubettes) outside the building. He asked 'do you sing?' and that is how they signed up to the label.

The past needs the future, like modern Venice needs those under water foundations, otherwise it crumbles. But give me a live drum fill, a horn section and guitars anytime.....

Edited September 27, 2007 by Carl Dixon

[Jellybean]

Well i think its BRILL with more and more youngsters turning up at venues all over the place maybe some just to see what its like some get bitten by it some don,t.

I,ve got two daughters and a son who,s 25 Daniel he loves it with a passion so does Gemma my eldest at 22 she entered the dance comp at Prestatyn in March should have won it hands down and it was,nt just my opinion either loads of others said too!! She did the lot backdrops....flips.....kicks....spins my youngest Laura at 21 loves it too but not as much!!

Daniel raves on about it to his mates and a few have turned up at venues and enjoyed it we,ve since gained a new recruit to the soul scene Alex only 20 he loves it and told us he hates the modern shite that hits the charts nowadays

Helen xx

Edited September 27, 2007 by JELLYBEAN

[macca]

Can't find imberboy's post, macca, and Imberboy is probably dealing with Chabby Dodds at the moment. But he's probably got it pretty right.

It was on a another thread billy. I was just making a tongue in cheek comment about all these 'iconic' urban tribes, & rightly or wrongly connecting it to this thread. in the 70's I belonged to the northern soul community, dressing a certain way, livin' the nightlife etc; my father listened to lena horne, shirley bassey & irish country & western. buggered if I was gonna listen that, I considered it hideous & still do, with the exception of lena horne of course. who is chabby dodds? please forgive me if it's a daft question, but I live in a land that must divest itself of its culture in order to be on a par with blighty. I'm looking at my coat.

[Tomangoes]

There has been plenty of cases of 'classic' Northern Soul re-worked from one era to another, for example the Bobbettes - Happy go lucky me RCA/Mayhew. Sometimes its better, sometimes its not.

For some of our senior members (not me btw) they may recall the outrageous 1960's re-working of 'Where have all the flowers gone' on Okeh..........................

Young kids are missing out big time on what the Northern Soul scene could offer, as there aint an alternative scene that can match it. The music is only part of it. Most of us came into this scene from 'easy listening' records like the Flasher/Interplay/Ghost in my house etc, so if it takes Fat boy slim to re-record ST etc, so what, nothings new in the big picture.

Ed

[Guest Andy Kempster]

my seven year old loves northern

his favourite track is jimmy mack, my world is on fire and he now has his own record box

i gave him about 20 stardusts to mess about with and a few lessons on the decks and now he happily spins some tunes while i have a beer and watch the footy results

indoctrination, what a wonderful thing..

out of the mouths of babes......"dad, wouldnt life be boring without northern soul" uttered from his lips only last sunday after a 1 hour session of the decks

he's even almost got spins down to a tee....all hail the next generation

[Guest soul99 easylay]

out of the mouths of babes......"dad, wouldnt life be boring without northern soul" uttered from his lips only last sunday after a 1 hour session of the decks

he's even almost got spins down to a tee....all hail the next generation

Couldn't put it better myself, I reckon your lads quote should go down in history alongside Shankly's "Football isn't a matter of life and death, it's more important than that"! Life would indeed be VERY boring without Northern Soul - I reckon you've got one very bright little lad on your hands there!

Personall, I love seeing youngsters on the scene - it was only last year (at Jinxy's Lakeside night in Scarborough) that I was watching some very impressive floor moves from a lad who couldn't be much more than 18, who'd come with (I assume) his Mum and Dad, and he was all decked out in bowling shirt, brogues and bags - he cut quite a dash and it was a joy to watch.

So come on all you parents, get with the indoctrination of your kids, at this rate we can keep the scene going for years more to come (just don't play any of that bloody crappy modern soul to them though!) That's just cruel!

[Godzilla]

Good on you Carl, having the bottle to say that you actually like it - when I posted this thread it was done kind of tongue in cheek -when I furst heard it I was aghast, I thought it was sacrilige, but after hearing it more and more I lightened up - I was telling Godzilla about this track and said "It's so bad I actually am starting to like it now", but, well I am actually ok with it completely now, mainly because I love the Flirtations (and most female soul vocal groups actually), so hearing it tranced up with extra horns isn't such a bad thing after all?

It's horrid.

[Guest soul99 easylay]

It's horrid.

I'll email the full 7 minute track to you if you want Godz - it's a grower

[Godzilla]

I'll email the full 7 minute track to you if you want Godz - it's a grower

Don't you dare!

Anyway I'll just delete the email without opening it. Then I'll search the net for similar stuff to send you. You know, familar sounding tunes with cheesy "contemporary" beats behind them. I'll start with Jive Bunny and Starsound. And Hooked on Classics.

This is surely the noughties equivalent and nothing more

Godz

[John A]

My girls think its pretty much crap..GOOD! I dont want em tagging along with me and think its better they're out with people their own age anyway.

[Guest andyrattigan]

Spot on. Carl.

Nobody really hears what we hear when we listen to music. Each generation has to have its own sound and I'd be worried if younger people just wanted what we listened to.

I can understand that lots of people who frequented the big clubs of the 70's have a lot of strong memories linked to soul music but I don't think you can say that gives them a monopoly on the depth of emotion that they feel as opposed to younger folk. I was never at Wigan, Blackpool Mecca, Stafford, etc. etc but I grew up in the 90's listening to Northern and was only a handful of youngsters in the west of Ireland into it. I have wonderful memories of clubs in Dublin and travelling over to England to attend allnighters on my own and with others.

I am still as into this music as ever and now that I live in England get out as much as I can and still collect the records as well. I am as into Soul as anyone who has been on the scene for thirty years plus. Living in county Mayo, west of Ireland in the 80's/90's was very restrictive in terms of accessing this wonderful music. It was trips to Dublin for Kent albums and sojourns to Manchester for 45's and allnighters.

[Guest nubes]

Well my nearly 12 year old loves it!!!..he loves Prestayn with a passion....he is also proud to be a card carrying member of the Rugby Soul Club.... this is music that he has grown up with.., ....dont get me wrong...he keeps upto date with all the mainstream stuff..but luvs his old stylee soul music.....Delxxx

[Dylan]

My daughter is 15 months old and she is developing some pretty nifty dance moves.

She listens to a lot of soul music and hasn't complained once.

[Guest eedeecee]

It does not surprise me that the children of today are not interested in old material.

you need some young blood to keep any scene vital...especially the soul scene. But I do not agree with you that 'children of today' are not interested in old material. There's proof worldwide that good quality music is always being rediscovered by new and old fans alike. Why should it be different with NS? Just look up eBay, I cannot believe that all people bidding on the old records are 50+ collectors!! Come on...

Edited September 27, 2007 by eedeecee

[Guest thenorwichdancer]

it doesnt matter how old you are, how rich you are, where you live, what school you went to, or what your friends do.....

if you have soul in your heart you will love NS music and the NS scene.

[hipshaker 05]

i like the remix clip .... breathes energy into the track, and as someone said, should appeal to those who like modern dance music.

and of course i do like the original.

[Guest soul99 easylay]

Don't you dare!

Anyway I'll just delete the email without opening it. Then I'll search the net for similar stuff to send you. You know, familar sounding tunes with cheesy "contemporary" beats behind them. I'll start with Jive Bunny and Starsound. And Hooked on Classics.

This is surely the noughties equivalent and nothing more

Godz

Where does that leave Frank Popp Ensemble then?

I've heard "Hip teens" and "Breakaway" played at the Lakeside and 99 Soul Club (at Scarborough Grand) - they're both modern covers (and bloody good ones too), so how come they are generally more accepted?

(I know the answer to this one, I'm just waiting for anyone to take the bait)

[good angel]

it doesnt matter how old you are, how rich you are, where you live, what school you went to, or what your friends do.....

if you have soul in your heart you will love NS music and the NS scene.

Well said, Lady Commando

Regards,Kev

[Guest WPaulVanDyk]

Well as said you need young people to keep the scene going and even i am young at 26 compared to you lot who are what 45 and over well an average age. I like all music and would happily go out with people my age if it was an Indie gig or whatever but i can never go away from going out with my dad to see his friends who i get to know and new ones who love Northern soul which i am more into now then i was 10 years ago

[good angel]

A young lad come running up to me at a nighter this year slightly out of breath and said, me and my girl friend want to know what was that last record,its bloody fantastic,I told him it was Rita And The Tiaras, Gone With the Wind, Dore Records,he had never heard it before,and asked how much it would cost to buy,so I told him the price,I said why dont you get it on a CD,and he wanted to know if he get one from the record bar.

That just reminded me of myself years ago So Northern rare Soul,still makes you have goose bumbs,and you have to get on that dance floor

Kev

Edited September 30, 2007 by good angel