Northern Soul H Q Outside The Uk ?

[Ralf Mehnert]

We did this with Italian Scooters both the Mod scene and the soul scene are ours but we have others, Punk, Teddy Boys, New romantics, Skinheads, Goths, Chavs, there are many more iconic Great British youth cults but none from Europe?

You do not respect the dance floor and the majority do not respect the music.

[Guest Una Scot-Oz]

"In the UK we revere the dance floor and worship the music"

I love that statement! Good posts....not sure about the socks and sandals, but the dancing makes up for it!

[Ralf Mehnert]

We did this with Italian Scooters both the Mod scene and the soul scene are ours but we have others, Punk, Teddy Boys, New romantics, Skinheads, Goths, Chavs, there are many more iconic Great British youth cults but none from Europe?

You do not respect the dance floor and the majority do not respect the music.

OI IMBERBOY,

....thats not true. Techno/Rave was big over here before someone noticed it in the U.K.. It was a whole youth culture with own magazines, big events, top djs, clothes and so on...even if I don`t like it and never been into it.

[Guest stromberg]

What if the rare soul scene evolved/developed in such a way that the central focus of the scene, geographically speaking , was centred somewhere OUTSIDE the UK ;

with the biggest (and youngest) crowds, leading collectors and DJ's , best venues and events , most talented dancers located elsewhwere ....

Would that be far too unbearable to contemplate ????

I guess this is a complete sience fiction scenario, it will never happen in the next 100 years.

Surely there are healthy "scenes" and enjoyable events in many countries across europe, but no country will ever come close regarding the pure quantity (and of course quality) of the UK soul scene, be it djs, collectors, dealers or -yes- dancers. The whole history is not repeatable, it is so deeply rooted in britain that it's simply not comparable to other countries, so why do it?! I think this is just stating the obvious.

And I guess this was the topic, so, if you imagine the "HQ" of the soul scene in another country, you would be in the situation european soul fans have been in and still are in

Apart from that it makes no real sense to discuss (sub)cultural heritage of the UK and other european countries. My opinion.

I guess one should simply say that there are people in europe who are really into the music and that we are just trying to enjoy ourselves, organizing events, collecting records etc. blah blah

That's it, I guess I can say that the vast majority of the people I know has no real interest in simply copying the UK scene and its history. It's the opposite, there are SOME things about it that are a complete turn off, i.e. politics, ego dj's, people judging records by when it was played by which deejay, 6t's only, oldies only events. and most people I know from germany are trying to avoid to copy this..

When I am in the UK I always enjoyed the events immensely, but I have absolutely no problem enjoying myself at other european events. But then again I stopped going to scooter events in 1991

best wishes from germany,

Stefan

[jocko]

First before answering below and on topic where exactly is this mythical NS HQ in the UK these days, that suggests a direction and a strategy and a united (at top level at least) scene, I certainly don't see that, I only see a load of egotistical local councillors doing their own thing.

Maybe time again to say there is no Northern Scene in the UK, just loads of local scenes for local people.

we based Northernsoul music and made a youth culture. The youth culture or scene called northernsoul started in my back yard with a music that was of course originally from the states.

Agreed, but WTF was Northern last a youth culture? What relevance does that have to now?

We did not shadow or copy a culture we, GB formed it into our own and gave it a fashion, a way of living and a flavour that far exceeds its origin. It became ingrained into the lives of large group of people who formed a sub culture.

You say above that we originated it, but here you say it exceeds its origin, if its original how does it have an origin, what is that origin and in what way has it exceeded it?

We do have our fair share of UK Soul records, not sure if there are any European ones, apart from a few that have been translated or sang in local tongues.

WTF has this got to do with this debate, how many were recorded specifically because of the Northern Youth culture you are supposedly talking about here, other than the embarrassing casino classics type, are you saying you are proud of these?

I would say we have far more UK Northern records than UK Soul records, although there are some fine UK soul records. I assume you are meaning Northern or it doesn't make any sense as above first, some of us are happy to have lost these along the way.

Can you name one European sub or youth culture that isn't a copy of some one else? No you can't because there aren't any. I am not saying you are unimaginative I am saying your culture does not allow youthful expression, not my fault but it is a massive cultural difference that separates the UK from main land Europe.

Were Mods not based on European style, scooters suits etc. Not maybe the music but the style, did we not steal that? This was part of the evolution of a culture surely that predated the NS scene.

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's true and just because I say it doesn't mean I'm a racist!!!

No but the way you express it means you come over incredibly xenophobic and arrogant, much the way most people think of the English. I assume after all your time in Germany you speak fluent German and have many German friends?

. These can usually be seen holding a bottle of the latest alcohol pop or half a beer and launching them selves across the dance floor in a drunken state whilst spilling the drinks on to the dance floor. Sad yes, true yes

You do not respect the dance floor and the majority do not respect the music.In the UK we revere the dance floor and worship the music, that's not me making things up that's me pointing out the reality of European Northernsoul.

From my experience that's hardly just a European problem nowadays re dancefloore and I would be interested in further clarification of just how people revere the music, my experience is many NS people will listen to anything but outside the scene and many more still don't connect it with a wider soul scene, that's not a problem for me but its not revering the music, its revering their Lost Youth Culture as the NS is nowadays.

The spiritual home for NS will always be the UK agreed, good thing is Europeans are taking the good sides, the music, comradeship etc and leaving the shit. In particular the Europeans seem to get the point it's a soul music scene and therefore the crap that's been played over the years is getting lost along the way. Well done I say.

The Germans, Swedes and Italians I have met are every bit as passionate about the music, much more knowledgeable than many about the music AND its roots/history and are very respectful of the origins of the scene . Which when you read your two posts is really more than some deserve.

[ImberBoy]

Una and Ralph, I thank you both for not attacking me and allowing me to give a point of view without jumping on me. Danke.

I was a very proud to be part of Germanys "Northernsoul Family" and much honored to be accepted on the German Scooter Scene.

The German boys and girls who are the back bone of the German Scene are ultra fans with a depth of musical knowledge that dwarfed mine, Carsten Fox, Michael Wiherhand, Michael Fuchs, Bio, "Sunny" Martin Driever, Champ, Michael Wink and Gerd Baum just to name a few who I respect and call my friends.

All mega DJ's but none can dance to save their lives LOL.

Alas in ordnung especially my socks, shorts and sandals! LOl

[ImberBoy]

Jocko my mother is German, my wife is German and my children have dual nationality. Wanna come to my house when the world cup is played, I'll show you xenophobic ya cheeky fookah.

The only person worthy of playing the xenophobe was Sir Patrick Moore, don't even pretend to call me a racist! How very very dare you.

[Ralf Mehnert]

Ralph, I thank you both for not attacking me and allowing me to give a point of view without jumping on me. Danke.

I was a very proud to be part of Germanys "Northernsoul Family" and much honored to be accepted on the German Scooter Scene.

The German boys and girls who are the back bone of the German Scene are ultra fans with a depth of musical knowledge that dwarfed mine, Carsten Fox, Michael Wiherhand, Michael Fuchs, Bio, "Sunny" Martin Driever, Champ, Michael Wink and Gerd Baum just to name a few who I respect and call my friends.

All mega DJ's but none can dance to save their lives LOL.

Hi Timber,

there`s no reason to attack you...but things changed over the years and maybe you only attend the scooterists-orientated venues in the early 90`s. There is much more to do nowadays than standing with a bottle of beer on the dancefloor.

You can visit very well promoted Weekenders in Frankfurt, Bamberg, Nuremberg and next week first time in Hamburg. There are so many nice and great DJs with brilliant collections over here you don`t know. Just a few of them started in the scooterists-scene (I know what you mean..).

Think most of us were influenced by the U.K. Soul Scene in the mid 80`s/early 90`s...but meanwhile most of us are around the 35-45 and we build up our own scene (nearly without the whole politics like in the U.K.) apart from the scooter-thing.

...and my arse...the DJs can`t dance...

Ralf

[Steve G]

[In the UK we revere the dance floor and worship the music, that's not me making things up that's me pointing out the reality of European Northernsoul.

Hi ya Imberboy,

Have to recall a conversation that I've had with Sam, on the way back from playing abroad - and that was that when playing abroad we were able to break more new sounds in a one - two hour set than we would ever dare to back home (with the exception of a handful of venues). So I am not sure where you are coming from on this point - unless you mean a lot of UK people seem to revere the dancefloor, on a sound they've heard a 1,000 times ; overseas we kept everyone dancing with "first plays".

[Guest Roccia]

I'm an Italian promoter & DJ (ok, a sort of... ), and I'm working hard to build a healthy northern soul scene over here, with some noticeable results IMVHO, but what Imberboy said is the truth.

UK is the one and only homecountry of this scene... We can have good events across Europe, but the true essence of NS is undoubtably British. That's a tribute I'm always happy to pay, maybe because I'm so anglophile, but that's it...

My ex-wife had a T-shirt with "NORTHERN SOUL IS BRITISH AS FISH & CHIPS" on front...

Definitely true.

Roccia

[Ralf Mehnert]

UK is the one and only homecountry of this scene... We can have good events across Europe, but the true essence of NS is undoubtably British.

Roccia

Your right Roccia...Northern Soul (as a scene) is a british thing.

....but the music is international.

I can`t say I`m anglophile. I love Soul and I`m german. It`s not my fault...(my parents started the whole trouble 37 years ago).

[Reg]

I'm an Italian promoter & DJ (ok, a sort of... ), and I'm working hard to build a healthy northern soul scene over here, with some noticeable results IMVHO, but what Imberboy said is the truth.

UK is the one and only homecountry of this scene... We can have good events across Europe, but the true essence of NS is undoubtably British. That's a tribute I'm always happy to pay, maybe because I'm so anglophile, but that's it...

My ex-wife had a T-shirt with "NORTHERN SOUL IS BRITISH AS FISH & CHIPS" on front...

Definitely true.

Roccia

I would suggest that our soul scenes are different but enjoyable in their own way I love my fish and chips but on the other hand give me a nice lasagne any day of the week I've been to a couple of european dos and the main problem is they just can't replicate that seediness that we have in many a venue Your venues are usually too modern and cosmopolitan and there are usually doors on the ladies toilet cubicles which is kind of hard to get ued to when you're used to places like Sheridans You also have far too many attractive younger people who don't get too upset if they get up to a record and realise it's the instrumental version nor do you see many taking holdalls with 3 spare pare of underpants to a soul night!

[Guest Roccia]

I would suggest that our soul scenes are different but enjoyable in their own way I love my fish and chips but on the other hand give me a nice lasagne any day of the week I've been to a couple of european dos and the main problem is they just can't replicate that seediness that we have in many a venue Your venues are usually too modern and cosmopolitan and there are usually doors on the ladies toilet cubicles which is kind of hard to get ued to when you're used to places like Sheridans You also have far too many attractive younger people who don't get too upset if they get up to a record and realise it's the instrumental version nor do you see many taking holdalls with 3 spare pare of underpants to a soul night!

Reg there are good and bad things here and there. You in the Old Blighty have something we'll never have even in a million years: a certain type of venues... I've been to Stoke King's Hall, Brighouse Ritz Ballroom, Cleethorpes Beachcomber... Those places have an atmosphere that we in Euorpe could never recreate in our 70s-80s style discos, with low ceilings, marble tiles dancefloor, cheap sofas, and the whole lot...

[jocko]

Jocko my mother is German, my wife is German and my children have dual nationality. Wanna come to my house when the world cup is played, I'll show you xenophobic ya cheeky fookah.

The only person worthy of playing the xenophobe was Sir Patrick Moore, don't even pretend to call me a racist! How very very dare you.

Show me where I called you a racist, I was quite clear on my wording as to me that is a very serious accusation with no proof. To try and accuse me of that with no substance is bang out of order.

I actually did not call you a xenephobe either, I said the way you expressed your points on this debate was xenephobic, you are clearly proving you are not by your home life, maybe therefore think before you speak next time.

I did not even attack you personally as you imply in your previous post, I challenged your logic, as are others are now. You still have to answer any of my points.

It is difficult enough to debate on here without causing offence, please just stick to facts in future.

Jock O'Connor

[macca]

so, europe has to free itself from its culture, eh?

this could well be the

biggest emancipation movement since the days of wilberforce.

perhaps the time has come for you to help Europe

throw off its shackles too.

keep 'em coming good sir, they're a joy to behold.

[Guest Black Gold of the Sun]

Reg there are good and bad things here and there. You in the Old Blighty have something we'll never have even in a million years: a certain type of venues... I've been to Stoke King's Hall, Brighouse Ritz Ballroom, Cleethorpes Beachcomber... Those places have an atmosphere that we in Euorpe could never recreate in our 70s-80s style discos, with low ceilings, marble tiles dancefloor, cheap sofas, and the whole lot...

Vive la differance matey Europe has its own thing goin on

Edited September 26, 2007 by Black Gold of the Sun

[ImberBoy]

Roccia, greetings brother!

I met a couple of Italians during recent Isle of Wight Scooter Rally and I asked if they knew you, sorry I forgot their names? They both said they did and I asked for my salutations to be passed on to you.

Long live Northernsoul and long live the diversity it brings, Jock lets not fall out......... I chalange you to a dance off, bring your white socks! XXX

[Reg]

Reg there are good and bad things here and there. You in the Old Blighty have something we'll never have even in a million years: a certain type of venues... I've been to Stoke King's Hall, Brighouse Ritz Ballroom, Cleethorpes Beachcomber... Those places have an atmosphere that we in Euorpe could never recreate in our 70s-80s style discos, with low ceilings, marble tiles dancefloor, cheap sofas, and the whole lot...

He he...when you mention discos like that it reminds me of teenage holidays in Rimini in the early 80s with Ryan paris-Dolce Vita playing everywhere, men with mullets and moustaches wearing espadrilles Happy days!! I must definitely come over to Italy soon...bin far too long

[Guest Roccia]

Roccia, greetings brother!

I met a couple of Italians during recent Isle of Wight Scooter Rally and I asked if they knew you, sorry I forgot their names? They both said they did and I asked for my salutations to be passed on to you.

Long live Northernsoul and long live the diversity it brings, Jock lets not fall out......... I chalange you to a dance off, bring your white socks! XXX

Hi Simon,

there were severals friends of mine at IOW this year, I don't know who you have met...

Why don't you come to our Isle of Elba rally next year...? Sorry... OT...

Ciao

Roccia

[Guest Roccia]

He he...when you mention discos like that it reminds me of teenage holidays in Rimini in the early 80s with Ryan paris-Dolce Vita playing everywhere, men with mullets and moustaches wearing espadrilles Happy days!! I must definitely come over to Italy soon...bin far too long

Strange world Reg... at that time you were spending your holidays in Rimni listening all those crappy "Festivalbar" stuff, and I was spending mine in East London, llistening those skinhead Oi! bands such as the 4 Skins and the Cockney Rejects...

[Reg]

Strange world Reg... at that time you were spending your holidays in Rimni listening all those crappy "Festivalbar" stuff, and I was spending mine in East London, llistening those skinhead Oi! bands such as the 4 Skins and the Cockney Rejects...

haha probably with my older brother!! Hey and my excuse was that I didn't know any better....we went to the adriatic for about 5 years on the run and I had some great times! especially as I got older as I'd got into the mod scene by then and there were scooters everywhere!!!

I swear I am not a secret Ryan Paris fan...honestly

[Guest Roccia]

haha probably with my older brother!! Hey and my excuse was that I didn't know any better....we went to the adriatic for about 5 years on the run and I had some great times! especially as I got older as I'd got into the mod scene by then and there were scooters everywhere!!!

I swear I am not a secret Ryan Paris fan...honestly

Reg do you remember the Slego venue (usually it was hosting the Sunday niter), the one with the balcony and the big clock on the ceiling...?

Ah... great memories from Rimini Mod Easter Rallies... Don't you fancy make the next one...? I'll dj there for sure...

Edited September 26, 2007 by Roccia

[Reg]

Reg do you remember the Slego venue (usually it was hosting the Sunday niter), the one with the balcony and the big clock on the ceiling...?

Ah... great memories from Rimini Mod Easter Rallies... Don't you fancy make the next one...? I'll dj there for sure...

Def thinking about coming next July for the Soul Weekender if it's on again....all I can remember about rimini is sunbeds, scooters and very large pizzas!!!! ...it's been 20 years

[Soulof]

Hiya mate! bet you're missing the brown ale and Asda by now!!

Mr B and I may be coming over to Gothenburg in November....send us some details would ya?

Cheers, Reggie x

* Would be grt to have you both over. Will send you details and also post up on S-Source in a near future

when all is sorted out. Bring some ASDA midget gems and winegums will you

[Modernsoulsucks]

Hi ya Imberboy,

Have to recall a conversation that I've had with Sam, on the way back from playing abroad - and that was that when playing abroad we were able to break more new sounds in a one - two hour set than we would ever dare to back home (with the exception of a handful of venues). So I am not sure where you are coming from on this point - unless you mean a lot of UK people seem to revere the dancefloor, on a sound they've heard a 1,000 times ; overseas we kept everyone dancing with "first plays".

Steve, I obviously can see your point but I've cleared the floor many a time wiyh 45s that went on to be huge such as Trannels, Johnnie Mae Matthews and Pat&Blenders. I don't care.

Now,you and Sam are respected names on the scene. Why not leave the rare oldies at home and play what you believe in.

ROD

[Steve G]

Steve, I obviously can see your point but I've cleared the floor many a time wiyh 45s that went on to be huge such as Trannels, Johnnie Mae Matthews and Pat&Blenders. I don't care.

Now,you and Sam are respected names on the scene. Why not leave the rare oldies at home and play what you believe in.

ROD

Good point, but always felt you need to balance competing interests, rather than just go off on a tangent for an hour.

[Simon M]

Good point, but always felt you need to balance competing interests, rather than just go off on a tangent for an hour.

If only there was a gig , where everyone did leave the big rare oldies behind