Just an observation really that has got me thinking is there a Rare Soul record mountain out there building up? as there seems to be a huge amount of records in constant circulation and being offered up for sale.

Recently I started to look at moving a few records on, swap, sell, trade type of thing to generate a bit of cash to buy other stuff etc. but when you actually start to look at the bigger picture there seems to be a huge amount of people selling records from the major dealers through to private collectors with a glut of similar titles on offer, on Soul Source alone the turnover of records on offer is incredible, add Ebay and other sites into the mix and the supply of records is vast, with the advent of Ebay in particular some records which were to a point rare and hard to find appear to have constantly surfaced through that channel on almost a daily basis now it seems in some cases there are simply too many copies of certain records on offer making the demand for them almost zero of course you are always going to get the big ticket items and rarer records which will sell and do have a worldwide market.

Has it got to the stage where there is a huge backlog of records which infact nobody wants anymore? I know several people who have vast amounts of records who trade in them with box upon box of 45's which at times are proving difficult to sell, some of the major dealers must be sitting on thousands of records many of which must be just sitting there unclaimed.

The choice out there at present seems to be vast and is far more a buyers market than ever before, records which once were desired and less common are turning out to be far less rare than we once thought, again the indemand tunes will sell forever and a day which we see from the many auctions out there but if you look under the surface there is without question a huge mountain of records to choose from.

Some records which come up on Soul Source for example you think wow nice tune! and they struggle to sell or gain very little interest, often the original asking price is dropped and I'm sure many deals are done this way, records listed on other sites and lists seem to be either re listed if they don't sell or there is more than one copy in stock or on offer which repeat every so often and so it goes.

There is alway's going to be a demand for Rare Soul records, the passion and the desire to own records is the key to keep the wheel in motion but it seems to me that just because a record is valued at x,y,z it can sometimes be a very different story when you come to try and sell certain records? of course demand, style, taste and collecting patterns change as time goes by, certain records will alway's hold their book price and often improve in value but others flutuate, many drop and others it would seem simply go off the scale and join the excess of vinyl out there.

For many of us I'm sure it's about the tune, desire to own it and simply down to the music rather than it's value and should never be treated as an investment, easy to perhaps say but a bit of a shock to the stystem if you ever deside to sell part or all of your collection to find that some of your treasured tunes are infact not that easy to sell?or less rare than you perhaps thought, is the market flooded? are there more records out there than people collecting them? or is there an excess of good records on offer? like I said just an observation.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

Edited August 12, 200717 yr by Mark Bicknell

Mark

I think there are a number of factors at work here

1) American record dealers (not necessarily soul specialists) are due to the net much more aware of which records are popular/ in demand over here much more quickly - resulting in more copies coming up for general sale - rather than in the past where uk dealers generally had the time through their contacts to stockpile copies of these indemand tracks and then control their release onto the market - and also controlling the prices.

2) The huge inflation of prices in the uk over the past few years resulting in entry level soul 45s for the new collector starting @ £15-20 - can only be doing one thing - putting off potential new collectors!!

3)Given that this is what is happening there will be a huge reduction in demand for low - mid price 45s which many of the long term collectors already have & the trophy hunter collectors will never want.

So yes there appear to be large numbers of low- mid range 45s with a notional book value - but with a diminishing number of new collectors to buy these 45s - the notional book value has little or no meaning at all.

I could go on but have only had one coffee!!

More coffee and off to the local boot sale for me.

Derek

  Mark Bicknell said:

Just an observation really that has got me thinking is there a Rare Soul record mountain out there building up? as there seems to be a huge amount of records in constant circulation and being offered up for sale.

Recently I started to look at moving a few records on, swap, sell, trade type of thing to generate a bit of cash to buy other stuff etc. but when you actually start to look at the bigger picture there seems to be a huge amount of people selling records from the major dealers through to private collectors with a glut of similar titles on offer, on Soul Source alone the turnover of records on offer is incredible, add Ebay and other sites into the mix and the supply of records is vast, with the advent of Ebay in particular some records which were to a point rare and hard to find appear to have constantly surfaced through that channel on almost a daily basis now it seems in some cases there are simply too many copies of certain records on offer making the demand for them almost zero of course you are always going to get the big ticket items and rarer records which will sell and do have a worldwide market.

Has it got to the stage where there is a huge backlog of records which infact nobody wants anymore? I know several people who have vast amounts of records who trade in them with box upon box of 45's which at times are proving difficult to sell, some of the major dealers must be sitting on thousands of records many of which must be just sitting there unclaimed.

The choice out there at present seems to be vast and is far more a buyers market than ever before, records which once were desired and less common are turning out to be far less rare than we once thought, again the indemand tunes will sell forever and a day which we see from the many auctions out there but if you look under the surface there is without question a huge mountain of records to choose from.

Some records which come up on Soul Source for example you think wow nice tune! and they struggle to sell or gain very little interest, often the original asking price is dropped and I'm sure many deals are done this way, records listed on other sites and lists seem to be either re listed if they don't sell or there is more than one copy in stock or on offer which repeat every so often and so it goes.

There is alway's going to be a demand for Rare Soul records, the passion and the desire to own records is the key to keep the wheel in motion but it seems to me that just because a record is valued at x,y,z it can sometimes be a very different story when you come to try and sell certain records? of course demand, style, taste and collecting patterns change as time goes by, certain records will alway's hold their book price and often improve in value but others flutuate, many drop and others it would seem simply go off the scale and join the excess of vinyl out there.

For many of us I'm sure it's about the tune, desire to own it and simply down to the music rather than it's value and should never be treated as an investment, easy to perhaps say but a bit of a shock to the stystem if you ever deside to sell part or all of your collection to find that some of your treasured tunes are infact not that easy to sell?or less rare than you perhaps thought, is the market flooded? are there more records out there than people collecting them? or is there an excess of good records on offer? like I said just an observation.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

And no bad thing IMO Mark.

Classing myself as a fan rather than a collector, i am constantly priced out of the market, usually relying on charity shops or the very rare occasion i have sufficent brownie points with the Mrs to be able to buy any records. So anything that makes these records more accesable is a good thing.

Its not all bad though, the thrill of the chase is as good as just buying the records i want, i kind of think that using dealers is a bit of a cop out for me. Never being able to afford to use them, makes the odd occasion i can, seem too easy.

Dunno if this makes sense to all you serious dealers, traders, collectors. but it works for me.

I think as time has gone on......

1) The number of people collecting vinyl (especially 60s) had declined - remember how it was years ago versus now.....These days a lot of people use CD's, MP3s, downloads etc etc

2) many of those who do buy vinyl are trophy hunters who all want the same "rekkids"

3) there's more to life than records - if you got a choice between having a luxury holiday or buying a record, more people now would go for the former.

My tuppence worth

I have been buying and selling records (on a purely private basis) for many a year now. And it is my observation that it has, over the last 5 years or so, become increasingly more difficult to sell tunes outside the top 500 or 1000 for anything approaching their former perceived value.

This means that, as Mark and others have said, that many really good but not "in-demand" records just don't sell. Or rather they do but only at a greatly reduced price from their perceived value.

But the top 500 / 1000 tunes p[lus current in-demanders now fetch unvelievably high prices.

At the moment I have about 2500 records to sell, with more being added to the pile almost daily. But I have no idea how I am going to get rid of anything more than about 10-15% of them. And I need to to fund my new found obsession for Motown albums:)

Phil

  phild said:

At the moment I have about 2500 records to sell, with more being added to the pile almost daily. But I have no idea how I am going to get rid of anything more than about 10-15% of them. And I need to to fund my new found obsession for Motown albums:)

Phil

Soul pakcs are the order of the day,say 100 45s for a tenner

PS put me down for half`o`dozen,discount for bulk?.

Edited August 12, 200717 yr by ken

Excellant idea Ken

Cheers Paco

  Steve G said:

I think as time has gone on......

1) The number of people collecting vinyl (especially 60s) had declined - remember how it was years ago versus now.....These days a lot of people use CD's, MP3s, downloads etc etc

2) many of those who do buy vinyl are trophy hunters who all want the same "rekkids"

3) there's more to life than records - if you got a choice between having a luxury holiday or buying a record, more people now would go for the former.

My tuppence worth

Good point there Steve, we booked a holiday to Florida last March to do the Disney thing with our son, as ever time flew by and the holiday was upon us.....Jacqui mentioned the small point of spending money...lol without even thinking about it I outed four tunes resulting in a fantastic holiday.......slightly the other way round from your point but confirming that there is more to life than records, I've not missed the records either be they were top tuneage.

There is always something new to buy, chase and enjoy, my original post here was more an observation of the vast amount of 45's that seem to be out there on offer and perhaps not as many collectors out there anymore which has been touched on so far here with the replies.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

excellent post mark, have noticed this to, also it seems that people will buy and pay higher prices of

people like your good selve ie; fab peps £40 cant give mine away for £30, also noticed marvellos £100

ive had an issue for sale for ages £50 why? is it because you are known? just a observation mate

strange thing this record collecting lol.

cheers

russ

  russoul1 said:

excellent post mark, have noticed this to, also it seems that people will buy and pay higher prices of

people like your good selve ie; fab peps £40 cant give mine away for £30, also noticed marvellos £100

ive had an issue for sale for ages £50 why? is it because you are known? just a observation mate

strange thing this record collecting lol.

cheers

russ

Good points Russ there mate, regarding selling Peps, Marvellows etc. all I do is check the price guides, what I paid for the record and price it accordingly, you will notice that I've put a 'will haggle' comment on my current running list so there is room for negociation, you raised the point on the price of The Peps which I took on board but it is listed in one of the guides at £75.00 so who's right? I reduced it and it sold same with The Marvellows 45...I really don't think it matters if you are known or not whatever that means???...lol like you Russ I'm just one of the lad's with a few tunes mate alway's have been.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

excellent post mark, have noticed this to, also it seems that people will buy and pay higher prices of

people like your good selve ie; fab peps £40 cant give mine away for £30, also noticed marvellos £100

ive had an issue for sale for ages £50 why? is it because you are known? just a observation mate

strange thing this record collecting lol.

cheers

russ

Russ, It's just down to you being an ugly c@@t

I am selling most of my records over next few months, just to finance the purchase of more Lambretta's , can't see the value of them going higher any more and as said on here it,s getting bloody hard to sell the same old same that with the electronic age everybody must have them by now !!

We have a growing record mountain in our spare bedroom.

OOOhhh, I hear you say..."lots of lovely vinyl" !!!!

NO....A huge Pile of awful, chemically induced vinyl crappiness.

I feel a late night mass burial may be imminent

  NASHEE said:

We have a growing record mountain in our spare bedroom.

OOOhhh, I hear you say..."lots of lovely vinyl" !!!!

NO....A huge Pile of awful, chemically induced vinyl crappiness.

I feel a late night mass burial may be imminent

Ted was doing his best to add to that moutain last night

I know of a few mates who like myself rejoined the scene about five years ago, on dragging their record box out of the loft they found for example the Tobi Legend they paid three quid for from soul bowl now goes for three hundred, and the Mel Britt pressing that was a quid is now in double figures, the temptation to sell for a mega profit then becomes great. add to that the collection of twenty plus otis redding singles no one wants anymore thats just sitting there and the amount of vinyl starts building up. Plus I know from personal experience dealers in the U.S. all seem to have Manships book at hand, i have had many dealings with these people who think everything they have is rare and Northern, which is one of the reasons records get catagorized as northern when they deffinatly aint.

WESTY

This could be the start of Armageddon

Yes all your records could be potentially worth shirtbuttons

Whoever has a worthless copy of She Did by The Ascots on Bethlehem I'll give you a fiver (including postage)

Edited August 12, 200717 yr by richard

  ken said:

Soul pakcs are the order of the day,say 100 45s for a tenner

PS put me down for half`o`dozen,discount for bulk?.

Not a bad idea, but 100 for £100 sounds better to me. Still want 6?

Phil

  ged parker said:

Ted was doing his best to add to that moutain last night

Ged dear...hope you weren't taking advantage of Ted's I've been up for 2 nights stupor, by selling him stuff that has been gathering dust in your spare bedroom..c'mon, you can tell me the truth

Ted adds to said mountain every goddam week....I may have to surgically remove his Earphones

Ted & Bob enter the house on Sunday morning....piles of lovingly chosen 45's under their arms....WE have got some nice bits here Nashee....ggggggggrrrrrrrr

The Living room now takes on the look of a small production line....Turntable spins...record laid on...arm accross...and out comes

BOBS PILE.....The I'm going to listen to these again in private, when I go home pile.

Intermission while coffee is served

Our 4 piles emerge..........

PILE 1.....I'll take That Pile....tiny pile of very very good records..if any have taken my fancy

PILE 2....The Bugger off Nashee pile.......a very small pile of very very good records, that Ted cluches tightly to his chest, thus preventing me from adding them to Pile 1

PILE 3....The take out next week and trade for other records pile...no explanation needed

PILE 4....The I'll go through these later Nashee Pile.........Meaning...when Nashee is distracted I'll Stash this lot in the spare room...until I can find some rich deaf person to buy them.

Luv him to bits....

  phild said:

And I need to to fund my new found obsession for Motown albums:)

Phil

Phil,

Do you have a list of albums that you are looking for, or that you already have?

I have around 250 motown albums that I'd be willing to part with, but I'll be bugg'rd if I've got the time to list them all at the minute...

PM me a trades list if you have one, as I'm more than happy to swap.

There's no doubt that some of the people who flocked back to collecting in the 90s are now offloading again.

I'd love to know what most of the records advertised on S Source actually sell for. It's a subject I raised a few weeks ago......apparently everyone gets just about what they ask... honest

I'm hoping we've seen the first flurry of an avalanche. So many records and so little time.

Regards,

Dave

www.theresthatbeat.com

www.hitsvillesoulclub.com

  phild said:

Not a bad idea, but 100 for £100 sounds better to me. Still want 6?

Phil

I aint got £600.

  NASHEE said:

Ged dear...hope you weren't taking advantage of Ted's I've been up for 2 nights stupor, by selling him stuff that has been gathering dust in your spare bedroom..c'mon, you can tell me the truth

It was that Geoff Claxton honest

  ged parker said:

It was that Geoff Claxton honest

Yeh right

  Mark Bicknell said:

Just an observation really that has got me thinking is there a Rare Soul record mountain out there building up? as there seems to be a huge amount of records in constant circulation and being offered up for sale.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

I have a theory that says that all the returning soulies who were keen to buy they stuff that theyy once

had (or wanted) created a big demand. That demand is probably over now, when I go to venues

the dealers look like they're struggling. If the papers are to be believed there could be a

micro-recession on it's way and the selling may well grow. One dealer offered me a £200 record

for £100 couple of weeks ago.................guess we'll all know in 6 months time.

  Daveboogaloo said:

I know of a few mates who like myself rejoined the scene about five years ago, on dragging their record box out of the loft they found for example the Tobi Legend they paid three quid for from soul bowl now goes for three hundred, and the Mel Britt pressing that was a quid is now in double figures, the temptation to sell for a mega profit then becomes great. add to that the collection of twenty plus otis redding singles no one wants anymore thats just sitting there and the amount of vinyl starts building up. Plus I know from personal experience dealers in the U.S. all seem to have Manships book at hand, i have had many dealings with these people who think everything they have is rare and Northern, which is one of the reasons records get catagorized as northern when they deffinatly aint.

WESTY

Tobi Legend currently £420 on one auction site with 2 days to go

  Soulsmith said:

Tobi Legend currently £420 on one auction site with 2 days to go

I mean that is just senseless. The record is worth no more than £125 on a demo. Much more on issue but it's not a rare record. Greedy sellers and clueless collectors, that's what it's all about at the moment when the reality is, get your price guide, cross out every price and halve it, thats the reality. There are not enough record buying people left. Apart from the 10,000 on John Manships mailing list, obviously.

maybe people are finally now starting to realise that some records are just not as rare as the price demands, and therefore not worth the money.

said many times on here by better people than me.

  Steve G said:

"....there's more to life than records...."

Wot???? :lol: Tell me it's not true!!!!

Edited August 13, 200717 yr by mel brat