Brutal Attack On Dj?

[Paul-s]

In over 30 years (with a slight break), I have never heard or seen a fight between TRUE soulies!! Perhaps I have been living with my head in the sand. On a more regular basis, 'cat fights' have broken out, but dismissed as a bit of hair pulling. Reading though I am not alone in saying, we should be old enough to pull away from a fight. If anyone feels the NEED to fight, they should keep it between themselves, WELL away from a venue and YES they should be banned if they can't control themselves!!! We all get a little bit irrate at times, mostly through a slight (and I do mean slight) missunderstanding, even asking for a record to be played. We are ALL at fault to let others spoil our scene by a bit of fisticuffs. Anyone who 'claims' to be a mate of someone fighting at a 'Do', should think again . . . YOU should have stopped it for whatever reason it started, it should not be OUR problem on here!!!

Martin

p.s. Fight . . . I'd rather have another drink!!

First sensible thing Ive read on this. The people who were watching, including Rimmer and the geezer crying about being banned, should have stopped it! Its not for the scene! All this bollocks and gossip, its nothing to do with us. As for banning people from venues.....thats up to the venue....Get over it! Ive banned myself from certain venues , just because I dont want to be around that kind of shit! No loss, to them or me...sleep well.

[Simsy]

Yes Simsy.But a public enquirey!!

Sounds abit like you want Judge,Jury and hangman.

When that will definately douse petrol on the embers.And turn into somethin alot bigger.

Your way would of to of got the police involved at the offset.

I myself kno that both parties want to close this ugly chapter.And get back to livin normal lives again.

So what i am saying is let them decide on the best course of action.

Or shall we nominate another Albert Pierpoint??Or maybe a trial by ordeal!

PS MIddleton was brill lastnite if you missed it

Mike Cog

Public enquiry not necessary Mike. Since the facts seem to be inconclusive, after Pete pointed out the incident took place outside the do 'some time later' ...

Whatever the DJ did to warrant the beating (if that's what it was) is none of our concern. What is of our concern, is that the chivalrous etiquette that exists/existed on the NS scene remains unchanged and this was an isolated incident. This however is difficult to ascertain as the facts of the case seem far from conclusive imo.

Missed Middleton, bummer.

[Guest Matt Male]

Missed Middleton, bummer.

I went up to a bloke at Middleton and asked him if he was you... he wasn't

Edited July 16, 2007 by Matt Male

[Guest Brian J]

First sensible thing Ive read on this. The people who were watching, including Rimmer and the geezer crying about being banned, should have stopped it! Its not for the scene! All this bollocks and gossip, its nothing to do with us.

'they should have stopped it', then 'it's nothing to do with us'....make your mind up!

It's all right sitting at home and saying people should have stopped it, last time I did that, both people concerned ended up turning on me.

[pikeys dog]

I went up to a bloke at Middleton and him if he was you... he wasn't

Wi' such scintillating anecdotes, Aye forsee a successfull stint on t' After Dinner Speeches circuit for ye.

Oh Arrr!

[Guest DonnaD]

It is the promoters that I feel for, having to make a decision without full facts (apart from the CCTV!) in order to ensure that no one at thier event feels threatened and that there is no fighting outside etc. Someone who was a witness to this attack was visibly shaken by the brutality of it. In my opinion it would be best for all if those involved just stayed away for a while, whilst this all died down, instead of putting the pressure on the promotors to have to decide what is best. Those involved, in the meantime, should sort out thier differences themselves, like adults, instead of asking those on this forum to sort it all out for them. If they feel the only way to resolve it is through violence then do it away from us!

[Tomangoes]

Well, what a thread. Never thought it could be so complex.

As suggested at the start, it would appear that if a tape exists, and an independant judge who knew all parties concerned viewed it, it would confirm who did what.

Until then its a matter of opinion.

Like most on here, I dont know anybody involved but its a bad state of affairs until it gets resolved.

As hard as it is for some to accept, we still work on innocent until proven guilty.

If the accused is guilty, prove it and ban them forever, or leave them alone.

Ed

[Guest Bearsy]

Well, what a thread. Never thought it could be so complex.

As suggested at the start, it would appear that if a tape exists, and an independant judge who knew all parties concerned viewed it, it would confirm who did what.

Until then its a matter of opinion.

Like most on here, I dont know anybody involved but its a bad state of affairs until it gets resolved.

As hard as it is for some to accept, we still work on innocent until proven guilty.

If the accused is guilty, prove it and ban them forever, or leave them alone.

Ed

simple really

[Paul-s]

It is the promoters that I feel for, having to make a decision without full facts (apart from the CCTV!) in order to ensure that no one at thier event feels threatened and that there is no fighting outside etc. Someone who was a witness to this attack was visibly shaken by the brutality of it. In my opinion it would be best for all if those involved just stayed away for a while, whilst this all died down, instead of putting the pressure on the promotors to have to decide what is best. Those involved, in the meantime, should sort out thier differences themselves, like adults, instead of asking those on this forum to sort it all out for them. If they feel the only way to resolve it is through violence then do it away from us!

....beautifully and sensibly put!

[Jules]

"believe half of what you see, and none of what you hear".

might make a good line for a song that.

[stainless steve]

Hi

Kev was going to post up yesterday but didn't get time as we weren't in. I'm going to try and remember what he was going to put, if I make any mistakes sorry.

At Chris Watermans do a couple of weeks ago Kev asked Steve, a friend of the guy involved to ask them not to come to Lowton this month, as he knew the other party would be there, as they DJ in the back room. He also said he did not want both parties in the venue at the same time if there was going to be trouble. Kev also spoke to the guy involved's girlfriend on the Tuesday and went through the same thing, that he didn't want any trouble in Lowton.

On the Friday evening when Kev was DJing, the party he had asked not to come arrived with some friends, which in itself wouldn't have been so bad had he, firstly gone onto the stage and spoke to Kev about why he was there, and that he wasn't there to cause any trouble. Whilst Kev was DJing I was told by somebody who had overheard one of his friends say that if the DJ said a word that the other guy was going to kill him and that if anybody tried to throw him out, he was going to kill them too. Which didn't leave Kev with much of an alternative. Kev has never told anybody at anytime that they were barred, as I think they will all agree.

I then spent the remainder of my evening talking to friends of the guy asked to leave, and the other people involved, in the back rooms behind the stage to see if this whole mess can be sorted out.

Kev is on a hiding to nothing with Lowton, as many of you will testify to when i've run up to them in their cars at the end of the night, asking them to turn music off while they are on the car park, we have the people in the houses calling out the council nearly every month with complaints. Fighting and police would just about finish it off. Kev as a promotor also has to think about the safety of all the other people that are in the venue should there be any trouble.

Kev has asked me to put on the bottom that he will gladly get all parties involved over to Lowton and bang their heads together, then make them all stand in the naughty corner for the whole evening.

as for me, I don't go out that often as I have other commitments, and when I do go out I want to just have a nice time with ALL the people on the soul scene that i've been friendly with over the years, so come on, get it sorted out!

sorry if this is a bit scrambled but i'm in work and that's what I should be doing instead of writing this!

Hi. In response to your posting on behalf of KEV,You said you are trying to remember what Kev wanted you to relay to us on his behalf and if you made any  mistakes etc sorry,,

 sometimes sorry does not quite cover it and i shall give golden example.(your quotation.which has probably been said innocently without any malice by you)... "I was told by somebody who had overheard one of his friends say that if the DJ said a word that the other guy was going to kill him and that if anybody tried to throw him out, he was going to kill them too".

If this isn't one of the biggest causes of ill-feeling & trouble on the scene today, ie; 'somebody' told 'somebody' else about what 'someone' else said....ie;... second-hand information etc.

You've not only passed it on by mouth but you've also wrote it down for loads of people to read.

Now 'everybody'  knows 'somebody'  that told them that 'somebody'  else had heard what a friend of the 'party' involved had said!  The original nosey get that heard the fighting talk was someone with '100%' hearing, 20-20 vision...and I bet he/she was sat on his  knee at the time..great memory eh?

If the time comes when asked to stand-by what he/she had heard,  chances are he/she won't be able to remember much about it all.   Seem's nearly everyone on the 'scene' was there at the time as we all know the facts.   The thing is, 'fatfish'  started a thread to clear his own name as he was not involved with the 'dispute'  but he has already been judged by numerous people who all claim to know exactly what went on and as a result its at the state its at now.

Witnesse's ie;reliable people who put their name to what they are saying..leads  me to believe that

there must have been only half a dozen anywhere near to comment.

Second point;. As for Kev (who I had a lot of respect for)  not having much of an alternative

if he'd have made the right decision in the first place ie; 'bar all'  all  'bar none'  he wouldn't have had

a problem at all.  But as he's taken sides ie; one of the 'party's' was doing a job for him which gave him entrance to the venue   which is no excuse at all really.  In my mind that's taking sides.

There seems to be some confusion about being 'barred', if someone's asked not to show at a venue and they are refused entry etc.. to me that means 'barred' whether it be for the one night or for ever!

So c'mon Kev admit you got it wrong, you can't reward one with a dj spot and refuse the other one entry and then try to make out that you're not taking sides.

You know just as much as I do about the facts which is more or less nothing for sure.

So be the man that I always thought you was and own up to your mistake.

[Guest Chris Waterman]

First sensible thing Ive read on this. The people who were watching, including Rimmer and the geezer crying about being banned, should have stopped it! Its not for the scene! All this bollocks and gossip, its nothing to do with us. As for banning people from venues.....thats up to the venue....Get over it! Ive banned myself from certain venues , just because I dont want to be around that kind of shit! No loss, to them or me...sleep well.

Paul

To be fair to Dave Rimmer, he had already stated in the previous thread and in a responce to Moggy, 'He missed the start of the fight' and 'Nobody stood by and watched the attack' 'We were too far away to have done anything to stop the fight'

This I can support as fact as I was walking from the other direction towards Dave, Lou and a other and we all got to the scene at the same time, as we got to Bob who was standing on the pavement about ten yards from Karl and Martin who were on the road between a row of cars the door staff arrived and picked Karl up off the floor, Lou picked Karl's record up off the floor. That's the facts as i saw them, the only people who really know what happened at the start are Karl, Martin and Bob.

Chris W

[Little-stevie]

pointless posts from some,they don't know any of the facts really..

Was it one on one

Was it one and a few kicks from another

Was it a fight or an attack

Eye witness or cctv

Is it a promoters problem what happens outside a venue...

It all goes round in circles...

The cctv footage should make it clear, if was an attack by one or two men or it was a fight between two men...If its an attack then the people who did this should take the blame,if its a fight then maybe both parties could make the peace and not let so many people get involved.... If i ran a venue and some person attacked another inside or outside then i would not want that person in the venue again,it would make no difference if it was a freind or a stranger.... I and many others don't really know much at all,let the footage bring all this to an end please... I and others are sick of it...

Maybe let a few people see the cctv and then they could post what they see if the footage is clear..End of...

Steve

Edited July 17, 2007 by little-stevie

[Guest sharynm]

Hi. In response to your posting on behalf of KEV,You said you are trying to remember what Kev wanted you to relay to us on his behalf and if you made any mistakes etc sorry,,

sometimes sorry does not quite cover it and i shall give golden example.(your quotation.which has probably been said innocently without any malice by you)... "I was told by somebody who had overheard one of his friends say that if the DJ said a word that the other guy was going to kill him and that if anybody tried to throw him out, he was going to kill them too".

If this isn't one of the biggest causes of ill-feeling & trouble on the scene today, ie; 'somebody' told 'somebody' else about what 'someone' else said....ie;... second-hand information etc.

You've not only passed it on by mouth but you've also wrote it down for loads of people to read.

Now 'everybody' knows 'somebody' that told them that 'somebody' else had heard what a friend of the 'party' involved had said! The original nosey get that heard the fighting talk was someone with '100%' hearing, 20-20 vision...and I bet he/she was sat on his knee at the time..great memory eh?

If the time comes when asked to stand-by what he/she had heard, chances are he/she won't be able to remember much about it all. Seem's nearly everyone on the 'scene' was there at the time as we all know the facts. The thing is, 'fatfish' started a thread to clear his own name as he was not involved with the 'dispute' but he has already been judged by numerous people who all claim to know exactly what went on and as a result its at the state its at now.

Witnesse's ie;reliable people who put their name to what they are saying..leads me to believe that

there must have been only half a dozen anywhere near to comment.

Second point;. As for Kev (who I had a lot of respect for) not having much of an alternative

if he'd have made the right decision in the first place ie; 'bar all' all 'bar none' he wouldn't have had

a problem at all. But as he's taken sides ie; one of the 'party's' was doing a job for him which gave him entrance to the venue which is no excuse at all really. In my mind that's taking sides.

There seems to be some confusion about being 'barred', if someone's asked not to show at a venue and they are refused entry etc.. to me that means 'barred' whether it be for the one night or for ever!

So c'mon Kev admit you got it wrong, you can't reward one with a dj spot and refuse the other one entry and then try to make out that you're not taking sides.

You know just as much as I do about the facts which is more or less nothing for sure.

So be the man that I always thought you was and own up to your mistake.

I've had this argument shoved down my throat since i've known Kev and neither of us have shown the slightest interest or taken sides, fact, ask both couples. i've never changed attitudes or been off with either couple. The only reason we had to take an interest was when the argument turned violent, and then the only interest we have taken is with a view to a venue that Kev promotes.

I would imagine that Kev asked the people to leave that have shown the greatest propensity for trouble. I agree with everybody else and the faster somebody gets off their backside and goes and looks at this video, then the faster they can all stop acting like children. I don't see any of these couple away from the soul scene so have no interest in the outcome.

People wanted to know as a promotor why he came to that decision and i've tried to explain it, we aren't going to be dragged any further into this stupid argument and i'm not going to post anything about it on here again. Kev is on the train at the moment and will be for a few hours, so if any of you feel so aggrieved by what he has done, then feel free to call him, if you don't have his number PM me and i'll give it to you. If you want to talk to me about it, i'll give my number too.

Don't try and turn this into a witch hunt against promotors that don't want fighting in their venue. It wasn't us fighting in an alley.

it makes me sad that this post has had so many hits when it's about violence and negitivity.

[Dysonsoul]

With all due respect Andy, i have no bitter pills to swallow..!!

As previous postings by Dave Rimmer and others state i did not get involved.Are you not now questioning the integrity of these people?

if there is a video of this lets see it.you pick the venue and ill be there with all the other people who want to see it.

Again i stress that did not pay any part of this incident and i will not stop for anything to clear my name of these bullshit allegations.

As for getting together to resolve it.........i,m well up for it. Is the other party?

Suggestion....Lets get the police involved its not too late. Thats how confident i am about all this.

What do you think?

Firstly, when i said about " bitter pills " was mean't as a middle ground for both party's , both sides believe they're right , isn't there some room for resolve with both sides giving a bit of slack !

Not one for questioning anyone's integrity , even though stories have been swapped and changed.

Spoke to mr coney who is in the process of either getting the video ( which is someone's private property so it's that persons call ) Or worst case scenario the phone number of doorman in charge on the night who will help all interested partys with whatever info they need.

i'm afraid you lost me when you mention going to police ! certainly not in my dictionary , but hey why not if you'd like there help in the matter.

hope this helps i've spent way too much time on this already,i like records that's what i like -finding records...

good luck to all involved.

[Mike]

think everyone involved/concerned has had fair chance to answer/post/comment etc

Andy's last post above, does mean it can be resolved one way or other and imo draws a line under current thread

so am closing this very shortly as feel best thing allround

any concerns etc feel free to post in members feedback forum