Northern In The Mainstream

[Mike]

few threads about northern in daily mail , film soundtracks etc etc flying around the forum

is northern in mainstream media a good or a bad thing?

vote above

[Guest Baz]

I voted bad because nobody EVER gets it right (no pun inteded for the mail thread ) :angry:

portrayed as some happy clappy oldies movment in the media, never on the underground side.

[Pete S]

Can only be a good thing. Anyone who says keep it underground is a dinosaur because it'll stay underground, nobody will discover it and it will die out, simple as that. We're all getting older. Will NS still be around after we all die? Not without exposure bringing in new people.

[paultp]

Voted Bad.

Anyone remember the 100 club for the 3 months after the article in the Observer in about 2001?

Its still there for people to find if they want to and if presented in the right way those that want to will.

Cheers

Paul

[Guest moggy]

Good Thing,

any form of exposure via media, has to be good, it lets folk know the scene is still around and may just attract one or two new members, or rekindle memories of some of the older attendees who may have thought it had ceased to exist even if it is at the expense of portraying us as a group of oldish (your only as old as the woman you feel) odd balls who like the black stuff, how many of us still do tapes/cds for those who ask us whats Northern all about, so any additional exposure via the media can only be a healthy one.

LOL oldish oddball

[Bazza]

Can only be a good thing. Anyone who says keep it underground is a dinosaur because it'll stay underground, nobody will discover it and it will die out, simple as that. We're all getting older. Will NS still be around after we all die? Not without exposure bringing in new people.

I agree with this,obvious I think

Bazza

[Simsy]

Voted Bad.

"I really like that fried chicken music you played"

Depends on the level of media exposure I guess. Too much and we'll be overrun by jiving idiots and their girlfriends, complete with drinks in the middle of the floor. Too little and it will surely die. It's there to be found and that's why people who are prepared to dig a little will usually get more out of it, rather than it be served up to them in a styrofoam container...

[Guest in town Mikey]

Voted Bad.

Anyone remember the 100 club for the 3 months after the article in the Observer in about 2001?

Its still there for people to find if they want to and if presented in the right way those that want to will.

Cheers

Paul

Absolutely Paul. BAD BAD VERY BAD!

Anyone who was there the weekend it was included in the Guardian guide what's on, with an article accompanying it will still be having nightmares. Remember that guy who looked like the Tears for fears fella (May even have been him.)? He was just hammered and staggered about into everyone. Fair play he managed to stay to the very end though. But when he tried to stage dive I really had to stop myself belting him.

BAD BAD BAD!!!!!!!

Also very embarrasing. In the movie about the Women'sInstitute calendar, (Thats it Calendar Girls), It has an instrumental bit and I was wrestling to identify it. Shouting out - I'm a big man, in a silent cinema is not good.

BAD BAD BLUSHINGLY BAD.

Northern boys - Change is not good (copyright - soccer am)

Edited May 1, 2007 by in town Mikey

[Peter99]

I voted good.

I wasn;t at the 100 Club so can't comment on that particular experience. However, I think broader exposure to the masses would have more pro's than con's. It would give more exposure to the many, many artists whose music is still something the masses know nothing about.

[Guest Simon]

I voted bad, keep it as chin stroking & elitist as possible.

The media are lazy & will only ever portray NS in a way that they see fit.

Simon

[Gert Mark]

It looks like the people voting no, are voting to keep the scene as it is, ifear its a lost cause, things change ( had that rammed home when we nearly lost the 100 club).

We used to wear flares and sideburns, then pegs and sweatbands, then 50,s geasy hair and levis, all with different people and times.

The one constant is the music, and to keep that to ourselves for fear of looking silly in the press isnt doing the music justice, and maybe a little unsure ourselves, sod it, let em come, let em come, let em come, let em all come down to the tundrid. (Quoting milwall???)

[Guest in town Mikey]

It looks like the people voting no, are voting to keep the scene as it is, ifear its a lost cause, things change ( had that rammed home when we nearly lost the 100 club).

We used to wear flares and sideburns, then pegs and sweatbands, then 50,s geasy hair and levis, all with different people and times.

The one constant is the music, and to keep that to ourselves for fear of looking silly in the press isnt doing the music justice, and maybe a little unsure ourselves, sod it, let em come, let em come, let em come, let em all come down to the tundrid. (Quoting milwall???)

I understand where you are coming from bruv but

There can be no representation of Northern Soul at all, anywhere in the media, by anybody other than those that are the "sacred few"

[Guest in town Mikey]

In all seriousness, as it may appear my posts are flippant.

Keeping the scene underground is one of its most imporatant features. Making it part of the public consciousness is IMO a faster way to a demise than Pete's idea that keeping it underground is going to kill it.

The public move on, from just about everything. Northern Soul has been strong, because of, and not in spite of it being an elitist scene.

Having soap characters wearing Wigan badges, or storylines with a pratt making a bigger pratt of himself over a record just makes us look ridiculous. Maybe we are, but we are so forking cool being so.

[Guest garv]

I just voted " good thing" , we dont own this scene & with a few of the younger DJ`s & forward thinking promoters i think the future could be just as exciting for a new generation as it was for us, in europe they seem to attrack a very young crowd but i think history holds us back [ sometimes ] in this country.

I dont have any fears on the beer on the dance floor jiving bunnies type of person because for every one of those there`s a guy/ girl standing in the corner taking it all in & will return to a soul nite / nighter with like minded mates.

Why can they attrack young growds in europe & have a fresh vibe & yet over here we have all these rules & regs ........ christ it would be easier to do the knowledge than get excepted for making a few mistakes in your infancy to soul music.

The dynamics of society have changed from the 70`s / 80`s & it is our duty to hand this beautiful music on ......... what the younger generation do with the structure of how they enjoy listening to it, is up to them.

Edited May 1, 2007 by garv

[Ged Parker]

A bad thing obviously - the media are only interested in selling papers or advertising between their programming the truth is irrelevant to them so why would they spend any time or effort in getting things right. Whats more if it could be spun to sensationalise the 'odd', 'quirky', 'seedy', 'retro', 'dark' etc side of the scene it would be. There are enough places to find out what rare soul is all about not least of which are the numerous venues playing it every week. The scene is for experiencing and the music is for hearing not reading lies and half truths about.

[Guest]

Oh so very bad!!.

[Guest moggy]

In all seriousness, as it may appear my posts are flippant.

Keeping the scene underground is one of its most imporatant features. Making it part of the public consciousness is IMO a faster way to a demise than Pete's idea that keeping it underground is going to kill it.

The public move on, from just about everything. Northern Soul has been strong, because of, and not in spite of it being an elitist scene.

Having soap characters wearing Wigan badges, or storylines with a pratt making a bigger pratt of himself over a record just makes us look ridiculous. Maybe we are, but we are so forking cool being so.

Dissagree Mike

Keeping it underground and away from the public domain will almost certainly kill it, as no one would ever hear of it, I agree in part regarding the b******s way Vernon attempted to portray a Northern music lover did us no favours and how on earth does he manage to give Liz Mac a good seeing to i will never know, but seriously, if for instance, television were to air a serious and fair assesment of the scene with maybe showing the different sides we have to our scene ie oldies venue and a modern venue and in most peoples opiniun (soul folks) it was a true and honest assesment, how could that do it any harm, yes some might say, what the f**k are them old b******s doing, but some may say, Id love to be a part of that, and that can only be a good thing, If we think back to how we all got in to this music, i am sure a lot of folk did so through something they read or maybe seen on tv in the early days of the scene, yes a lot of people went out of there way to find it in other ways, and yes people do move on, but we didnt, theres still lots of us out there, lets get em in first then decide if it was a bad thing to do, cat food washing powder or kfcs who gives a shit, its a bit of exposure to the music.

be nice to know, does anyone know someone who now attends due to anything they watched or heard on tv

This is only my opinion of course

[Guest Rich Walker]

Can only be a good thing. Anyone who says keep it underground is a dinosaur because it'll stay underground, nobody will discover it and it will die out, simple as that. We're all getting older. Will NS still be around after we all die? Not without exposure bringing in new people.

Gotta' agree with Pete here... I think it's sad that you guys are so protective over such an interesting scene. If nothing is done to promote and raise awareness of Northern it will just fade away. (At least here in the UK.)

It's very hard for young people to get into Northern; and when they do some of you are very unwelcoming, which is a shame considering you guys have so much to offer.

With you're help and advise we can keep this beautiful scene alive!

Rich.

P.S. A lot of you are very welcoming to new soulies, and I am very grateful for all the support I have received since joining this forum a few years ago.

[Guest Baz]

It looks like the people voting no, are voting to keep the scene as it is, ifear its a lost cause, things change ( had that rammed home when we nearly lost the 100 club).

We used to wear flares and sideburns, then pegs and sweatbands, then 50,s geasy hair and levis, all with different people and times.

The one constant is the music, and to keep that to ourselves for fear of looking silly in the press isnt doing the music justice, and maybe a little unsure ourselves, sod it, let em come, let em come, let em come, let em all come down to the tundrid. (Quoting milwall???)

If done right it can be good, but the music is never constant in the press...........Do i love you.........says it all, its not vibrant, its not fresh and it sure aint appealing

[Guest moggy]

It's very hard for young people to get into Northern; and when they do some of you are very unwelcoming, which is a shame considering you guys have so much to offer.

Richard

At 15 I discovered this wonderful way of life and like you found constant barriers put up by people who were older than me, I got into the collecting scene almost immeadiatly, and thats were i found people unwelcoming, frowning at you as if your some f****n idiot cos you didnt know who sung what or what it came out on etc, it got easier as time went on, it was as if i had to earn some sort of respect from these people by what i purchased, dont get me wrong, there also many fantastic people i have had the pleasure of meeting and becoming friends with , it just saddens me that 30 years on we still have a small minority of arse wipes looking down on new comers and people who just love the music or just wanna dance, but dont as yet have the knowledge to mingle with egoes grrr made me mad then, and makes me made now.

[Guest Rowly]

Can only be a good thing. Anyone who says keep it underground is a dinosaur because it'll stay underground, nobody will discover it and it will die out, simple as that. We're all getting older. Will NS still be around after we all die? Not without exposure bringing in new people.

Wot Pete Said - innit.

[Simsy]

Wot Pete Said - innit.

Nah.

Don't listen to him, he doesn't go out anymore and wouldn't have to put up with the influx of loons that an over publicised ns scene would create.

As previously stated you get a better turned out and well rounded soulie if they have to dig a little in the first place. We did. Who says they'd be interested anyway if it was rammed down their throats? In general the ill-informed's view of us is (as Ady once put it) "a load of weirdos dancing to crap music all night".

[Guest moggy]

Nah.

Don't listen to him, he doesn't go out anymore and wouldn't have to put up with the influx of loons that an over publicised ns scene would create.

As previously stated you get a better turned out and well rounded soulie if they have to dig a little in the first place. We did. Who says they'd be interested anyway if it was rammed down their throats? In general the ill-informed's view of us is (as Ady once put it) "a load of weirdos dancing to crap music all night".

Weirdo"s Thats a bit harsh isnt it

[Guest Simon]

be nice to know, does anyone know someone who now attends due to anything they watched or heard on tv

Yeah, me, i'd never heard of it until i saw that Felix cat on the box & then progressed on slightly further when i heard some NS whilst buying some chicken down my local KFC.

Also i used to dress like a weirdo but i now wear bags & vests & patches & stuff whilst out & about.

Simon

[Pete S]

Moggys right about one thing, we had to go through a hard apprenticeship to qualify to even be accepted on this scene back in the 70's. I remember being 14 coming up to 15 and I went to a 'disco' at the Bradmore Arms in Wolverhampton, obviously we couldn't drink but I never drank til I was 18 anyway, but basically what happened was, I was wearing a shirt with a Wigan casino patch sewn on the chest, and this bloke came up to me - his name was Mick Perks, some old Wolvo people may remember him - and he must have been about 20 I guess, and we had this conversation:

him - "So you go to Wigan do you?"

me - "er..."

him - "have you ever been to Wigan?"

me - "erm, no I haven't"

him - "so why are you wearing a Wigan patch then? If I ever see you wearing that patch again I'll rip it off your f*cking shirt"

bastard...

[Guest moggy]

Yeah, me, i'd never heard of it until i saw that Felix cat on the box & then progressed on slightly further when i heard some NS whilst buying some chicken down my local KFC.

Also i used to dress like a weirdo but i now wear bags & vests & patches & stuff whilst out & about. see miracles do happen praise the lord

Simon

Simon you forgot to mention, that you spilt some ketchup off yer KFC on your cap sleeved shirt and went home and put it in the washing machine with your favourite brand of soap powder all down to the power of advertising

[SteveM]

Yeah, me, i'd never heard of it until i saw that Felix cat on the box & then progressed on slightly further when i heard some NS whilst buying some chicken down my local KFC.

Also i used to dress like a weirdo but i now wear bags & vests & patches & stuff whilst out & about.

Simon

[Guest moggy]

Moggys right about one thing, we had to go through a hard apprenticeship to qualify to even be accepted on this scene back in the 70's. I remember being 14 coming up to 15 and I went to a 'disco' at the Bradmore Arms in Wolverhampton, obviously we couldn't drink but I never drank til I was 18 anyway, but basically what happened was, I was wearing a shirt with a Wigan casino patch sewn on the chest, and this bloke came up to me - his name was Mick Perks, some old Wolvo people may remember him - and he must have been about 20 I guess, and we had this conversation:

him - "So you go to Wigan do you?"

me - "er..."

him - "have you ever been to Wigan?"

me - "erm, no I haven't"

him - "so why are you wearing a Wigan patch then? If I ever see you wearing that patch again I'll rip it off your f*cking shirt"

bastard...

Pete,

best of it is, there are still wa****s out there who still ask people that, also bit of a bummer you not drinking at the Bradmore that night, could have whacked yer bottle off his f***n head, what a complete and utter bullying tosser he was ah :angry: grrrr still makes me angry

[Simsy]

Weirdo"s Thats a bit harsh isnt it

Very.

[Pete S]

Pete,

best of it is, there are still wa****s out there who still ask people that, also bit of a bummer you not drinking at the Bradmore that night, could have whacked yer bottle off his f***n head, what a complete and utter bullying tosser he was ah :angry: grrrr still makes me angry

First time I actually did go, made the mistake of going on Jethro's coach which contained all the villains, anyone who was new to the coach was allowed to be taxed 50p each by Patto and his mates at the back just for being allowed on the coach!

The only upside of this - when we arrived at the Casino, we were dropped off right outside the door, followed Jethro to the front of the queue and were allowed in before anyone else. Not sure how he did that.

[Guest moggy]

50p choofin eck, could of picked up a couple of tasty boots for that mate

[Pete S]

50p choofin eck, could of picked up a couple of tasty boots for that mate

I hadn't left school so still had a paper round that used to pay £1.50 a week for 7 days and 7 nights delivery!!! so you can tell how much that 50p was worth back then!

[Guest moggy]

I hadn't left school so still had a paper round that used to pay £1.50 a week for 7 days and 7 nights delivery!!! so you can tell how much that 50p was worth back then!

Well at 15 i was a bit of a gangster used to go up the rag market in Brum, and pinch a couple of skirts and tops, (before you all jump to the wrong conclusion) then off to the 3.00 oclock disco at a social club near to home, and sell them to the girls, the girls always seemed to have money when i was a kid, never had a pot to p**s in meself, and this how i funded my craving for the black stuff, do you remeber Clive Jones, used to get a lift off him from time to time in his camper van, I was about 18 then though, tight git used to charge me 2 quid, always got first look at his sales box though, some beauties obtained that way, oh and yes my life of crime ended when i was 16 when i got a job, free Biggsy

[Dave]

I voted bad because nobody EVER gets it right (no pun inteded for the mail thread ) :angry:

portrayed as some happy clappy oldies movment in the media, never on the underground side.

90% of it is!!!!

Can only be a good thing. Anyone who says keep it underground is a dinosaur because it'll stay underground, nobody will discover it and it will die out, simple as that. We're all getting older. Will NS still be around after we all die? Not without exposure bringing in new people.

Spot on Pete, (for once )

Voted good. The 100 club ain't the only venue on the scene!

[Peter99]

bastard...

fcuking bastard!

[Guest Bearsy]

If its put across as how the scene really is and all the rules of the scene were explained then why not.

[Dave]

If its put across as how the scene really is and all the rules of the scene were explained then why not.

Rules???!!!

[Guest Baz]

If its put across as how the scene really is and all the rules of the scene were explained then why not.

Rules?

F*** rules. im not part of no scene with rules in it

[Guest Baz]

Rules???!!!

Snap! great minds and all that

[chrissie]

Rules???!!!

WHAT!!!! I must of been off school that day, 34 years on and off the scene and I never knew there were any rules. Well hopefully I've broken most of them . There should only be one "rule" and that's.......................... No Rules Just Enjoy!!!!!!!!

QoFXX

Edited May 1, 2007 by chrissieo

[Sean Hampsey]

Think the promotion of Soul Music in mainstream media is a very good thing.

Bring it on!

Think the 'mostly' misinformed reporting of 'Northern Soul' (The scene and the music) in mainstream media a bad thing.... purely because the portrayals of the people involved in the 'scene' are usually inaccurate or derogatory.

Were someone able to put forward a well written piece on the Music, its global reach and the extraordinary camaraderie within it (without making 'Northern' out to be some bizarre cult) I'd be very much in favour.

Sean Hampsey

[Sanquine]

I feel it's a bad idea - the reason! We all have non soul friends and a lot of us have children, my daughter is 15, has lot's of mate's round so they have been exposed to Northern all their live's. A few think it's ok but much prefer other type's of music.

My sister came to a few venue's in the early 90's, but didn't continue, non of her friends took to it either. It seem's to me it's something that's a part of you or not - that simple. We found it without the modern technology available today - giving far more access to it than ever before. In the 70's it was just word of mouth and were still here

What I'm trying to say is that new people that really want to get into it come along with friend's that are already on the scene. Could be a worry that if put out into the mainstream and become's common place, that it would attract general around town folk, just coming along to get drunk, cause trouble or pester female's - wouldn't make for a good atmosphere

Imo

Karen

[Guest nubes]

I feel it's a bad idea - the reason! We all have non soul friends and a lot of us have children, my daughter is 15, has lot's of mate's round so they have been exposed to Northern all their live's. A few think it's ok but much prefer other type's of music.

My sister came to a few venue's in the early 90's, but didn't continue, non of her friends took to it either. It seem's to me it's something that's a part of you or not - that simple. We found it without the modern technology available today - giving far more access to it than ever before. In the 70's it was just word of mouth and were still here

What I'm trying to say is that new people that really want to get into it come along with friend's that are already on the scene. Could be a worry that if put out into the mainstream and become's common place, that it would attract general around town folk, just coming along to get drunk, cause trouble or pester female's - wouldn't make for a good atmosphere

Imo

Karen

You have just summed it up perfectly in my eyes....i dont think the trouble would just be with town menfolk though....you must have had the odd townie female who have grabbed the arm of a male soulie and drunkenly saying to them "show us the dance then luv"

Yes it was very much word of mouth before all this internet stuff...and in my mind ...if people are that determind to get into the scene....i really don't think going mainstream would be the answer...you don't choose to be into Northern...it chooses you...Delxxx

[Rednose]

Can only be a good thing. Anyone who says keep it underground is a dinosaur because it'll stay underground, nobody will discover it and it will die out, simple as that. We're all getting older. Will NS still be around after we all die? Not without exposure bringing in new people.

well said

[Citizen P]

Why do we have to worry about who walks through the door as a newie.

Either this music grabs you by the nuts and turns your life around or it does'nt.There aint no middle ground!

Those that get it will stay, those that don't will feck off to the next big thing.

BUT first, they gotta hear it.

Tony

[BlueWail]

I feel it's a bad idea - the reason! We all have non soul friends and a lot of us have children, my daughter is 15, has lot's of mate's round so they have been exposed to Northern all their live's. A few think it's ok but much prefer other type's of music.

My sister came to a few venue's in the early 90's, but didn't continue, non of her friends took to it either. It seem's to me it's something that's a part of you or not - that simple. We found it without the modern technology available today - giving far more access to it than ever before. In the 70's it was just word of mouth and were still here

What I'm trying to say is that new people that really want to get into it come along with friend's that are already on the scene. Could be a worry that if put out into the mainstream and become's common place, that it would attract general around town folk, just coming along to get drunk, cause trouble or pester female's - wouldn't make for a good atmosphere

Imo

Karen

Ive had the similar experience as you,my 19 year old daughter has been brought up on soul music and has no interested in soul music at all,and over the years ive took loads of non soulies to soul venues which they then usually use as amunition to make fun of me at a later date as they prop up the bar in my local.

men dancing together, o.a.p disco, throwing talc on the floor ect ect

[Guest Byrney]

Voted bad.

All dance scenes (not just Northern) are portrayed in terms of stereotypes by a lazy media.

The scene can find new blood through more succinct channels e.g. Soul Revolution and the like

[Guest Matt Male]

I'm not the only one who voted 'who cares' but am i the only one to explain why?

I can't vote good or bad because firstly, as has been said before, media reporting of the rare soul scene never get it right (look at Soul Britainia, a programme devoted exclusively to the music) but on the other hand a certain amount of media exposure keeps it in the public mind and leads the odd few searchers to our door on a regular basis, so that's good.

Forget the media though, WE should do more if we want to promote the music outside the scene. I talk about soul music and collecting vinyl on a regular basis with kids i teach and some of them are old enough for niters at 18. They are always interested. I even bring up Soulclub on the school computers and play something loud in class through the classroom speakers to give them a taste. I've even shown them that clip of me dancing on YouTube (ok so there was just a shocked silence to that one). I used to teach a girl who's dad was a regular at the Half Time Orange (unfortunately parents evening just turned into a chat about what we'd been buying lately ) but she and her friends knew what northern was.

My point is it's out there, plenty of kids know about it. When the KFC adverts were on there was a girl in class with the compilation CD, not the best introduction but it was a start. If they don't like the music fair enough, if they do maybe they will try to find out more. Although i doubt their 40 something teacher is the kind of fashion role model they are looking for...

I agree with Karen that it's something that's in you. We were all young and 'soulless' once... and then it happened!

Matt

Edited May 1, 2007 by Matt Male

[Steve G]

Also i used to dress like a weirdo but i now wear bags & vests & patches & stuff whilst out & about.

Simon

Some might suggest that this sentance is a bit oxymoronic Simon Bags and vests? - fancy dress mate

[Crumb]

In the past it's had a negative effect in the short term but been good for the scene in the long run. I might never have got into it myself without footsee, This England etc but I don't think that applies today. I can't really see many youngsters discovering northern because of media coverage & it'll just turn us all into laughing stocks. I think people in bags, vests & beertowels look naff so if any 18 year olds did come, I think they'd soon piss off again.