Darrell Smith (BBC Proms northern soul) releases record

[Phil J]

Lancashire’s Darrell Smith has released a homage to the Drifter in collaboration with the Stoke band ‘Soul Brothers Syndicate’. Many of you will remember him from the epic Royal Albert Hall gig on bbc in 2023. It’s been played so far on Radio 6 but if anyone can help get it played on mainstream Radio 2 it would no doubt give a boost to its chances of success? Available here   https://kycker.ffm.to/drifter

[Woodbutcher]

Thankfully all the links are tucked away behind paywalls or require signing up to to listen to so hopefully it'll just fade away unnoticed.

[Phil J]

53 minutes ago, Woodbutcher said:

Thankfully all the links are tucked away behind paywalls or require signing up to to listen to so hopefully it'll just fade away unnoticed.

Oh dear

[Shinehead]

1 hour ago, Woodbutcher said:

Thankfully all the links are tucked away behind paywalls or require signing up to to listen to so hopefully it'll just fade away unnoticed.

Never to be heard again 

[Phil J]

I don’t think a DJ of the calibre and integrity of Colin Curtis would be involved in the project (which he is) if the band didn’t in someway have some authenticity. If you listen to the original version and this one I find them very similar to be honest and if we keep knocking Young people who are trying to emulate a music genre their parents were into then, let’s face it, when all of us 60+ year-olds have died then I’m afraid the scene dies with us!!

[Dylan]

Off all the attempted revivals and attempts to attract new comers this has to be the most commercialised and marketed era yet.  It’s non stop and coming from a lot of directions.

 

Just typifies the social media world we now live in.

 

please let it stop….

[Phil J]

As you say, the age of social media has taken over and ppl need to decide whether to adapt, evolve and participate (i.e. like we’re doing right now on this platform) or just fade away. Our generation seem to scoff a lot at the likes of Bristol Soul Club and their energetic enthusiastic youngsters but if no-one was nostalgic about their parents’ preferred music genre then the whole scene just dies like the dinosaurs which is kind of depressing IMO 

[Chalky]

Adapt, evolve and participate? Why when we already have Ray Pollard.  Some band wagon jumper ain’t going to better Ray.  Northern Soul doesn’t need emulating or copying, it doesn’t need changing.  What is already there is one reason why it has endured for so long.  
 

Always puzzles me why some join a scene and immediately want to change it, therein lies the problem and why it gets so many backs up.  Just enjoy it as it is, it doesn’t need to change or copying, especially by a bunch of of soulless brit singers. 

Edited December 8 by Chalky

[Shinehead]

This record has nothing to do with the progression or keeping the music alive, it is a attempt to make money on the back of a Northern classic and an attempt to get people on here to get the record on to the BBC 2 playlist.

Edited December 8 by Shinehead

[Mal C]

He may have to get in line, is his version better than Don Charles or Stewart Smith?

[Dylan]

2 hours ago, Phil J said:

As you say, the age of social media has taken over and ppl need to decide whether to adapt, evolve and participate (i.e. like we’re doing right now on this platform) or just fade away. 

It probably is a time where many will step aside and let next generation put there spin on things.  How old now people who attended Wigan etc 60 or older ?

 

not sure I want to adapt to this new social media created scene.

 

i preferred things how they used to be.  How they still are as well in some places.

[Phil J]

1 hour ago, Mal C said:

He may have to get in line, is his version better than Don Charles or Stewart Smith?

Or even the Long John Baldry version? 

[Phil J]

1 hour ago, Shinehead said:

This record has nothing to do with the progression or keeping the music alive, it is a attempt to make money on the back of a Northern classic and an attempt to get people on here to get the record on to the BBC 2 playlist.

Been in touch with the ppl making it:  money made is going out in royalties (presumably to those who own copyright?) 

[Kenb]

11 minutes ago, Dylan said:

It probably is a time where many will step aside and let next generation put there spin on things.  How old now people who attended Wigan etc 60 or older ?

 

not sure I want to adapt to this new social media created scene.

 

i preferred things how they used to be.  How they still are as well in some places.

On the “How old now” bit…Slight topic drift, but people i meet from time to time who strike up a Wigan conversation always say they we’re 15 yrs old and sneaked out of home through the toilet window.

[Phil J]

13 minutes ago, Kenb said:

On the “How old now” bit…Slight topic drift, but people i meet from time to time who strike up a Wigan conversation always say they we’re 15 yrs old and sneaked out of home through the toilet window.

Well matter of fact I WAS 15 (Nov.74) and told parents I was staying at my mate’s, g/friend did same, train Stoke to Crewe then onto Wigan. But seriously if the under 60’s are not welcomed, encouraged and allowed to put their own (tech-savvy) spin on things then the scene can only realistically last another 5-10 yrs, this is why the Darrell Smith project, the touring Do I Love You show and performers such as The Signatures and Jonny Boy - while not being everyone’s cup of tea - nevertheless are reaching a wide audience and keeping the music relevant. I guess it’s all about opinions …… TAXI!  

[Shinehead]

3 minutes ago, Phil J said:

  the Darrell Smith project, the touring Do I Love You show and performers such as The Signatures and Jonny Boy - while not being everyone’s cup of tea - nevertheless are reaching a wide audience and keeping the music relevant. I guess it’s all about opinions …… TAXI!  

It's hardly keeping the music relevant it is taking Northern Soul into tribute type shows territory.

I will stick with the real deal.

 

 

 

[Dylan]

31 minutes ago, Kenb said:

On the “How old now” bit…Slight topic drift, but people i meet from time to time who strike up a Wigan conversation always say they we’re 15 yrs old and sneaked out of home through the toilet window.

I think the desperation to be 18 and have access to the adult world of pubs and clubs will happen forever with all generations.  Sneaking in underage has some kudos to share stories with your mates.

2 minutes ago, Shinehead said:

It's hardly keeping the music relevant it is taking Northern Soul into tribute type shows territory.

I will stick with the real deal.

 

 

 

Exactly Its an embarrassment to all that’s good about rare soul and the rare soul scene.

[Dr Ray Dj]

Someone wants to make a hit song great, cover a relatively unknown singer and pay the dues that's great too. Not sure how marketing a cover version on the back of a music scene, ai ethically alright? Although the open nature of the scene means anyone can and will whatever any else wants.

I'm just not sure if its good for the future of the scene itself vs. youngsters coming in and energising it in the clubs - which is where the scene is rather than in the charts. That's my opinion but I'm from Watford so what do I know.

Edited December 8 by Dr Ray Dj

[Kenb]

2 hours ago, Phil J said:

Well matter of fact I WAS 15 (Nov.74) and told parents I was staying at my mate’s, g/friend did same, train Stoke to Crewe then onto Wigan. But seriously if the under 60’s are not welcomed, encouraged and allowed to put their own (tech-savvy) spin on things then the scene can only realistically last another 5-10 yrs, this is why the Darrell Smith project, the touring Do I Love You show and performers such as The Signatures and Jonny Boy - while not being everyone’s cup of tea - nevertheless are reaching a wide audience and keeping the music relevant. I guess it’s all about opinions …… TAXI!  

people have been saying "the scene" can only last another ________ 'fill in the blanks' for years , since at least 1990. What "scene" is really left anyway?

[Dobber]

For me this version doesn’t create any impact purely from the recording aspect,any pre digital song then recorded digitally just sounds plastic! The drifter like 1000’ of other 60’s songs are recorded analogue and in mono,that’s a big part of the appeal! This cover version may have sounded better if they found an old studio using tape and old mics etc..

tbh his voice is the only thing that works,the music sounds flat! Please don’t tell me it’s qbase onboard instruments?

personally I don’t like any cover versions,utterly pointless! If your gonna spend a week in a studio with musicians etc then at least do original material,even if it sounds “northern soulie”

[Chalky]

3 hours ago, Phil J said:

Well matter of fact I WAS 15 (Nov.74) and told parents I was staying at my mate’s, g/friend did same, train Stoke to Crewe then onto Wigan. But seriously if the under 60’s are not welcomed, encouraged and allowed to put their own (tech-savvy) spin on things then the scene can only realistically last another 5-10 yrs, this is why the Darrell Smith project, the touring Do I Love You show and performers such as The Signatures and Jonny Boy - while not being everyone’s cup of tea - nevertheless are reaching a wide audience and keeping the music relevant. I guess it’s all about opinions …… TAXI!  

You’ve been going since 1974 and it seems you still don’t get it?   Commercialisation, the trivialisation and imitation has always been frowned upon. 
I know loads under 60, I’ve nearly 2 years to go before I hit 60, they’ve all embraced the scene for what it is, all the records were new ay one time and never did anyone feel it had to evolve.

The youngsters seem to be doing a good job at several clubs without resorting to tribute acts etc.  the tribute acts are aimed at a completely different audience, the kind of people I went to nighters to get away from. 
And if you think royalties are getting paid 100% then you need to give your head a wobble. 

[Timbo58]

I think the whole 'the scene will die unless we allow it to....... progress/diversify/water itself down/sell its soul/cheapen itself or become less authentic/true to its roots' (choose your own preferred interpretation) argument is hugely overblown and frankly I only care about my experience of it, not someone who might decide to join in if its adapted to their own lifestyle in the future.

That might be an unfashionable thing to say, but I never made it to Wigan/Torch/Wheel etc - I started off as a 'Johnny come lately' in the early 80's, we were tolerated by the older established lot precisely because we respected that authenticity is absolutely ALL in rare soul, respect for dancers, DJs and everyone else based on a shared passion for the music.

FWIW the totally OTT claims on Facebook etc in the marketing of this record 'number 1 for xmas' etc etc etc were laughable, sorry but they were, It's, at best, a passable rendition of a song, lets not over egg it.

 

 

 

[Phil J]

No.5 on the ITunes R&B chart, not bad. But don’t you ‘purists’ accept that when Amy Lame and Stuart Maconie played it on radio 6 it will have introduced N.S. to thousands of new listeners, some of whom will then go and seek out an event and some will even get into your rare/underplayed genre which then keeps the scene busy/relevant/healthy or whichever adjective you wish to insert! Is that not a good thing, oh hang on, I suspect I know the answer 

[Woodbutcher]

[Shinehead]

1 hour ago, Phil J said:

No.5 on the ITunes R&B chart, not bad. But don’t you ‘purists’ accept that when Amy Lame and Stuart Maconie played it on radio 6 it will have introduced N.S. to thousands of new listeners, some of whom will then go and seek out an event and some will even get into your rare/underplayed genre which then keeps the scene busy/relevant/healthy or whichever adjective you wish to insert! Is that not a good thing, oh hang on, I suspect I know 

Good to hear that this cover version will have an impact on the rare soul scene.

 

[Shinehead]

Errors 

Edited December 9 by Shinehead

[Phil J]

11 minutes ago, Shinehead said:

Good to hear that this cover version will have an impact on the rare soul scene.

 

Don’t think they were trying to break into the rare scene tbf! There’s more than one type of soul - I’m sure I don’t need to list them! They’re just a normal group of lads using their musicianship skills to pay homage to the sounds they used to hear coming from their parents’ turntables, really not sure where all the vitriolic comments come from? And there was me thinking the N.Soul community was generally warm and welcoming, Jesus wept! 

[Shinehead]

5 minutes ago, Phil J said:

Don’t think they were trying to break into the rare scene tbf! There’s more than one type of soul - I’m sure I don’t need to list them! They’re just a normal group of lads using their musicianship skills to pay homage to the sounds they used to hear coming from their parents’ turntables, really not sure where all the vitriolic comments come from? And there was me thinking the N.Soul community was generally warm and welcoming, Jesus wept! 

Why do you seem to want an endorsement for type of music these guys are producing, if it makes them successful and happy good luck but the music they produce is not Soul music in the way most on here perceive it.

[Phil J]

45 minutes ago, Shinehead said:

Why do you seem to want an endorsement for type of music these guys are producing, if it makes them successful and happy good luck but the music they produce is not Soul music in the way most on here perceive it.

Nope - no endorsement required/necessary! I was merely saying “look what these youngsters are up to - holding a candle up to what us guys used to get up to - great!” That’s all ….. btw I would say the minority of soul fans are into the rare scene and the majority into mainstream/ ‘the 500’ / bangers etc Mind you I’m judging it on empty/full dance floors and maybe you officianados/connoisseurs of soul are not into that side of soul and mainly listen? I don’t know but personally I feel higher % of ppl on soul source are into mainstream but I could be wrong and if I am ….. fair enough 

[Roburt]

Wonder what Fluff Freeman would have made of this version (had he still been around) ... 

Edited December 9 by Roburt

[Timillustrator]

2 hours ago, Phil J said:

Nope - no endorsement required/necessary! I was merely saying “look what these youngsters are up to - holding a candle up to what us guys used to get up to - great!” That’s all ….. btw I would say the minority of soul fans are into the rare scene and the majority into mainstream/ ‘the 500’ / bangers etc Mind you I’m judging it on empty/full dance floors and maybe you officianados/connoisseurs of soul are not into that side of soul and mainly listen? I don’t know but personally I feel higher % of ppl on soul source are into mainstream but I could be wrong and if I am ….. fair enough 

If you ask that sort of question in this forum that is the kind of answer you will get. TBH people have been recording cover versions of soul for at least 60 years in an attempt to make it into the mainstream so one more isn't going to elect an enthusiastic response. 

I find it interesting though that even when megastars like Kylie and Bruce Springsteen record cover versions it seems to have absolutely zero impact on the soul scene and this will inevitably be the same. Good for the original composers though, they or their families might at least get some decent royalties for once. 

The odd cover version does also get played at more mainstream soul events, thinking mainly of that awful Stock Aitken Waterman version of The Love I Lost, which people seem to like.

Edited December 9 by Timillustrator

[Phil J]

1 hour ago, Timillustrator said:

If you ask that sort of question in this forum that is the kind of answer you will get. TBH people have been recording cover versions of soul for at least 60 years in an attempt to make it into the mainstream so one more isn't going to elect an enthusiastic response. 

I find it interesting though that even when megastars like Kylie and Bruce Springsteen record cover versions it seems to have absolutely zero impact on the soul scene and this will inevitably be the same. Good for the original composers though, they or their families might at least get some decent royalties for once. 

The odd cover version does also get played at more mainstream soul events, thinking mainly of that awful Stock Aitken Waterman version of The Love I Lost, which people seem to like.

Know what you mean about certain tracks fill the floor even though they’re not technically ‘soul’ e.g. Bob Sinclair (a French DJ I believe) and Tribute. It’s more of a rave record really with that thumping beat but ppl seem to be mad for it when the mood is right? In terms of royalties, the original singers/composers (many of whom are deceased now) live in poverty, I know someone who located some in the States, Dena Barnes wasn’t aware there were thousands of British fans dancing to one of her old songs, it would be a real humane gesture - a kind of levelling up - if someone who’s ever made £00’s or £000’s from one of these records could donate a % to them? Just saying. 

[Phil J]

Just to annoy you lot even more, the video has been released today - nice retro vibe going on utilising the Kings Hall Stoke which has been used before to replicate the Casino - obvs the naysayers on here will hate it!!

[Kenb]

6 minutes ago, Phil J said:

Just to annoy you lot even more, the video has been released today - nice retro vibe going on utilising the Kings Hall Stoke which has been used before to replicate the Casino - obvs the naysayers on here will hate it!!

now you are getting the hang of this forum 

[Shinehead]

1 hour ago, Phil J said:

Just to annoy you lot even more, the video has been released today - nice retro vibe going on utilising the Kings Hall Stoke which has been used before to replicate the Casino - obvs the naysayers on here will hate it!!

Are you the promotion person ? 

[Jessie Pinkman]

Phil If the goal is to get the single played on the BBC Radio 2, then your best bet is for the band to come out as LGBT.

If that's a no, then it still has a better chance of getting played on the Beeb than the other new cover version that's just been released, this is more in tune with most of the age group on this forum.

Great lyrics.

 

Edited December 9 by Jessie Pinkman

[Phil J]

18 minutes ago, Jessie Pinkman said:

Phil If the goal is to get the single played on the BBC Radio 2, then your best bet is for the band to come out as LGBT.

If that's a no, then it still has a better chance of getting played on the Beeb than the other new cover version that's just been released, this is more in tune with most of the age group on this forum.

Great lyrics.

 

33 minutes ago, Shinehead said:

Are you the promotion person ? 

Absolutely not mate - just doing my (small) bit for the epic city of Stoke on Trent

[Wiggyflat]

This sort of cover version has been going on for years along with the use of iconic Northern Soul imagery to try and shift units..  ..Who remembers Oliver Darley from around 2002 ...it's just the same.

[Chalky]

3 hours ago, Phil J said:

Know what you mean about certain tracks fill the floor even though they’re not technically ‘soul’ e.g. Bob Sinclair (a French DJ I believe) and Tribute. It’s more of a rave record really with that thumping beat but ppl seem to be mad for it when the mood is right? In terms of royalties, the original singers/composers (many of whom are deceased now) live in poverty, I know someone who located some in the States, Dena Barnes wasn’t aware there were thousands of British fans dancing to one of her old songs, it would be a real humane gesture - a kind of levelling up - if someone who’s ever made £00’s or £000’s from one of these records could donate a % to them? Just saying. 

I doubt Dena Barnes had any royalties coming her way unless she was one of the writers which if memory serves she wasn't, same for the majority of the artists concerned.   I've been in touch with a faire few artists who were unaware of their popularity, they are now though and that is enough for most.

Edited December 9 by Chalky

[davidwapples]

20 minutes ago, Chalky said:

I doubt Dena Barnes had any royalties coming her way unless she was one of the writers which if memory serves she wasn't, same for the majority of the artists concerned.   I've been in touch with a faire few artists who were unaware of their popularity, they are now though and that is enough for most.

Wasn't it duke browner who wrote this?

[Chalky]

5 minutes ago, davidwapples said:

Wasn't it duke browner who wrote this?

Just checked yes he cowrote it but with Dena so I stand corrected. 

[Peter99]

Wow! The post has generated more response on here than any other post for a while. 

I haven't read all of them.......................

Peter

[Simsy]

Might work better if they stuck to Wigans Ovation, or Nosmo King or sim, but not Ray. Don’t aim that high and balls it all up.

Seeing Ray Pollard perform the Drifter live at the 100 Club made the hairs on the back of the neck stand up and we whooped with joy hearing his brilliant soaring soulful voice hit those high notes.

Attempting to emulate such is beyond presumptuous and frankly quite wrong.

[Simon T]

24 minutes ago, Simsy said:

Might work better if they stuck to Wigans Ovation, or Nosmo King or sim, but not Ray. Don’t aim that high and balls it all up.

Seeing Ray Pollard perform the Drifter live at the 100 Club made the hairs on the back of the neck stand up and we whooped with joy hearing his brilliant soaring soulful voice hit those high notes.

Attempting to emulate such is beyond presumptuous and frankly quite wrong.

not bad for a 72 year old

 

Edited December 9 by Simon T

[Pittstar]

13 hours ago, Phil J said:

No.5 on the ITunes R&B chart, not bad. But don’t you ‘purists’ accept that when Amy Lame and Stuart Maconie played it on radio 6 it will have introduced N.S. to thousands of new listeners, some of whom will then go and seek out an event and some will even get into your rare/underplayed genre which then keeps the scene busy/relevant/healthy or whichever adjective you wish to insert! Is that not a good thing, oh hang on, I suspect I know the answer 

 

13 hours ago, Phil J said:

No.5 on the ITunes R&B chart, not bad. But don’t you ‘purists’ accept that when Amy Lame and Stuart Maconie played it on radio 6 it will have introduced N.S. to thousands of new listeners, some of whom will then go and seek out an event and some will even get into your rare/underplayed genre which then keeps the scene busy/relevant/healthy or whichever adjective you wish to insert! Is that not a good thing, oh hang on, I suspect I know the answer 

 

[Pittstar]

With Respect I Don’t think there are Many People left on the Planet who Haven’t Heard of Northern Soul. 

[Peter99]

8 minutes ago, Pittstar said:

With Respect I Don’t think there are Many People left on the Planet who Haven’t Heard of Northern Soul. 

Many have heard of Northern Soul; but, those that understand it are the Chosen Few!

Excuse the pun.

Peter

[Pittstar]

What a well Educated Reply Peter

[Phil J]

Understand it? What like some sort of hierarchy do who are in on some sort of mystical secret!! A music genre/scene can be different things to different ppl, some will be geeks/anoraks who could tell you a record’s serial no., date of release, producer etc whereas others just want a bit of escapism, turn up at a venue, pay their fiver, dance dance dance then go home and forget about it - the distraction proved to be a welcome diversion. But to suggest some ‘understand’ it more than others suggests a whiff of superiority and is ever-so-slightly pompous and judgemental, good god! It was never like this in the mid 70’s when we were all just daft naive teenagers in search of something unusual ….. you lot will be putting on masters degrees and PHD’s on NS next!! LOL 

[Peter99]

1 hour ago, Phil J said:

Understand it? What like some sort of hierarchy do who are in on some sort of mystical secret!! A music genre/scene can be different things to different ppl, some will be geeks/anoraks who could tell you a record’s serial no., date of release, producer etc whereas others just want a bit of escapism, turn up at a venue, pay their fiver, dance dance dance then go home and forget about it - the distraction proved to be a welcome diversion. But to suggest some ‘understand’ it more than others suggests a whiff of superiority and is ever-so-slightly pompous and judgemental, good god! It was never like this in the mid 70’s when we were all just daft naive teenagers in search of something unusual ….. you lot will be putting on masters degrees and PHD’s on NS next!! LOL 

I'm sure you understood what I meant; it was a factual observation. In terms of any whiffy superiority I think you can claim that hat by reading far too much into what I said. Obviously, you feel the need to try and defend the subject matter of your thread, well done for having the strength of your convictions. 

Me, I'm just an inferior so and so - and I don't claim to be anything other. 

Peter

Edited December 9 by Peter99
typo