Phyllis Brown & Dolly & the Fashions Connection

[Tlscapital]

Straightening things on Discogs and 45cat.com between the 3 Phyllis Brown discographies (Cali, Texas and Ohio) I see now that her pink label pressing variation on Rainbo records of 'oh baby !' B / W 'why' features Dolly & the Fashions from 'the right one' on Ivanhoe Records and 'absence made my heart grow founder' on Tri Disc.

This peculiar credit addition is featured only on the pink release that I only noticed now as I don't own this pink variation and before didn't bother to look closer as to what made them different beside the color variation... For this is a good record that is somehow of a 'taking dust' Northern sound that only got DJ action when first played...

The composer Cliff Chambers (also named Willie Headen as singer) and his Cupid Publishing Co. also add to establish the connection between this Phyllis Brown of 'oh baby !' B : W 'why' on Rainbo Records (featuring Dolly + Fashions) and both the previous Dolly & the Fashions records to definitively be one and the same gang at work.

It is proposed by some on 45cat.com that Dolly is Dolores Hall. This through the James Carmichael & Earl Nelson, Bob Relf, Fred Smith involvements on both Dolly & the Fashions singles that would then take her to Keymen and Mirwood... Although to my ears the singing of Dolores Hall and Dolly of the Fashions don't really match IMHO.

Later by 1967 this Cali Phyllis Brown of ours here joined the Babies. A girl group that got 2 releases on Dunhill. One covering Jerry Butler's 'you make me feel like someone'. The Babies were aiming for bigger things but judging by the number of stock copies versus promos to be found on the market the success was not met.

Anyway could this white girl here named Phyllis Brown also be a previously member of the Fashions and went on to do this solo effort on rainbow Records and then went to chance bigger things as lead singer in the Babies group ? Would anyone know better if Dolly & the Fashions are actually related to this Phyllis Brown and if so how ?

            November 1963                                       March 1965                                      

  

                         1965                                                      1965

 

Edited May 8 by Tlscapital

[Mal C]

Just adding some info Tim, 'Oh Baby' and the brill flip 'Why' were both recorded at Gold Star Studios, 6243 Santa Monica Blvd, Los Angeles, California. I read as 'OB' was played in the UK by John Vincent at Wigan in 1975.

I have 1966 as the release date, maybe 65 was when the Rainbo 45 was recorded.

[Tlscapital]

1 hour ago, Mal C said:

Just adding some info Tim, 'Oh Baby' and the brill flip 'Why' were both recorded at Gold Star Studios, 6243 Santa Monica Blvd, Los Angeles, California. I read as 'OB' was played in the UK by John Vincent at Wigan in 1975.

I have 1966 as the release date, maybe 65 was when the Rainbo 45 was recorded.

Don't know for 1966 as the few 4 singles released on that Rainbo records company are all dated by 1965 on 45cat.com. But without better reference like Bill Board or Music World charts or review for example but the link with both Cliff Chambers composer and the Dolly & the Fashions last single indicate to me like a close time frame rather than a lengthy one and the Ivanhoe has a year of release.

Thanks for that John Vincent play by 1975 tip. Likely as I said a now (for a while but could be proven wrong) a 'dusty' oldie NS sound that could still have got some exposure 10 years after on the decks in less forwarded progressive (doesn't necessarily mean positive to me) clubs hence it's inclusion on that 1985 Soul Supply compilation 'soulful kinda music' but not so much after I'd believe as I never heard it out...

Edited May 8 by Tlscapital

[Blackpoolsoul]

2 hours ago, Tlscapital said:

Straightening things on Discogs and 45cat.com between the 3 Phyllis Brown discographies (Cali, Texas and Ohio) I see now that her pink label pressing variation on Rainbo records of 'oh baby !' B / W 'why' features Dolly & the Fashions from 'the right one' on Ivanhoe Records and 'absence made my heart grow founder' on Tri Disc.

This peculiar credit addition is featured only on the pink release that I only noticed now as I don't own this pink variation and before didn't bother to look closer as to what made them different beside the color variation... For this is a good record that is somehow of a 'taking dust' Northern sound that only got DJ action when first played...

The composer Cliff Chambers (also named Willie Headen as singer) and his Cupid Publishing Co. also add to establish the connection between this Phyllis Brown of 'oh baby !' B : W 'why' on Rainbo Records (featuring Dolly + Fashions) and both the previous Dolly & the Fashions records to definitively be one and the same gang at work.

It is proposed by some on 45cat.com that Dolly is Dolores Hall. This through the James Carmichael & Earl Nelson, Bob Relf, Fred Smith involvements on both Dolly & the Fashions singles that would then take her to Keymen and Mirwood... Although to my ears the singing of Dolores Hall and Dolly of the Fashions don't really match IMHO.

Later by 1967 this Cali Phyllis Brown of ours here joined the Babies. A girl group that got 2 releases on Dunhill. One covering Jerry Butler's 'you make me feel like someone'. The Babies were aiming for bigger things but judging by the number of stock copies versus promos to be found on the market the success was not met.

Anyway could this white girl here named Phyllis Brown also be a previously member of the Fashions and went on to do this solo effort on rainbow Records and then went to chance bigger things as lead singer in the Babies group ? Would anyone know better if Dolly & the Fashions are actually related to this Phyllis Brown and if so how ?

            November 1963                                       March 1965                                      

  

                         1965                                                      1965

 

Her full name is Phyllis Marie Brown Threatt and I noticed somewhere in 2021 that she made a comment about some info being incorrect on her recording/s. After that when "Sonny" died last summer and I never tried to make contact during her obvious grief.

 

[Tlscapital]

1 hour ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

Her full name is Phyllis Marie Brown Threatt and I noticed somewhere in 2021 that she made a comment about some info being incorrect on her recording/s. After that when "Sonny" died last summer and I never tried to make contact during her obvious grief.

 

Well careful here as these 3 girls are not one and the same. This Phyllis Heidi Brown / Threatt (spouse of Sonny Threatt) is the white Southern Carolina girl who sang first in the Nomads on Mo-Groov then after together with Sonny (Sunny) went to Texas to record for the Major Bill Smith's stalls to enjoy little fame.

Then there's Phyllis 'Charity' Brown from Ohio that sung first for the in-famous Dawn 'rain' once Northern Soul HIT wonder group before going solo under the 'Charity' surname... And finally this third California Phyllis Brown that was also white and leaning into 'soul' music too. Better known as lead in the Babies on Dunhill.

Edited May 8 by Tlscapital

[Robbk]

11 hours ago, Tlscapital said:

Don't know for 1966 as the few 4 singles released on that Rainbo records company are all dated by 1965 on 45cat.com. But without better reference like Bill Board or Music World charts or review for example but the link with both Cliff Chambers composer and the Dolly & the Fashions last single indicate to me like a close time frame rather than a lengthy one and the Ivanhoe has a year of release.

Thanks for that John Vincent play by 1975 tip. Likely as I said a now (for a while but could be proven wrong) a 'dusty' oldie NS sound that could still have got some exposure 10 years after on the decks in less forwarded progressive (doesn't necessarily mean positive to me) clubs hence it's inclusion on that 1985 Soul Supply compilation 'soulful kinda music' but not so much after I'd believe as I never heard it out...

I would guess that Dolly of Dolly and The Fashions was NOT Dolores Hall, who it seems to me, had a deeper and fuller singing voice and more range than Dolly.  The two voices seem to sound very much like different people.

[Blackpoolsoul]

14 hours ago, Tlscapital said:

Well careful here as these 3 girls are not one and the same. This Phyllis Heidi Brown / Threatt (spouse of Sonny Threatt) is the white Southern Carolina girl who sang first in the Nomads on Mo-Groov then after together with Sonny (Sunny) went to Texas to record for the Major Bill Smith's stalls to enjoy little fame.

Then there's Phyllis 'Charity' Brown from Ohio that sung first for the in-famous Dawn 'rain' once Northern Soul HIT wonder group before going solo under the 'Charity' surname... And finally this third California Phyllis Brown that was also white and leaning into 'soul' music too. Better known as lead in the Babies on Dunhill.

This thread from 4 years ago was good

 

[Blackpoolsoul]

14 hours ago, Tlscapital said:

Well careful here as these 3 girls are not one and the same. This Phyllis Heidi Brown / Threatt (spouse of Sonny Threatt) is the white Southern Carolina girl who sang first in the Nomads on Mo-Groov then after together with Sonny (Sunny) went to Texas to record for the Major Bill Smith's stalls to enjoy little fame.

Then there's Phyllis 'Charity' Brown from Ohio that sung first for the in-famous Dawn 'rain' once Northern Soul HIT wonder group before going solo under the 'Charity' surname... And finally this third California Phyllis Brown that was also white and leaning into 'soul' music too. Better known as lead in the Babies on Dunhill.

I assume you have seen the youtube video which quotes 

 

"(Rainbo 1001) Presented here is the A-side of a rare and highly desired slab of vinyl sought out by collectors of obscure 1960's Los Angeles Soul. Featuring the voice of sixteen year old Phyllis Brown, 'Why' was also composed by the young and soulful artist. Miss Brown was provided with quite a musical education growing up as her father was the founder of Rainbo Records which was housed within the Rainbo pressing plant on North Las Palmas Boulevard in Hollywood. Commencing in 1939, not only 45, 33 and 78 r.p.m. discs were manufactured at the Rainbo pressing facility but also records that were inside of toy dolls, flexi-discs and records on the back of cardboard cereal boxes were made there. By the time Phyllis was a young teen, crates of freshly pressed recordings, most notably, fine R&B specimens were at her fingertips begging to be listened to and absorbed which is exactly what she did. In 1966, Phyllis was booked at a session at Hollywood's Gold Star Recording Studios where two tracks, 'Why' and the Cliff Chambers dancer, 'Oh Baby!' were cut. In a musical style similar to that of the work of Gene Page, Fred Darian and Raul Abeyta, oddly no arranger credit was given on the label but whoever it was, they along with an ensemble of L.A.'s 'Wrecking Crew' successfully created a double-sided masterpiece that showcased the soulful voice of Phyllis Brown surrounded by the magical reverberation of the Gold Star echo chamber. Pressed in a miniscule run, both yellow and pink colored labels were pasted on 45's cranked out on the Rainbo label. The following year, Phyllis along with three other girls formed the group, The Babies and issued a couple of slick L.A. Pop singles on Dunhill that are highly recommended and worth seeking out. Phyllis continued to have a lucrative career recording demos for other songwriters as well as composing and making music as a solo artist and also with Sunny Threatt. In 2018 after a thirty-five year gap in making music, Phyllis continued to share her gift by recording an albums worth of material entitled, 'Songs I Haven't Forgotten'."
 

[Tlscapital]

No I didn't. But thanks for that lovely well written slab of bio. Five stars. Although it doesn't mention the involvement of Dolly & the Fashions (credited only on the pink release) in this session it does shed light on the involvement of other 'big' names from the then 'Hip' Cali musical scene for this daddy's daughter little vanity record on his own label Rainbow records that is.

So we could guess that daddy also paid for Dolly and her Fashions to be present during this studio session but in the end only to lend their backing vocals over Phyllis's 'oh baby !' just love the way you love ... my sweet baby, darlin' baby break and refrain... without further connection between Dolly & the Fashion and our Cali Phyllis Brown daughter of Rainbo records's boss.

Edited May 9 by Tlscapital

[Kenb]

Gold Star a month after it closed in 1984.

Also, Effie Smith was the main exec behind Tri Disc. ( and possibly a lesser exec for the Marc label)

 

Edited May 9 by Kenb
correction

[Graham Anthony]

Dolly and The (Her) Fashions were sisters Doretha and Loretha Moody who had been gospel singers in their fathers church before backing Zeke Strong as the Queen Tones and then becoming Dolly and The Fashions. Info courtesy of Steve Propes.

[Blackpoolsoul]

2 minutes ago, Graham Anthony said:

Dolly and The (Her) Fashions were sisters Doretha and Loretha Moody who had been gospel singers in their fathers church before backing Zeke Strong as the Queen Tones and then becoming Dolly and The Fashions. Info courtesy of Steve Propes.

In the thread from 2019 (above) it also says they were a trio, Doretha, Loretta "and" their cousin Shirley Allen. 

[Kenb]

1 hour ago, Graham Anthony said:

Dolly and The (Her) Fashions were sisters Doretha and Loretha Moody who had been gospel singers in their fathers church before backing Zeke Strong as the Queen Tones and then becoming Dolly and The Fashions. Info courtesy of Steve Propes.

I'm not saying you or anyone else is wrong...but i have them as Doretha and Lolietha. And that came from a 1967 delinquent tax report, which you wouldn't have thought got it wrong.

Edited May 9 by Kenb

[Robbk]

1 hour ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

In the thread from 2019 (above) it also says they were a trio, Doretha, Loretta "and" their cousin Shirley Allen. 

They sounded a lot more like there were three of them, and that the 3rd wasn't an overdub of one of the 2.