reggae at soul nights?

[petegroover]

back in the seventies around london,from time to time reggae tunes got played at the end of the nights,was this a london thing? the tunes allways went down well and it seemed a pity when it got droped as it was a fun knees up end to the nights,ps it was old reggae tunes

Edited May 3 by petegroover

[Tlscapital]

My 2 cents. Sorry if I come a bit 'negative' but such is my own experience of it. Not a Londoner so indeed I can't relate to such an experience and born only in 1970 when the world had change by then and so did the scenes too. Still I read some about it and get the thing and picture what it was made of and what was 'fresh' as 'rooted' with it.

Coming from the Jamaican side of music things I always preferred the fully segregated sounds for 100% in-deep immersion of rare, in vogue and connoisseur sounds. This applies for my soul nights as well. Although I always enjoyed the lighter social gatherings of such 'soul & ska' social nights playing mostly 'easy' and 'accessible' sounds.

On the 'rare' soul and northern soul scene I always found the bits of "Jamaican" imported sounds at those do's mostly not to my liking. Often records I even use to diss when I was into the Jamaican sounds. The first time I endured that I was in awe. Found it a poor 'alternative' in sing-a-long and danceable sounds. With 'rare soul' tag priced on them 

My (not only mine) best experience in 'mixing' both in one night was on boat (that remained on the docks) with the upstairs room dedicated to 'soul' dee-jays and the 'basement' for Jamaican sounds. Both dishing out great sounds from humble and less humble collectors for a catchy and rare sounds mixture that thrilled all those who attended.

Edited May 1 by Tlscapital

[Shinehead]

Soul is my main love but I am partial to reggae and ska but at a event not for me no problem though with a different room playing reggae.

[Chalky]

No no no no....no

[Modernsoulsucks]

OK at those "anything goes" Sunday afternoon spots.

[Carty]

 There are some incredibly soulful Reggae sounds out there , The Rocksteady era and the  Studio 1  catalogue is full of them, especially the mid to late 60s to early 70s.     Anyone  not familiar with  Carlton and the Shoes , The Heptones , or pretty much anything with Vin Gordon on Trombone from this period , along with hundreds more , will be richly rewarded by taking a listen.                                                                                                                                              

[Timbo58]

In a separate room, yes. Not otherwise.

Just my personal preference anyway.

[Leicester Boy]

Northern my first love but ska and reggae in another room is fine especially weekenders. 

[Vadnochka]

Dave Wilkins who like me has been around since the mid 60's now does a Ska / Reggae night on different dates from his regular soul nights at the Tamworth Progressive club - both worth a look if either are your thing. Good venue as well.

Also I remember Tim Brown auctioning an absolute fantastic pounding Jamaican 45 a few years ago - made a note of it somewhere but it's lost - and I remember going to the Nite-Owl Birmingham a few yrs ago ( all-nighter) and a punter gave Carl & Maria Willingham some right stick for playing a reggae type sound. I told she'd better stick with George Pepp and the Tomangoes - So she did and dedicated them to me.

[Ian Parker]

On 01/05/2024 at 19:55, Chalky said:

No no no no....no

not just me then ?    im with chalky...

[Wilxy]

10 hours ago, Ian Parker said:

not just me then ?    im with chalky...

As am I, Whilst not anti Reggae by any stretch of the imagination...It's a definite NO from me!

[22ndsoul]

Been saying this for a while,definate NO from me also and i don't mind reggae but played at a reggae night !

[petegroover]

so it must have been a london thing is what i'm getting? i first heard it way before the 100 club started in 78 or 79?  there was a fair few original mods & suede heads about- so i guess it was an early days rare soul thing?  i see no reason not to bring it back,obviously the tunes must be soufull and just a couple at the end,not a big deal,just breaking things up a bit,trying to make it interesting,,looks like i'm on my own,not the first or last time ,i travel alone gladly,ps i've heard loads of mega crap soul played at big venues,so  wtf?

Edited May 6 by petegroover

[Catsprint]

I’ve never understood advertised Soul, Motown & Northern Soul events that play Reggae and Ska, not for me.

[Constellation161]

Good to read these comments, glad to say I’m not the only one that thinks reggae at a soul night is a no no.

[Mal C]

I'd say no at an actual proper Soul do, I guess this has to do with the kind of event, if it's a Scooter do, or something like Tony Renold's Outrigger reunions, then I'd expect it...

I guess folks do have to put their hands up to tracks like Glen Miller & Boris Gardiner (Bronco). 

 

 

[Returned Ringo]

29 minutes ago, Mal C said:

I'd say no at an actual proper Soul do, I guess this has to do with the kind of event, if it's a Scooter do, or something like Tony Renold's Outrigger reunions, then I'd expect it...

I guess folks do have to put their hands up to tracks like Glen Miller & Boris Gardiner (Bronco). 

 

 

Which Boris Gardiner on Bronco - there should be two

[Tlscapital]

2 minutes ago, Returned Ringo said:

Which Boris Gardiner on Bronco - there should be two

'More than words can say' off course 

[Returned Ringo]

2 minutes ago, Tlscapital said:

'More than words can say' off course 

I rate Forever and a day even better. Blank, credited to Orville Wood on some sources but sounds like Boris Gardiner to me

[Tlscapital]

2 minutes ago, Returned Ringo said:

I rate Forever and a day even better. Blank, credited to Orville Wood on some sources but sounds like Boris Gardiner to me

OK thanks. It was unknown to me. Preferring the reggae flip though. To each its own. For me Jamaican doing their soul stuffs is like Americans doing their ska or reggae sounds... Never fully sounded so right to my ears. With few exceptions to like (not even of the rare kind necessary) but never or so rarely to adore.

When I was deep into the Jamaican stuffs most of these now supposed soul Jamaican records were not well regarded by most and barely selling whenever. And I was adventurous with all the weird things I picked to train my ears with those peanuts Jamaican related records nobody else want so not shy or opinionated.

Although I always loved my 'soulful' ska, rock-steady and reggae sounds. Always preferring the Jamaicans doing their things and the Americans doing theirs. If I still can enjoy deep nitty-gritty Jamaican connoisseur DJ spots, like on a 'blues' night, a MOR 'classic' ska & reggae fan DJ selection will bore me instantly.

Like a Northern Soul DJ filling a spot gap with such Jamaican sounds at a soul nights with predictable Jamaican sounds is just depressing to me. The other way around the same IMHO. Both will inevitably 'surf' on the surface of what these sounds have most "accessible" to a broad crowd. Which is not what I'm in for.

[Kev Cane]

No chance, East Detroit, South Side of Chicago, Cleveland Ohio, North Philly, Palmer Park DC , etc al,  Reggae has no place amongst the American ghetto that gave us the incredible concept that is SOUL music, folk have got to realise, that this phenomenon was never meant for white folk in a dance hall in England, Europe etc, it was meant for Afro Americans, in the the 60s and 70s, to forget their depair in the ghetto, and let their frustrations out on a Saturday night, so where Reggae comes into this is beyond me 

Kev

[Tlscapital]

1 minute ago, Kev Cane said:

No chance, East Detroit, South Side of Chicago, Cleveland Ohio, North Philly, Palmer Park DC , etc al,  Reggae has no place amongst the American ghetto that gave us the incredible concept that is SOUL music, folk have got to realise, that this phenomenon was never meant for white folk in a dance hall in England, Europe etc, it was meant for Afro Americans, in the the 60s and 70s, to forget their depair in the ghetto, and let their frustrations out on a Saturday night, so where Reggae comes into this is beyond me 

Kev

Uh ! Sorry but we're taking the British phenomenon here taking roots in the rare soul scene here where a lot of the so called 'soul boys' were ex 'hard' mods or even skinheads and suedeheads who for some were also into the Jamaican sounds... Were both scenes had a lot of bridges.

Hence that even at in those 'blues' West Indian nights they also played a lot of their beloved so called American "soul" sounds with such favorites like Willie Tee 'walking up', Sam Cooke 'Chain Gang' and other classics of the likes so this is where we're coming from on here. 

[Kev Cane]

Nice record from King Charles, and the Wailers on Coxone is good, but, few and far between, you can talk as long as you like about the mods and skinheads, but, the appreciation, and understanding of REAL Soul music, and it's purpose, weren't really appreciated IMH, over here, until the mid 80,s onwards, whenst, no longer was the DJ king, collectors embarking on their own digging expeditions t,other side of the pond, unearthing the real stuff,  no patronising here, just saying it as I saw it, Reggae had no place at all at any of the magnificent progressive Soul venues I frequented, totally different genre for me, I'm only answering the subject matter, Reggae, for me, has no place at bona fide SOUL events 

Kev 

[petegroover]

ok so glad i mentioned this-not

[Woodbutcher]

1 hour ago, petegroover said:

ok so glad i mentioned this-not

[Lamont]

On 01/05/2024 at 17:10, Tlscapital said:

My 2 cents. Sorry if I come a bit 'negative' but such is my own experience of it. Not a Londoner so indeed I can't relate to such an experience and born only in 1970 when the world had change by then and so did the scenes too. Still I read some about it and get the thing and picture what it was made of and what was 'fresh' as 'rooted' with it.

Coming from the Jamaican side of music things I always preferred the fully segregated sounds for 100% in-deep immersion of rare, in vogue and connoisseur sounds. This applies for my soul nights as well. Although I always enjoyed the lighter social gatherings of such 'soul & ska' social nights playing mostly 'easy' and 'accessible' sounds.

On the 'rare' soul and northern soul scene I always found the bits of "Jamaican" imported sounds at those do's mostly not to my liking. Often records I even use to diss when I was into the Jamaican sounds. The first time I endured that I was in awe. Found it a poor 'alternative' in sing-a-long and danceable sounds. With 'rare soul' tag priced on them 

My (not only mine) best experience in 'mixing' both in one night was on boat (that remained on the docks) with the upstairs room dedicated to 'soul' dee-jays and the 'basement' for Jamaican sounds. Both dishing out great sounds from humble and less humble collectors for a catchy and rare sounds mixture that thrilled all those who attended.

Are you talking Roots & Rockers material?

[Tlscapital]

28 minutes ago, Lamont said:

Are you talking Roots & Rockers material?

No why ? The Roots and Rockers things and scenes definitely didn't mix that well with others or briefly only and merely on the surface with the RAR late seventies London thingy. But that was more politically oriented than real music bliss...  So am talking rather about the earlier days in the late sixties up to the early seventies when American sounds played  by the Jamaicans next to their owns appealed to some British kids that shared these sound imprints to grow their hits of their own too. Sharing 'common grounds'.

Back in the late sixties in the UK at the intersections of these flourishing emerging scenes came into parallel more purists scenes like the 'Revive' Jamaican and the 'rare soul' scene. Cutting off these 'bridges'. The nostalgia for more accessible do's after the 2-Tone craze and the Mod "revival" allowed some dedicated to original 'underground' side of things went on to promote such 'cross-over' events all over again. Elder nostalgic Jamaican folks in London at least kept on having that 'tradition' all along though...

Not trying to teach or preach here but since I believe that the OP was referring to such musical events I thought I'd give my insights having attended all of these and have pursued to prefer mostly the segregated musical policy events. And so aiming to explain why I believe most elders will prefer to keep them sounds separated. Knowing that it's hard enough to please one and the same crowd with one 'connoisseur' sounds only. Adding different music genres on one night evidently makes it even more troublesome. 

[Lamont]

Your absolutely correct, but i'm a huge Roots & Culture collector, Soul has always been first for me from my first Northern love from 1969 to early 2K Soul, it's very rare you meet collectors that like both and the people i know are all based in the South, i was just wondering.

The heavier Roots music gets the more i personally enjoy

Edited May 15 by Lamont

[Shane Cosgrove]

Reggae at a Northern or rare soul do big no, no for me. At a mod do, or a gig where DJ's are showcasing their tunes of different genres no issues. Most gigs I do here in Manila are often Northern Soul, Motown, Ska and Reggae do's but they are advertised as that. Sometimes Modern Soul and House.

[Mark S]

Despite Toots and the Maytalls Reggae got soul still dont want it at a soul do.                  

 

[petegroover]

shall we all just kill my post,obviously it's not working/worth the agro

[Shinehead]

23 minutes ago, petegroover said:

shall we all just kill my post,obviously it's not working/worth the agro

Can't see your problem, you ask a question and awaited answers and most people said Reggae at Soul do,s was a no, which is fine by me. 

I like reggae but I keep it separate when I play it at home, i.e I will have a few days when that is all I play but never mix it with soul to different in my view to play together , so going out and hearing it mixed with soul is defo a no even at the end of the night.

Edited May 15 by Shinehead

[Tlscapital]

8 hours ago, Lamont said:

Your absolutely correct, but i'm a huge Roots & Culture collector, Soul has always been first for me from my first Northern love from 1969 to early 2K Soul, it's very rare you meet collectors that like both and the people i know are all based in the South, i was just wondering.

The heavier Roots music gets the more i personally enjoy

Well I'm to other way around and felt more than once disgusted early (at the age of 17) with the sudden ska, rock-steady and reggae records prices shoot-up at first then later with a dreadful plastic commercialist avail of Carnaby skinheads bloom to doom it all for me somehow. So involved then was I with my soul sounds (Northern, deep, sweet, modern groove...). Once in need of money to fund different things (no records) I sold out my collection of Jamaican stuffs to 2 friends. It was good need money then. Now it would be much more though... Stil enjoying my friends sharing their Jamaican discoveries. although rarely bluffed. But still occasionally a new 'old' love struck happens.

Anyway I still love the Jamaican sounds  but couldn't afford to deal with collecting both and when I attend such venues like for soul sounds am most critical. But whenI love I love. Liking is not enough. So after doing my rounds with the Jamaican sounds 15 years I understood that besides discovering new tunes new sounds just wouldn't happen. No matter how further I pushed my musical earbuds tolerance. Soul sounds on the other hand is much more vast. The roots reggae sound never really hooked me. Although the 'bluesy' wailing singer on a low down nitty gritty heavy rhythm sounds most appealing the mixture never really caught on me. And I've tried back then but I never...

But respect to you and those who know what they love. Thrilled my friend who bought my firsthalf of Jamaican collection came to my place the other day to play on my respectable MONO phono rig his latest 45 finds and in there Burning Spear's first ever 45 and he was so thrilled with it (body talk) yet it kind of left me cold. Although I heard and understand the quality about it and why some go crazy for that, my ears sensitivity just don't react to that. And where he sometimes favor the 'vocal' side I still like before favor the plain 'version' flip for a dull 'hypnotic' (to me) or boring (to others) rhythm with basic bass variations. Could I dig roots and bass culture 'dubs' & 'versions' only ?  

[Leicester Boy]

39 minutes ago, petegroover said:

shall we all just kill my post,obviously it's not working/worth the agro

Not agro, this forum often has frank exchanges,  I think at something like a weekender it's fine to have it in a separate room, it certainly beats listening to the 6th playing of some overplayed top 500 spin.

[Carty]

1 hour ago, petegroover said:

shall we all just kill my post,obviously it's not working/worth the agro

Just different opinions Pete , Personally ,  I enjoy the "Club a go go " type selections Sean Chapman does , as long as the music played is the music advertised , its all good , if however its advertised as lets say a reggae and ska night and Northern is played ( or vice versa of course ) then its a false bill of goods . 

[petegroover]

yea fair comment carty and leicester boy,i do get that and agree, i guess i'm going way back to  when events were called a soul nite, o a rare soul night,so lot more scope to bung things in,though what was called rare then omg

[Greedy]

Looking forward to Blackpool and hearing proper Northern again.  God forbid we like something a little different ️koko . Ktf etc

Edited May 18 by Mrmick
Spelling

[Woodbutcher]

Just imagine it the other way around , would anyone want to hear F***k W****n at a reggae night , absolutely not !

 

Probably the wrong example as nobody really wants to hear it at a soul night either ...