How Much Longer Can It Last?

[Guest]

I'm still loving it at 36 & dont see it dying at all. The only old grumpy man I know is my other half because he's fed up of me going out every weekend

[Stevie T]

WATCH ME !!!!....OW!!...dear lord have started dancing already,middleton is not until saturday...

silly old bugger........

[KevH]

Everyone...take a few minutes out like i just did, go and put a couple of your favorite tunes on and then come back on here and explain why we all do this?

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

just did,....just have,....."hairs on the back of the neck time".

As Bobby Byrd said

" I KNOW YOU GOT SOUL" (IF YOU DIDN'T YOU WOULDN'T BE HERE) .and we're all still here!!!!.

[Dave Moore]

Northern Soul= The Elixir of life, and I for one am a 52 year old youth,albeit I do avoid mirrors,but I love the whole experience warts and all, more than ever. Just do it

Regards,

Dav e

www.theresthatbeat.com

www.hitsvillesoulclub.com

[Modernsoulsucks]

"You're right about the irrelevance of whether a tune was played in the 70s, well known to us or rare.. to the younger people the music is all relatively new"

Why is this an irrelevance? For a lot of us who have stuck with it I would imagine we're not particularly interested in hearing records we've either got or have heard in the past. Might be new to young people but it's not particularly exciting for me.

Again it's admitted by Dave that this young scene will probably be seperate which is my whole point. Enjot what you've got and don't expect much to change as it seems to be getting along fine right now.

ROD

[Dave]

"You're right about the irrelevance of whether a tune was played in the 70s, well known to us or rare.. to the younger people the music is all relatively new"

Why is this an irrelevance? For a lot of us who have stuck with it I would imagine we're not particularly interested in hearing records we've either got or have heard in the past. Might be new to young people but it's not particularly exciting for me.

Again it's admitted by Dave that this young scene will probably be seperate which is my whole point. Enjot what you've got and don't expect much to change as it seems to be getting along fine right now.

ROD

Like I said, it's irrelevant to the people Steve was talking about. Not to our generation, but that's a different matter.

[Madmandy]

Revival

Simon, I think it's a forgone conclusion that we will end up "looking like 'The Last of The Summer Wine' with a better soundtrack".

There are not enough youngsters on the scene to carry it on after we are dust.

So what I say?

Northernsoul is ours, it's not a precious legacy that has to be passed down, its only precious if those who hold think it so and if they don't then hey" fook em!!

No one has a crystal ball, but here is my prediction based on what happened to the Mod/Scootering scene that mirrors our in a slightly different way but the passion is identical.....

Were the mod/Scootering scene bubbled up with volcanic proportions was after the film Quadrophenia. This cave "New blood" into the scene.

The Northernsoul scene, I predict needs to or will do, die to raise phoenix like. What this will need is a catalyst that captures the imagination as did Quadrophenia, The Strange world of northernsoul sadly fell well short of the mark.

There is no formula, it's not enough just to know our music is quality, if in time some one re-discovers the re-discovered and it captures the imagination again then they will be off. God bless them coz they are in for a roller coaster of a ride, be nice to see it happen but we kinda all know we will be long forgotten, bugger!

The Punk scene came just as the youth were disillusioned with the shat on Top Of the Pops and the northernsoul scene was a secret under ground scene spawned against the chicken in a basket and crushed velvet jacket night clubs (yes I know there is more to it than that but I want to go and eat lunch soon!).

"The average age of the average Northern Soul punter is creeping towards the mid fifties and ill health (and worse) is becoming an issue for many". Didn't realy need reminding of that!

As far as the legacy is being tarnished by the rantings, well to be honest, no one listens, cares or realy gives a flying fook at what is said by a DJ or record dealer come collector, honest! There is life out side the record box.

They're all a bunch of train spotters who I used to take lunch money off at school who need the likes of "Soul Source" (tongue in cheek here dudes) to maintain the myth.

Fook me are there any dancers on this list? Coz I think I'm the only expert on here? :-) Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Here !!!! (waves hand in air) Im still dancin Matey!!!!

You ask Mark Bicknell!!!

Mand :O)

[Madmandy]

I'm still loving it at 36 & dont see it dying at all. The only old grumpy man I know is my other half because he's fed up of me going out every weekend

Hi Kirsty

Im gettin that now.... my blokey is gettin tired of N/S every weekend and we go out together!!

Mand

[Billywhizz]

The average age of the average Northern Soul punter is creeping towards the mid fifties and ill health (and worse) is becoming an issue for many.

At best things are increasingly more and more like an extended episode of drug addled, demented 'Grumpy Old Men'. Within three years it will be worse ...it'll be looking like 'The Last of The Summer Wine' with a better soundtrack.

There are many great ambassadors for the Northern Soul scene. And there are many terrible ones.

The Northern Soul scene's glorious past and the true wonder of the music we all love, the history of what is probably the longest running, most wonderful, passionate, eclectic youth cult in the UK is in danger of being dragged down by dementia, bitterness, selective memory and the refusal to relax the unwritten rules of 1974 while constantly flaunting them.

A younger crowd reading things on here would surely generally run a mile from the 'empty vessel' mentality of maudlin nostagia for things that happened more than 30 years ago? Like the protestations of a inmate of a care home refusing to get dressed in the morning, the semi delirious shouts against attempts to move forward in any way, shape, or form are getting louder, while the next generation, the caretakers, surely look on in horror, trying to understand why its happening and hoping the legacy isn't tarnished by the rantings?

How much longer can the whole thing last ?

simon, simon, simon ur talking about time, enjoy what we got, u only live twice, o by the way its the hardcore keeping the soul scene alive.

Billy P.S: I enjoyed your show the other week

[Guest]

Some very interesting answers.

More interesting is the amount of knee jerk defensiveness going on.

Why anyone sees my original post as 'moaning' is more interesting still maybe but some people will always focus on the bad side.

Sorry if a few have taken it personally, but I'm not saying anywhere that saying anywhere that carrying on into late middle age is somehow wrong but i am saying the 'head in the sand' attitude is going to kill it stone dead. Some bad news for a few...late 30's actually isn't young really !

The point of my posting was pure and simple. If there are not genuine amounts of new, and in this case it means 'young' people, are attracted it will die. And the attitudes I see recently means it doesn't have a hope in hell.

A few years back there were a number of genuinely good, younger deejays on the scene....Dave Flynn, Irish Greg, ect. We seem to have fallen backwards into pure nostalgia.

[ImberBoy]

"Backwards into pure nostalgia"? Not too sure if we are on the same page here?

This isn't personal and it's not going to be a dig at you honest.

Nostalgia, of course there is going to be a massive degree of nostalgia. We are mostly middle aged.

Fact, the young aren't queuing up to buy Spencer bags, fact, there is new music found, played and loved. I have been into this scene since I was 16 and I am now 45 just when I think I have heard every soulful tune going I am constantly, weekly reminded how good and fresh n vibrant the scene is!

I am lucky to live in South Yorkshire were northernsoul is as deeply rooted as our coal seams, The Frobisher soul Night the other week for instance I heard track after track that was new to me, fookin brilliant.

I took my youngest son to Eggborough the other week, his first ever soul do and he threw some shapes on the floor n busted some moves like a good un, I was well proud of him but he aint ever gonna wear pollyvelts n a Wrigley belt.

As me old pal Polly palmer used to say in Manifesto... its only a night out.

You can't kill what has never lived. The music will just get a bit dusty until its right for the next bunch of soulies to dust off n boogie.

I'll finish this with one last thought, our scene has never been so good.

[adamt]

speaking as the voice of one of the youngest on the scene, to be completely honest, i bloody hate most young kids, especially the trendy ones who try to get into the scene cause it's 'hip' now (i guess with the whole andy smith thing). Basically, what these kids don't understand is that the northern scene aint for pulling birds or getting sloshed as so much as it's for the love of the music, therefore most youth don't understand such an idea. I goto northern nights cause i love northern music and i love to dance to the songs. It really pisses me off when young kids come out and stand in the middle of the dance floor and spill their drinks everywhere and try to pickup birds, it just isn't really what it's all about. Also, from experience running an weekly indie night, youngsters seem to only dance to a song they know. Whenever i dj at an indie night some kid might request a song from an artist and if its a b-side or something they won't dance, and i play northern at my indie nights too. The reason i goto 100 club and such is to hear records played by djs such as butch, ady, mick smith, etc cause they may only be one in a few djs that have that record. I don't want to goto a night and hear records i already own, and that might become a problem if more kids get involved, it'll be the northern soul top 500 all over again.

now i know people might take the piss cause i'm quite young, but anybody who knows me will explain my problem with 'these kids today' and i just don't particularly like them and their attitude. If they give respect to the music and scene then that's great, but if they're there to pull birds and get pissed in the middle of the dance floor then i won't be too pleased.

anyhow, that's enough of my late night rant

[Guest Bearsy]

Some very interesting answers.

More interesting is the amount of knee jerk defensiveness going on.

Why anyone sees my original post as 'moaning' is more interesting still maybe but some people will always focus on the bad side.

Sorry if a few have taken it personally, but I'm not saying anywhere that saying anywhere that carrying on into late middle age is somehow wrong but i am saying the 'head in the sand' attitude is going to kill it stone dead. Some bad news for a few...late 30's actually isn't young really !

The point of my posting was pure and simple. If there are not genuine amounts of new, and in this case it means 'young' people, are attracted it will die. And the attitudes I see recently means it doesn't have a hope in hell.

A few years back there were a number of genuinely good, younger deejays on the scene....Dave Flynn, Irish Greg, ect. We seem to have fallen backwards into pure nostalgia.

You know how to make a young man feel old Simon

Im quite new to the scene and i have been made welcome from soulies of all ages and it does not bother me about anyones age younger or older than me as i am personally really enjoying what im getting out of the scene, and to be honest i am not too worried about the scene dieing on its arse because it aint moved forward enough for some peoples likings, thats their problem if their head is in the sand, as more fade away from the scene in the near and distant future im hoping i will still be around and enjoying it as much as today with new and old soulies, i read so much about the old days and how people travelled for great allnighters but today there really dont seem to need to travel as nigh on every weekend there is shitloads of events on and that in itself proves that the scene is vibrant and loved as much now as it has ever been for so many soulies. so if more fade away from the scene and not so many come into the scene all it means is that the scene will be more compact and less events maybe and then the need to travel a bit further afield for your fix of soul will be the norm, it could kind of rekindle the days of old, ok maybe not but it was a thought and here is another thought, quality will always survive and as long as there is another soulie out there then i will have someone to share this great scene of ours with.

Bearsy (a young 38)

[Guest nubes]

speaking as the voice of one of the youngest on the scene, to be completely honest, i bloody hate most young kids, especially the trendy ones who try to get into the scene cause it's 'hip' now (i guess with the whole andy smith thing). Basically, what these kids don't understand is that the northern scene aint for pulling birds or getting sloshed as so much as it's for the love of the music, therefore most youth don't understand such an idea. I goto northern nights cause i love northern music and i love to dance to the songs. It really pisses me off when young kids come out and stand in the middle of the dance floor and spill their drinks everywhere and try to pickup birds, it just isn't really what it's all about. Also, from experience running an weekly indie night, youngsters seem to only dance to a song they know. Whenever i dj at an indie night some kid might request a song from an artist and if its a b-side or something they won't dance, and i play northern at my indie nights too. The reason i goto 100 club and such is to hear records played by djs such as butch, ady, mick smith, etc cause they may only be one in a few djs that have that record. I don't want to goto a night and hear records i already own, and that might become a problem if more kids get involved, it'll be the northern soul top 500 all over again.

now i know people might take the piss cause i'm quite young, but anybody who knows me will explain my problem with 'these kids today' and i just don't particularly like them and their attitude. If they give respect to the music and scene then that's great, but if they're there to pull birds and get pissed in the middle of the dance floor then i won't be too pleased.

anyhow, that's enough of my late night rant

My God...close my eyes...and you sound like someone from the long distance past...that is not a critisicm my friend......you have just echoed what most folk who are into rare soul feel.....You have soul in your heart and always will.....long may it last..to me... you have proved that the ethics behind the rare soul scene will never die....and if there are moe like you...then most of us 'near pensioners' can now rest assured that the music will always carry on.....your attitude towards 'kids today' is no different to our attittudes 20-30+ years ago to non soulies our age.. take care.....take care Delxx

[Guest]

In my oppinion the Soul Scene has never been better !

Prestatyn this weekend with 5000 or whatever people grooving to all kinds of Soulful tunes.

People returning to the scene all the time. Richard S doing his thing on RADIO 2 every Sat..................Mark Bicknell and Solar Radio......Ms Fox doing radio stoke..................Has and Di with "The Right Track" Wythenshaw FM.........................and I could go on and on!

Northern Soul is doing well ............................Sites like this one where we can find out almost anything we need to know about Soul music!

Record collecting is still massivley popular with collectors and Djs still as mad as ever!

Respect to all the DJs, Promoters, internet people, - All the passionate Soulfans that are doing their thing for one reason - for the love and promotion of Soulmusic!

Why worry about somthing dying out when it is clearly so healthy and growing?

See you all at Prestatyn with the other many thousands of "Soulboys n Girls"

Edited March 10, 2007 by mossy

[Guest]

bit severe Simon and have to say not the way I see things on here at all

if anything feel such posts like yours could cause more damage than the odd grumpy post as imo does gives a false picture.

average age mid 50s ???

would argue with that one

as for what the "younger crowd" think ??

loads of members on here who I would say fall into that category

why dont you ask them?

sorry but have to say to me comes over as the very thing you are complaining about...

a grumpy old man post

Mike, must have missed your post yesterday.

In what way does promoting debate 'cause damage' ? Surely no more than any other post on Soul Source and, I would argue actually less then some.

I would like to point out that I did post 'the average age.... is creeping towards..." not, as you say "average age is mid 50's...".

As for why don't I ask them? Thats exactly what I'm doing.

My post is not a complaint. It's an observation with a question at the end. "How long can it last?"

Some have taken that bit and answered it. There are some very positive stories from members regarding younger punters, but frankly, few actualities from younger punters. But I hope they are right and being a positive person I applaud them and agree with them.

But some of the reactions have been astonishing and very "OTT" and seem to have been taken as a personal attack, for which I apologise as my intention was not to attack anyone personally.

But surely some of those reactions are exactly the sort of thing that would put any youngster, off the 'scene' ?

[Billywhizz]

Hi Kirsty

Im gettin that now.... my blokey is gettin tired of N/S every weekend and we go out together!!

Mand

Oh dear oviously no ones up for 2 allnighter and a alldayer the weekend lol.

Billy

[Jumpinjoan]

Mike, must have missed your post yesterday.

In what way does promoting debate 'cause damage' ? Surely no more than any other post on Soul Source and, I would argue actually less then some.

I would like to point out that I did post 'the average age.... is creeping towards..." not, as you say "average age is mid 50's...".

As for why don't I ask them? Thats exactly what I'm doing.

My post is not a complaint. It's an observation with a question at the end. "How long can it last?"

Some have taken that bit and answered it. There are some very positive stories from members regarding younger punters, but frankly, few actualities from younger punters. But I hope they are right and being a positive person I applaud them and agree with them.

But some of the reactions have been astonishing and very "OTT" and seem to have been taken as a personal attack, for which I apologise as my intention was not to attack anyone personally.

But surely some of those reactions are exactly the sort of thing that would put any youngster, off the 'scene' ?

I'd say a load of old farts moaning and going round muttering... 'we're all doooomed' would put youngsters off more...(not that i'm saying you're a moaning old fart...)

They have no idea... nor care ... about the politics of the scene... and quite frankly... neither do i.

Come on people... lighten up... seems like a lot out there have forgotten how enjoyable the soul scene is...

[Guest James Trouble]

You lot are acting like Dad's Army, worried about the nazi invasion that never happens while the paratroopers are out there doing the business on the battle fields of Europe.

"We're all doooomed!"

The truth is that most reading this post are going to die before the "northern scene" does, so I suggest you do what I'm going to do tonight. Go out and enjoy it like it's your last night, just incase it is

Edited March 10, 2007 by James Trouble

[Guest Rowly]

You lot are acting like Dad's Army, worried about the nazi invasion that never happens while the paratroopers are out there doing the business on the battle fields of Europe.

"We're all doooomed!"

The truth is that most reading this post are going to die before the "northern scene" does, so I suggest you do what I'm going to do tonight. Go out and enjoy it like it's your last night, just incase it is

Blimey James - you're looking a bit startled in that pic mate!

[Chalky]

You lot are acting like Dad's Army, worried about the nazi invasion that never happens while the paratroopers are out there doing the business on the battle fields of Europe.

"We're all doooomed!"

The truth is that most reading this post are going to die before the "northern scene" does, so I suggest you do what I'm going to do tonight. Go out and enjoy it like it's your last night, just incase it is

well said, got better things to do than sit here going on about what might be sometime in the future. Enjoy it while you can

[Guest James Trouble]

Blimey James - you're looking a bit startled in that pic mate!

Nah mate, that's one of the Dad's Army clutching to his oldies rifle.

"Oh no, we don't use these new fangled sub machine guns. I'll stick to my tried and trusted oldies bolt action, it worked on the dance floor in 1978, it'll work again. Now where did I leave my trench shovel?"

Edited March 10, 2007 by James Trouble

[good angel]

Just been to the,Osteopath to treat my ostioarthritis ive had traction,Acupuncture about 20 plus needles in my back.WHEN IS THE NEXT NIGHTER, :fool:

Kev

[Guest Rowly]

Nah mate, that's one of the Dad's Army clutching to his oldies rifle.

Ah yes silly me. An uncany resembleance tho mate... must be those big wide staring eyes......

[ExYoungSoulie]

I like this thread! The thread started with the question of "when will it end?". Being a "youngster" I see things slightly differently to some perhaps. My background on NS is a way of life instilled into my by my parents. I've been very fortunate in that NS is all I've known from my own beginnings really. Growing up around soulies that would always be with the parents has given me the opportunity to know and love some brilliant characters from the scene. The conversation crops up now and again as to when will it end.

It seems to me that certain er... "old" soulies love the idea of the scene continuing, others seem very precious and want to take their records to the grave with them. Nostalgia then kicks in and people fear change. I, of course, never saw Wigan and the Torch etc, but attended soul-nites from around the age of 12/13... occasionally Dad would even let me carry his records!! For me, the last fifteen years hasn't changed much at all.

I really want the scene to remain because I love it, and soul music to me, means escapism from the rest of the world for a few hours in an environment where everyone is there for the music and there is no aggro.

The grown ups may at some point have to concede that record prices need to come down to make them available to a younger market. I only purchase CD's and this isn't so much a choice issue but cost... I can either save up for months for one track or buy a couple of CD's every month and hear the sounds.

It's essential that the experienced (now trying to find words other than old ;o) ) soulie embraces (I dont mean hug a hoodie) the very people that may just keep their dream alive.

Recent marketing campaigns have raised the profile of NS to a wider audience through Cat food ads (including KFC) and this really should be the springboard for the people that want to keep the scene alive to open it up to the masses. Naturally, some will say it's crap or for "old people". I now have mates that like the music because i've introduced it to them, and they love the way people dance, but the events simply dont appeal to them, due the current clientel and the "clickiness" that can be felt by youngsters.

So if we youngsters walk right on in... you have to stetch out your arms!

The scene will remain. I so advise.

[Guest]

Nah mate, that's one of the Dad's Army clutching to his oldies rifle.

"Oh no, we don't use these new fangled sub machine guns. I'll stick to my tried and trusted oldies bolt action, it worked on the dance floor in 1978, it'll work again. Now where did I leave my trench shovel?"

Is that why you cant dance Trouble...........trench foot

[Dave]

I like this thread! The thread started with the question of "when will it end?". Being a "youngster" I see things slightly differently to some perhaps. My background on NS is a way of life instilled into my by my parents. I've been very fortunate in that NS is all I've known from my own beginnings really. Growing up around soulies that would always be with the parents has given me the opportunity to know and love some brilliant characters from the scene. The conversation crops up now and again as to when will it end.

It seems to me that certain er... "old" soulies love the idea of the scene continuing, others seem very precious and want to take their records to the grave with them. Nostalgia then kicks in and people fear change. I, of course, never saw Wigan and the Torch etc, but attended soul-nites from around the age of 12/13... occasionally Dad would even let me carry his records!! For me, the last fifteen years hasn't changed much at all.

I really want the scene to remain because I love it, and soul music to me, means escapism from the rest of the world for a few hours in an environment where everyone is there for the music and there is no aggro.

The grown ups may at some point have to concede that record prices need to come down to make them available to a younger market. I only purchase CD's and this isn't so much a choice issue but cost... I can either save up for months for one track or buy a couple of CD's every month and hear the sounds.

It's essential that the experienced (now trying to find words other than old ;o) ) soulie embraces (I dont mean hug a hoodie) the very people that may just keep their dream alive.

Recent marketing campaigns have raised the profile of NS to a wider audience through Cat food ads (including KFC) and this really should be the springboard for the people that want to keep the scene alive to open it up to the masses. Naturally, some will say it's crap or for "old people". I now have mates that like the music because i've introduced it to them, and they love the way people dance, but the events simply dont appeal to them, due the current clientel and the "clickiness" that can be felt by youngsters.

So if we youngsters walk right on in... you have to stetch out your arms!

The scene will remain. I so advise.

Very well put, but I fear your hopes will be dashed.. there are too many old scrotes who are suspicious of anyone under 35 who has not passed the NS written exam

I hope for the sake of you and others like you a scene develops without the word "northern" attached that many current "soulies" will not want to attend.. then you may have a chance of newcomers discovering the music.

[ExYoungSoulie]

I think it would be a shame if "our" soul lost it's "northern" label. Having said that, I've heard mates say "I like Motown but not Northern Soul". This amazes me and is, in my humble opinion, purely down to saying you don't like something prior to tasting it. NS is an acquired taste and it takes time... I bet some people didnt like the taste of beer once upon a time but we all get there in the end!

If the label was gone, perhaps it could be sold to people as simply soul that they may not have heard before and introduce it slowly. This, I dare say, would fly in the face of many (perhaps myself included) who want NS to keep its identity but if the scene is to remain, why might not be able to have our cake and eat it...

[Guest Lynsey_Wez]

one of the earlier comments about the 'younger soulies being in their 30s' made me feel really old!

im 29 now, sighhhhhhh.........yes, 30 this year

i started listening to northern about 10 years ago but didnt pluck up the courage to actually go to my 1st soul night til i was about 22ish. kept going every so often then, for a couple of years until i was about 24ish when i just ended up going to a soul night / nighter nearly every weekend!

its just dawned on me that i still think of myself as a 24 year old youngie on the scene, but im actually nearly 30 now. aahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! big scream! wheres all that time gone?

the thing is......i am well aware that there is a huge age gap between me & the majority of people i meet at nighters, but it doesnt bother me in the slightest. i have lots of friends ive met just through northern soul, that are nearer my parents age than mine. when im out laughing...talking & dancing, no matter how old the people are - they are still just people. people that i can relate to because of the music & have a laugh. they might be telling me about what their kids have been upto & their kids are a similar age to me in their 20s, or a bit younger in their teens!

i think its great that it can be so diverse (people wise). i cant think of any other scene at the moment where this would also be possible, can you?

[Winnie :-)]

I think it would be a shame if "our" soul lost it's "northern" label. Having said that, I've heard mates say "I like Motown but not Northern Soul". This amazes me and is, in my humble opinion, purely down to saying you don't like something prior to tasting it. NS is an acquired taste and it takes time... I bet some people didnt like the taste of beer once upon a time but we all get there in the end!

If the label was gone, perhaps it could be sold to people as simply soul that they may not have heard before and introduce it slowly. This, I dare say, would fly in the face of many (perhaps myself included) who want NS to keep its identity but if the scene is to remain, why might not be able to have our cake and eat it...

=============

Good points, well put. I was trying to explain it to a couple of young girls at work, they didn't pick up on the 'northern' tag I'd added, both just said they love soul, so perhaps that is the way forward

Winnie:-)

[Guest]

Interesting, people's attitudes. Obviously me and my lesser half (!) love Soul in general and try to get friends along when we go out to NSoul events. Thing is, sometimes our friends are confronted with comments like, "you can't dance like that, don't you know about Northern step?" or something similar. True, probably not typical but at some events there is very much a "dress code", a "way of doing things" and so on.

Ok, so that's tradition, the way things have always been done but is that the way forward?

Not criticising, just pointing out.

So my friends would rather go to a night advertised as "Soul across the board" (or something) and we need people like my friends cos they're new blood. They're not over keen on the talc, the cliqueness (sp?) that most certainly exists. They can't understand why there's all this talk about rare records when they've never owned a record, only use CDs and more likely MP3 players........

Is it just a nostalgia club, people talking about the venues of yesteryear - great though they were? Is it dressing up 70s style? Does it or should it matter what we collectively wear because comments I've heard certainly suggest so at times.

I certainly believe from experience that there's a huge market for good Soul Across The Board nights out marketed as such where the music isn't all Deep Disco, Hardhouse, MTV dance, bang bang bang yo yo yo rap/hip hop. And we're not interested in Phoenix Nights Out!

My youngest friend who comes out with me when I can persuade her is 29 and the oldest 42. All missed out on Wigan, Blackpool etc. So if you want a newer audience maybe aspects have to evolve. Maybe they are but I get the impression that the "Togetherness" is a little too exclusive sometimes and that some of us with differentthoughts feel excluded.

I love much of the music and the stories behind the music but I think that things may need to change if this particular scene is to adapt, survive and prosper.

Just some thoughts not meant to offend.

Ali x

[Soul Shrews]

Oh dear oviously no ones up for 2 allnighter and a alldayer the weekend lol.

Billy

Why not.......... ya bunch o lightweights

[Guest]

One thing I do know is this... there is an untapped fanbase - everyday people that love this genre yet don't get to hear about it because time has passed by and they're unaware it's still going on.

People laughed at Soul Patrol but all I kept thinking about was the extent of the audience it reached.

I'm out into the centre of Town in a couple of weeks, I'm taking a bag full of flyers but more importantly I'm taking a boogiebox with a well stocked CD. I figure that people passing by will hear tunes that turned them on 'back then' and bring them back into the fold.

YIPEEEEE... bring them on back

[Guest mel brat]

Northern isn't the property of the original crowd, there are many younger people into the music, most of the better bars and clubs in Leeds regularly play northern soul to a mixed crowd of 20 - 35 year olds and most of them love it, the big Mod / indie club in Leeds 'Brighton beach' always has a packed dance floor playing northern 'classics' as does 'Move on up', the 'Wardrobe' and other similar clubs, not to mention stuff we have promoted ourselves over the last few years. I read about the supposedly 'Dark times' after Wigan closed, and yes the allnighter scene may have gone further underground but on the growing scooter scene of the time, Northern was (and still is) massive and many people like myself started getting into the music around this time. The scene isnt just 50 somethings who were there the first time around (Lucky b*******!)it is an evolving scene in my eyes and far from over, ok the glory days may be over (?), but there are still loads of great venues / DJ's who show no signs of slowing down and many younger people infiltrating the scene, so plenty of life in the old Dog yet!

Ste

I don't think that anyone has suggested that Northern Soul is the "property of the original crowd". However, having "carried the torch" (no pun intended!), for so long it behoves us to ensure that it's passed into safe hands, and doesn't become the victim of passing fads and fashions!

The Northern Soul scene (I hope) has ALWAYS evolved - even if the evolutionary process has often been painful and controversial (See the Mecca thread for ample evidence of this! ) But all this is just another example of how much it has meant to us over the years. I'm personally delighted that a younger crowd has embraced Northern Soul - and other forms of Soul music too, hopefully.

(Perhaps they'll be good enough to push us 'oldies' around the dancefloor

in wheelchairs when the time comes! )

[Guest mel brat]

Thing is, sometimes our friends are confronted with comments like, "you can't dance like that, don't you know about Northern step?" or something similar. True, probably not typical but at some events there is very much a "dress code", a "way of doing things" and so on...

Ali x

Is THAT what they call that peculiar sideways-and-back shuffle then? "Northern step"?? I SEE. I've never danced like that in 35 years! Nor would I be seen dead wearing 70s clobber - "retro-cool" or otherwise! (It was awful enough the first time around!)

Seriously, I think you'll find that those who criticise the most are those who have been on the scene for the shortest time (even if that means 20 years!) and have adopted an artificial and entirely bogus dress code etc. Even before Wigan Casino opened (in September 1973), the wearing of 'baggies' and leather soled (Solatio) shoes were on their way out, as was the wearing of badges etc., so really there is no such thing as a proper 'Northern Soul dress code' at all!

Edited March 10, 2007 by mel brat

[Guest lolmil]

How young do you feel?

From a personel point of view, as long as there are new tunes (to me) to discover / hear then it goes on until my old ticker say's that's enough

Loll

[Guest mel brat]

speaking as the voice of one of the youngest on the scene, to be completely honest, i bloody hate most young kids, especially the trendy ones who try to get into the scene cause it's 'hip' now (i guess with the whole andy smith thing). Basically, what these kids don't understand is that the northern scene aint for pulling birds or getting sloshed as so much as it's for the love of the music, therefore most youth don't understand such an idea. I goto northern nights cause i love northern music and i love to dance to the songs. It really pisses me off when young kids come out and stand in the middle of the dance floor and spill their drinks everywhere and try to pickup birds, it just isn't really what it's all about. Also, from experience running an weekly indie night, youngsters seem to only dance to a song they know. Whenever i dj at an indie night some kid might request a song from an artist and if its a b-side or something they won't dance, and i play northern at my indie nights too. The reason i goto 100 club and such is to hear records played by djs such as butch, ady, mick smith, etc cause they may only be one in a few djs that have that record. I don't want to goto a night and hear records i already own, and that might become a problem if more kids get involved, it'll be the northern soul top 500 all over again.

now i know people might take the piss cause i'm quite young, but anybody who knows me will explain my problem with 'these kids today' and i just don't particularly like them and their attitude. If they give respect to the music and scene then that's great, but if they're there to pull birds and get pissed in the middle of the dance floor then i won't be too pleased.

anyhow, that's enough of my late night rant

An honest commitment to the music we love is all that's required of anyone. That and NO fighting or otherwise disruptive behaviour!

[Guest mel brat]

I think it would be a shame if "our" soul lost it's "northern" label. Having said that, I've heard mates say "I like Motown but not Northern Soul"...

What's worse is when people say that they like Motown or Northern - but they don't like SOUL, which I heard many times in my youth (Y-es, I CAN remember that far back, as it happens!) What do they call Gladys Knight, Brenda Holloway, Linda Jones, etc. if not Soul with a capitol 'S'?

[BlueWail]

Im 40

Ive been into northern since i was in secondry school and happend to miss the hay day

I think he scene has about ten years left in it then it will turn into a copy of the teddy boy scene with the last few remaing soulies getting together in some hotels function room

No mass influx of new blood is coming through however hard we try

Ive got a 19n year old daughter and aneleven year old son

and both have been brought up with a diet of soul music from the day they were born

The 19 year old is into dance music

The 11 year old is into his nintendo wii

The thought of kids getting ino their parents music isnt really going to work

otherwise if it worked like that

I would be an elvis fan like me ma

[Guest mel brat]

Bet we will see some 100+ year old guy or gal being interviewed sometime in the future as one of the handful of remaining Casino originals, much doubt it will be me, but someone will make it.

Who are these "Casino originals" ???

[Chalky]

=============

Good points, well put. I was trying to explain it to a couple of young girls at work, they didn't pick up on the 'northern' tag I'd added, both just said they love soul, so perhaps that is the way forward

Winnie:-)

In the 80's I can't really remember "Northern Soul" being used to a great degree. It was mainly "Rare Soul" or "6t's Rare Soul" etc or in some cases just the name of the soul club and all-nighter.

[Chalky]

The Northern Soul scene (I hope) has ALWAYS evolved - even if the evolutionary process has often been painful and controversial (See the Mecca thread for ample evidence of this! ) But all this is just another example of how much it has meant to us over the years. I'm personally delighted that a younger crowd has embraced Northern Soul - and other forms of Soul music too, hopefully.

(Perhaps they'll be good enough to push us 'oldies' around the dancefloor

in wheelchairs when the time comes! )

Trouble is it's hardly evolving now, going backwards in many casesd to a more oldies and retro scene. The sooner it gets away from the oldies only mentality and embraces crossover (and I don't mean Angie Stone, Futures etc) and other genres the scene will stand a better chance of bringing in some young uns.

[Simon M]

In the 80's I can't really remember "Northern Soul" being used to a great degree. It was mainly "Rare Soul" or "6t's Rare Soul" etc or in some cases just the name of the soul club and all-nighter.

Dont forget the 80's terms Modern Soul and 60's newies

Edited March 11, 2007 by Simon M

[Chalky]

Dont forget the new 80's terms Modern Soul and 60's newies

how can I forget those why are the records termed 60's newies back then still referred to as 60's newies?

[Simon M]

how can I forget those why are the records termed 60's newies back then still referred to as 60's newies?

Are they really ?

[Guest billinghamsoulboy]

how about this, my mam and dad who are both 60 are going to their first ever soul event at whitby weekender in july this is purly down to me and the mrs telling them what a good time we have my dad is now bugging me for cds so he can practice his dancing it will last forever this northern thing.

[Guest biggray1]

how about this, my mam and dad who are both 60 are going to their first ever soul event at whitby weekender in july this is purly down to me and the mrs telling them what a good time we have my dad is now bugging me for cds so he can practice his dancing it will last forever this northern thing.

Fantastic Stuff Mate,hope your Mum & Dad have a great time

[Guest biggray1]

After reading all of this thread and your oppinions etc related to age and the scene's future and new interest from new people i find that peoples age is mentioned alot why does ones age have to be mentioned! I find it difficult to understand that some souolsourcers have to keep raising comment on age. What as age got to do with listinen or Dancin or generally enjoying company who have the same interest as one's self

[Guest]

Good point biggray...and that applies to older and younger. The tolerence towards the younger seems not to be very good according to this thread tho.

[Guest]

Trouble is it's hardly evolving now, going backwards in many casesd to a more oldies and retro scene. The sooner it gets away from the oldies only mentality and embraces crossover (and I don't mean Angie Stone, Futures etc) and other genres the scene will stand a better chance of bringing in some young uns.

100% behind you on this Chalky