Dissertation help! Looking for interviewees

[Fish Fingers]

On 07/10/2021 at 12:34, gdsoul said:

Hi there!

 

I am a student at the University of Strathclyde, and I am looking for participants to be involved in research for my dissertation about Northern Soul. I am particularly looking to speak to anyone who was involved in the scene at the time and can share some of their memories! My research is specifically looking into the parallel between working class youths from northern towns in the 1970s and black American ‘Northern Soul’ music of the 1960s. Please feel free to ask any questions, and I look forward to hearing any responses! (Please note, these interviews will be conducted remotely, through telephone or zoom – can literally be less than 10 mins of your time!)

 

Thank you.

I would be happy to do the phone call. 

I grew up in a working class Northern town (Warrington) and got into Northern Soul in the mid 1970s.

[Steve G]

There is enough here for a dissertation.

[Local]

11 hours ago, Fish Fingers said:

 

I grew up in a working class Northern town (Warrington) and got into Northern Soul in the mid 1970s.

You had it easy in Cheshire ! we used to dream of being working class in Wigan.

When I were a lad, my dad used to have to pay the mill owner sixpence a day to work in't weaving sheds and if he was lucky get 10mins break in a sixteen hour shift for his bred & dripping. 

[Mssoulie]

On 08/10/2021 at 11:08, Chalky said:

I guess she is focusing on the struggles of the majority of us growing up, yes I know not everyone struggled but most of us were working class and we all happened to follow a genre of music whereby the vast majority of the artists struggled with so many obstacles in their way to a better life.

You should all offer your services and be interviewed if you feel so strongly about the subject or leave her to get on with it. 

Sense as always.

[Mssoulie]

1 hour ago, Local said:

You had it easy in Cheshire ! we used to dream of being working class in Wigan.

When I were a lad, my dad used to have to pay the mill owner sixpence a day to work in't weaving sheds and if he was lucky get 10mins break in a sixteen hour shift for his bred & dripping. 

Only 16 hours. What did you do with rest of the day. Lazy bugger.sorry.

[Fish Fingers]

I would imagine the OP may have gone elsewhere now to get the help they were requesting. 

A 10 minute phone call was all they were asking for. 

[Solidsoul]

On 10/10/2021 at 12:41, Local said:

 

So by your definition  Joe 90 and Hawaii 50 , to name just two are part of Northern Soul musical genre ?

It's all subjective, the goal post are constantly changing with the passage of time.

Unfortunately yes. I cringed when they were first played, and still do now!

But if you look into any genre of music, you will find great records and really bad one's.

Edited October 13, 2021 by D9 Ktf

[Solidsoul]

On 10/10/2021 at 16:43, Chalky said:

But Soul Bros Inc and Eddie Parker are not Northern Soul records, well they weren’t recorded as Northern soul. They were however accepted by the Northern Soul scene, given wider prominence and rescued from failure and obscurity by the Northern Soul scene, a scene that has accepted just about every popular and not so popular musical genre going. 

I know fully well what you are saying, as I have been involved with Northern Soul for a long time.

But times have moved on.

I  think in 2021 the Northern Soul scene has been established long enough, and matured enough, for it's music to be called a genre. 

I think you are right that we should agree to differ on this, just different view points.

Edited October 13, 2021 by D9 Ktf

[Middleman]

9 hours ago, Fish Fingers said:

I would imagine the OP may have gone elsewhere now to get the help they were requesting. 

A 10 minute phone call was all they were asking for. 

LOL, probably now chosen a less complicated subject for the dissertation, quantum physics or something. 

[Bus Pass Dancer]

I’ve just got to get into this one...... Good chat Chalky but was anyone else that intelligent back then?? And totally agree Northern Soul was and still is ‘a way of life ‘! The sounds came from all genres of records, and still does! One of my favourite ever plays is by Phil Coulter but who the heck thought to play it in the first place? He’s a country music piano player??? If the song worked it got played, end of! The ‘scene’ was just that. I said it before, you dressed how you wanted, only the shoes really mattered... if you couldn’t afford leather soles you used talc! You had to take something to keep you awake and dancing all night! It was pure escapism from the 70’s ...... no matter what your colour, class or creed. There was no racism. Not all the songs were by long suffering black Americans! Not all the participants were drug taking working class Northerners! It was a few years of excitement and despite all the clubs still doing their things it’ll never be the same again.

 I still do all-nighters. I still dance the same way. I still close my eyes and remember. 

[Dim]

1 hour ago, Bus Pass Dancer said:

I’ve just got to get into this one...... Good chat Chalky but was anyone else that intelligent back then?? And totally agree Northern Soul was and still is ‘a way of life ‘! The sounds came from all genres of records, and still does! One of my favourite ever plays is by Phil Coulter but who the heck thought to play it in the first place? He’s a country music piano player??? If the song worked it got played, end of! The ‘scene’ was just that. I said it before, you dressed how you wanted, only the shoes really mattered... if you couldn’t afford leather soles you used talc! You had to take something to keep you awake and dancing all night! It was pure escapism from the 70’s ...... no matter what your colour, class or creed. There was no racism. Not all the songs were by long suffering black Americans! Not all the participants were drug taking working class Northerners! It was a few years of excitement and despite all the clubs still doing their things it’ll never be the same again.

 I still do all-nighters. I still dance the same way. I still close my eyes and remember. 

1 hour ago, Bus Pass Dancer said:

I’ve just got to get into this one...... Good chat Chalky but was anyone else that intelligent back then?? And totally agree Northern Soul was and still is ‘a way of life ‘! The sounds came from all genres of records, and still does! One of my favourite ever plays is by Phil Coulter but who the heck thought to play it in the first place? He’s a country music piano player??? If the song worked it got played, end of! The ‘scene’ was just that. I said it before, you dressed how you wanted, only the shoes really mattered... if you couldn’t afford leather soles you used talc! You had to take something to keep you awake and dancing all night! It was pure escapism from the 70’s ...... no matter what your colour, class or creed. There was no racism. Not all the songs were by long suffering black Americans! Not all the participants were drug taking working class Northerners! It was a few years of excitement and despite all the clubs still doing their things it’ll never be the same again.

 I still do all-nighters. I still dance the same way. I still close my eyes and remember. 

Phil Coulter is from my home town of Derry in the north of Ireland.. He's a composer and an accomplished pianist. He has 23 platinum discs, 39 gold and 52 silvers to his name plus 5 Ivor Novello awards. 

He co wrote Puppet on a String for Sandie Shaw and Congratulations for Cliff Richard. I think even he would agree that being part of NS history stretches the bounds of credibility just a wee bit. 

 

 

 

[Paul-s]

On 07/10/2021 at 13:34, gdsoul said:

Hi there!

 

I am a student at the University of Strathclyde, and I am looking for participants to be involved in research for my dissertation about Northern Soul. I am particularly looking to speak to anyone who was involved in the scene at the time and can share some of their memories! My research is specifically looking into the parallel between working class youths from northern towns in the 1970s and black American ‘Northern Soul’ music of the 1960s. Please feel free to ask any questions, and I look forward to hearing any responses! (Please note, these interviews will be conducted remotely, through telephone or zoom – can literally be less than 10 mins of your time!)

 

Thank you.

We have to remember that the heavy marketing that has evolved over the decades has perpetuated a 'corporate' driven idea of what  'Northern Soul' is that is linked to its possibilities as a commercially viable asset.

This of course plays a big part in perpetuating a fixed and dominating idea of what is encompassed by the term because if it wanders too much it endangers the asset. 

Take for instance a DJ who starts a venue that only batters the same few hundred tunes, linked to the Wigan era, he/she stopped going out when the scene evolved beyond Wigan and more incredible tunes carried on being discovered via other venues and emerging DJ's. They want to run a viable commercial Northern Soul event but do not buy records (not since Wigan closed) they don't even care/know what's emerging post Wigan. Enter the Top 500, fixed collection of records that some insist, erroneously, define Northern Soul.

I would advise that you don't just interview 'I went to Wigan', then stopped when it closed' people. Unless you want to just reiterate a narrow lens, perpetuate the tired old myths that already exist, and a dominant narrative that is compromised by financial interests that have long been linked to cultural capital 

If you are a scholar doing a thesis in this field then you can/should check out Bourdieu and the various forms that drive capital - you will see it at play in the way that professional Wigan Myth marketers wheel out the same tired narrative in order to self serve. Lazy research and journalism supports these myths by always interviewing the same people, whose experience often never extended beyond the doors of the Casino: fine if its only about the Casino, but not if its about 'Northern Soul'.

 

Best of luck.

 

Edited October 15, 2021 by Paul-s

[Paul-s]

On 13/10/2021 at 16:57, Bus Pass Dancer said:

I’ve just got to get into this one...... Good chat Chalky but was anyone else that intelligent back then?? And totally agree Northern Soul was and still is ‘a way of life ‘! The sounds came from all genres of records, and still does! One of my favourite ever plays is by Phil Coulter but who the heck thought to play it in the first place? He’s a country music piano player??? If the song worked it got played, end of! The ‘scene’ was just that. I said it before, you dressed how you wanted, only the shoes really mattered... if you couldn’t afford leather soles you used talc! You had to take something to keep you awake and dancing all night! It was pure escapism from the 70’s ...... no matter what your colour, class or creed. There was no racism. Not all the songs were by long suffering black Americans! Not all the participants were drug taking working class Northerners! It was a few years of excitement and despite all the clubs still doing their things it’ll never be the same again.

 I still do all-nighters. I still dance the same way. I still close my eyes and remember. 

I would disagree with a bit of that summary: There were fights (I saw a few), there were forms of racism that showed themselves in various ways, not explicitly, but implicitly. Thats not a judgement, but a fact of being working class and unaware of the consequences of the way we used language at the time.

[Bus Pass Dancer]

Paul-s. You are now obviously a very intelligent and observant person, but what I was trying to say was that back in the day I doubt anyone was that clever that they could analyse what was happening at the time? Maybe now we’re old and grey and have experienced life, our views differ.  I just prefer to look back and remember the good bits! The dancing. The music. The highs! (Even the come-downs). No doubt in a couple of years someone will be writing a dissertation on raves of the 2000’s.......... and everyone will remember something different. 

I’ll stand by the old maxim ‘if I had to explain, you wouldn’t understand ‘ KTF 

[Paul-s]

2 hours ago, Bus Pass Dancer said:

Paul-s. You are now obviously a very intelligent and observant person, but what I was trying to say was that back in the day I doubt anyone was that clever that they could analyse what was happening at the time? Maybe now we’re old and grey and have experienced life, our views differ.  I just prefer to look back and remember the good bits! The dancing. The music. The highs! (Even the come-downs). No doubt in a couple of years someone will be writing a dissertation on raves of the 2000’s.......... and everyone will remember something different. 

I’ll stand by the old maxim ‘if I had to explain, you wouldn’t understand ‘ KTF 

I totally agree (not with the bit about my intelligence though) with what you say about no-one was that clever and in a state to analyse anything at the time. Too busy having a great time to care or notice.

My comments are mostly retrospectively looking back and unpicking what I did, saw, heard etc. I can still viscerally feel the good bits and the bad (but at the time they all felt good), even surviving the ODing, the missing school and the frequent arrests. What a life changing experience! It stays with me through thick and thin. 

You won't be surprised to hear that they have already written much about the 2000's rave scene.

 

[Blackpoolsoul]

2 hours ago, Bus Pass Dancer said:

Paul-s. You are now obviously a very intelligent and observant person, but what I was trying to say was that back in the day I doubt anyone was that clever that they could analyse what was happening at the time? Maybe now we’re old and grey and have experienced life, our views differ.  I just prefer to look back and remember the good bits! The dancing. The music. The highs! (Even the come-downs). No doubt in a couple of years someone will be writing a dissertation on raves of the 2000’s.......... and everyone will remember something different. 

I’ll stand by the old maxim ‘if I had to explain, you wouldn’t understand ‘ KTF 

I was waiting for rave to be mentioned as that is not a genre of music either but a scene too 

[Mssoulie]

One thing that must be understood and cannot be left out is all of the passion we feel towards this scene of ours. This can be hard to get to grips with if you've never heard music that brings a lump in your throat a tear to your eye and the goose bumps upon goose bumps all over. 

Hugh

[Solidsoul]

18 hours ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

I was waiting for rave to be mentioned as that is not a genre of music either but a scene too 

Dictionary explanation of a music Genre;

"A style or category of music"!

Edited October 16, 2021 by D9 Ktf

[Chalky]

18 hours ago, Paul-s said:

I totally agree (not with the bit about my intelligence though) with what you say about no-one was that clever and in a state to analyse anything at the time. Too busy having a great time to care or notice.

My comments are mostly retrospectively looking back and unpicking what I did, saw, heard etc. I can still viscerally feel the good bits and the bad (but at the time they all felt good), even surviving the ODing, the missing school and the frequent arrests. What a life changing experience! It stays with me through thick and thin. 

You won't be surprised to hear that they have already written much about the 2000's rave scene.

 

We were growing up, enjoying ourselves.  We lived for the weekend but none of us thought for a minute we would be sat here now 40 and 50 plus years later discussing this thing of ours let alone many still trying to do what they did when they were 18.

[Frankie Crocker]

On 11/10/2021 at 04:03, Fish Fingers said:

I would be happy to do the phone call. 

I grew up in a working class Northern town (Warrington) and got into Northern Soul in the mid 1970s.

In those days, Warrington was in Lancashire. In my books, it still is. I was born in Warrington, and as it says Lancashire on my birth certificate, I consider myself a Lancashire Lad.

My father’s family came from Wigan. My grandmother worked at the Trencherfield Mill. My great-uncle died in the Maypole pit disaster at the age of 16. My father worked his rocks off to get to university, enabling me to follow the same path.

PM me with details and I’ll help out with your dissertation.

[Tomangoes]

On 12/10/2021 at 12:19, D9 Ktf said:

I know fully well what you are saying, as I have been involved with Northern Soul for a long time.

But times have moved on.

I  think in 2021 the Northern Soul scene has been established long enough, and matured enough, for it's music to be called a genre. 

I think you are right that we should agree to differ on this, just different view points.

If you attend a "across the board" Northern soul event, you can expect to hear every conceivable type of music ever tagged into the all encompassing modern Northern soul scene.

Ska, r & b, jazz, funk, disco, 60s soul, black and blue eyed through to today, and anything goes.

Thats why its not a genre.

Its a collection of genres manipulated into one scene to maximise the clientelle numbers.

I'd say it was more a genre in the mid 70s than it is now in terms of an identifiable music style played.

One man's Northern soul is certainly not guaranteed to be another man's definition of Northern soul. Not sure it ever was! 

Ed

 

 

 

 

 

[Solidsoul]

4 hours ago, Tomangoes said:

If you attend a "across the board" Northern soul event, you can expect to hear every conceivable type of music ever tagged into the all encompassing modern Northern soul scene.

Ska, r & b, jazz, funk, disco, 60s soul, black and blue eyed through to today, and anything goes.

Thats why its not a genre.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ed,   Those genre's you mention,

"Ska, r & b, jazz, funk, disco, 60s soul, black and blue eyed"    are not pure!

Just like Northern Soul, they are each made up of a hodge podge/ mixture of music!

I know Northern Soul music is selected from those genre's, and others.   But that does not stop  Northern Soul music becoming a genre of it's own, when it all comes together! 

 

Edited October 16, 2021 by D9 Ktf

[Zoomsoulblue]

What happened to the explanation I always gave in the 70ts - when asked what was Northern Soul - my reply - You know mid 6ts Motown sound ? - yea - well it’s like that but better

[Frankie Crocker]

On 15/10/2021 at 13:13, Bus Pass Dancer said:

Paul-s. You are now obviously a very intelligent and observant person, but what I was trying to say was that back in the day I doubt anyone was that clever that they could analyse what was happening at the time? Maybe now we’re old and grey and have experienced life, our views differ.  I just prefer to look back and remember the good bits! The dancing. The music. The highs! (Even the come-downs). No doubt in a couple of years someone will be writing a dissertation on raves of the 2000’s.......... and everyone will remember something different. 

I’ll stand by the old maxim ‘if I had to explain, you wouldn’t understand ‘ KTF 

Sorry, but I have to take issue with your opening statement. The Manchester University Northern Soul Club - Baz Lowe of Hyde, Lorraine from Corby, Pat Malloy of Cannock, Brenda from Prestatyn, Simon Millican of Kendal, Kate from Southport, Bill from Leeds (mate of Steve Caesar) and yours truly, analysed each and every record travelling to and from Wigan by car or train. We also went to Blackpool Mecca and The Ritz, so there was plenty more to analyse. As Manchester University was, and still is, the premier university in North-West England, I’d say we were fairly clever. The really smart move though was being based in Manchester as it was handy for travelling to Wigan Casino.

[Paul-s]

2 hours ago, Frankie Crocker said:

Sorry, but I have to take issue with your opening statement. The Manchester University Northern Soul Club - Baz Lowe of Hyde, Lorraine from Corby, Pat Malloy of Cannock, Brenda from Prestatyn, Simon Millican of Kendal, Kate from Southport, Bill from Leeds (mate of Steve Caesar) and yours truly, analysed each and every record travelling to and from Wigan by car or train. We also went to Blackpool Mecca and The Ritz, so there was plenty more to analyse. As Manchester University was, and still is, the premier university in North-West England, I’d say we were fairly clever. The really smart move though was being based in Manchester as it was handy for travelling to Wigan Casino.

Nice to know. 

I was only a 15 year old apprentice at the time and travelling from a shit estate in Grantham. I had never even heard of Universities so a world away from me.

I guess you were obviously older and at University. To this day I didn't know there was a Manchester University Soul club in the 70's, so I've learnt something.

I would disagree with the statement that everyone at University is fairly clever though. 

[Geeselad]

On 15/10/2021 at 16:10, Blackpoolsoul said:

I was waiting for rave to be mentioned as that is not a genre of music either but a scene too 

I was going to use that as another example. Well, initially at least. In 88/ 89 you would have heard; Belgian new beat, US house and freestyle, break beat, UK house, Italo house, new Jersey garage and even street soul at a rave. The genre didn't start till late 90/91, by then it was almost over for those that started the scene. 

[Mssoulie]

43 minutes ago, Paul-s said:

Nice to know. 

I was only a 15 year old apprentice at the time and travelling from a shit estate in Grantham. I had never even heard of Universities so a world away from me.

I guess you were obviously older and at University. To this day I didn't know there was a Manchester University Soul club in the 70's, so I've learnt something.

I would disagree with the statement that everyone at University is fairly clever though. 

Most of the people that I know that went to university are usually the ones that you have to explain things to more than once. ( Dartmouth Naval College) mostly.

Analysing the records and analysing what was happening at the time are two different things. 

[Frankie Crocker]

1 hour ago, Paul-s said:

Nice to know. 

I was only a 15 year old apprentice at the time and travelling from a shit estate in Grantham. I had never even heard of Universities so a world away from me.

I guess you were obviously older and at University. To this day I didn't know there was a Manchester University Soul club in the 70's, so I've learnt something.

I would disagree with the statement that everyone at University is fairly clever though. 

Hi Paul.

You are right as nowadays some can get into a university with two grade E’s at A Level. True scholarship is rare in Sixth Forms these days as most students do not read books or newspapers for pleasure, and rely on set texts and revision guides to ace the test. 

In the mid 70’s, Soul Night on Tuesdays at the Solem Bar in the Union was a humming event for students from colleges in Manchester, plus a sprinkling of outsiders.

[Chalky]

Happy to receive an e-mail from Georgia this morning that she got a first in her studies.  Happy to have helped with her dissertation.

One quote from one who marked her paper was particularly satisfying...

Quote

One of the comments were "One of the key strengths of this dissertation are the fascinating and rich oral history that you have worked to uncover. Your interviewees offer a vivid account of their time in the Northern Soul scene and it was wonderful to have some of the joy of that time captured here, they also reflect on the complicated politics of the period and their commentary around race was especially interesting."

Well done Georgia

Edited March 28, 2022 by Chalky

[Mike]

1 hour ago, Chalky said:

Happy to receive an e-mail from Georgia this morning that she got a first in her studies.  Happy to have helped with her dissertation.

One quote from one who marked her paper was particularly satisfying...

Well done Georgia

wow, hats off to Georgia and all on here who got involved

a smile inducing moment

well done