Is it really worth buying from America

[Haighy]

I’ve just paid for a disc from America via discogs. On checkout I was automatically charged uk vat. Sometimes buying from the uk can be cheaper and vice versa. With this new vat charge is it worth the hassle of buying from America?

[Carty]

Depends entirely on the price , If a given items price is still attractive after the VAT and postage are added, then yes , The automatic VAT payment does make this less likely as we go forward .. maybe there will be a slight reduction in U.S. dealers pricing to reflect the fact that U.K. buyers are thinner on the ground than previously , but dont hold your breath ... 

[Girdwoodinc]

Have noticed some UK buyers inflating their prices 20% on discogs so that their records are inline with the US ones for sale, which is lunacy really as I would've bought from them if they were cheaper 

[Davlee]

As discussed all depends on purchase price.  20% VAT along with higher Postage costs from USA is a real  leveller and there are fewer bargains now. If you want something badly enough and its an in-demand disc you are going to have to bite the bullet if you cant find one in UK. 

I try to buy a few collective items from US Discogs sellers to average out Shipping costs per order.  

 With ebay, i just set a limit to what I am happy with , including VAT & Shipping.

 

[Billy Jo Jim Bob]

Just recently before buying I asked a Discogs seller if he would sell 'off site' and described the issue of Tax etc. He was aware of it and happy to move forward without going thru Discogs.

I've also had a bit of an argument with Ebay over adding 28.5% tax as opposed to 20%. They told me that there were fee's involved as they outsource tax collection to the shipping company. In the end they said if I wasn't happy with this arrangement I could ask the seller to sell it off Ebay...which was a bit of a shock coming from them.

Just ask the seller is the message.

 

Edited July 14, 2021 by Billy Jo Jim Bob

[Chalky]

2 hours ago, Girdwoodinc said:

Have noticed some UK buyers inflating their prices 20% on discogs so that their records are inline with the US ones for sale, which is lunacy really as I would've bought from them if they were cheaper 

Really? I’ve always found UK sellers to be far more expensive than any US seller in general. I’ve often bought from the US rather than give my money to a greedy Brit who often mark their prices for Lps 50 to 100% more expensive. 

[Geeselad]

This applies to Europe as well. It's certainly making cheaper end sounds not worth buying from the states. 

[Midnight Drifter]

2 hours ago, Billy Jo Jim Bob said:

Just recently before buying I asked a Discogs seller if he would sell 'off site' and described the issue of Tax etc. He was aware of it and happy to move forward without going thru Discogs.

I've also had a bit of an argument with Ebay over adding 28.5% tax as opposed to 20%. They told me that there were fee's involved as they outsource tax collection to the shipping company. In the end they said if I wasn't happy with this arrangement I could ask the seller to sell it off Ebay...which was a bit of a shock coming from them.

Just ask the seller is the message.

 

Yes, but beware that you'll lose purchase protection then. 

I only do that occasionally when I 'know' the seller. I was bitten once I didnt pay too much attention and my money's gone..

[Blackpoolsoul]

5 hours ago, Carty said:

Depends entirely on the price , If a given items price is still attractive after the VAT and postage are added, then yes , The automatic VAT payment does make this less likely as we go forward .. maybe there will be a slight reduction in U.S. dealers pricing to reflect the fact that U.K. buyers are thinner on the ground than previously , but dont hold your breath ... 

I have also noticed a few dealers are starting to add "make on offer" to their sales to facilitate the VAT costs

[Haighy]

I’ve just instructed customs to send a disc back to sender. I paid $4800 for a disc before the uk vat was in place on discogs. The seller put just under $2500 dollars value on the customs  declaration to keep him inline with IRS rules but wasn’t bothered about the tax I would have to pay. Pre discogs vat added, the norm was to put $5 on the declaration. I paid over the odds for the disc as it’s unplayed but with tax to pay f&&& that it’s on its way back. 

[Blackpoolsoul]

6 minutes ago, Haighy said:

I’ve just instructed customs to send a disc back to sender. I paid $4800 for a disc before the uk vat was in place on discogs. The seller put just under $2500 dollars value on the customs  declaration to keep him inline with IRS rules but wasn’t bothered about the tax I would have to pay. Pre discogs vat added, the norm was to put $5 on the declaration. I paid over the odds for the disc as it’s unplayed but with tax to pay f&&& that it’s on its way back. 

How can someone put $5 on a customs declaration for a $4800 record that is bonkers and would not be insured and is potential Tax Evasion (even though we don't like it)

Why should the seller care about UK taxes that we have to pay ?

Edited July 14, 2021 by Blackpoolsoul

[Frankie Crocker]

Yes, most definitely if the price is right. Best to buy directly from the source rather than the middleman in Britain. If the record is mint unplayed, that’s surely worth taking into consideration. If you can use a USA address, postage costs and taxes will be lower too. We’re scraping at the bottom of the US barrel these days so grab what you can when it comes to market as it won’t be there in years to come.

[Blackpoolsoul]

5 minutes ago, Frankie Crocker said:

Yes, most definitely if the price is right. Best to buy directly from the source rather than the middleman in Britain. If the record is mint unplayed, that’s surely worth taking into consideration. If you can use a USA address, postage costs and taxes will be lower too. We’re scraping at the bottom of the US barrel these days so grab what you can when it comes to market as it won’t be there in years to come.

All the 7" singles for sale on Discogs total just over 1 Million

396000 for sale in the USA

353000 for sale in the UK

The rest of the world makes up the other 300000

Interesting that, I thought

[Girdwoodinc]

4 hours ago, Chalky said:

Really? I’ve always found UK sellers to be far more expensive than any US seller in general. I’ve often bought from the US rather than give my money to a greedy Brit who often mark their prices for Lps 50 to 100% more expensive. 

Just a couple of things I’d been keeping an eye on recently and noticed the U.K. sellers change their prices 

[Winsford Soul]

4 hours ago, Chalky said:

Really? I’ve always found UK sellers to be far more expensive than any US seller in general. I’ve often bought from the US rather than give my money to a greedy Brit who often mark their prices for Lps 50 to 100% more expensive. 

Totally agree Karl. For example  a  particular record is available from let's say 10 different sellers on discogs 8 non UK.  2 UK . 100% guarantee the 2 UK  sellers will be massively more expensive than the non UK sellers . 

[Modernsoulsucks]

4 minutes ago, Winsford Soul said:

Totally agree Karl. For example  a  particular record is available from let's say 10 different sellers on discogs 8 non UK.  2 UK . 100% guarantee the 2 UK  sellers will be massively more expensive than the non UK sellers . 

My experience from selling when I had the outlet in Manchester and selling online is that if the record is the right price then there wouldn't be 10 copies to compare ! 

They'd be gone.

[Geeselad]

18 minutes ago, Winsford Soul said:

Totally agree Karl. For example  a  particular record is available from let's say 10 different sellers on discogs 8 non UK.  2 UK . 100% guarantee the 2 UK  sellers will be massively more expensive than the non UK sellers . 

Things that are $15 dollars, couple of copies in the US, the UK sellers want £30 quid or more. 

[Haighy]

1 hour ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

How can someone put $5 on a customs declaration for a $4800 record that is bonkers and would not be insured and is potential Tax Evasion (even though we don't like it)

Why should the seller care about UK taxes that we have to pay ?

So you don’t know anyone that has avoided tax on records?

[Winsford Soul]

56 minutes ago, Modernsoulsucks said:

My experience from selling when I had the outlet in Manchester and selling online is that if the record is the right price then there wouldn't be 10 copies to compare ! 

They'd be gone.

I'm not on about rare stuff . When they would go anyway. 

[Modernsoulsucks]

2 minutes ago, Winsford Soul said:

I'm not on about rare stuff . When they would go anyway. 

Me neither. I'm talking about the cheaper end where it will most likely be double or triple what I consider the price to be or in less than reasonable condition, hence they just don't sell.

[Winsford Soul]

2 minutes ago, Modernsoulsucks said:

Me neither. I'm talking about the cheaper end where it will most likely be double or triple what I consider the price to be or in less than reasonable condition, hence they just don't sell.

Rod. What you and I consider the price to be or should be is vastly different from what most sellers think. 

[Frankie Crocker]

1 hour ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

All the 7" singles for sale on Discogs total just over 1 Million

396000 for sale in the USA

353000 for sale in the UK

The rest of the world makes up the other 300000

Interesting that, I thought

But not too many Mel Britts or Bobby Klines there... Most of the records won’t sell as the demand is not there. A million records isn’t much when you consider the top ten in the charts sold millions in the 60’s and 70’s. Even the top top Motown sounds barely sell unless they in demand by the Northern fraternity. The sounds we want are buried in the States and more likely to appear on eBay if they are rare, valuable or in demand. Discogs is handy for obscure, cheap unknown sounds, but how any of these actually turn up regularly?

[Modernsoulsucks]

1 minute ago, Winsford Soul said:

Rod. What you and I consider the price to be or should be is vastly different from what most sellers think. 

True, but the fact that they're still up for sale time and time again IMO points to us being right.

I guess for a lot of sellers it's a hobby so can afford to sit on them.

[Chalky]

1 hour ago, Geeselad said:

Things that are $15 dollars, couple of copies in the US, the UK sellers want £30 quid or more. 

The UK sellers add the postage on a bit more knowing most will pay it rather than go to the states, vultures.  

[Joesoap]

1 hour ago, Modernsoulsucks said:

True, but the fact that they're still up for sale time and time again IMO points to us being right.

I guess for a lot of sellers it's a hobby so can afford to sit on them.

I know exactly what you mean - multiple copies of the same record that sit there unsold for months on end.  Good example (of many) Dee Dee Sharp 'What kind of Lady. There's permanently about 25 -30 copies of that on Discogs, starting at £100+ for VG+ or better. Fabulous record but guys, you're obviously not gonna shift it at that price!

Edited July 14, 2021 by Joesoap

[Jnixon]

Depends entirely on how much I want it. I’ve bought things I’ve wanted / wanted back for years recently  And haven’t cared about price. But im certainly thinking more and pulling the trigger less. 

Personally I’d rather buy from UK sellers and sell that way too. eBay hasn’t been as cost effective for me for years anyway especially since the postage has gone from 4$ to whatever the seller wanted to charge making cheaper purchases pointless. 

Discogs can do what it likes I’ve not had an account for almost 8 years now and my record buying/selling life has not been compromised in any way. If anything it’s much better for not having it. 

As for greedy UK sellers bumping prices up by 20% just don’t bite. The record world for ever has been full of overpriced records and that’s never going to change. They just won’t sell their tunes it’s that simple. 

[Guest]

I recently bought a copy of  Elaine Hill - Is It Really Worth It?  which doesn't appear to be rare as discogs  / CD&Lp had twelve copies between them and ebay had six copies. The USA dealers were offering the record at substantially less than the UK dealers so  I opted for a mint copy at $8. However with the postage of $19 plus the possibility of customs charges I delayed the purchase.

All the UK dealers were offering the record at between £30 and £45 regardless of condition. I'd suggest there is a degree of 'sheep' following because the records were clearly struggling to sell at that price for what is a record that is not currently 'in demand'.  I rarely buy from English dealers as they are not generally good value. I did buy a copy of the Elaine Hill 45 -- from Germany. It was cheaper by £8 even with the Brexit tax.

[Billy Jo Jim Bob]

One of the things I have noticed is that the number of US sellers of soul 45's seems to have declined. The possible reason is that Ebay now require sellers bank details and the move away from normal Paypal payments. I know from a couple of US people I buy from that they will not give Ebay this information. Maybe they will move to Discogs or Musicstack etc ?

Edited July 15, 2021 by Billy Jo Jim Bob

[Girdwoodinc]

15 minutes ago, Billy Jo Jim Bob said:

One of the things I have noticed is that the number of US sellers of soul 45's seems to have declined. The possible reason is that Ebay now require sellers bank details and the move away from normal Paypal payments. I know from a couple of US people I buy from that they will not give Ebay this information. Maybe they will move to Discogs or Musicstack etc ?

Is Musicstack still on the go?

[Billy Jo Jim Bob]

1 minute ago, Girdwoodinc said:

Is Musicstack still on the go?

I've not bought anything off it in years, but it still pops up when searching and there seems to be current sellers on there

 

[Girdwoodinc]

2 minutes ago, Billy Jo Jim Bob said:

I've not bought anything off it in years, but it still pops up when searching and there seems to be current sellers on there

 

cool - need to have a check again

[Jnixon]

I still think it’s worthwhile discogs sellers making their lists well know with other contact details to cut discogs out of the loop. Might be worthwhile setting up a discogs link thread or pinned topic on here somewhere other than the website sales so people can sell those tunes via email their means.

 I’m mean who doesn’t love a good trawl through a long record list. 

[Girdwoodinc]

45 minutes ago, Jnixon said:

I still think it’s worthwhile discogs sellers making their lists well know with other contact details to cut discogs out of the loop. Might be worthwhile setting up a discogs link thread or pinned topic on here somewhere other than the website sales so people can sell those tunes via email their means.

 I’m mean who doesn’t love a good trawl through a long record list. 

Crack for record whores

[Jnixon]

5 minutes ago, Girdwoodinc said:

Crack for record whores

Nice to have something additional to do while binge watching classic emmerdale. 

[Mike]

1 hour ago, Jnixon said:

I still think it’s worthwhile discogs sellers making their lists well know with other contact details to cut discogs out of the loop. Might be worthwhile setting up a discogs link thread or pinned topic on here somewhere other than the website sales so people can sell those tunes via email their means.

Nope not on here.

People pay fees for the trading services that Discogs provide

Any attempts to use this site to 'cut Discogs out of the loop' would raise all sort of issues and as such would not be welcome

Can we get back to the original topic thrust, if needed use the support section to discuss this sideshow further

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jnixon]

No problem

[Simon T]

Maybe a daft question, but if i was the sell a record on Discogs that i wanted to get a £100 in my pocket for (Paypal, but not F&F) how much would i need to charge / get paid to cover fees, paypal fees, VAT etc?

1 to UK buyer

2 to EU buyer

3 rest of the world

thanks

[Blackpoolsoul]

5 hours ago, Simon T said:

Maybe a daft question, but if i was the sell a record on Discogs that i wanted to get a £100 in my pocket for (Paypal, but not F&F) how much would i need to charge / get paid to cover fees, paypal fees, VAT etc?

1 to UK buyer

2 to EU buyer

3 rest of the world

thanks

The VAT is paid by the buyer if in EU or certain parts of the world so that doesn't matter the money gets paid by them into your Paypal account and then charged on your end of month invoice (assuming you are in the UK) charges are 10% (including VAT) Discogs and approx 5% Paypal so £117 sale cost for you to get £100 net

Paypal at moment are making profit on the whole transaction including shipping (which was a mistake I am lead to believe) and that is to be rectified later so they only make there cut on the item

Edited July 15, 2021 by Blackpoolsoul

[Davey S]

Just bought from Headbonedaddy did the maths and I was happy with the deal plus they are always quick and reasonable with shipping .

Dave.

[davidwapples]

11 hours ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

The VAT is paid by the buyer if in EU or certain parts of the world so that doesn't matter the money gets paid by them into your Paypal account and then charged on your end of month invoice (assuming you are in the UK) charges are 10% (including VAT) Discogs and approx 5% Paypal so £117 sale cost for you to get £100 net

Paypal at moment are making profit on the whole transaction including shipping (which was a mistake I am lead to believe) and that is to be rectified later so they only make there cut on the item

If its going to cost 17 percent with fees to get a hundred pounds you would probably be better auctioning them by a couple of well known dealers who charge 20 percent.

You are only losing a small difference and it only takes a couple of bidders to get you more than you wanted to start with

[Blackpoolsoul]

1 hour ago, davidwapples said:

If its going to cost 17 percent with fees to get a hundred pounds you would probably be better auctioning them by a couple of well known dealers who charge 20 percent.

You are only losing a small difference and it only takes a couple of bidders to get you more than you wanted to start with

I don't think the £100 records make much difference. I agree though anything above £500 as the their responsibility, postage and insurance

Edited July 16, 2021 by Blackpoolsoul

[Simon T]

15 hours ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

The VAT is paid by the buyer if in EU or certain parts of the world so that doesn't matter the money gets paid by them into your Paypal account and then charged on your end of month invoice (assuming you are in the UK) charges are 10% (including VAT) Discogs and approx 5% Paypal so £117 sale cost for you to get £100 net

Paypal at moment are making profit on the whole transaction including shipping (which was a mistake I am lead to believe) and that is to be rectified later so they only make there cut on the item

Thanks. i thought it might be something along those line, so it would be £117 on Discogs, £100 F&F on here!

[Blackpoolsoul]

3 hours ago, Simon T said:

Thanks. i thought it might be something along those line, so it would be £117 on Discogs, £100 F&F on here!

Some on here are also selling on Facebook

Selling F&F will get you caught out soon Paypal are checking

Also I don't know how Soul Source is set up for sales (perhaps someone can tell us) as I don't know if they are an Online Market Place ?

Edited July 16, 2021 by Blackpoolsoul

[Simon T]

1 minute ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

Some on here are also selling on Facebook

Selling F&F will get you caught out soon Paypal are checking

I meant, I'd rather sell on here to get the £100 or less, than stoke discogs coffers especially since they introduced their ridiculous shipping debacle, i still don't understand it.

as for the F&F, has anyone been warned or sanctioned for it?

[Mike]

24 minutes ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

Some on here are also selling on Facebook

Selling F&F will get you caught out soon Paypal are checking

Also I don't know how Soul Source is set up for sales (perhaps someone can tell us) as I don't know if they are an Online Market Place ?

never get your way of asking questions or indeed posting on here

we do have a support forum, always better to use that rather than these sort of weakly phrased questions you seem to enjoy posting hidden away in topics

ask there and you will get an answer!

here are, am awaiting

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/forums/forum/41-site-support/

 

 

Edited July 16, 2021 by Source
expanded

[Blackpoolsoul]

18 minutes ago, Source said:

never get your way of asking questions or indeed posting on here

we do have a support forum, always better to use that rather than these sort of weakly phrased questions you seem to enjoy posting hidden away in topics

ask there and you will get an answer!

here are, am awaiting

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/forums/forum/41-site-support/

 

 

Never mind I don't sell records, so have no idea and was genuinely trying to help others with passing on what I do know and asking what I don't

[Midnight Drifter]

4 hours ago, Simon T said:

Thanks. i thought it might be something along those line, so it would be £117 on Discogs, £100 F&F on here!

This is one of many reasons why I rather buy here than on discogs, the major being a form of unspoken mutual trust on here..

[Martin Phillips]

I've noticed quite a few primarily newish American sellers but some long standing ones too  on Discogs are not selling to British buyers now presumably because of the intricacies of the new arrangements.Some in the past  excluded the UK anyway but its a growing trend.It was quite irksome the other day when I spotted a minty garagey psych little 45 on there but couldn't get my mitts on it! Onr big German dealer is no longer selling to the UK either since July 1st 

[Solidsoul]

It's not as much hassle to buy from the States now than it used to be pre internet days. I used to go to the currency exchange and buy dollars to send through the post! Then there was the need to send for a Goldmine mag to get the dealers lists. Sending bids by letter through the post. The risks I used to take, etc.

So it has been easier with the internet but is becoming more difficult and less bargains to be had.

I used to get some real bargains in pre-internet days. The USA dealers didn't have much of a clue on value, till they got those price guides and popsike!

 

Edited July 17, 2021 by D9 Ktf

[Haighy]

On 14/07/2021 at 17:50, Blackpoolsoul said:

How can someone put $5 on a customs declaration for a $4800 record that is bonkers and would not be insured and is potential Tax Evasion (even though we don't like it)

Why should the seller care about UK taxes that we have to pay ?

Potential tax evasion, bothered. If your boss  needed you to work on bank holiday mon and offered you £300 cash in hand would you reply, that’s potential tax evasion, I will work and pay the tax. No you wouldn’t, or if I’m wrong your a nougat