Joseph Webster on eBay

[laparis]

What the hell is going on with the Joseph Webster??Do we have a new world price for a soul record??

https://www.ebay.com/itm/313562802214?hash=item4901cca826:g:5OIAAOSwspBgw6ZN

That’s absolutely insane.Glad i didn’t sell my copy.I have been offered 8k for it last year and was close to sell.

Still absolutely ridiculous.Great tune though but don’t think worth that kind of money.

Curious to hear your thoughts about it.

 

[Chalky]

Has to be some dodgy bidding going on

[laparis]

Not sure about that.Except one bidder with just 11 feedback the rest looks pretty legit.

[Frankie Crocker]

What a stunning auction. Don’t often see several top rarities like this at once - shame the conditions are variable. As for Joseph Webster, one of the rarest of the rare in a very decent condition - do people have credit card limits that can buy records in this price bracket? I thought it had peaked at 8K when the Detroit copy sold a couple of years ago. I would say it’s a 10K record now, but the millionaires will scrap over this to the death, so who knows what it’ll finish at.

[Modernsoulsucks]

1 hour ago, Chalky said:

Has to be some dodgy bidding going on

He sells a lot on consignment doesn't he ?

Open to abuse.

A lot of the listings are VG and below. Lucky if it's VG+ and above.

Prices he gets for common albums in poor condition baffles me.

Tbh I just scroll past nowadays.

[laparis]

Hamilton Movement currently at 4K for a G copy.

Are people on crack these days??How stupid can people be thsts unbelievable.

4k should be more a VG+ one.So sad how desperate people are.

[Andyg]

3 hours ago, Chalky said:

Has to be some dodgy bidding going on

you and i know someone who has had all the top records in his collection but it took him 14 years to get his hands on this & paid 10 grand for it 4 years ago

 

[Frankie Crocker]

4 hours ago, Chalky said:

Has to be some dodgy bidding going on

One bid withdrawn so the price has fallen. A few novices. Only one private bidder. One major buyer, plainly a dealer/collector. Couple of serious buyers. A couple of jokers just registering an interest to receive bid notifications. All looks normal. The auctioneer is a top outfit so all should run smoothly.

[Winsford Soul]

Carolinasoul. Is a trusted and respected dealer as far as I'm concerned, But hey what do I know

always stuff to be had cheap if you want to scroll through the thousands of records,  admitted not all mint but most of these records are 40/  50+ years old what do you expect. 

Ste

[Ladymidnight]

Their VG is easily as good as most major UK dealers’ EX grade. I guess that strict grading explains some high prices achieved for VG or less records.

[Paul Shirley]

On 16/06/2021 at 23:45, Winsford Soul said:

Carolinasoul. Is a trusted and respected dealer as far as I'm concerned, But hey what do I know

always stuff to be had cheap if you want to scroll through the thousands of records,  admitted not all mint but most of these records are 40/  50+ years old what do you expect. 

Had some very clean records from him , he graded as vg+ to me they looked mint or excellent plus 

 

Edited June 20, 2021 by Paul Shirley
Non

[Chalky]

7 hours ago, Andyg said:

you and i know someone who has had all the top records in his collection but it took him 14 years to get his hands on this & paid 10 grand for it 4 years ago

 

Its a rare record for sure, rarely seen for sale. Few in collections which we might see surface now given the price. 

6 hours ago, Winsford Soul said:

Carolinasoul. Is a trusted and respected dealer as far as I'm concerned, But hey what do I know

always stuff to be had cheap if you want to scroll through the thousands of records,  admitted not all mint but most of these records are 40/  50+ years old what do you expect. 

Ste

Not saying it is anything to do with him Steve, like you say he is trustworthy. 

[laparis]

9 hours ago, Frankie Crocker said:

One bid withdrawn so the price has fallen. A few novices. Only one private bidder. One major buyer, plainly a dealer/collector. Couple of serious buyers. A couple of jokers just registering an interest to receive bid notifications. All looks normal. The auctioneer is a top outfit so all should run smoothly.

Yes that was the 11 feedback bidder who bidded it up and then retracted his bids,exactly the one i suspected who might be dodgy and i think it is.

I would block him if i were the seller as he might try and ruin the auction at the end.

[Solidsoul]

9 hours ago, Winsford Soul said:

Carolinasoul. Is a trusted and respected dealer as far as I'm concerned, But hey what do I know

 

Is it Lou Stanley? 

[Modernsoulsucks]

2 hours ago, D9 Ktf said:

Is it Lou Stanley? 

Lou is darkhorsesmoke

[Girdwoodinc]

2 hours ago, D9 Ktf said:

Is it Lou Stanley? 

It's Carolina Soul in Raleigh/Durham - Jason Perlmutter

[Mal C]

Joseph Webster is ok, ultra rare, but its not really that uplifting is it... I don't get goosebumps on this one at all... wait there,  I might have said this last week about another expensive 45...  but $13k would but purchase an awful lot of really brilliant records!

 

Edited June 17, 2021 by Mal C

[Quinvy]

Personally think it's one of the best 70's dance tunes of all time. A complete game changer, and very rare.

If you are lucky enough to be wealthy, then I suppose these kind of prices are acceptable. Unfortunately I'm not.

[Winsford Soul]

Just laughed when I seen this from back in  the day. 

James was after a rare record and he was going to sell his Joseph Webster for it. How rare do you have to go.  

[Frankie Crocker]

I’m wondering if a few have been turned up? Surely more were pressed up than have surfaced so far. Quite a few good finds have come out of Detroit recently including one mint copy of Joseph Webster.

Until very recently, the version by Angela Davis was hardly known. Then a whole load turned up in Detroit. Given the link connecting the two versions, it would not surprise me if more copies were to be discovered in the not too distant future.

[Wheelsville1]

1 hour ago, Frankie Crocker said:

I’m wondering if a few have been turned up? Surely more were pressed up than have surfaced so far. Quite a few good finds have come out of Detroit recently including one mint copy of Joseph Webster.

Until very recently, the version by Angela Davis was hardly known. Then a whole load turned up in Detroit. Given the link connecting the two versions, it would not surprise me if more copies were to be discovered in the not too distant future.

I was told several years ago that someone tracked down joseph Websters daughter who had copies of the record but she was quite hostile and would not sell any.

[Frankie Crocker]

54 minutes ago, Wheelsville1 said:

I was told several years ago that someone tracked down joseph Websters daughter who had copies of the record but she was quite hostile and would not sell any.

Entirely plausible. Usually the promise of lots of money overcomes hostility. Maybe a patient Detroit dealer will eventually use powers of persuasion and plenty of dollars to salvage the records before they are lost forever.

[Wheelsville1]

2 minutes ago, Frankie Crocker said:

Entirely plausible. Usually the promise of lots of money overcomes hostility. Maybe a patient Detroit dealer will eventually use powers of persuasion and plenty of dollars to salvage the records before they are lost forever.

Its quite a few years ago that i was told this and i cant remember who i had the conversation with,but i think it was a case of her not wanting herself or her father being exploited in any way. 

[Soulhawk]

I'm a Detroit dealer

pm me the number

I'll treat her right

 

 

[Andyg]

1 hour ago, Wheelsville1 said:

Its quite a few years ago that i was told this and i cant remember who i had the conversation with,but i think it was a case of her not wanting herself or her father being exploited in any way. 

I heard the same story and went a little further to say that if anyone booted it his family would persue them in the courts.

 

[Weingarden]

I was trying to figure out when I traded my copy, and I think I've pinpointed it to 2004, to a well-known UK jock. If only I had known then what I know now...

[Mal C]

22 hours ago, Quinvy said:

Personally think it's one of the best 70's dance tunes of all time. A complete game changer, and very rare.

If you are lucky enough to be wealthy, then I suppose these kind of prices are acceptable. Unfortunately I'm not.

fair comment, I absolutely love 'Cornell Gunter - Love In My Heart'  but that is another 7ts track that seems to get an awful lot of, "Nah, not my thang". 

Horses, Courses, and Mucho Deep Pockets need only apply!

I nabbed the above scan for my i-Tunes, and noticed the lesser quality one I had was shot via the same camera lens, same lighting, so must then be the same dealer who sold that earlier copy...?

Edited June 18, 2021 by Mal C

[Soulhawk]

nah, the earlier clean copy was sold by a store in the Detroit suburb of Royal Oak

[Billy Jo Jim Bob]

On 16/06/2021 at 20:10, Modernsoulsucks said:

He sells a lot on consignment doesn't he ?

Open to abuse.

A lot of the listings are VG and below. Lucky if it's VG+ and above.

Prices he gets for common albums in poor condition baffles me.

Tbh I just scroll past nowadays.

I used to buy, sell and swap in his early days before the 'Carolina Soul' name and I can say that his 45's are very strictly graded. His VG would be NM for us. 

Not sure about consignment being open to abuse, but I guess people could bid up there own 45's if they wanted.

I'm about to send him a couple of obscure synth boogie things as I haven't a clue where to sell them here and he obviously has collectors who look for different types of records, so probably the best route for me. 

[Modernsoulsucks]

1 hour ago, Billy Jo Jim Bob said:

I used to buy, sell and swap in his early days before the 'Carolina Soul' name and I can say that his 45's are very strictly graded. His VG would be NM for us. 

Not sure about consignment being open to abuse, but I guess people could bid up there own 45's if they wanted.

I'm about to send him a couple of obscure synth boogie things as I haven't a clue where to sell them here and he obviously has collectors who look for different types of records, so probably the best route for me. 

But his ads contain his grading scale.

According to him VG is not NM ?

[Ncfc]

On 16/06/2021 at 23:45, Ladymidnight said:

Their VG is easily as good as most major UK dealers’ EX grade. I guess that strict grading explains some high prices achieved for VG or less records.

With you on that Carl. He has auctioned stuff for me and was surprised how honest Jason's gradings are. Defo undergrades. 

[Billy Jo Jim Bob]

32 minutes ago, Modernsoulsucks said:

But his ads contain his grading scale.

According to him VG is not NM ?

There's US grading and UK grading. Very different in my experience.

[davidwapples]

Yes no ex in us grading so vg is one rank higher than uk grading,  so ex uk is vg usa

[Modernsoulsucks]

19 minutes ago, davidwapples said:

Yes no ex in us grading so vg is one rank higher than uk grading,  so ex uk is vg usa

EX UK is VG++ USA isn't it ?

[Ladymidnight]

Also, most major UK dealers (not all!) are quite sloppy with their grading. For example, a M- could look like this:

[Chalky]

3 hours ago, Modernsoulsucks said:

But his ads contain his grading scale.

According to him VG is not NM ?

I've bought a few VG and VG+ from him and his grading is always better....as said NM, Ex at least for a brit

[Modernsoulsucks]

26 minutes ago, Ladymidnight said:

Also, most major UK dealers (not all!) are quite sloppy with their grading. For example, a M- could look like this:

That was sold at M- ?

VG or less IMO.

So am I right in thinking you're saying he's a conservative grader and if you're happy with UK sellers grading [a lot of which is ambitious to put it politely] you'd be very happy with Jason's ?

[Ladymidnight]

Yes, definitely VG-, though it played ok. Jason is a very conservative grader in my experience, and I would say that his VG is generally equal to or better than most UK dealers’ EX. I’m certainly not saying all UK sellers are like that, but many of the established ones are, as far as I’m concerned. 

[davidwapples]

That's a vg-  about 30 40 % value of a mint- record

[Ladymidnight]

Just now, davidwapples said:

That's a vg-  about 30 40 % value of a mint- record

If you’re grading correctly/honestly, yes:) 

[Benji]

After buying thousands of records from all over the world I have to say that the worst graders are UK sellers. Period. Especially Northern Soul sellers.

[Paul Shirley]

23 hours ago, Mal C said:

fair comment, I absolutely love 'Cornell Gunter - Love In My Heart'  but that is another 7ts track that seems to get an awful lot of, "Nah, not my thang". 

Horses, Courses, and Mucho Deep Pockets need only apply!

I nabbed the above scan for my i-Tunes, and noticed the lesser quality one I had was shot via the same camera lens, same lighting, so must then be the same dealer who sold that earlier copy...?

Definitely not the same seller !! If your meaning the one that’s on eBay now and the one sold around 4 years ago on eBay ?   
If that’s not what you meant then my mistake,

Edited June 19, 2021 by Paul Shirley

[Midnight Drifter]

18 hours ago, Benji said:

After buying thousands of records from all over the world I have to say that the worst graders are UK sellers. Period. Especially Northern Soul sellers.

Of course you're talking Soul records here, otherwise: Have you met sellers of Jamaican or even better, African records? 

As I do buy aforementioned records as well as Soul records, I must say I am quite happy with my UK sellers.

And you surely will always find better and worse graders among them all, be it US, UK or whatever country they might sit in.

[Paul Shirley]

On 17/06/2021 at 22:15, Wheelsville1 said:

I was told several years ago that someone tracked down joseph Websters daughter who had copies of the record but she was quite hostile and would not sell any.

No  sorry to disappoint partly right , yes people have spoken to her but no copies I’m afraid at least I was told that from a very reliable source, that tale has been going around for years think Dave Thorley could give you more details  I’m not saying it’s wrong her family are not to be crossed , and American copyright laws are very tough unlike ours , she was in London not very long ago a well known dealer spoke to her regarding copyright & possible reissue, I haven’t spoken to him for over a year since then this sonic wax thing has appeared I’m dying to find out what’s gone on with that

Edited June 19, 2021 by Paul Shirley

[Wheelsville1]

39 minutes ago, Paul Shirley said:

No  sorry to disappoint partly right , yes people have spoken to her but no copies I’m afraid at least I was told that from a very reliable source, that tale has been going around for years think Dave Thorley could give you more details  I’m not saying it’s wrong her family are not to be crossed with and American copyright laws are very tough unlike ours , she was in London not very long ago a well known dealer spoke to her regarding copyright & possible reissue, I haven’t spoken to him for over a year since then this sonic wax thing has appeared I’m dying to find out what’s gone on 

Ok,i was going on what i had been told.With regards to the sonic wax release,yes it would be interesting to know whats behind that. 

[Paul Shirley]

20 minutes ago, Wheelsville1 said:

Ok,i was going on what i had been told.With regards to the sonic wax release,yes it would be interesting to know whats behind that. 

Yeah it’s same as what I heard as well but I found out lots more since I heard the story,  yes gonna try and find out about that release if so I’ll message you atb take care

[Wheelsville1]

22 minutes ago, Paul Shirley said:

Yeah it’s same as what I heard as well but I found out lots more since I heard the story,  yes gonna try and find out about that release if so I’ll message you atb take care

Yes that would be great as i have wondered about all these sonic wax releases etc that Steve Jefferies is behind as to wether they have been licensed , correct royalties paid etc. 

[Frankie Crocker]

1 hour ago, Wheelsville1 said:

Yes that would be great as i have wondered about all these sonic wax releases etc that Steve Jefferies is behind as to wether they have been licensed , correct royalties paid etc. 

 

1 hour ago, Wheelsville1 said:

Yes that would be great as i have wondered about all these sonic wax releases etc that Steve Jefferies is behind as to wether they have been licensed , correct royalties paid etc. 

I don’t know Steve personally, but I‘ve bought from him. He has had 300 Joseph Websters pressed up at £20 a pop. If the US copyright owner had no original copies of the record, then $5K would clinch the deal, yield a profit, satisfy a suspicious Detroiter and give scope for further leasing deals, say to Kent. Judging from Steve’s other offerings, he surely has a business model on a very even footing. As the UK’s latest new vinyl kid on the block, maybe Steve can post on here what the situation is?

[laparis]

598 watchers on Joseph Webster LOL

Probably 595 are peter gazers

[Kenb]

6 minutes ago, laparis said:

598 watchers on Joseph Webster LOL

Probably 595 are peter gazers

Enlighten a numpty like me. Why would you care about the “high price” someone wants to pay. You say you have one, and turned down an £8K offer. I’m intrigued (politely)