Ebay Empty Package Scam

[Baz Atkinson]

GOT ABOUT £400 QUIDS WORTH OFF LARS LAST MONTH,GENE REDDING ,THE RARE EJ AND THE ECHOES AND DUKE TURNER ,THERE CAME WITHIN 5 DAYS AND WERE WELL WRAPPED ETC.HOWEVER THE BRITISH POST OFFICE WORRY THE SHIT OUT OF ME ,HAD SOME VERY BAD EXPERIENCES AND THERE ARE SO GOOD AT PASSING THE BUCK.YOU CAN ASK FOR A TRACKING NUMBER BUT I DO NOT KNOW IF THAT APPLIES TO TRANSACTIONS IN EUROPE.

BAZ A.

[Guest sjay]

Toughie this and a pisser for Lars if he's telling the truth.

How closely did you examine the package Steve? Were there any different kinds of tape, sealing etc?

[/quoteOk lets get this bit absolutely straight I offered to send Lars pictures of the packjage to show him ,it is a top opening packafe folded over from the front to the back with a 2 inch strip of brown parcel tape wrapped all the way around it.without breaking this tape there is no way to open the package let alone remove a record (unless paul daniels is now working for the post office ).

How do i know that this is the original tape you may ask,well it sill has the luftpost sticker and the deutche post payment label on it all intact and perfect,it is also not a reued mailer I cut both endds to open it I still have the strip of tape I removed from the back wkich fits back perfectly in place and if you are familiar tith this type of tape it is very sticky and has pulled a residue of cardboard from the packet which you would expect and this aligns exactly with this strip of tape at the back oof the packet(ie there is only 1 damage mark on the package where I presonally opened it )as you all know this type of tape can only be used once as the residue of the cardboard makes the glue on the tape useless and therefore it it is imossible to open this type of tape and re-use it to seal a package again it just will not stick.I am perfectly happy to let anyone on here examine it and when Lars said that once he had sent records to John Anderson and the same thing happened I suggested that I take the package to John and let him examine it to verify what I said as I live 12 miles way from Kings Lynn to this lars replied this is your answer if you live so close a local postman must be stealing them!!

I bet Johns really worried now as hes been doing mail order from Kings Lynn for over 30 years (has anyone ever received an empty package from him )

The seller is talking rubbish ,my business is international antique exporting my customers are buying my goods which are then shipped to all the 4 corners of the globe I fully understand the care that must be exercised in the dispatch of these goods ie making sure that the customer recives the correct items that they have paid for.

My first suggestion to lars was that he had either simply made an error and not enclosed the record or that he may have mixed it up with another order and sent someone else my record by mistake along with the items that they had purchased.As he said he no longer had the record I suggested that he email the other buyers to see if they had received my record by mistake.This he did and I waited till he got his replies back ,no said Lars no one has it it is stolen what can we do.Just suposing that you received a free record from a dealer in a situation like this would you tell him or not??

The only way I can see that this is not a very very clever scam(100% massive feedback)is that Lars is not very careful in the way way he prcesses his orders and sometimes sends extra records to a lucky customer at the expense of an unfortunate one (not a typical example of german efficiency) and if this is indded the case he needs to take more cre to make sure it never happens again,for it to happen at all is bad to have it happen again and again is negligent and so I feel it it perfectly right for him to have refunded my money and he should also do to Rachel and anyone else who has received an empty package from him

Steve

[Guest James Trouble]

I'm sure if Lars was going to 'scam' you he would have done it to someone else with a rare record and not just a £50er?

It doesn't make sense to do it with a £50er, sell a lumpy record and do it, yeah, could see the temptation, but on a £50 record. No way, not Lars. That would be stupid.

There has to be an explanation. A mistake somwhere, or theft from the post office?

Edited February 2, 2007 by James Trouble

[Guest Carl Dixon]

Maybe it is time for some serious investigations into this and set a trap:

I suggest Lars take 3 of his 'single' sized packages and fill them with valueless 45's and post to 3 different addresses in the UK. However, post 1 from his normal post office and the other 2 from a different post office. Take digital photos of them beforehand, front and back and even inside if you can and email the photos to the UK recipients who are involved with this 'covert' operation.

If all 3 arrive looking exactly the same, with the records - there was no tampering by either post office.

If the 2 arrive not tampered with from the alternative post office, but the 1 from the regular post office has evidence of mischief, you are on the way to proving there is an issue at the senders end.

You could 'wax' seal the packages as an alternative. This would make it harder to disguise the package being opened and resealed. But they may just start disappearing altogether.

Alternatively, you could just do 1 package through the regular post office and put a note in the package advising the thief that the reason there is a piece cardboard inside and not a record, is because you have been caught! He/she will then know you mean business and may back off. You could approach the post office manager and explain what has happened and agree to set the trap there.

If Lars has a reputation to maintain, it must be protected and some investigation initiated to ensure this. If somebody is up to mischief this would be the right thing to consider.

Just a thought.

[Guest ruffsounds]

Re Missing or empty parcels my son who used to work for the Post office as well as Parcelforce has told me of some of things that can happen whilst parcels are in transit, Firstly the Postal services can and often randomly open packages (supposedly as a security matter) and are trained in how to open and reseal packages without leaving tell tale signs. Secondly if somebody cant make out address or postcodes or improperly packaged then they go into different areas to be repacked, but he also says that there is a lot of dodgy dealings going on as well so i guess we all have to be carefull of what we buy or sell.

cheers Ruffsounds

[Docfish]

Steve, why do you permanently doubt my reputation? I never doubt yours, not in my e-mails to you and not on any discussion board. You got a refund ... what else do you want? This is not some kind of Charles Bronson movie here, or do I get something wrong? I can assure you that I feel desperately sorry for what happened, but I feel in no way guilty! I really see no sense in arguing here in a Sherlock Holmes manner; I know that I packed your record and send it out on Monday. What happened afterwards is out of my control ... I've send hundreds of 45s in the last year to the UK and everywhere in the world, without any problems

I do sell some spares and records I don't need - here, on fryers funk-forum, on the modern soul board, on soul-talk and on ebay. My username on every board, I've mentioned and on ebay is "docfish". So don't buy from me, if in any doubt. It's that easy ...

enough said from my side,

Lars

[Guest Awake 502]

I post over 1000 packages a year ( not records ) too all corners of the world, anything valued at over £32 and I insist on enhanced compensation / special delivery. Peace of mind for both parties.

[Guest rachel]

So don't buy from me, if in any doubt. It's that easy ...

Well, I wouldn't again, partly because of the empty package, and partly because you don't seem to be prepared to reassure your buyers by at least trying to find out what's apparently happening at the post office - one package like this would be unlucky, three is a bit too much of a coincidence to do nothing about... but if you're not that bothered then it's your choice.

[Docfish]

Rachel, I am bothered. I called a hot line for complaints run by the german post this morning, I have waited 10 long minutes (for 50 cent a minute, while listening to the worst background music in the world) till I got a student-call-center-jobber on the line. Who just told me, that he could do nothing for me, but thanks for your call bla, bla, bla ...

Well, I wouldn't again, partly because of the empty package, and partly because you don't seem to be prepared to reassure your buyers by at least trying to find out what's apparently happening at the post office - one package like this would be unlucky, three is a bit too much of a coincidence to do nothing about... but if you're not that bothered then it's your choice.

[Pete S]

I once sent a recorded by recorded delivery, the package was opened, the record was removed and replaced with a non soul record, resealed, and sent on to it's destination. Obviously the person who bought it complained, I raised a complaint, they said the package had arrived intact and I could f*ck off basically, so never trust any postman working at the Colchester sorting office.

[Dave]

Don't like this.

Have bought from the vendor, and vaguely know the buyer.

Having said that.. I take Lars to be the straight guy.

[Ged Parker]

Don't like this.

Have bought from the vendor, and vaguely know the buyer.

Having said that.. I take Lars to be the straight guy.

I also have bought from Lars without any problems but as can be seen from his feedback so have loads of people. James is right if Lars was going to scam anyone it would be for more than £50. I don't knwo any DJ who would risk his reputation for £50. Having said all that the description of the package does make tampering sound inplausable. If I had to bet, which I don't,d say this was a genuine mistake by Lars and someone got an extra record but won't admit it.

I wouldn't hesitate to buy from Lars in future, mind you I'd email him asking him to take care packing the item

[Guest James Trouble]

Well, I wouldn't again, partly because of the empty package, and partly because you don't seem to be prepared to reassure your buyers by at least trying to find out what's apparently happening at the post office - one package like this would be unlucky, three is a bit too much of a coincidence to do nothing about... but if you're not that bothered then it's your choice.

At worst Lars has made a mistake, and his response is probably due to him being a little confused and frustrated. Tricky one, but I'd say you'll find dozons of folk around here who have dealt with Lars and would recomend him. He's a sound guy.

Edited February 2, 2007 by James Trouble

[Jumpinjoan]

At worst Lars has made a mistake, and his response is probably due to him being a little confused and frustrated. Tricky one, but I'd say you'll find dozons of folk around here who have dealt with Lars and would recomend him. He's a sound guy.

.... you arse twitching a bit there was it James?

[Guest Lady Maverick]

The seller was me and I can only assure, that I have packed the record properly and send it to you. I can't held responsible for a stolen record! And what kind of shi**y trick should that be, sending an empty package? God damn, if I would be a cheater I wouldn't send the parcel out and would pretend, that it got lost on the way.

By the way, It's abit nasty after recieveing a full refund, talking bad about me.

Check my feedback on evil bay and you will see, that this kind of shit happens, but in 99,99% obviously not with me as a seller

Lars

Lars...may I suggest possibly trying a different post if possible?? I have no reason to judge and I am not, but from the outside looking in, please understand that it doesn't look right. I have sold items on eBay from time to time and never had a problem with the post...even overseas post.

However, I understand your frustration as I have been called a "cross-dressing f--" from a person who accused me of false advertisment, when I was specific in the condition of the record...even answering his rude questions in a polite and business-like way. Needless to say, I have since had him reported...I don't pay Verizon to receive such nasty email from losers like him.

I still chuckle at the fact that I have been called a "cross-dressing f--"...those that know me and see me online know otherwise!

So maybe trying another post in your area if possible may solve this problem?

Re Missing or empty parcels my son who used to work for the Post office as well as Parcelforce has told me of some of things that can happen whilst parcels are in transit, Firstly the Postal services can and often randomly open packages (supposedly as a security matter) and are trained in how to open and reseal packages without leaving tell tale signs. Secondly if somebody cant make out address or postcodes or improperly packaged then they go into different areas to be repacked, but he also says that there is a lot of dodgy dealings going on as well so i guess we all have to be carefull of what we buy or sell.

cheers Ruffsounds

Yes, there are some dishonest folk out there that would stoop this low, but wouldn't they have lost their jobs by now??? That's ridiculous! I know packages are subject to searching as it goes thru customs to and from the US, but still, that's crazy!

[Guest James Trouble]

.... you arse twitching a bit there was it James?

Just realised I should be concentrating on more important things than winding up birds, but I'll be saving it for a later date!

Edited February 2, 2007 by James Trouble

[stomper45]

Rachel, I am bothered. I called a hot line for complaints run by the german post this morning, I have waited 10 long minutes (for 50 cent a minute, while listening to the worst background music in the world) till I got a student-call-center-jobber on the line. Who just told me, that he could do nothing for me, but thanks for your call bla, bla, bla ...

Lars' you'd be better trying to find out how your mail travels yourself. Go to or ring your local office, find out where the mail goes from your local post office or postbox, then ask to speak to the manager of that first sort/cosolidation point, tell them your problem the culprit may be here. Then find out if its sent for further handling at a final consolidation point, again find a duty manager and explain probs.

[Guest bleusuperb]

When I was posting out records by standard mail around 1 in every 20 were being reported back to me as not recieved. Almost all of them were to U.K Buyers, any records going abroad seemed to arrive safely.

I then decided that I would send everything as recorded, signed for, deliveries. since doing this everything sent out has been delivered.

It would seem that either the Royal Mail has a number of music lovers in their ranks or certain buyers relished having both the records and a full refund, although it is probably a combination of both scenarios.

[Guest rachel]

Since this thread started, Lars has contacted me today and sent a refund for the two records which I didn't receive. Hopefully he will manage to resolve this problem and it won't happen to anyone else.

[Guest sjay]

Since this thread started, Lars has contacted me today and sent a refund for the two records which I didn't receive. Hopefully he will manage to resolve this problem and it won't happen to anyone else.

Well Im pleassed to hear that you got a refund too Rachel Im pretty sure that if you had to make a guess that Lars has shipped these missing records to other people by mistake but this being so he should still be held responsible for for making a full refund as he has therefore failed to deliver someones purchase,and as he has made refunds I guess he has now faced up to this responsibility in the only way acceptable.

I spoke today to John Anderson about his experience with Lars he told me it was a £15 record for his own british collection his packet was empty and unopened Lars said it must be stolen John was having none of this and demanded and recived a full payment.

If Lars problem is with packing the records and mixing orders he really must address this but I cannot see anyway you can package a record without packing one in the first place

steve

[Ezzie Brown]

I have won items from LARS(Docfish) in the past and had no problems at all.

i have had several records from docfish over the years, never any problem, speak as you find!!!! EZZIE

[boba]

I have gotten several items from Lars over the years with no problems, and I'm overseas (US), plus he was friendly on several occasions and gave me advice on some items on my want list, totally unsolicited.

-bob in Chicago

[Guest SteveJohnston]

i have had several records from docfish over the years, never any problem, speak as you find!!!! EZZIE

Had my first records of Lars just last week the two arived safe and sound. The records were a private sale just me sending a email then paying on paypal. If Lars was into ripping of punters there was the perfect opportunity!.

Steve J

[Guest sjay]

Don't like this.

Have bought from the vendor, and vaguely know the buyer.

Having said that.. I take Lars to be the straight guy.

Hi mate thanks for the vote of confidence I asked Docfish for the one thing that would clear this matter up once and for all a copy of his proof of postage for this packsge which would have the wight in grams printed on it so I could take the package to the post office have them weigh the package I received and compare the 2 simple!!

No unfortunately Lars said he didnt have one so we will never know.

Dont want to go here again but dont want anyone thinking Im not a staight guy eitheras I said this would have sorted the problem once and for all

Steve

[Larsc]

I used to work part-time as a postie when I was a teenager. One of my work mates used to open up (plastic) envelopes from film processing companies to remove one or two unused rolls of film. Then he would reseal the package with his lighter and deliver it to the recipient. He only did this when there were at least four or five rolls in the package so it would look like the lab had made a mistake.

[Guest Paul]

To be fair to both parties it's almost impossible to prove what really happened. Buying and selling is always open to scams - from buyers, sellers and postal workers.

The important point here is that for all expensive purchases people should use special delivery or airsure, with insurance and a receipt showing the weight, the date and a tracking number.

I avoid buying from unknown sellers (especially overseas) these days because if you get ripped off you can't turn up and knock on someone's door if they happen to live in a remote part of Texas surrounded by man-eating alligators. And of course they know that.

I was scammed recently and I realised the seller was just taking the piss because he was 4,000 miles away ...so I found his home address and told him he had 24 hours before I called the Dade County police department. Suddenly I got a full refund.

Everything changes when you say "I know where you live!" or "my dad's a policeman!" or whatever.

Anyway, I'm off to rob the mail train. I reckon it's full of 45s, hopefully in M- condition. If I end up with loads of warped 45s I'll be leaving negative feedback.

Paul Mooney

Edited February 5, 2007 by Paul

[Paul Capon]

All,

I think I'll start putting a signature across the packing tape on parcels that I send. I would suggest that Lars and others do the same.

PS I can also vouch for Lars.

Regards,

Paul Capon

Edited February 5, 2007 by souler

[Guest Richard Bergman]

Hi I am asking for help on this bought a record on ebay from a 100% pos fedback very genuine looking seller,package arrived it was empty I contacted seller asking what had happened he said someone in the post office has stolen it not his responsibilty as I paid pay pal would offer 50% of my purchase price back.I have bought records for 30 years and there is no way on earth that this package was tampered with in any way.I smell a rat here on the face of it one would feel that to share the cost of a genuine thefy might be fair and as he seems a genuine seller I should belive him but I dont.Has anyone else had similar problems are there sellers who get away with regularly cheating.I dont want to name this seller right now but I would welcome any pms from any of you who have had the same problem with names of sellers to see if any of them are doing this on a regular basis.

Steve

You do hear a few horror stories from time ....this is part and parcel (pun intended!!! ) of the black market trade. I've never had any real problems with sellers more at the other end and the "salt of the earth" brit posties. My last run in was when they tried to squeeze a £100 pound girl group record through my 2inch letterbox even though clearly marked on the packaging were the words RECORD & FRAGILE....Self explanatory really!!!!

In regards to your case all I can ask is the seller from Belgium ... anglo-belgain relations have suffered in the last few years.

[Tolbert]

I know Lars well. He is a very honest person. I buy records since years from Lars and he is always fair, never had any trouble with him (beside the fact that he is a HSV-fan ). Be shure he will never cheat on someone. Fact is that I have more and more trouble with the post office since the last years. Maybe it's the partial privatisation of the german post or the part time staff. A few times i get no information that a packet is waiting at the post office and so the record get back to the us or uk; Registered mail was put in the staircase, free for everybody; records did not arrive at all. Even two chairs that i ordered, disapeard!! The Inquiry was a joke! Registered mail seems to be the safest way but is no insurance . Tim

[Ralf Mehnert]

i think every collector or seller can tell us stories about lost money or records.

...once i`d sent a lot of money to a u.s. based dealer and just 20% of my hard earned arrived at him...why the thief didn`t took all...i don`t know...

...and i`d ordered a few sales tapes from a well known u.k. dealer in the late 80`s...i`d paid...the tapes arrived at my postbox...but there was not a single song on the tapes. send them back to him...and didn`t get a refund until now

things like that will happen again and again, especially for the regular collectors/sellers.

all i can say is that i know lars for years. here`s here for the music...not for the money. and if he want to ripp off some u.k. collector...he will send him an parcel without the magnetics on bonnie...not a 50 quid record. i never had any trouble when dealin with him. over here he`s a well respected dj and collector/seller. it would be nice not to damage someones reputation...after he gave full refunds for lost items.

calm down....no new simon soussan in sight

ralf