Gino Washington 2 tunes/release chronology theory query

[Tlscapital]

With only the Mala release with a definitive release date at November 1968 the other releases variations leave us to only guess what happened there, then and when...

The Washpan trio singles dating 1968 seem most plausible. If so they likely predate the 'Ill be around' Mala venture deal. Likely a tune that Gino had much hope for... 

Only judging by the 'few' number of stock Mala copies flying around of 'I'll be around' and their great condition it did not "HIT" as Gino would/could have expected. 

Would Gino then have gotten back into the studio to re-mix 'I'll be around' (much rawer than the Mala) and release it on his Atac label somewhere in the year 1969 ?

Then re-releasing 'what can a man do' as a 'B' side on his following Atac label release with 'doing the pop-corn'. That got picked up by the R.P.R distribution group.

After that little success (judging by the number of worn copies flying around) they decide to give another shot at 'Ill be around' (shortened "chicken' picking guitar intro).

That last attempt at charting with 'I'll be around' seem to have suffer the same misfortune faith as the first Mala release judging by the number of copies flying around.

The discographies to be find are chaotic or not coherent. Love Gino, crave 'I'll be around' and so I wanted to sort this one out if ever someone had some better insight... 

Edited April 18, 2021 by Tlscapital
Not different takes actually but mixes well.

[The Yank]

This article is from the August 23, 1969 issue of Record World. So it looks like the Mala 45 came out first and the ATAC version was second. 

 

[Tlscapital]

On 14/04/2021 at 20:43, The Yank said:

This article is from the August 23, 1969 issue of Record World. So it looks like the Mala 45 came out first and the ATAC version was second. 

 

Thanks that's fantastic info. Have just completed that on 45cat. Will do it on discogs later.

This means that the Atac release distributed by R.P.R. came out last likely as I first deduced.

The local Atac with the best version of 'I'll be around' still has no definitive release date given.

As it might be a prior release to the Mala... But with the very different mix of 'I'll be around' likely not.

FWIW the Mala copies have the strongest mastering for 'like my baby'. With more depth and 'Oomph !'

The local Atac has the best take and mastering with the long guitar chicken 'picking' intro for 'I'll be around '.

Edited April 18, 2021 by Tlscapital

[Gaz T]

Sort of makes sense

I always thought the blue mala issue was the version you don't see as much

[Nick Soule]

If you switch 2 and 3 around, I believe that is the correct order for everything. "I'll Be Around..." was a local hit and you never see the Mala copy in or around Detroit.  

[Tlscapital]

5 hours ago, Gaz T said:

Sort of makes sense

I always thought the blue mala issue was the version you don't see as much

From my experience there is about 2 blue stocker for 3 yellow promo Mala floating around. Almost an even "rarity" ratio for that national distributed Mala release. As for the later R.P.R. Atac release a stocker is yet to be found if ever it exists. The local Detroit Atac is the harder issue to come by in real clean condition... Ain't that saying a something ? 

[Wheelsville1]

45 minutes ago, Tlscapital said:

From my experience there is about 2 blue stocker for 3 yellow promo Mala floating around. Almost an even "rarity" ratio for that national distributed Mala release. As for the later R.P.R. Atac release a stocker is yet to be found if ever it exists. The local Detroit Atac is the harder issue to come by in real clean condition... Ain't that saying a something ? 

The mala press is definatley the first label,Gino constantley tried to promote this record hence re releasing it on his own label.The white promo copies were an attempt to to promote it on the west coast.To my knowledge it never got past the promo stage. 

[Tlscapital]

5 hours ago, Nick Soule said:

If you switch 2 and 3 around, I believe that is the correct order for everything. "I'll Be Around..." was a local hit and you never see the Mala copy in or around Detroit.  

Thought about that. Yes now that you point out the fact that the Mala copie are not to be found in the Detroit area could indeed indicate that it was first pressed on Atac.

There with enough local air-play it could then haven been picked-up my Mala with a closure in the deal for Gino to keep local exclusivity in sales, distribution and promotion.

What triggered that little quest/querry of mine was the difference in the masterings first an mixes after. Owning a Detroit Atac for long enough I got accustom to it's sound.

Then got a Mala copy to sell on for a friend and got blown away by the sound difference. Especially on the 'I'll be around' side. That clearly indicate a reel/tape mastering job.

But that on it's own doesn't imply much. The last R.P.R. release seem to aim for a last chance to HIT higher allowing me to believe that Gino expected more from the Mala deal.

Taking me back to my theory that the Mala was first. Gino deception in that venture outcome re-release it on his own to be picked up a second time around as 'Wheelsville1' corroborate.

Edited April 16, 2021 by Tlscapital

[Wheelsville1]

24 minutes ago, Tlscapital said:

Thought about that. Yes now that you point out the fact that the Mala copie are not to be found in the Detroit area could indeed indicate that it was first pressed on Atac.

There with enough local air-play it could then haven been picked-up my Mala with a closure in the deal for Gino to keep local exclusivity in sales, distribution and promotion.

What triggered that little quest/querry of mine was the difference in the masterings first an mixes after. Owning a Detroit Atac for long enough I got accustom to it's sound.

Then got a Mala copy to sell on for a friend and got blown away by the sound difference. Especially on the 'I'll be around' side. That clearly indicate a reel/tape mastering job.

But that on it's own doesn't imply much. The last R.P.R. release seem to aim for a last chance to HIT higher allowing me to believe that Gino expected more from the Mala deal.

Taking me back to my theory that the Mala was first. Gino deception in that venture outcome re-release it on his own to be picked up a second time around as 'Wheelsville1' corroborate.

The same thing goes with popcorn wylie releasing tommy neal on palmer and then having a second go on his own pamline label. 

[Chalky]

I would have thought one of the Atac was released locally first with Mala picking it up for national distrubution?  

[Tlscapital]

1 hour ago, Chalky said:

I would have thought one of the Atac was released locally first with Mala picking it up for national distrubution?  

The all white (promo only) Atac was distributed by R.P.R. (Los Angeles) who had national distribution connections. It came out in August 1969 together with Jimmy McFarland 'lonely lover' on R.P.R. !

The Mala being from November 1968 it came out prior that Atac R.P.R. release. That leaves the local Atac (Gino's Detroit own) in question as to it's date of release. Before or after Mala zat is ze kwestion !

Edited April 16, 2021 by Tlscapital

[Chalky]

9 minutes ago, Tlscapital said:

The all white (promo only) Atac was distributed by R.P.R. (Los Angeles) who had national distribution connections. It came out in August 1969 together with Jimmy McFarland 'lonely lover' on R.P.R. !

The Mala being from November 1968 it came out prior that Atac R.P.R. release. That leaves the local Atac (Gino's Detroit own) in question as to it's date of release. Before or after Mala zat is ze kwestion !

Personally I would assume Mala came second.  Have you thought of asking Gino, is he still around?

[Tlscapital]

1 minute ago, Chalky said:

Personally I would assume Mala came second.  Have you thought of asking Gino, is he still around?

I thought of asking someone who is still on contact with him... Now I must  Will report on it.