Ady Potts Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Totally agree with Chalky. Trent Sisters reminds me of what a girl felt, on being introduced to me one Friday night in a Melton Mowbray pub.. this rather pretty lady.. said "John Manship? ....I've heard of you" she looked me up and down.. screwed her face up and chirped "I'm so Disappointed!" Well John, I will say, Lisa does speak her mind !
Pete S Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 The Reason That The Trent Sisters Is Not A Big Record Is Because nobody Has Got a Copy. ...and because it's rubbish
Guest cC B Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 nice one...unfortunately not here, no, but someone out there should have a soundfile...christian? Nope.. And it's shit anyway... No need for posting up a MP3 Or for anybody else to look for it... ...anyone wants to sell/trade me a copy
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 -->QUOTE(C.B @ Jan 4 2007, 12:28 PM) link Nope.. And it's shit anyway... No need for posting up a MP3 Or for anybody else to look for it... ...anyone wants to sell/trade me a copy LOL, Wrighty was jsut saying he thinks you've gone off to hide so you don't have to see anyone post a sound file of it. And Christian, you know I would trade/pay more than you so you may as well give up hope now so if anyone has a copy of Willie Wright "Right On For The Darkness" they know their best bet is to email jamestrouble@hotmail.com and not Christian
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 ...and because it's rubbish You'd best not try and understand it Pete, stick to the simpler things in life as I'm sure you're easily confused
Pete S Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 You'd best not try and understand it Pete, stick to the simpler things in life as I'm sure you're easily confused But that's at least three people on this thread alone who've said it's average or below, not just me...anyway what's going on, why can I see your posts???
Simon M Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) But that's at least three people on this thread alone who've said it's average or below, not just me...anyway what's going on, why can I see your posts??? Yeah I agree with Pete-S for once, plus a high % of Kebs plays on the Northern scene were dire !! (to my ears and many others ) Pat Brady . Clarkie etc had much better 60's 70's & 80's Edited January 4, 2007 by Simon M
Steve G Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 , Lou Pride's "Got To Be Somebody For Me" on Suemi, Surely not that rare James?
Guest Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 But I do think that Chalky is showing up his rather limited taste by saying that Trent Sisters is a poor record. Shame on you Chalky, it is far from a poor record. That Mary Hunt thing that you are championing on the hand... :fool: Now now James people in glass houses and all that ,wouldn't want to bring up your awful "Eddie & Ernie c/up" would we ............oops i just have. Derek
Corbett80 Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 got to agree re: Willie Wright over Elipsis.....its got credit credentials to start with and the production and everything is just fantastic. Had no idea it was so rare though. That second Soul Spectrum Keb complied is one of the best comps I've heard, as in virtually every record on there is a complete winner. And its got Flowers on
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 But I do think that Chalky is showing up his rather limited taste by saying that Trent Sisters is a poor record. Shame on you Chalky, it is far from a poor record. That Mary Hunt thing that you are championing on the hand... :fool: Now now James people in glass houses and all that ,wouldn't want to bring up your awful "Eddie & Ernie c/up" would we ............oops i just have. Derek Touche Derek. But the Eddie & Ernie C/U packs the dance floors, and although that's not normally a great arguement for proving that a record is good or not, I'll use it
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Surely not that rare James? I hope not, but I've been looking for it for as long as I can remember. There must be one tucked away in a northern colelction somewhere? That and the Fabulous Jades are possibly the only two big known funk records I've not seen for sale in 10 years? Not including a few of Wrighty's things like the Aristocrats of course.
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) got to agree re: Willie Wright over Elipsis.....its got credit credentials to start with and the production and everything is just fantastic. Had no idea it was so rare though. That second Soul Spectrum Keb complied is one of the best comps I've heard, as in virtually every record on there is a complete winner. And its got Flowers on Agreed, great stuff on there. I'm sure Wrighty will confirm, but I'm sure there are only two copies of Willie Wright? Or is it one? Am I right thinking it's just Wrighty and DJ Shadow? I could only imagine how big it would be if Sam got hold of a copy I do hope Wrighty plays it at Soul Revolution February 24th? Edited January 4, 2007 by James Trouble
Guest wrighty Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Agreed, great stuff on there. I'm sure Wrighty will confirm, but I'm sure there are only two copies of Willie Wright? Or is it one? Am I right thinking it's just Wrighty and DJ Shadow? I could only imagine how big it would be if Sam got hold of a copy I do hope Wrighty plays it at Soul Revolution February 24th? as far as i know keb's old copy went to kenny dope via baby t records...so just mine and kenny's at present
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) Just thought of another one... Mr Clean + The Soul Inc "What's Going On" , only a couple of copies of this mind blowing version of the marvin gaye classic. That would be huge if a northern DJ started playing it. Too rare to be widely known by most soul collectors though. Mr Clean and Willie Wright together in a set, it doesn't get much more holy grail than that. End of discussion for me. Edited January 4, 2007 by James Trouble
Them Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 I have to say I find that Hott Ice , a bit better than Ellipsis ....In my opinion , and all that Only your opinion? Guess the many feel so!
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 as far as i know keb's old copy went to kenny dope via baby t records...so just mine and kenny's at present Easy to get them two muddled up. Big black man or slight built ginger man
Guest Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Touche Derek. But the Eddie & Ernie C/U packs the dance floors, and although that's not normally a great arguement for proving that a record is good or not, I'll use it Not a good arguement at all really the soul scene is littered with crap records that filled dance floors.... but i'll let you off this time Derek
Them Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Yeah, I regretted selling the Ellipsis for a month or two but the Chain Reaction isn't going anywhere But if you changed your mind, just remember that I can be a good home for it.
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Not a good arguement at all really the soul scene is littered with crap records that filled dance floors.... but i'll let you off this time Derek My point exactly
Guest cC B Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Just thought of another one... Mr Clean + The Soul Inc "What's Going On" Even worse! Avoid at all costs! People should stick to the original version.. ...now who wants to sell me this crappy record? Got some tasty trades Much better than the ones James will offer you
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 -->QUOTE(C.B @ Jan 4 2007, 02:56 PM) link Even worse! Avoid at all costs! People should stick to the original version.. ...now who wants to sell me this crappy record? Got some tasty trades Much better than the ones James will offer you I think we'll both have to dream on Christian. Potential sellers already know I have better trade and will offer more cash than you anyway and already know to email jamestrouble@hotmail.com if they have a copy, so I won't mention it again
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 I want the Trent Sisters, but not as much as I wanted the Little John which is probably the top of the tree for that kind of funk/northern/R+B crossover sound. But I do think that Chalky is showing up his rather limited taste by saying that Trent Sisters is a poor record. Shame on you Chalky, it is far from a poor record. That Mary Hunt thing that you are championing on the hand... :fool: The Funk 'holy grails' would be Innersouls "Take Your Time", possibly (not) Tickled Pink "Reach Out", certainly Carleen + The Groovers "Can We Rap", Lou Pride's "Got To Be Somebody For Me" on Suemi, Fabulous Jades and maybe Abraham + The Metronomes. More could be added, Wrighty is probably the man to give a list and I'm sure a few of them will feature on his Sister Funk 2 compilation that is being launched in the Deepfunk room at Soul Revolution February 24th, plug plug. I wouldn't put Elipsis in the disco holy grail bracket, although others might. Florence Trapp would be the one at the top for me. Limited taste see your talking out of your arse again Trent Sisters isn't even a good dancer, it's all over the place, poor northern in terms of quality IMHO. Far better 20 quid records out there. Personally think too many worry more about the value of a record rather than the quality.
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 ...and because it's rubbish kin ell Pete, we agreeing on something
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) Limited taste see your talking out of your arse again Trent Sisters isn't even a good dancer, it's all over the place, poor northern in terms of quality IMHO. Far better 20 quid records out there. Personally think too many worry more about the value of a record rather than the quality. As Derek pointed out, dance floor reaction does not make a good or bad record. Trent Sisters' appeal comes from the tension, build up, innovative beat and syncopation, the experimentation, the harmony, the grind and the sheer ooomph of it. Measuring a record in terms of "northern" is a pretty bad bench mark IMO Chalky, unless you are looking at it as a northern DJ and not a collector. I'd hardly call Trent Sisters a 'northern' record anyway. More like R+B or protofunk. Not that it matters. I don't think anyone on this thread worries about the value of records, do they? The fact that it is a thread about "holy grails" suggests it's about records that people would want to get hold of no matter what the cost of getting a copy, hence "holy grail"? I'd wager that if Trent Sisters was a "cheap and underplayed" you would be all over it Chalky, and perhaps I could be so bold as to suggest that it is you who are worried about the value of the record and not those who like it? I can understand if you give a reason for not liking it musically, or that it doesn't warrant 'holy grail' status because "Little John" is better because of A, B, C and should be concidered holy grail rather than trent sisters. But to jsut say that it's only liked because it is worth alot of money, even though it has not actually being sold for decades is a daft arguement. You are basically saying that many of the world's top collectors are tastless and are blinded by a price tag on a record? Edited January 4, 2007 by James Trouble
Guest Leigh J Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 These sort of records , ( with hindsight) spoilt the night for me ..for me Guys 60's stuff was better ! Keb did have his moments though , but Big Frank three times in the space of an hour ..dear me Dont Suppose You Liked 'The Whirlpool Marty Thomson' Either
Simon M Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) huh huh Edited January 4, 2007 by Simon M
Simon M Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Dont Suppose You Liked 'The Whirlpool Marty Thomson' Either Nop .. "on the brink" , "peanut duck" ahhhhh and I forget many . but I first heard Royal Robbins and Two People via Keb and he , allegedly compiled a modern soul tape in the early 80's that got me collecting mainly that !
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) As Derek pointed out, dance floor reaction does not make a good or bad record. Trent Sisters' appeal comes from the tension, build up, innovative beat and syncopation, the experimentation, the harmony, the grind and the sheer ooomph of it. Measuring a record in terms of "northern" is a pretty bad bench mark IMO Chalky, unless you are looking at it as a northern DJ and not a collector. I'd hardly call Trent Sisters a 'northern' record anyway. More like R+B or protofunk. Not that it matters. I don't think anyone on this thread worries about the value of records, do they? The fact that it is a thread about "holy grails" suggests it's about records that people would want to get hold of no matter what the cost of getting a copy, hence "holy grail"? I'd wager that if Trent Sisters was a "cheap and underplayed" you would be all over it Chalky, and perhaps I could be so bold as to suggest that it is you who are worried about the value of the record and not those who like it? I can understand if you give a reason for not liking it musically, or that it doesn't warrant 'holy grail' status because "Little John" is better because of A, B, C and should be concidered holy grail rather than trent sisters. But to jsut say that it's only liked because it is worth alot of money, even though it has not actually being sold for decades is a daft arguement. You are basically saying that many of the world's top collectors are tastless and are blinded by a price tag on a record? I agree with you that the dance floor isn't really the best judge of whether a record is good or bad or to it's quality. And I'm not going to go down the route of whether the record is northern or not. I can say that I'm not nor have I ever been particualrly fond of the record, £5000 or £50, it would make no difference in this case as I think the record is average at best, always have done. It might be one of the holy grail rarity wise but my initial arguement wasa to who is it the holy grail, the dancer or the collector? In the dancers case this particular record would fail IMHO. NOthing you can say can persuade me otherwise on this record and I certainly don't see in the record what you see in it. Little John is a different matter, that record is in a different class to the Trent Sisters. I would say many buy records because of the price tag. Many a time I've been sat behind the boxes and all some are interested in are the expensive ones even thought there have been plenty of lesser and even unknown to them cheap records in front of them, they just weren't interested in them. There are also plenty of cheque book DJ's about as well. Last thing I do is worry about the price of a record, if I can't afford a record I look for something I can afford Edited January 4, 2007 by chalky
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) I would say many buy records because of the price tag. Many a time I've been sat behind the boxes and all some are interested in are the expensive ones even thought there have been plenty of lesser and even unknown to them cheap records in front of them, they just weren't interested in them. There are also plenty of cheque book DJ's about as well. I don't spend my times in the record room at events, I'm always on the dance floor or at the decks so I wouldn't know what goes on in those sort of places, so you may well be right What's a cheque book DJ? You sure they exist or is it a northern soul myth? I wonder if they have these kinds of arguements on the antiques road show website? I can see it now: "That bloody Earl of Boddington, he only fills his country mansion up with renaissance paintings and rare furniture and then lets the public in to see his treasures because he is just a cheque book collector, what a fool he is, when will the public learn!" I disagree with what I believe is largely a fabrication of the northern soul scene's imagination. Unless you can come up with some examples of "cheque book DJs" Chalky? I somtimes think there are 'sheep' DJ, who follow other's taste, but I hardly think calling some of the big collectors "cheque book DJs" is fair. And besides, even if they did exist, is it not better to have them than not have them? Like our "Earl Of Boddington", at least it keeps the records in this country to be enjoyed by the public rather than going to collections in different parts of the world? Just my opinion. Edited January 4, 2007 by James Trouble
Guest Leigh J Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Nop .. "on the brink" , "peanut duck" ahhhhh and I forget many . but I first heard Royal Robbins and Two People via Keb and he , allegedly compiled a modern soul tape in the early 80's that got me collecting mainly that ! Keb & Guy Were Knocking Out A lot Of Stuff Every Week At stafford , That Was The Attraction For Me , you wont Get that again Not with 60's , Yes There Were a Few Dodgy Tunes But I Dont Think A high Percentage, Keb Played Loads Of Class Records : Lee Mcinney & The Magnetics Ray Marchand Ship Of Fools Little John Jimmy seals Yesterday Jesse Davis Hang On In There Enchantments Soul Set Tony Galla Oracles Clyde Mcphater Lonley People Empires Colt 45's (G Rushbrooke Played This b4 Keb) Off The Top Of My Head
Ady Croasdell Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 I think I've expressed my desire to get the Love Experience enough times on here now, since my copy was rather rudely wrenched from my box. It's certainly my 'holy grail'. Dreammakers is pretty special We've got the master tape of this from Golden State Recorders and a note that says it came out on Love 001 in March 1973 though Manship has it listed on Cherry Red, presumably not the punk label that Sharon didn't sign to.
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 I don't spend my times in the record room at events, I'm always on the dance floor or at the decks so I wouldn't know what goes on in those sort of places, so you may well be right What's a cheque book DJ? You sure they exist or is it a northern soul myth? I wonder if they have these kinds of arguements on the antiques road show website? I can see it now: "That bloody Earl of Boddington, he only fills his country mansion up with renaissance paintings and rare furniture and then lets the public in to see his treasures because he is just a cheque book collector, what a fool he is, when will the public learn!" I disagree with what I believe is largely a fabrication of the northern soul scene's imagination. Unless you can come up with some examples of "cheque book DJs" Chalky? I somtimes think there are 'sheep' DJ, who follow other's taste, but I hardly think calling some of the big collectors "cheque book DJs" is fair. And besides, even if they did exist, is it not better to have them than not have them? Like our "Earl Of Boddington", at least it keeps the records in this country to be enjoyed by the public rather than going to collections in different parts of the world? Just my opinion. I think you know what I mean by cheque book DJ but thats a different topic all together I've no wish to get into any other arguement right now. We may as well agree to disagree, we both have differing opinions of this record. Said it many a time before, if we all liked the same stuff it would be pretty boring.
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 We've got the master tape of this from Golden State Recorders and a note that says it came out on Love 001 in March 1973 though Manship has it listed on Cherry Red, presumably not the punk label that Sharon didn't sign to. Yeah, it's on Cherry Red. Any plans to reissue it?
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Keb & Guy Were Knocking Out A lot Of Stuff Every Week At stafford , That Was The Attraction For Me , you wont Get that again Not with 60's , Yes There Were a Few Dodgy Tunes But I Dont Think A high Percentage, Keb Played Loads Of Class Records : Lee Mcinney & The Magnetics Ray Marchand Ship Of Fools Little John Jimmy seals Yesterday Jesse Davis Hang On In There Enchantments Soul Set Tony Galla Oracles Clyde Mcphater Lonley People Empires Colt 45's (G Rushbrooke Played This b4 Keb) Off The Top Of My Head nowt wrong with this top 20 floorfillers of Kebs.....
Guest Leigh J Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 nowt wrong with this top 20 floorfillers of Kebs..... What Year Is This From ? 85?
Guest James Trouble Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) I think you know what I mean by cheque book DJ but thats a different topic all together I've no wish to get into any other arguement right now. We may as well agree to disagree, we both have differing opinions of this record. Said it many a time before, if we all liked the same stuff it would be pretty boring. Alot of folk don't like Trent Sisters. Easy to see why, it's grating. And I would probably agree that it's not a holy grail. There was one on the market a few months ago, and there was hardly a mad holy grail style rush for it. You still deserve a ribbing for not likeing it though I know what you mean by cheque book collector, but I don't think it's somthing that needs to be worried about or even exists. And we'd rather have people on the scene buying the expensive and rare records and playing them for all to enjoy rather than have the tunes end up away from our clubs, don't you think? I can understand comments about 'sheep DJs', those sort of people exist in all walks of life. I have even suggested such things with my comment about "the power of Sam" I've heard people call Mick H a "cheque book DJ", but he's head and shoulders above 99% of the DJs on the soul scene in my very correct opinion. And wouldn't you rather have DJs out there buying the rare records and playing them on the UK soul scene than not? Edited January 4, 2007 by James Trouble
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 What Year Is This From ? 85? without looking '86 I think. Taken from echoes. I cut all the northern stuff out and binned the rest of the mag, all in folders upstairs.
Guest Simon Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Just to add my tuppence worth, i've always liked the Trent Sisters, had it on a tape from a good few years back, never realised it was that rare though. Again it's one of those connoiseury type tracks that i like, if you played it probably only two people would dance, it is a little bit awkward but very good imo. Other tracks i like in this sort of vein are Holly Maxwell 'Don't say you love me', 'I don't wanna go on' (female artist, forget the name) & Connie Van Dyke on Wheelsville - all great tunes but they don't really flow for the dancefloor. Simon
soulsalmon Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Keb & Guy Were Knocking Out A lot Of Stuff Every Week At stafford , That Was The Attraction For Me , you wont Get that again Not with 60's , Yes There Were a Few Dodgy Tunes But I Dont Think A high Percentage, Keb Played Loads Of Class Records : Lee Mcinney & The Magnetics Ray Marchand Ship Of Fools Little John Jimmy seals Yesterday Jesse Davis Hang On In There Enchantments Soul Set Tony Galla Oracles Clyde Mcphater Lonley People Empires Colt 45's (G Rushbrooke Played This b4 Keb) Off The Top Of My Head Gary also played the oracles first c/u as jackie lee and the trips
Quinvy Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 I agree Little John is far better, in fact it's damn good, and far more desirable thasn the Trent Sisters which I personally think is average, rare I grant you but average non the less, just my crazy opinion Has anyone got a sound file of the LITTLE JOHN??? Don't think I've ever heard it.
Quinvy Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Little Ron and the Esquires - I Found Someone must be close in terms of '60s Holy Grail - didn't think there was more than one copy of this (will be proved wrong now though) and not really been heard since Rushbrooke retired - did his copy go to Keb? As pretty sure he used to play it when still covered (Sims Twins?) Sound file for this LITTLE RON & ESQUIRES anyone?
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Just Wait And See - little john - go-gate 13070 refosoul
Chalky Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) I Found Someone - little ron & esquires - 13071 refosoul Edited January 4, 2007 by chalky
Guest uroffal Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 I Found Someone - little ron & esquires - 13071 refosoul Great - not heard this for 20 odd years mate - thanks for posting
Guest Simon Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Just Wait And See - little john - go-gate 13070 refosoul This ain't bad but i wouldn't personally be fussed about having a copy, don't think the track has much longevity, like most of these R & B type things they become boring quite quickly. 'Love, troubles, heartache & misery' in the same vein is much better imho. Simon
Corbett80 Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 (edited) 'I've heard people call Mick H a "cheque book DJ", but he's head and shoulders above 99% of the DJs on the soul scene in my very correct opinion. And wouldn't you rather have DJs out there buying the rare records and playing them on the UK soul scene than not?' I think DJs like Mick are great, particulary after visiting Lifeline and hearing the DJs there playing not just rare records but quality obscurities and records that you just don't hear anywhere else. Theres nothing better than hearing new sounds of excellent calibre and even better when they are in plentiful supply. Very keen on Mick's Anita Humes CU too, a belting record. ps. Anyone know how many copies of the Royal Imperials on Mellow Town are knocking about?? Edited January 4, 2007 by mulf
Ady Croasdell Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Yeah, it's on Cherry Red. Any plans to reissue it? At some stage yes. Nobody knows if it came out on the Love label presumably.
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