All-nighter entrance fees

[Len]

Welcome to the latest poll, thanks in advance for voting, any comments are as usual most welcome -

We all appreciate getting value for money, but what do you consider ‘value’ when planning your weekend? Be it an All-nighter Soul Night, All-dayer or Weekender, is it live acts, a cracking venue, certain DJs, or an event being an ‘event’ like a reunion for instance?

Share your vote choice and reasons with us (if happy to) What do you think is a reasonable price for an All-nighter / Soul Night nowadays etc?

All the best,

Len 

[Mod66]

All events on Soul Source and Gold Soul represent excellent value, whether they are £5 or £40.

When you think what you can pay to see an artist or band ( non Northern) and come away unfulfilled.

Northern prices can't be beaten.

 

[Geeselad]

nighters should be at least a tenner, cant see how they could be run for less. Great to go one for free on sat though

[Andybellwood]

Invariably favour experienced  , knowledgable , professional & respected promoters who have stood the test of time , factoring in the quality of the venue , pa , djs and overall customer experience they deliver. 

 

Too many 'Johnny come latelys' operating on a shoestring in every locality flitting from one struggling pub and/or social club to another . 

 

'Club acts'  playing 'Northern & Motown' covers have little appeal for us -  just doesn't stack up against the genuine article . 

 

Travel not an issue to get it right for us , ideally somewhere to incorporate into a weekend break or if abroad , holiday . 

 

Admission/ticket price , no complaints . Beer etc prices not a deal breaker . 

Edited March 14, 2017 by andybellwood

[Bbrich]

Agree 100% with Andybellwood.  The quality events are good value e.g. Cleethorpes weekender for approx £40 must work out about £1 per hour and Maxine Brown last year was probably worth the bets part of that on her own!

On the other hand i have been to some free local do's that were overpriced!! 

[Calvinlee]

I think £10/£12 quid is just right.. I'd pay more if there was a live act of course

[Billywhizz]

min 12 pounds with choc bar 4 ,allnighter 

[Mod66]

Well said Andy

''''Club acts'  playing 'Northern & Motown' covers have little appeal for us -  just doesn't stack up against the genuine article .''' 

I said as much re: Motown the Musical in a previous forum

[Modernsoulsucks]

Is there a case for OAP, UB, ESA discounts ?

 

[Andybellwood]

18 hours ago, andybellwood said:

Invariably favour experienced  , knowledgable , professional & respected promoters who have stood the test of time , factoring in the quality of the venue , pa , djs and overall customer experience they deliver. 

 

Too many 'Johnny come latelys' operating on a shoestring in every locality flitting from one struggling pub and/or social club to another . 

 

'Club acts'  playing 'Northern & Motown' covers have little appeal for us -  just doesn't stack up against the genuine article . 

 

Travel not an issue to get it right for us , ideally somewhere to incorporate into a weekend break or if abroad , holiday . 

 

Admission/ticket price , no complaints . Beer etc prices not a deal breaker . 

To add a bit of controversy perhaps . Would never step inside a Conservative (or Liberal) Club for a Northern event or any other occasion -  doubt if many ex miners would either ? 

Edited March 15, 2017 by andybellwood

[Chalky]

Its been a round a fiver for soul nights and tenner for nighters for donkeys and it shows.  Far too many dumps, far too many with little comfort.  An all-nighter should be a minimum of £15.  Go to an equivalent night on the club scene with the best Djs and you would be paying 25 to 40 quid yet we have a scene that begrudge a £12 entrance fee.  I bet Djs are still paid what they were ten years ago with many not even getting paid.

Most just don't realise what it costs today for a decent venue, decent sound system and paid Djs.

Edited March 14, 2017 by chalky

[Len]

I agree Chalky - The aprox £10.00 All-nighter / £5.00 Soul Night is now what we are used to.

I feel for some promoters, because the margins can be very tight / and there is absolutely zero 'safety net' for if they have one or two nights with low attendance.

Personally I would be happy to pay £15.00 to a promoter that I trusted to use that money to put on a decent event, not scrimping on kit, DJ fees, door staff fees etc etc etc. Also to have a bit for themselves because promoting can take up a lot of time - More so nowadays because of there being so much competition / which also brings more risk of not so many people through the door.

Entrance fees aren't really a huge percentage of a night out if you travel far / drink / even stay over in hotels which is often the case nowadays, but raising those door prices does seem to be a sticking point, as I said, because it's what we are all used to - Although in reality, I don't think an extra £3.00 would be a 'deal breaker' for the majority of people, and that extra few quid would be welcomed / and well used by any decent promoter. 

All the best,

Len 

[Chalky]

And what really winds me up or did was all the tight tw*ts who did all they could to get in for nowt yet contribute nothing to the promotion of the night. 

[Len]

I remember a guy turning up at Life-line around 3.00am, he asked Mick H if he could get in for a fiver because he was late, I think Mick felt a bit 'put on the spot', and it was a bit awkward for a second or two, then the guy said he only had a fiver on him! At that point, I butted in and paid the other £5.00 myself because I felt it was uncalled for / and I kinda knew the said guy, so wanted the situation dealt with quickly (I was embarrassed by it)

I used to get a bit of......"You're not going to charge me aya?".......from mates, but like to think most said it 'tongue in cheek' (Cheeky B*rstards) 

We're a strange lot when it comes to money!

Len 

[Chalky]

8 minutes ago, LEN said:

I remember a guy turning up at Life-line around 3.00am, he asked Mick H if he could get in for a fiver because he was late, I think Mick felt a bit 'put on the spot', and it was a bit awkward for a second or two, then the guy said he only had a fiver on him! At that point, I butted in and paid the other £5.00 myself because I felt it was uncalled for / and I kinda knew the said guy, so wanted the situation dealt with quickly (I was embarrassed by it)

I used to get a bit of......"You're not going to charge me aya?".......from mates, but like to think most said it 'tongue in cheek' (Cheeky B*rstards) 

We're a strange lot when it comes to money!

Len 

I remember one from Leeds who paid his tenner in at Sheridans then went to back door and let his three mates in.  Andy charged them all a tenner and then threw them all out 

Edited March 14, 2017 by chalky

[Russ Vickers]

It should be £15 minimum for a Nighter.  Compared to normal club nights we charge a pittance, no wonder the sound systems are shite & DJ's get paid nowt.

Russ

[Geeselad]

2 hours ago, chalky said:

Its been a round a fiver for soul nights and tenner for nighters for donkeys and it shows.  Far too many dumps, far too many with little comfort.  An all-nighter should be a minimum of £15.  Go to an equivalent night on the club scene with the best Djs and you would be paying 25 to 40 quid yet we have a scene that begrudge a £12 entrance fee.  I bet Djs are still paid what they were ten years ago with many not even getting paid.

Most just don't realise what it costs today for a decent venue, decent sound system and paid Djs.

having been involved with an oldskool club nights over the last 5 years ago the costs are do differ. we I paid a minimum of 800 for a name guest dj and 500+ for light/system of the quality needed for these events, people want to feel, not just hear the music. this was for a small venue, that had a capacity of 120- tho we did sneak more in sometimes. £15 was our top ticket price, so the budget was really tight. Not that many club nights or DJ's can get the ticket price they used to justify, 10/15 or even 20 years ago. I have my Hacienda new years '91 ticket stub priced at £15, a fortune, they all sold out in early Dec. that seldom happens anymore.

[Hornet]

Pension dosent stretch that far & green & clears not 3 4 £2 anymore !

Edited March 14, 2017 by hornet

[Wiganer1]

• I charge £10 for Nuneaton coop allniter ,felt guilty about putting up from £7
• always updating my equipmemt ,,speakers ,,needles etc and always pay my djs

[Ian Stacey]

11 hours ago, wiganer1 said:

• I charge £10 for Nuneaton coop allniter ,felt guilty about putting up from £7
• always updating my equipmemt ,,speakers ,,needles etc and always pay my djs

  Yes mark is a good promoter !has gone to great lengths to improve the equipment & never failed to pay the djs I think we could all do with digging deeper  in our pockets for all-nighters I think 14 would be fairer price at todays nighters as prices have rocketed lately for tunes ect but not entrance fees .you pay double what we pay to get in a normal nightclub & far to many friends think that its okeh to beg & jaw to get in free even though they are on good money very unsoulful indeed   

[Guest Andi]

On 3/14/2017 at 13:42, modernsoulsucks said:

Is there a case for OAP, UB, ESA discounts ?

 

That would be most of us then ...

[Bbrich]

£10 for Nuneaton allniter is too cheap!  I'm not saying I know what you should be charging just that that is a lot of value for £10 compared to other forms of entertainment. My Reading FC season ticket costs me about £20+ per game for 90 minutes and is often a let down whereas I have never failed to enjoy a soul do.

[Chalky]

Looking at the poll, I love one of those who think entrance fees are to high to explain why?  Most nighters are ten hour affairs, soul night at least five.  Why is a fiver or tenner to high?

[Len]

I think some people may be getting mixed up between what they can personally afford, and what the entrance fee to an All-nighter is actually worth (Which is understandable I hasten to add)

All the best,

Len 

 

[Shsdave]

When we started Solid Hit we charged £5 on the door, 11 years later when we finished it was still a fiver. guest DJs always got paid & in my opinion they were paid very well for a soul night, in fact probably more than at some allniters. That said we always tried to bring in quality DJs from around the country & were worth every penny & after expenses to London i'm sure many got home with just a few quid left. I like to think that with one exception (when we were between venues & rightly or wrongly trying to keep our name in the mix) we always had decent venues with good quality sound systems apart from the first couple at Kings Cross when we used the in house shite system  that soon changed. If we were losing money on the night we wouldn't have kept going, mind you we didn't make any either. any profits were put back such as having Pat Lewis & Ronnie Walker live.

Trouble is nowadays, especially in London, most functions rooms have disappeared to be renovated & turned into empty restaurants & cocktail bars & it gets harder & harder to find decent venues in a good location.

Excuse my ramble 

[Chalky]

1 minute ago, SHSDave said:

When we started Solid Hit we charged £5 on the door, 11 years later when we finished it was still a fiver. guest DJs always got paid & in my opinion they were paid very well for a soul night, in fact probably more than at some allniters. That said we always tried to bring in quality DJs from around the country & were worth every penny & after expenses to London i'm sure many got home with just a few quid left. I like to think that with one exception (when we were between venues & rightly or wrongly trying to keep our name in the mix) we always had decent venues with good quality sound systems apart from the first couple at Kings Cross when we used the in house shite system  that soon changed. If we were losing money on the night we wouldn't have kept going, mind you we didn't make any either. any profits were put back such as having Pat Lewis & Ronnie Walker live.

Trouble is nowadays, especially in London, most functions rooms have disappeared to be renovated & turned into empty restaurants & cocktail bars & it gets harder & harder to find decent venues in a good location.

Excuse my ramble 

Solid Hit always a quality night out the times I went. Well worth a fiver, today or 11 years ago.

[Len]

17 hours ago, SHSDave said:

When we started Solid Hit we charged £5 on the door, 11 years later when we finished it was still a fiver. guest DJs always got paid & in my opinion they were paid very well for a soul night, in fact probably more than at some allniters. That said we always tried to bring in quality DJs from around the country & were worth every penny & after expenses to London i'm sure many got home with just a few quid left. I like to think that with one exception (when we were between venues & rightly or wrongly trying to keep our name in the mix) we always had decent venues with good quality sound systems apart from the first couple at Kings Cross when we used the in house shite system  that soon changed. If we were losing money on the night we wouldn't have kept going, mind you we didn't make any either. any profits were put back such as having Pat Lewis & Ronnie Walker live.

Trouble is nowadays, especially in London, most functions rooms have disappeared to be renovated & turned into empty restaurants & cocktail bars & it gets harder & harder to find decent venues in a good location.

Excuse my ramble 

That's fair enough. Isn't it funny (and kinda nice) that you kept the price at £5.00 for 11 years - A financial adviser would have kittens!

........Or did you keep it at £5.00 because that figure is so much easier to work out the change on the door? (Mine stayed at £5.00 for a long time for that very reason) 

Len 

[Chalky]

46 minutes ago, LEN said:

That's fair enough. Isn't it funny (and kinda nice) that you kept the price at £5.00 for 11 years - A financial adviser would have kittens!

........Or did you keep it at £5.00 because that figure is so much easier to work out the change on the door? (Mine stayed at £5.00 for a long time for that very reason) 

Len 

One of tne reasons we kept entrance fee to a tenner rather than £12 was the messing about with change  £15 would have been a step to far for many.....

[Ged Parker]

The price is way too low if the music matches my taste and way too high when it doesn't.

Seriously though punters used to complain at £6 for a three room event at the Winter Gardens in Blackpool when the Neighbourhood ran it.  Ultimately that's what killed the event off.  Whatever is reasonable there will be those willing to put on poor events in poor venues playing the lowest common denominator music as a vanity project.  That suppresses the price that can be charged.

 

[Jaco]

Are the people who complain about entrance fees the same people who (often) overpay for vinyl?

Just a thought.

[Shsdave]

2 hours ago, LEN said:

That's fair enough. Isn't it funny (and kinda nice) that you kept the price at £5.00 for 11 years - A financial adviser would have kittens!

........Or did you keep it at £5.00 because that figure is so much easier to work out the change on the door? (Mine stayed at £5.00 for a long time for that very reason) 

Len 

We couldn't be bothered really Len, I think Des mentioned it once but the thing with the change was one reason not to, the fact that people will spend xxx amount on a record & then complain about an extra quid or two on admission price was another & we weren't losing money so we just left it. Haha yes a financial advisor may have had kittens. I always used to put a sign on the door "members only" so when drunken suits used to come down I would ask if they were members & obviously they weren't as we didn't have membership (though that didn't stop the occasional one say yes but I've left my membership card at home )but occasionally they would ask if they could pay extra to get in ...... it never worked as it was never about clawing every pound we could.  In fact if i knew that someone had travelled a fair distance I would let them in for nothing as a thanks. No I'll never be rich 

[Shsdave]

42 minutes ago, Jaco said:

Are the people who complain about entrance fees the same people who (often) overpay for vinyl?

Just a thought.

Haha exactly i've just wriiten something very similar in my post above 

Edited March 17, 2017 by SHSDave

[Len]

40 minutes ago, Jaco said:

Are the people who complain about entrance fees the same people who (often) overpay for vinyl?

Just a thought.

In my experience - Yes!  

I remember putting the entrance fee up from £2.00 to £3.00 at The Embankment Club many moons ago, and was surprised at how many mentioned it / complained, then I saw the very same people head straight to the record bar! It made me smile actually 

Len 

[Julianb]

Should they offer discounts to OAPs?

These would save plenty on here a few quid!

[Guest BabyBoyAndMyLass]

22 minutes ago, JulianB said:

Should they offer discounts to OAPs?

These would save plenty on here a few quid!

They'd be running at a loss if they did that!

OK they'd be running at an even bigger loss.

[Guest BabyBoyAndMyLass]

What sort of money do DJs get purely out of curiosity, say a big name at a large event and a smallish name who goes national? Just wondering how it stacks up against being a smallish pro stage musician.

Edited March 17, 2017 by BabyBoyAndMyLass

[Chalky]

16 minutes ago, BabyBoyAndMyLass said:

What sort of money do DJs get purely out of curiosity, say a big name at a large event and a smallish name who goes national? Just wondering how it stacks up against being a smallish pro stage musician.

Decent promoters 100 quid, twice that and plus for the real top names.  I would say thought that the average would be £50/£75, not totally sure.  The side rooms will get nothing or at the very least a nominal amount.

[Bbrich]

1 hour ago, BabyBoyAndMyLass said:

What sort of money do DJs get purely out of curiosity, say a big name at a large event and a smallish name who goes national? Just wondering how it stacks up against being a smallish pro stage musician.

Being a small name (or in fact 'no name at all!) I have been paid £60 for between 45 mins & 90 mins at dos with say 150 to 200 in attendance down to nil at others when they aren't making any money/free events. When i've been paid the missus has also got in free and they are probably events that we would have been happy to pay and attend anyway even if not d'jing.

 

[Guest BabyBoyAndMyLass]

Thanks Chalky and bbrich, those numbers are pretty good then, good on 'em. I've no desire to try DJing as I go to events when I'm not gigging to get away from being on the stage. But yes glad to see that the DJs where possible do get a nice earner.

We always put in a good word for our local events on here that are posted, and we attend every event locally that we can subject to work commitments as we both work a lot of weekends, it's important to us that they do OK out of it, if folks don't do all they can to attend and support events then obviously the folks won't put them on and who would blame them? Nobody can run at a loss.

Whenever I go to events I'm/we're always happy with the prices we pay, say for example St Ives Soul on Wax weekender 25 squid, three evenings of quality event for that seems very cheap to me, we're local so don't have to get accommodation but for a nice venue, a heap of DJs we consider that very good value for money, in fact looking at prices like 4 or 5 quid for a soul night or 10 to 15 for a niter or mini-niter, the soul scene provides excellent value for money, to the point that we always hope that the promoters and DJs do go home with a few bob in their pocket, we know also that some only break-even or even make a loss which is a shame.

Edited March 17, 2017 by BabyBoyAndMyLass

[Len]

3 hours ago, BabyBoyAndMyLass said:

But yes glad to see that the DJs where possible do get a nice earner.

It's not a 'nice earner' though really is it? Ok, it's obviously better than ya average hourly rate, but personally I think, Butch for instance, should get £500.00 for an All-nighter, because he must attract at least 50 people (x £10.00 min) / and the other DJs for the rest of the nights' entertainment (depending how many people the promoter estimates they each attract) should get £200.00 each, to cover their expenses and a 'nod' for the night (That's really not a great deal especially if you compare it to some of today's 'great' DJs on other scenes)

This would of course have to be incorporated in to the entrance fee (Ok so maybe £15.00), but I personally think that is its' worth 

Unless its a night of loads of DJs, but that's another take on it (Do the 'math' on this)

All the best,

Len 

[Eddiefoster]

23 minutes ago, LEN said:

It's not a 'nice earner' though really is it? Ok, it's obviously better than ya average hourly rate, but personally I think, Butch for instance, should get £500.00 for an All-nighter, because he must attract at least 50 people (x £10.00 min) / and the other DJs for the rest of the nights' entertainment (depending how many people the promoter estimates they each attract) should get £200.00 each, to cover their expenses and a 'nod' for the night (That's really not a great deal especially if you compare it to some of today's 'great' DJs on other scenes)

This would of course have to be incorporated in to the entrance fee (Ok so maybe £15.00), but I personally think that is its' worth 

Unless its a night of loads of DJs, but that's another take on it (Do the 'math' on this)

All the best,

Len 

I look at it more simply (maybe overly?)

No DJs can possibly be in it for the money; just do the math on fees vs the value of 1 record (say a 500 quidder which isn't much nowadays)

Even at £100 for a spot it's over 5 gigs to get payback (Inc expenses)

Hope that's no too off-topic, something that's always seemed obvious but overlooked by some. 

[Bbrich]

I've just done the maths & based on rough value of my records and 'fees' earned over the last year it will take me over 250 years to get into profit and that doesn't allow for expenses and assumes i wont buy any more records     seriously though i agree with Len and where 'big name' dj's are playing especially with exclusive sounds then they deserve a proper reward. e.g. Lifeline where i only managed to get to a few times i would have paid £25. I also think the promoters of any quality event deserve a decent profit - i can only imagine the risk,stress and work that goes into putting on a decent event - when i have d'jd i just have to turn up with a box of records....      at the other end of the scale i dont want to travel and pay good money to hear dj's play re-issues.

 

 

 

Edited March 18, 2017 by bbrich
duplicate sentence.

[Geeselad]

be interesting to hear what top rock and roll dj's get paid , or any other equivalent scene, mod or phyc for example, the comparison with dance music is a misnomer imho, club nights usually revolve around a single guest, with a much bigger pull for a much higher fee. thank god we don't have superstar soul or funk DJ's yet!  

[Geeselad]

Just now, geeselad said:

be interesting to hear what top rock and roll dj's get paid , or any other equivalent scene, mod or phyc for example, the comparison with dance music is a misnomer imho, club nights usually revolve around a single guest, with a much bigger pull for a much higher fee. thank god we don't have superstar soul or funk DJ's yet!  

and don't mention Craig, f***w*tt Charles!

[Dave Rimmer]

From a pure financial point of view, DJ fees rarely cover my expenses because of the high price of train tickets and taxis. That's not why I DJ though, in most cases, I would have attended the venues I DJ at anyway, so it's nice to have some dosh to spend on a record when I get there lol

[Chalky]

7 hours ago, bbrich said:

 seriously though i agree with Len and where 'big name' dj's are playing especially with exclusive sounds then they deserve a proper reward. e.g. Lifeline where i only managed to get to a few times i would have paid £25. I also think the promoters of any quality event deserve a decent profit - 

 

I wish there had been more with your thinking, we'd still be running.  Andy and Mick, I doubt they made much profit over the 12 years it ran.  Trouble is the nighter scene is fast becoming a social scene with the music secondary, some spend more time outside with the smokers than they do paying attention to what is being played.

[Rugby Soul Club]

Len, I don't know if you saw my post re: the rising cost of hiring the Benn Hall and it prompted your thread.

Anyway, for those who didn't see it, here it is...

We've just paid the deposit for the next year of Rugby Allniters.
The council have put our hire charge up by 26% this year, that's another £255 just for the room (excluding door staff) Those who are good at maths will realise that's £1,200 a night!

We have to take it on the chin because we love the venue & don't want to lose it just because it's a mental layout.

We have had a rise in charges every year (except last year) since we started and have managed to still keep our entry to £10 before 9pm and £12 after.

Luckily our numbers have gone up too.
So we still don't intend to put our entry price up. And we'd like to thank you all for your continued support. xx

 

It was never about the money for us but covering our costs needs to happen. It didn't for the first 4/5 yrs and we've probably never covered our loses from back then but we've had a great time doing it

[Len]

Hi Sean,

No I didn't see your post ref your Benn Hall costs going up (26% is a huge hike!) Coincidentally I was thinking about the subject (probably related to my own usual business worries), and thought the way our scene is 'business wise' is pretty interesting (or bizarre even)

Your numbers going up compensating for any rise in costs is a great achievement, especially nowadays.

All the best,

Len  

[Rugby Soul Club]

5 minutes ago, LEN said:

Hi Sean,

No I didn't see your post ref your Benn Hall costs going up (26% is a huge hike!) Coincidentally I was thinking about the subject (probably related to my own usual business worries), and thought the way our scene is 'business wise' is pretty interesting (or bizarre even)

Your numbers going up compensating for any rise in costs is a great achievement, especially nowadays.

All the best,

Len  

Yes, we've been very lucky with numbers.

My eldest son did comment when we were running at a loss that my career in accounts wasn't really ringing alarm bells

[Guest Andi]

On 3/18/2017 at 19:25, chalky said:

I wish there had been more with your thinking, we'd still be running.  Andy and Mick, I doubt they made much profit over the 12 years it ran.  Trouble is the nighter scene is fast becoming a social scene with the music secondary, some spend more time outside with the smokers than they do paying attention to what is being played.

That's why the Night Owl in Brum is a good venue on warm dry nights =  roll up the shutter doors and the smoking area outside is in full view of the dance floor and vice versa. So in Old School style we can have our fags and still listen to the music, and chip it and run to the floor when our favorite comes on. Or just carry on smoking and dance outside.