Current Bootleg Trading (split from Soul Pack thread)

[Steve G]

5 minutes ago, Mace said:

I actually said £2k.....I know of records being pressed up at £2 a copy......but yes, more than 50 copies for sure......I implied as much earlier in thread that no-one would press up the supposed 30 copies of each as mentioned by Pete.

My instinct says 200 of each, and I think at that number you would get them for around £2 each........and they probably wont ALL sell for £50 to £100 each.......but I bet most do.

Yup if you press up 200 at £2 each, you only need to "sell" one quietly off ebay etc. as an original to a punter and you've got your money back + then some. Alternatively sell them as "superior boots" at £50, drip feed a few out quietly and again Bob's yer uncle. Quids in. As Pete well knows many sales go through out of the spotlight, and it is not beyond the bounds of reason for an unscrupulous dealer (not Pete) to "target" a sale to a potential buyer….all quiet, no one knows.

Someone posted a few months ago that Soussan was coming back and we'd all know soon. Makes you wonder 

Edited January 23, 2016 by Steve G

[Pete S]

1 minute ago, Mace said:

Exactly......you've already said you've had loads of people messaging you for copies and that certain ones you'd want at least £50 for................only time will tell but shall we meet back here in 6 months without editing our comments and see who got it right?

Yes for sure but I don't want to sell any of mine.  

[Sean Hampsey]

Could someone tell me, what are the Valerie Simpson & Terry Johnson titles (both sides of each)?

Sean

 

[hullsoul]

Some great free publicity for these boots,they'll fly out when they become available..........yes Pete I know they aren't supposed to be getting sold but it's just the cynic in me 

Cheers

Martyn

[Steve G]

Just now, Sean Hampsey said:

Could someone tell me, what are the Valerie Simpson & Terry Johnson titles (both sides of each)?

Sean

 

Motown album tracks I believe.

[Sean Hampsey]

Thanks Steve. Wondering which ones in particular?

If they've not been out as 45's before, it puts a slightly different slant on the 'passing off as originals' thing.

Still a boot, but what on earth were they thinking?

Sean

 

[Mace]

6 minutes ago, Pete S said:

Yes for sure but I don't want to sell any of mine.  

But you used to slag off Jonathan Capree all the time.....you hate the record.......you'd keep a boot of that over a crispy £50 note.......hmmm

[Mace]

The best thing that could happen here is if some-one else booted all these titles and flooded ebay with them at £6 a piece......

 

[Pete S]

10 minutes ago, Mace said:

But you used to slag off Jonathan Capree all the time.....you hate the record.......you'd keep a boot of that over a crispy £50 note.......hmmm

But if I sold it I wouldn't have the set...

[Steve G]

10 minutes ago, Sean Hampsey said:

Thanks Steve. Wondering which ones in particular?

If they've not been out as 45's before, it puts a slightly different slant on the 'passing off as originals' thing.

Still a boot, but what on earth were they thinking?

Sean

 

There seems to be a fad of putting album tracks on 7 and then saying "Oooh look what I have got, incredibly rare, no one even knew it was even on a 7". Egos and rare soul. I guess some people are fooled by it all (sighs).

[Russ Vickers]

The reason the boots will sell for money, certainly initially, is because of the 'they are not for sale' thing, therefore giving the impression, that theyre exclusive to a few special people.  The fact that it has been inferred that there are only 30 copies of each, also gives the impression that they will soon be gone, therefore if you own one or several, it wouldnt be too long before people would just assume you owned an original.

Its a brilliant sales pitch & I imagine this thread & the FB one will have the airwaves on fire, with some people desperate for copies before they 'disappear'.

BTW Nik Mak is a nice bloke & has been around for decades, including having promoted Yate for a short time, he is also a well respected producer & DJ on the dance scene.  Whilst I think Nik may have been a bit guillable, he has posted this information to ensure others are made aware of his experience & can consider this before they decide whether to go down the same route.

Best Russ

Edited January 23, 2016 by Russ Vickers
Made a mistake with number of records supposedly pressed, changed from 50 to 30 on Petes advise.

[Pete S]

30 copies, not 50.  £1000 per title, so £20,000 spent making them.

[Steve G]

You can all think this is some sort of private deal between a few rich guys for personal enjoyment. More fool you. I have no doubt that this was an attempt to scam collectors from the start. One dealer was offered copies of some of these titles for money and recognised them for what they were straight away. Good for him. Then the moody Rita Graham and Magnetics appeared. The scam, to destabilise the collectors market was busted. A botch. Now they're being given away to placate people who complain about Soul Packs? FFS wise up people. 

Edited January 23, 2016 by Steve G

[Pete S]

3 minutes ago, Steve G said:

You can all think this is some sort of private deal between a few rich guys for personal enjoyment. More fool you. I have no doubt that this was an attempt to scam collectors from the start. One dealer was offered copies of some of these titles for money and recognised them for what they were straight away. Good for him. Then the moody Rita Graham and Magnetics appeared. The scam, to destabilise the collectors market was busted. A botch. Now they're being given away. 

What absolute bullsh*t.  Why would anyone want to affect the collector's market?  It would hurt me and other dealers.  Ridiculous assumptions.

Edited January 23, 2016 by Pete S

[Steve G]

Just now, Pete S said:

What absolute bullsh*t.

Pete, you are nice guy, but your continued defence of the indefensible is making you look totally fucking stupid. Everyone is saying it. 

[Pete S]

Just now, Steve G said:

Pete, you are nice guy, but your continued defence of the indefensible is making you look totally fucking stupid. Everyone is saying it. 

So be it.  At least I've got all the facts though, you haven't.

[Steve G]

Just now, Pete S said:

So be it.  At least I've got all the facts though, you haven't.

You are involved? I have heard that too. I was surprised but that is another story doing the rounds. Mud is starting to stick on anyone connected with this.

Edited January 23, 2016 by Steve G

[Pete S]

Just now, Steve G said:

You are involved? I have heard that too. 

Involved in what exactly?

[Russ Vickers]

Pete, you are a proper stand up nice guy, & you are 100% loyal, but I think there is more to this than you think, I KNOW you, personally, would never be dishonest, but I think people are being mis lead & thats putting it nicely.

Best Russ

[Pete S]

https://soulfulrecords.com/catalog/3

why is this such a big deal when the above goes on every day every week and they have hundreds of counterfeits...is it just because of who might or might not be involved?

[Mace]

7 minutes ago, Pete S said:

What absolute bullsh*t.  Why would anyone want to affect the collector's market?  It would hurt me and other dealers.  Ridiculous assumptions.

Some-one told me today that he was advised to sell his originals by whoever is involved because it would do just that.....

[Steve G]

Just now, Pete S said:

https://soulfulrecords.com/catalog/3

why is this such a big deal when the above goes on every day every week and they have hundreds of counterfeits...is it just because of who might or might not be involved?

Come off it and stop playing the old "victim" card. It's a busted flush now. We comment on bootlegs every day on here, even more so on FB. The difference is mostly they're obvious boots and no one will get fooled. These ones were designed to deceive and have. Catch up on the FB thread please. Or is "anoraks corner" also talking "ridiculous assumptions". I think not.

[Pete S]

6 minutes ago, Mace said:

Some-one told me today that he was advised to sell his originals by whoever is involved because it would do just that.....

 

1 minute ago, Steve G said:

Come off it and stop playing the old "victim" card. It's a busted flush now. We comment on bootlegs every day on here, even more so on FB. The difference is mostly they're obvious boots and no one will get fooled. These ones were designed to deceive and have. Catch up on the FB thread please. Or is "anoraks corner" also talking "ridiculous assumptions". I think not.

I'm still waiting for someone to show me where they are being offered for sale...

[Steve G]

Just now, Pete S said:

 

I'm still waiting for someone to show me where they are being offered for sale...

Look at the FB page Pete. Money eventually refunded but sold as an original.

[Pete S]

1 minute ago, Steve G said:

Look at the FB page Pete. Money eventually refunded but sold as an original.

For God's sake, that was sold months before I even heard about these, Dave Flynn asked me if I knew anything about it, I said only that I've got a copy, and I actually got the bloke his money back even though it was nothing to do with me, I was given a name and asked if I could help and indirectly I was able to get the guy his money back.  

[Dave Rimmer]

18 minutes ago, Pete S said:

30 copies, not 50.  £1000 per title, so £20,000 spent making them.

So Pete, you are saying that someone, and although it has been implied it was Ian Levine, I don't think anyone has actually said so, has spent twenty grand on producing some bootlegs to give away to friends.

Really ???????

Now I don't doubt for a minute that you are just repeating what you have been told, and repeating it as the truth as you understand it, but that story does seem to be stetching the bounds of reality a little doesn't it.

[Pete S]

4 minutes ago, Steve G said:

Look at the FB page Pete. Money eventually refunded but sold as an original.

By the way, that was despicable to do that.

[Tlscapital]

16 minutes ago, Pete S said:

https://soulfulrecords.com/catalog/3

why is this such a big deal when the above goes on every day every week and they have hundreds of counterfeits...is it just because of who might or might not be involved?

Sad, dreadful, depressing and on top of it all ugly ! Why compare with that if you want to argue yourself out ?

[Garethx]

Which Willie Tee is in this bunch of rogue 45s?

[Steve G]

Just now, Pete S said:

For God's sake, that was sold months before I even heard about these, Dave Flynn asked me if I knew anything about it, I said only that I've got a copy, and I actually got the bloke his money back even though it was nothing to do with me, I was given a name and asked if I could help and indirectly I was able to get the guy his money back.  

But the point is Pete it WAS sold as an original. So the idea that these won't filter out doesn't hold water despite what you are being told. Full marks for getting the fella his money back.

[Pete S]

3 minutes ago, Dave Rimmer said:

So Pete, you are saying that someone, and although it has been implied it was Ian Levine, I don't think anyone has actually said so, has spent twenty grand on producing some bootlegs to give away to friends.

Really ???????

Now I don't doubt for a minute that you are just repeating what you have been told, and repeating it as the truth as you understand it, but that story does seem to be stetching the bounds of reality a little doesn't it.

When you put it like that it does but what if it was all meant to be kept within a tight circle of people who could maybe get away with dj-ing with them?

[Steve G]

Just now, garethx said:

Which Willie Tee is in this bunch of rogue 45s?

The mid tempo cut off of his Capitol LP….I can't be arced to go and find it now, but its the best track on the LP. Done on a moody Gatur 45.

[Dave Rimmer]

Just now, Pete S said:

When you put it like that it does but what if it was all meant to be kept within a tight circle of people who could maybe get away with dj-ing with them?

So, not just a bootlegger, but a fraud as a DJ as well !

What an impressive person this is.

 

[Pete S]

22 minutes ago, Mace said:

Some-one told me today that he was advised to sell his originals by whoever is involved because it would do just that.....

 

16 minutes ago, Steve G said:

Come off it and stop playing the old "victim" card. It's a busted flush now. We comment on bootlegs every day on here, even more so on FB. The difference is mostly they're obvious boots and no one will get fooled. These ones were designed to deceive and have. Catch up on the FB thread please. Or is "anoraks corner" also talking "ridiculous assumptions". I think not.

 

[Pete S]

23 minutes ago, Mace said:

Some-one told me today that he was advised to sell his originals by whoever is involved because it would do just that.....

 

17 minutes ago, Steve G said:

Come off it and stop playing the old "victim" card. It's a busted flush now. We comment on bootlegs every day on here, even more so on FB. The difference is mostly they're obvious boots and no one will get fooled. These ones were designed to deceive and have. Catch up on the FB thread please. Or is "anoraks corner" also talking "ridiculous assumptions". I think not.

"But the point is Pete it WAS sold as an original. So the idea that these won't filter out doesn't hold water despite what you are being told. Full marks for getting the fella his money back".

Sorry I am trying to reply to Steve's comment but can't quote it so pasted it above:

if you give these records to someone and say look you can have these but you are not allowed to sell them, how can you police that if someone decides to get greedy and go rogue with it.  I've sat on these copies for months, you didn't even know half the titles until I told you yesterday.  That's because I was told they were for me and not to be sold or swapped or discussed.

[KevH]

So,when a quantity of something fairly rare turns up - beware. What a depressing state of affairs.

[Pete S]

4 minutes ago, Dave Rimmer said:

So, not just a bootlegger, but a fraud as a DJ as well !

What an impressive person this is.

 

I think there's plenty of people play pressings every week Dave

[Steve G]

4 minutes ago, Pete S said:

 

"But the point is Pete it WAS sold as an original. So the idea that these won't filter out doesn't hold water despite what you are being told. Full marks for getting the fella his money back".

Sorry I am trying to reply to Steve's comment but can't quote it so pasted it above:

if you give these records to someone and say look you can have these but you are not allowed to sell them, how can you police that if someone decides to get greedy and go rogue with it.  I've sat on these copies for months, you didn't even know half the titles until I told you yesterday.  That's because I was told they were for me and not to be sold or swapped or discussed.

The strong belief (as yet unproven) is that the original plan was to make a killing, but when the plan was discovered, suddenly they're giveaways. Ian can protest as much as he likes (and he has told me his version too fair play to him), and I don't believe he is the original source of these records. But you have to admit giving records to occasional customers and hoping they won't sell them and saying "this is a secret" is at best, extremely naive. Some people just bring destiny on to them.

Edited January 23, 2016 by Steve G

[Modernsoulsucks]

1 hour ago, Sean Hampsey said:

Could someone tell me, what are the Valerie Simpson & Terry Johnson titles (both sides of each)?

Sean

 

Is there a Terry Johnson album ?

Can't say I've seen a copy.

Unreleased ?

[Pete S]

7 minutes ago, Steve G said:

 But you have to admit giving records to occasional customers and hoping they won't sell them and saying "this is a secret" is at best, extremely naive. Some people just bring destiny on to them.

Yes.  Mind boggling.  

[Dave Rimmer]

15 minutes ago, Pete S said:

I think there's plenty of people play pressings every week Dave

Really ? Where ? They should be taken out and flogged to within an inch of their lives for such a heinous crime.

Or if the DJs are playing pressings they should let the punters pay in with monopoloy money, and then pay the DJs with it. Fake records, fake DJs, fake money.

[Pete S]

1 minute ago, Dave Rimmer said:

Really ? Where ? They should be taken out and flogged to within an inch of their lives for such a heinous crime.

Or if the DJs are playing pressings they should let the punters pay in with monopoloy money, and then pay the DJs with it. Fake records, fake DJs, fake money.

Without wanting to get into a debate about this, we know for a fact that our ancestors from the early days used to play off Emidiscs most of the time as there were only one or two originals, but we still travelled to hear them.  Well I did anyway.

[davidwapples]

5 minutes ago, Dave Rimmer said:

Really ? Where ? They should be taken out and flogged to within an inch of their lives for such a heinous crime.

Or if the DJs are playing pressings they should let the punters pay in with monopoloy money, and then pay the DJs with it. Fake records, fake DJs, fake money.

I will try paying with monopoly money at the strip club if the ladies have fake breasts lol

Edited January 23, 2016 by davidwapples

[Mike]

please read the post above as it explains why posts are missing from saturday onwards

 

ok for info

the thread was closed on tuesday nite while the site looked at a request from Ian levine for the site to close the thread

some posts were edited/removed as per terms of use  and the thread was re-opened this morning

Ian Levine was invited to post a reply to members posts in this thread  via email which he did and is re-posted below

 

Posted via email  by Ian Levine 

FOR SOUL SOURCE - either post this in full or don’t post it at all - please do not censor it.

My involvement in these lookalikes was for a bit of private pleasure. They existed for a year now with nobody batting an eyelid until I took Nicholas Jeremy Clarke at his sworn word that he would keep them secret. Seven of these were never even on a single before. Only thirty copies of each were made and privately contained until this witchhunt burst forth. I may have been involved, but I myself did not press them, for a start I’m in a wheelchair.
And all my friends are scared to defend me in case they get dragged in and accused, like Pete Smith has been.

Two of your members, Steve Guarnori who is the self appointed leader of the soul police, and Kevin Johansen, are pursuing vicious malicious personal vendettas against me, like rottweilers with a fillet steak.

I am still recovering from my stroke. My stress levels are through the roof, having been called, in this thread “a carbuncle on the soul scene”. Those pursuing me through your site, will delight in glory if you announce my sudden death in your Soul News. Well if ghosts do exist, I VOW to come back and haunt Guarnori.

IT WAS ALL A HARMLESS BIT OF FUN, FFS, no different to cutting a few carvers.

In the meantime Alan Godfrey and Rob Burnette bootleg every record in sight, press 2000 at a time, sell them all over eBay for £7.99 and no-one says a word. They did Bill Bush and Bernie Williams and Al Williams and hundreds more, sometimes five new ones in a week. Alan Hamilton buys cheap boots, stick beautiful looking labels on them, and gets over £100 for them on eBay. The ones you all accuse me have never once appeared on eBay apart from the one Magnetics which I knew nothing about, and were given to people sworn to secrecy and people I trusted. My biggest mistake was to trust Nicholas Clarke who is really getting his jollies from all this. Funny how he never posted on Soul Source before starting the thread about me.

Have a little compassion people. It was done privately, on records that I myself discovered the first copies - Salvadors, Sam Williams, Billy Woods (at least the first copy from Anderson). As usual any past good I ever did is forgotten in an attempt to kick me when I’m down.

And why have none of you defended my soul packs. Despite the crap that Guarnori spouted, they have been full of decent records, I even made a podcast of them to prove this, and ninety five percent of my customers have praised them and raved over them, at a quid a record. I only break even on them. But now this thread has ensured I can never sell another one in my life.

I’m very sick and sad at all this. A harmless bit of fun gave my enemies the chance to put the boot in and ruin me forever, and my friends are too scared to say a word in my defence for fear of being smeared. Only Pete Smith alone, and only him, has been the voice of reason.

You’ve taken away all my love of the music, just like in 2003. I pray I don’t give in and sell up, because you’re all pushing me to the edge of a cliff.
Some of my podcasts have had 7000 listeners, so up till now, some people really did love, support, and appreciate me.
Now Nicholas Clarke single handedly ruined all that for me. I hope he can sleep at night after breaking all his promises both verbal and in writing.

 

[Steve G]

Thanks as i am mentioned I better post my reply again.

Just to put the record straight, I have NOT been pursuing a personal vendetta against Ian Levine. He was friends with me on FB until this year when he blocked me, Ive bought records from him in the past (none of these), we've exchanged emails periodically etc. and I am still happy to talk to him, even if he now thinks I am the head of the soul police (I did chuckle at that). 

But I HAVE been trying to get to the bottom of these mysterious records ever since the moody Rita Graham pitched up late last year with a friend of a friend. 

As for being haunted, oh God, please Nooooooo!!! Don't do it Ian 

[Rhino]

15 minutes ago, Steve G said:

Thanks as i am mentioned I better post my reply again.

Just to put the record straight, I have NOT been pursuing a personal vendetta against Ian Levine. He was friends with me on FB until this year when he blocked me, Ive bought records from him in the past (none of these), we've exchanged emails periodically etc. and I am still happy to talk to him, even if he now thinks I am the head of the soul police (I did chuckle at that). 

But I HAVE been trying to get to the bottom of these mysterious records ever since the moody Rita Graham pitched up late last year with a friend of a friend. 

As for being haunted, oh God, please Nooooooo!!! Don't do it Ian 

have they given him a new account or is this his reply to the whole site

[Woodbutcher]

It was an e-mail to the admin team .

[Rhino]

41 minutes ago, mike said:

please read the post above as it explains why posts are missing from saturday onwards

 

ok for info

the thread was closed on tuesday nite while the site looked at a request from Ian levine for the site to close the thread

some posts were edited/removed as per terms of use  and the thread was re-opened this morning

Ian Levine was invited to post a reply to members posts in this thread  via email which he did and is re-posted below

 

Posted via email  by Ian Levine 

FOR SOUL SOURCE - either post this in full or don’t post it at all - please do not censor it.

My involvement in these lookalikes was for a bit of private pleasure. They existed for a year now with nobody batting an eyelid until I took Nicholas Jeremy Clarke at his sworn word that he would keep them secret. Seven of these were never even on a single before. Only thirty copies of each were made and privately contained until this witchhunt burst forth. I may have been involved, but I myself did not press them, for a start I’m in a wheelchair.
And all my friends are scared to defend me in case they get dragged in and accused, like Pete Smith has been.

Two of your members, Steve Guarnori who is the self appointed leader of the soul police, and Kevin Johansen, are pursuing vicious malicious personal vendettas against me, like rottweilers with a fillet steak.

I am still recovering from my stroke. My stress levels are through the roof, having been called, in this thread “a carbuncle on the soul scene”. Those pursuing me through your site, will delight in glory if you announce my sudden death in your Soul News. Well if ghosts do exist, I VOW to come back and haunt Guarnori.

IT WAS ALL A HARMLESS BIT OF FUN, FFS, no different to cutting a few carvers.

In the meantime Alan Godfrey and Rob Burnette bootleg every record in sight, press 2000 at a time, sell them all over eBay for £7.99 and no-one says a word. They did Bill Bush and Bernie Williams and Al Williams and hundreds more, sometimes five new ones in a week. Alan Hamilton buys cheap boots, stick beautiful looking labels on them, and gets over £100 for them on eBay. The ones you all accuse me have never once appeared on eBay apart from the one Magnetics which I knew nothing about, and were given to people sworn to secrecy and people I trusted. My biggest mistake was to trust Nicholas Clarke who is really getting his jollies from all this. Funny how he never posted on Soul Source before starting the thread about me.

Have a little compassion people. It was done privately, on records that I myself discovered the first copies - Salvadors, Sam Williams, Billy Woods (at least the first copy from Anderson). As usual any past good I ever did is forgotten in an attempt to kick me when I’m down.

And why have none of you defended my soul packs. Despite the crap that Guarnori spouted, they have been full of decent records, I even made a podcast of them to prove this, and ninety five percent of my customers have praised them and raved over them, at a quid a record. I only break even on them. But now this thread has ensured I can never sell another one in my life.

I’m very sick and sad at all this. A harmless bit of fun gave my enemies the chance to put the boot in and ruin me forever, and my friends are too scared to say a word in my defence for fear of being smeared. Only Pete Smith alone, and only him, has been the voice of reason.

You’ve taken away all my love of the music, just like in 2003. I pray I don’t give in and sell up, because you’re all pushing me to the edge of a cliff.
Some of my podcasts have had 7000 listeners, so up till now, some people really did love, support, and appreciate me.
Now Nicholas Clarke single handedly ruined all that for me. I hope he can sleep at night after breaking all his promises both verbal and in writing.

 

well ive read this a few times and he did have a hand in the making and giving him to his friends,thats his version but then goes out to openly name and shame other such people doing it on a larger scale . if you care and have integrity report them you must have enough proof to back up to get them stopped. diverting the blame onto others and making you look like the man just helping friends. and if we have taken your love of the music there is always dr who enough said

 

[Spook]

You name other dealers selling bootlegs - which whatever peoples stance on them - we know are £7.99 moody copies .

I can remember this when I was a manager it was always the  perpetrator's first excuse:

I only did it because so an so did this and that, trying to deflect their own wrong doings and taking no responsibility for their own actions.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 27, 2016 by spook

[Quinvy]

4 minutes ago, Peter99 said:

What's manger? 

Wasn't Jesus born in one?

53 minutes ago, guest said:

I thought for the minute that I could hear violins if not then definitely the beep , beep sound of reversing .

You name other dealers selling bootlegs - which whatever peoples stance on them - we know are £7.99 moody copies .

Some big money titles have been sold as originals when they are not ['it's all a bit of harmless fun FFS' ]

Some 'top DJ's' have been spinning these boots at venues [maybe a chance to off load their originals ] but carry on with the kudos attached .

As collectors we ask a few questions for the memory bank - not really interested who did them - but just for future reference when someone offers me Satan's Breed for £50 .

No one personally is getting dug out as such - just collector awareness [Four Vandal's anyone ?]

 

Many a true word......