TWO THINGS THAT ARE KILLING THE SOUL SCENE

[Sikirby]

"Wigan was the last regular focal point ... "              ... that'll be the sort of comment that'll do it no end of good ...  

Obviously another from "oop narth" that's never dared or been bothered to make the journey to Oxford Street at any point in the last 36 years ... 

As I'm not from  "Oop narth" I have been somewhat daring and I have been bothered to visit not only Oxford Street, and Holloway Road but also daring enough to journey east as far as Hamburg and Nuremburg! I'm not trying to diminish the credibility of any nighter post Wigan, I'm simply saying there isn't a regular weekly focal point of the same ilk!!

[jimmy clitheroe]

All the mugs , tea coasters and all that other Commercal Tat along with the Tv commercials ( do they think we all wear baggy trousers & full circle skirts ffs!) I still cringe when it comes on the Box

[Davenpete]

Old age and drinking instead of taking drugs.

[lincsmod1970]

OK HERE WE GO IT SEEMS THAT THE SCENE AS GONE TOTALLY CRAZY AND IT'S BEING DESTROYED BY TWO MAIN FACTORS THE FIRST BEING THE RIDICULOUS SPIRALLING PRICES OF RECORDS. REALITY CHECK PEOPLE  MOST OF THESE TUNES HAVE BEEN ROUND A VERY LONG TIME AND SOME PEOPLE DONT REALISE JUST HOW MANY COPIES ARE ACTUALLY OUT THE  EPITOME OF SOUND A GOOD EXAMPLE A CERTAIN SHOP IN NOTTS HAD  MORE COPIES THAN YOU COULD WAVE A STICK AT, AND THERE'S PLENTY MORE LIKE IT AND TO TOP IT THERE STILL TURNING UP, DOESNT THAT TELL PEOPLE SOME THING ????? LIKE IT AINT THAT RARE . THE SECOND FACTORS SEEMS TO BE THE STUPID AMOUNT OF VENUES  MAINLY  PLAYING THE SAME 100 + SOUNDS WEEK IN WEEK OUT . FOR GODS SAKE WHY DONT THEY JUST HOLD ONE BLOODY NITE  IF THATS ALL THEY WANT TO HERE . WHATS THE POINT OF 50 ODD VENUES ALL PLAYING THE SAME , YOU MAY AS WELL ALL GO TO THE SAME PLACE, MAKES SENSE DOSN'T IT ??? AS FOR THE RARER SIDE OF THE SCENE  THESE VENUES ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN  AND MOST ARE TO FAR TO TRAVEL TO THESE DAYS FOR ME DUE TO WORK COMMITMENTS  . WHATS YOUR THOUGHTS GUY'S

Got to agree, record prices have become RIDICULOUS, but to be fair, no ones forcing people to stump up their money, if someone's prepared to pay over the odds for a record its their choice, in this day and age, its easy to look up what prices records are going for, if people get carried away on auction sites or whatever, more fool them... As for Epitome Of Sound, how long ago was it that said record shop had loads of copies in?? 10/15/20 years ago? He ain't still got em now, as with time, things get harder to find, even the so called "easy" tunes in decent condition, are becoming tricky, most these tunes we are collecting are what? 50/55 years old now?? ANTIQUES technically!! As for Soul nights and venues playing same old "safe" top 500 Soul tunes- TOTALLY agree, there are some good (albeit) few and far between rare and underplayed nights out there, one superb one that springs to mind, the FANTASTIC BIDDS POW WOW/ LIFELINE nights are spot on!! 120 odd miles away for me, but worth it! But if it says Motown and Soul night, or "across the board"  music policy (oh dear!) - I tend to stay away- you know your gonna get a Radio 2 Northern Soul night... May as well stop in and listen to the radio! Lol... Theres 10s of 1000s of Soul tunes out there, and to hear the same ones week in week out - NO EXCUSE! it's lazy!! The other bug bare, hearing the same tune played twice in a night!! WHY?? If its been played already, dig a bit deeper in your box, and find another quality tune!! Simples!! KTF!! JP 

[Steve S 60]

The other bug bare, hearing the same tune played twice in a night!! WHY?? If its been played already, dig a bit deeper in your box, and find another quality tune!! Simples!! KTF!! JP 

Why indeed?  I would expect any DJ to know what's already been played, either by turning up at the start of the night and listening to the other DJs, or asking for their playlist.  It's just unprofessional in my opinion.

[Markw]

Thats done it, I was looking to buy another copy of that one, when did Epitome of Sound had gone for a grand?

 

M

Christ Malcolm. Stop wandering around the hills of Buckinghamshire and get back on that laptop. Get with the programme buddy!!

[Markw]

TOO many events?  I suppose, are they having a diverse effect?  I didnt used to think they did, but they do. The monthly events with the SAME 5 guys playing the SAME tunes every month. Whats the bloody point? In February at Cream Cracker the guest dj's were from Bristol, Somerset, Gloucester, Kettering and Wellingborough, . Quiet a good mix of guests I thought all bringing tunes we wouldnt normally hear locally ( To me). We had less than 70 people in, which as arrogant as this is, was a miserable turnout for Cream Cracker ( we get 75 each time, at least). People didnt attend as there was a local ( to them ) event on playing Motown etc... or they didnt recognise any of the dj's. And there in lies the hub. We have gotten into a trap of as was previously stated "Blinkered" mentallity. Where the vast majority of people WILL only attend an event on their doorstep ( and if its on EVERY month and they know what they are getting) why should they travel further than the end of their town? Also when you get monthly events with the same guys on and only charge £2 or so entry, if you have top of their game, upcoming or travelling DJ's who's expenses you need to cover as a promoter you are on a losing game before you open your doors.  For a good portion of promoters its never been about prestige or money. But you have to as a promoter make your guests journey, no matter how far that may be, be financially viable and worthy of the tunes they bring with them. OK OK so I'll be slated for saying that and I dare say we all do it for the love etc... However what I mean is simply that if a guest has travelled however far to come to your club,  as a promoter you're not expecting them to do it for free. And if the majority of your crowd have decided to go to the Monthly, across the board Motown et al event the weeks either side of your event you may ned to go to the cashpoint to cover your costs. Thats the point at which its not fun anymore.

 

Kev ( dont do modern) Such

 

 

Soul Funktion charges no entrance fee (there is an honesty box on the bar should you feel inclined to contribute). DJs work there unpaid (other than a Soul Funktion DJ slip mat and record middle drinks coaster). They do it because they love it. The place is rammed every time from start to finish. It is full of folk of all age ranges, from 20s to 60s, from new recruits to veterans of Wigan and the Wheel. It does not (generally speaking) play classic Northern oldies; it does not play what might be described as classic Northern. But it has more to do with the true spirit of what Northern Soul once was and was once about than any venue I have attended in years and I am not alone in this feeling.

There is a maxim in this world that says that if you keep doing the same thing, you should not be surprised if you get the same result and things do not improve.

[Quinvy]

"Wigan was the last regular focal point ... "              ... that'll be the sort of comment that'll do it no end of good ...  

Obviously another from "oop narth" that's never dared or been bothered to make the journey to Oxford Street at any point in the last 36 years ... 

The guy did say "weekly" and as for your "oop narth" comment, that's why it was called "northern soul"

We all know that the 100 club was a huge part of the scene 30 years ago, but we are talking about today, 2015. It's just another allnighter these days.

[Amsterdam Russ]

But if it says Motown and Soul night, or "across the board"  music policy (oh dear!) - I tend to stay away- you know your gonna get a Radio 2 Northern Soul night...

A great description - I love it! A new expression for the Northern Soul lexicon to match the term "top 500" when used in a derogatory fashion! 

[Mark R]

The internet!!

People used to have to travel to a leading allnighters to hear and learn all the new monster sounds.

Now anyone can sit at home and listen to them!

The internet has enabled people who had a very limited knowledge about records, to become very clued up about them without going to allnighters.     

This has given them the confidence to be DJ's, and start there own soul nights, instead of travelling to major venues.

Maybe this has helped caused the demise of the big allnighters and the rise in local Soul nights.

I remember the days when most people who did not go to nighters knew hardly anything about current records, and didn't have a clue what was going on!!! 

 

True across the scene, not just the rare soul scene......years of knowledge gained in a matter of weeks.

 

Cheers,

Mark R

[Okehdownsouth]

What is killing the scene is grumpy old men moaning about the price of records.

In 1973 when I wen to my first allnighter I was 15 and earned £4.00 for working 2 ten hour shifts in a poxy hotel washing dishes, peeling spuds and scrubbing floors. After I had paid my bus fares I had about £3.20 left. If I spent 50p on a mint UK demo on Motown or Stateside in a second hand shop I thought that I had spent a fortune. The fact that I sold one of those very same records last week for £900 only makes me very very happy!

I think that fact that there are more venues and more DJ's and more collectors is great and shows that the love of great rare soul music is still alive. I will keep buying soul record until I the day I die.

 

 

[Mal C]

Christ Malcolm. Stop wandering around the hills of Buckinghamshire and get back on that laptop. Get with the programme buddy!!

I think I'll should keep to the Buckinghamshire hills Mark..

Edited September 7, 2015 by Mal C

[Markw]

 

We all know that the 100 club was a huge part of the scene 30 years ago, but we are talking about today, 2015. It's just another allnighter these days.

Not been to too many places this last 30 years then?

Edited September 7, 2015 by markw
Wrong quote (again!)

[Markw]

I think I'll should keep to the Buckinghamshire hills Mark..

Probably less trouble than going on Soul Source mate.

[Quinvy]

Not been to too many places this last 30 years then?

Yes I have, why?

[Guest Polyvelts]

Not sure about the Scene being killed - But I get ya point Steve me ol' mate  

Personally I miss the days when this was played at 4.00am.

Passed caring anyways now - KTF to those that can be bothered.

All the best,

Len

This at 4am would officially crack me up !! Stunning !!

[Mellorful]

A great description - I love it! A new expression for the Northern Soul lexicon to match the term "top 500" when used in a derogatory fashion! 

The lexicon has definitely been enhanced with ;Radio 2 northern soul; description.

I wish it was top 500, these days many venues don't get past the top 100, it's that predictability that disappoints many. But with just a little imagination and without needing to spend any more money the DJ could flip some of the regular plays.

Billy Butler = Right Track , the DJ flips the record and hey presto Boston Monkey, Stanley Mitchell = Get it baby, flip it and its Quit twisting my arm, Shirley Lawson = One more chance, flip it and its The Star. plenty of double sider records that could enrich the lives of the NS community.  

[Guest]

It's a vicious circle, if you don't invite everyone and their dog to Dj at your event, they won't come to support it. Simple as that. Even if your event has the best music in the world, people will definitely NOT come. 

I tried it

And far too many "Pop-up" DJs with their box of whatever who can`t DJ to save their lives...................If you need to ask "Can I DJ" then it`s quite obvious that you can`t!!

[Vadnochka]

Just a thought - can we please stop referring to a certain book as though it was some kind of definitive listing - I know it has become a point of reference for many people - a well intentioned relative even bought me a copy as a present -  a quick flick through and it was consigned to the 'car boot box' - it was and still is, one persons' personal opinion at a single moment in time  and as such could be a serious candidate for the re-commencement of book burning as a means of cleansing the proletariat - certainly for the damage its contents have wreaked since its publication. An alternative title could have been - 'Become a DJ in one easy lesson' (and rack off a sizeable % of punters)

Don't get me wrong I've known the author since he pitched up as a 15yr.old at the Torch and some of my discoveries are contained within it's covers, but like so many events, - World Wars / technological breakthroughs / Northern Soul - the history tends to be written by the victors / survivors - both physically and commercially and this book was first and foremost a commercial venture and as such must be deemed a success.

It's effect on the scene and the DJ landscape is more questionable but I have to agree that the area cliques that perpetuate the same old play lists and same insular outlook are a serious drag on anybody venturing slightly further afield as most local gigs suffer from this malaise - I would go as far as to say that most of the dj's do not have a clue about presentation, continuity, There is a lot to be said for having some sort of chronological knowledge of this most varied scene.

Last Autumn / Christmas I did some of my very infrequent appearances - at one well known club in Nottingham the other DJ's were offering my playlist from 20yrs ago at the same club and at a more local affair in Melton - I thought I'd put on a cracking oldies but rarities (Mr.Soul/Fascinators/Montclairs/Thee Midnighters etc.) spot only to be told by a couple of punters 'aye up mate - didn't know any of the sounds you played' - fortunately I'm not stupid and understand that whether there's no door tax or it costs a fiver I mixed in a few stds. and a couple of unknowns and kept the floor going, a fact conceded by said punters - I just thanked them and told them to get out more

I'm not expecting a flood of offers for spots even after also returning in triumph in Jersey recently - Speak clearly - make sense - don't mis-cue - have a decent playlist - play to the crowd (better still - know your crowd) - involve them in the evening - unfortunately I have nothing to offer other than this and 45yrs experience behind the decks - I can't offer a reciprocal  back slapping experience for promoters/dj's - that way the paying customers have a better night and all this talk of the scene being knackered /. vibrant - depending on your take will be irrelevant.

Are there really people out there who are so desperate for fame / acknowledgement but certainly not fortune that they will continually work for nothing - trust me a lot of the promoters take advantage of this whilst trousering either door money or fees from venues - ( yes fees from venues). I remember being short changed to the tune of 50% on my agreed fee at an all-nighter years ago in Leeds - packer as well - never went again.

Push the boat out folks - but slowly - you have to earn the right to introduce new stuff, particularly if it's an unsuspecting public -  bringing folks back to life from an existence in aspic can be a slow process - but lets face it some of us have been trying for nearly 50yrs and being eternal optimists we await the epiphany.

 

[Billywhizz]

And far too many "Pop-up" DJs with their box of whatever who can`t DJ to save their lives...................If you need to ask "Can I DJ" then it`s quite obvious that you can`t!!

hi Steve, these pop up DJ's with their boxes who can not DJ to save their lives. I went to a couple of soul nights recently, before allnighter's. DJ's id never seen or heard before, put some brilliant sets together. Fresh sounds really done the bizz. Ones pure soul at Nuneaten and the other was John may at Derby soul night. Well worth a visit. Cheers billy.

[barney]

just done a seaside w/ender with some so called top dj,s  similar line up to previous years and think its getting a bit stale , same dj,s mainly promoters same playlists Friday and Saturday ,quite a few repeats and not much in the way of good but underplayed.. the ,emphasis on the stompers  , went home on the sunday , don't do stats but would like to know the number of sounds played over the w/end the number of times certain tracks were played each night .ie the same track played fri ,sat and sunday and the nightly repeats . there seems to be a lack of conviction and imagination among dj.s who should know better , and even if it only considers the so called top 500 theres quite a few crackin sounds on the periphery that don't get but should be played , this to me is whats going to kill it , complacency ,lack of imagination and plain laziness ,

 

[KevH]

just done a seaside w/ender with some so called top dj,s  similar line up to previous years and think its getting a bit stale , same dj,s mainly promoters same playlists Friday and Saturday ,quite a few repeats and not much in the way of good but underplayed.. the ,emphasis on the stompers  , went home on the sunday , don't do stats but would like to know the number of sounds played over the w/end the number of times certain tracks were played each night .ie the same track played fri ,sat and sunday and the nightly repeats . there seems to be a lack of conviction and imagination among dj.s who should know better , and even if it only considers the so called top 500 theres quite a few crackin sounds on the periphery that don't get but should be played , this to me is whats going to kill it , complacency ,lack of imagination and plain laziness ,

 

just done a seaside w/ender with some so called top dj,s  similar line up to previous years and think its getting a bit stale , same dj,s mainly promoters same playlists Friday and Saturday ,quite a few repeats and not much in the way of good but underplayed.. the ,emphasis on the stompers  , went home on the sunday , don't do stats but would like to know the number of sounds played over the w/end the number of times certain tracks were played each night .ie the same track played fri ,sat and sunday and the nightly repeats . there seems to be a lack of conviction and imagination among dj.s who should know better , and even if it only considers the so called top 500 theres quite a few crackin sounds on the periphery that don't get but should be played , this to me is whats going to kill it , complacency ,lack of imagination and plain laziness ,

 

Sorry not sure what's happened with repeat quotes - all i was about to say was no lack of imagination,no complacency or laziness where i tend to go.If i hear any of that i won't go again.Simple.Luckily there's still enough djs and records out there to keep this boy happy.Set the bar high and the rest follows.

[Gilly]

Apart from the start of Wigan and in a few years Wigan had a very sparse attendance on a lot of Saturday nights and the Saturday after the monthly oldies almost empty with just a few hardcore punters and I could name most of the record bar lads

[Gointoagogo]

Sorry not sure what's happened with repeat quotes - all i was about to say was no lack of imagination,no complacency or laziness where i tend to go.If i hear any of that i won't go again.Simple.Luckily there's still enough djs and records out there to keep this boy happy.Set the bar high and the rest follows.

[Bossfourpart1]

OK HERE WE GO IT SEEMS THAT THE SCENE AS GONE TOTALLY CRAZY AND IT'S BEING DESTROYED BY TWO MAIN FACTORS THE FIRST BEING THE RIDICULOUS SPIRALLING PRICES OF RECORDS. REALITY CHECK PEOPLE  MOST OF THESE TUNES HAVE BEEN ROUND A VERY LONG TIME AND SOME PEOPLE DONT REALISE JUST HOW MANY COPIES ARE ACTUALLY OUT THE  EPITOME OF SOUND A GOOD EXAMPLE A CERTAIN SHOP IN NOTTS HAD  MORE COPIES THAN YOU COULD WAVE A STICK AT, AND THERE'S PLENTY MORE LIKE IT AND TO TOP IT THERE STILL TURNING UP, DOESNT THAT TELL PEOPLE SOME THING ????? LIKE IT AINT THAT RARE . THE SECOND FACTORS SEEMS TO BE THE STUPID AMOUNT OF VENUES  MAINLY  PLAYING THE SAME 100 + SOUNDS WEEK IN WEEK OUT . FOR GODS SAKE WHY DONT THEY JUST HOLD ONE BLOODY NITE  IF THATS ALL THEY WANT TO HERE . WHATS THE POINT OF 50 ODD VENUES ALL PLAYING THE SAME , YOU MAY AS WELL ALL GO TO THE SAME PLACE, MAKES SENSE DOSN'T IT ??? AS FOR THE RARER SIDE OF THE SCENE  THESE VENUES ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN  AND MOST ARE TO FAR TO TRAVEL TO THESE DAYS FOR ME DUE TO WORK COMMITMENTS  . WHATS YOUR THOUGHTS GUY'S

It does seem that there are some buyers out there who are cash rich. Perhaps its a case of their mortgages have finally gone and they can now afford the tunes coupled with a poor knowledge of how many copies are out there. Auctions really work well when two people with money chase the same item ! It may end in a high price but that does not mean it is really worth that amount . It just reached it on that day. Prices can goe down too and they may in the future!!!

Along with the mortgages,  their commitments may have dissapeared too. Free time may now mean people who have been restricted to family life now have the opportunity to venture out again. Unfortunately for those like myself who have been living off the quality sounds through the 80ts to today,  I now have to watch the scene slip back 30 years !!

There are good venues about but you have to make an effort for them to keep them alive. They will progress but only if we keep attending them.

Life line , 100 club , Rugby and a few others to name a few.

It is frustrating watching commercials and money minded people milk the scene but then that is nothing new .

 

KTF  Frank   Norwich

Edited September 7, 2015 by Bossfourpart1

[Gerry H]

the days of a dj making a record big have gone to many places opening up the brilliant day`s when Winsford Prestwitch tonys b/burn   and of cource king Georges hall stoke  junction 11 few other places dj`s made records big now theirs to many up n coming :Charity Nights that you can`t make records big anymore so then u get the talk moaners o they didn't use talk at wigan casino they k@@kin did i know cos i was th

ere

[Whiskyagogo]

Here in Perth Australia, we have a small choice of where to go and to be honest sometimes I am too knackered to go out, I wind my decks up and have a few drink's [sometimes more than a few] at home and still get the rush and the buzz that I got in the 70's. Bloody Brilliant this music eh!!

[Henning V Herzen]

2 things that will kill the scene:

- negative discussions like this

- losing the passion while getting more and more negative and regressive

 

[Henning V Herzen]

oh yeah. i can't remember any part of history were problem talk meant solving a problem or to find solutions...

If you guys still believe in the power of soul then there are only two ways imo out of the metalevel:

1. the constructivistic way: everybody has his/her own reality and they are all ok. Believe in what they do cause many different ways of thinkings generate many different views so the chance is bigger to keep the scene/the scenes alive

2. the "my truth is the right truth" way: you believe in what you are doing and thinking is the right way so help them people with support

[Orotava]

It does seem that there are some buyers out there who are cash rich. Perhaps its a case of their mortgages have finally gone and they can now afford the tunes coupled with a poor knowledge of how many copies are out there. Auctions really work well when two people with money chase the same item ! It may end in a high price but that does not mean it is really worth that amount . It just reached it on that day. Prices can goe down too and they may in the future!!!

Along with the mortgages,  their commitments may have dissapeared too. Free time may now mean people who have been restricted to family life now have the opportunity to venture out again. Unfortunately for those like myself who have been living off the quality sounds through the 80ts to today,  I now have to watch the scene slip back 30 years !!

There are good venues about but you have to make an effort for them to keep them alive. They will progress but only if we keep attending them.

Life line , 100 club , Rugby and a few others to name a few.

It is frustrating watching commercials and money minded people milk the scene but then that is nothing new .

 

KTF  Frank   Norwich

I think some folk have got their mitts on their pension pot...

[Guest]

hi Steve, these pop up DJ's with their boxes who can not DJ to save their lives. I went to a couple of soul nights recently, before allnighter's. DJ's id never seen or heard before, put some brilliant sets together. Fresh sounds really done the bizz. Ones pure soul at Nuneaten and the other was John may at Derby soul night. Well worth a visit. Cheers billy.

I agree Billy..... there are some who can but i`m taking about those who definitely cannot! 

[Markw]

the days of a dj making a record big have gone to many places opening up the brilliant day`s when Winsford Prestwitch tonys b/burn   and of cource king Georges hall stoke  junction 11 few other places dj`s made records big now theirs to many up n coming :Charity Nights that you can`t make records big anymore so then u get the talk moaners o they didn't use talk at wigan casino they k@@kin did i know cos i was th

ere

I suspect you need to get out more. There are plenty of venues out there on all the different aspects of the real rare soul scene making records "big", remembering that "big" is a relative term. Just need to get along to some of those venues, keep your ear to the ground and take no notice of the nostalgia-obsessed, youth-rediscovery, dressing-up, re-enactment circus which goes around claiming to be something it quite blatantly is not. Keep it real...........

[charliew]

My personal opinion is that Soul isnt dead its never been more vibrant the major thing is AGE ..... lets remember it was always a drug fueled dance scene where now i see it more of a drink fueld social scene,it is much more fragmented in its genres etc and things seem to be more pigeon holed and everybodys got an opinion ! However all that said seek and you shall find ok you may not have 4 or 5 major venues with a 1000 + people aching for more & DJ,s pushing bounderies to the masses but you have thousands of smaller venues offereing something for everybody which i suppose is dillution but also offers places to go that fit your particuliar criteria, if its a specialist night ie crossover, r&b, funk etc then your catered for, if its big allnighter where people from all over Britain travel to and dance smashed out there tatties then your gonna be sadly dissapointed unless you just like the top 500 which seems to be a big part of the reason the scene on the surface seems to be dying but can all these people be wrong or is it us the minority that has to make do with what weve got and cherish it ! like minded folk always find a way to gather & enjoy...... ok not on my door step but it never was, look at places like Lifeline, Rugby,  for allnighters and places like Rafa club, Grumpy soul, ATOH, Different Strokes, Horse & Groom, Filthy soul etc etc its out there if you want it ...

As for record prices and too many DJ,s etc you pays your money and makes your choice vote with your feet (Something for everybody out there if you look

Maybe Europe, weekenders.soul cruises, in foriegn lands also adds a new dimension which wasnt there when i was a lad, take all that into consideration you cant possibly say the soul scene is dying its never been more eclectic or vibrant.

[Markw]

My personal opinion is that Soul isnt dead its never been more vibrant the major thing is AGE ..... lets remember it was always a drug fueled dance scene where now i see it more of a drink fueld social scene,it is much more fragmented in its genres etc and things seem to be more pigeon holed and everybodys got an opinion ! However all that said seek and you shall find ok you may not have 4 or 5 major venues with a 1000 + people aching for more & DJ,s pushing bounderies to the masses but you have thousands of smaller venues offereing something for everybody which i suppose is dillution but also offers places to go that fit your particuliar criteria, if its a specialist night ie crossover, r&b, funk etc then your catered for, if its big allnighter where people from all over Britain travel to and dance smashed out there tatties then your gonna be sadly dissapointed unless you just like the top 500 which seems to be a big part of the reason the scene on the surface seems to be dying but can all these people be wrong or is it us the minority that has to make do with what weve got and cherish it ! like minded folk always find a way to gather & enjoy...... ok not on my door step but it never was, look at places like Lifeline, Rugby,  for allnighters and places like Rafa club, Grumpy soul, ATOH, Different Strokes, Horse & Groom, Filthy soul etc etc its out there if you want it ...

As for record prices and too many DJ,s etc you pays your money and makes your choice vote with your feet (Something for everybody out there if you look

Maybe Europe, weekenders.soul cruises, in foriegn lands also adds a new dimension which wasnt there when i was a lad, take all that into consideration you cant possibly say the soul scene is dying its never been more eclectic or vibrant.

Great assessment mate.  Well put.

[Quinvy]

It's all about opinions, and if you can go out every week and find something that stimulates you and keeps you interested, then I salute you because I certainly can't.

The so called up front venues are just the same as the oldies nights, they're just playing Stafford or other old venues records. Looking at playlists there's very little that is new. Even the crossover and seventies plays are the same big money rarities that the top jocks have been playing for years. 

Some people have been going out to events since the seventies without a break. How the hell they can keep the interest going is beyond me.

Edited September 8, 2015 by Quinvy

[Slim Jim]

It is all about opinions and a scene like ours that has lasted so long inevitably causes people to look back and think it was so much better before . 

There are aspects of today's commercialization of the scene that makes me cringe especially when one of your mates say's "I saw that Wheatabix advert on TV , do you guys really run around dressed like that al the time ?"  etc etc , but wasn't that always the case ? For every cool soul brother there was some dick running around with a Wigan's Ovation tee shirt .

Unfortunately in periods of popularity will come the negative exposure but the thing that will endure is how good the music is and that in itself is the cause for optimism that there's still plenty of life left in the ol' dog yet . 

I remember the late 80's/ early 90's when very little was happening , it was a case of keeping the head down and supporting whatever was on ...look on the bright side we've got plenty of choice now and there's still still plenty of quality to be found amongst the quantity .

I still get the same hairs on the back of the neck feeling when I hear a new sound I don't know or a brilliant oldie I'd all but forgotten same as I did when I first heard soul as a 15 year old kid .

Before I used to DJ once in a blue moon now there's plenty to choose from and I'm enjoying it .

Signed .... a cheerful Irish soul fan 

 

 

[Kev Cane]

It is all about opinions and a scene like ours that has lasted so long inevitably causes people to look back and think it was so much better before . 

There are aspects of today's commercialization of the scene that makes me cringe especially when one of your mates say's "I saw that Wheatabix advert on TV , do you guys really run around dressed like that al the time ?"  etc etc , but wasn't that always the case ? For every cool soul brother there was some dick running around with a Wigan's Ovation tee shirt .

Unfortunately in periods of popularity will come the negative exposure but the thing that will endure is how good the music is and that in itself is the cause for optimism that there's still plenty of life left in the ol' dog yet . 

I remember the late 80's/ early 90's when very little was happening , it was a case of keeping the head down and supporting whatever was on ...look on the bright side we've got plenty of choice now and there's still still plenty of quality to be found amongst the quantity .

I still get the same hairs on the back of the neck feeling when I hear a new sound I don't know or a brilliant oldie I'd all but forgotten same as I did when I first heard soul as a 15 year old kid .

Before I used to DJ once in a blue moon now there's plenty to choose from and I'm enjoying it .

Signed .... a cheerful Irish soul fan 

 

 

Hi Jim

Sorry, got to disagree, the mid 80,s through early 90's for me was a golden era, plenty going on, it was fantastic because it was defo underground, new discovered sounds to be heard most weeks, no retro circus, just enough venues to keep you occupied most weeks, 100 Club, Mexboro, Swan Mansfield, Shotts Allenton, Blackburn, everyone just moved around a good core of quality venues. Great days

Kev 

[Guest Mart B]

Hi Jim

Sorry, got to disagree, the mid 80,s through early 90's for me was a golden era, plenty going on, it was fantastic because it was defo underground, new discovered sounds to be heard most weeks, no retro circus, just enough venues to keep you occupied most weeks, 100 Club, Mexboro, Swan Mansfield, Shotts Allenton, Blackburn, everyone just moved around a good core of quality venues. Great days

Kev 

Toatly agree kev,and we was hearing good underplayed tunes has the Norm.Now we are back to accommodating the masses with overplayed Motown & Disco Demand oldies,it's not for me.

[Amsterdam Russ]

I have to ask all of you who are moaning about the quality of the events you attend - why do you go to them?

Isn't stupidity defined as doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different outcome? 

Wouldn't it make more sense to go to somewhere you're sure of having a good time, or are you just suckers for punishment?

Better still, if you don't think your soul needs are being catered for, why not do as so many others are doing and organise your own events? Then your punters can come on here and moan about how crap it and the music policy was. 

[Mike]

I know its midweek but can't someone get some topic going thats got a slightly positive feel? 

[Len]

I know its midweek but can't someone get some topic going thats got a slightly positive feel? 

HA HA HA Hilarious mate - To me it's all so messed up I can't even put it into words - Some love it / some hate it etc etc....... 

See some of you at Stateside Soul, Stubshaw WMC in October 

Also - Nice one Russell Gilbert

Len

Edited September 9, 2015 by LEN

[John A]

I have to ask all of you who are moaning about the quality of the events you attend - why do you go to them?

Isn't stupidity defined as doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different outcome? 

Wouldn't it make more sense to go to somewhere you're sure of having a good time, or are you just suckers for punishment?

Better still, if you don't think your soul needs are being catered for, why not do as so many others are doing and organise your own events? Then your punters can come on here and moan about how crap it and the music policy was. 

I agree. I don't bother going anymore. It's crap.

sorry, that wasn't very positive was it Mike? :)

Edited September 8, 2015 by John A

[Amsterdam Russ]

I know its midweek but can't someone get some topic going thats got a slightly positive feel? 

Instead of the "two things that are killing the scene", how about a thread on "two things that are keeping the scene alive and kicking"? 

[Slim Jim]

Hi Jim

Sorry, got to disagree, the mid 80,s through early 90's for me was a golden era, plenty going on, it was fantastic because it was defo underground, new discovered sounds to be heard most weeks, no retro circus, just enough venues to keep you occupied most weeks, 100 Club, Mexboro, Swan Mansfield, Shotts Allenton, Blackburn, everyone just moved around a good core of quality venues. Great days

Kev 

You are right Kev it did definitely have a more underground feel in that era and some brilliant sounds were discovered .

I was referring to Ireland and Belfast in particular and we hadn't a lot going on , the highlight for me was the odd trip to London and The 100 Club .

We had one club here from the late nineties until about five years ago now its nearly impossible to have a night that doesn't clash with something .... too much to try and get to it all .

It seems everyone loves their Northern Soul now days    

[Jem Britttin]

Hi Steve, don’t think the scene is being ‘destroyed’ you’re just turning in to a grumpy old git Lol!

 

Think record prices latterly are driven by two things. 1. As has already mentioned, people out there spending their retirement fund or similar 2. More importantly don’t think rarity in numbers has much relevance in most cases now; it’s more how many are available to buy!  a lot of these old classic originals are tucked away in peoples collections for posterity reasons, sure Epitome of Sound numbers wise not that rare, although probably not so many genuine ones as people think remember this got counterfeited pretty convincingly. Also a lot of rough copies about (mine included) but wouldn’t part with it for the world, which kind of explains what I am trying to say. If someone out there is looking for a pristine proper original and they have the where with all then they will pay what they want: surely their decision, but remember the value of your investment can go up as well as down as the small print says!

 

 Incidentally think there is a certain amount of hypocrisy going on here. I notice Kev Such commented that he had no idea why prices had gone bonkers and why people would pay so much, come on Kev you must have some idea! Correct me if I am wrong but you paid a king’s ransom for Timi Yuro a few years back and by your own admission you’re not a record collector per say so why?

 

As for the other points too many nights etc. ‘gawd luv a duck’ ain’t we done with this yet. This isn’t 1973 and unfortunately we are not all 16 year olds still. It is what it is folks. I gave up worrying about it years ago, sure it pisses me off when I am fed a load of bullshit about a record or something by some ‘new age ebay sage’ while taking a fag break outside at a night, but I just smile now and say thanks for the info mate and walk off it’s much easier. Things are never going to be the same as they were, but one thing I do feel we have failed to do over the years is to properly welcome or encourage new blood to the scene, we should have engaged more folks instead of arguing the toss! That’s why in the vacuum left behind everybody of a certain age seems to be a DJ or an expert now! It’s so easy folks, spend a week on the internet learning the basics of Northern Soul history another one buying the records of ebay and the like, hey presto your ready to go ‘The Northern Soul Instant Identity Kit’ I am thinking of seeing if it has any legs on Dragons Den.

 

All that said I and the same 4 or 5 DJs (Thanks Kev) are determined to carry on our own local night that attracts all sorts, old and young including people that have been around for years and those that know only 6 Northern Soul records, because funnily enough that’s what Northern Soul was built on, people in a room dancing and enjoying the music, despite their relative knowledge of records etc. Why is it we look back on it as though everybody was oh so cool and knowledgeable back then? Never was the case!

 

All the best ‘Right On’ Jem

Edited September 8, 2015 by Jem Britttin

[25miles]

We are killing the soul scene. With I don't know what. Take myself for instance at the weekend, . I worked 12 hours Saturday and Sunday, had Monday Off. Was supposed to be going Swinton nighter Sunday, but wasn't feeling to clever so I stayed in. And I love Swinton. A few year's ago you would have had to nail my feet to the floor to stop me going out if I was ill or not. Or Are we just getting old. 

Steve

 

 

yeh  man.............we will never be this young again !!

[Kegsy]

Oh for God's sake, the scene isn't dying or being killed, how can it be, there are more events now than there ever has been. What people really mean is the scene "as I perceive it to be" isn't as I would like it to be.  Get over yourselves, who do you think you are ?, you don't own the scene or set the rules by which it operates, nobody does, not even the so called big name DJs. Go to the events you want to and let others go to the events they want to. Kinnel we had this in the mid 70's with the Wigan/Cleethorpes/Mecca arguments. The scene changes, always has done, always will do.

Edited September 9, 2015 by Kegsy

[Joprinsen]

Toatly agree kev,and we was hearing good underplayed tunes has the Norm.Now we are back to accommodating the masses with overplayed Motown & Disco Demand oldies,it's not for me.

 It depends where you go Mart. Whilst that might be the case with some venues, there are still many that don't resort to that.

Hi Jim

Sorry, got to disagree, the mid 80,s through early 90's for me was a golden era, plenty going on, it was fantastic because it was defo underground, new discovered sounds to be heard most weeks, no retro circus, just enough venues to keep you occupied most weeks, 100 Club, Mexboro, Swan Mansfield, Shotts Allenton, Blackburn, everyone just moved around a good core of quality venues. Great days

Kev 

I agree Kev,

There  was lots going on in and around Manchester and Cheshire at any rate in the late 80's and early 90's.  Hyde Soul Club at Hyde Botanical Club is one I remember fondly. Incidentally there was also a good underground mod scene then too.

Jo

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 9, 2015 by JoPrinsen
to add

[Mal C]

Hi Jim

Sorry, got to disagree, the mid 80,s through early 90's for me was a golden era, plenty going on, it was fantastic because it was defo underground, new discovered sounds to be heard most weeks, no retro circus, just enough venues to keep you occupied most weeks, 100 Club, Mexboro, Swan Mansfield, Shotts Allenton, Blackburn, everyone just moved around a good core of quality venues. Great days

Kev 

totally agree with that, great time, right up to 99 when the London scene really got good..

[Mellorful]

Oh for God's sake, the scene isn't dying or being killed, how can it be, there are more events now than there ever has been. What people really mean is the scene "as I perceive it to be" isn't as I would like it to be.  Get over yourselves, who do you think you are ?, you don't own the scene or set the rules by which it operates, nobody does, not even the so called big name DJs. Go to the events you want to and let others go to the events they want to. Kinnel we had this in the mid 70's with the Wigan/Cleethorpes/Mecca arguments. The scene changes, always has done, always will do.

Well said

I love Friday and Saturday night out dancing, even better if its an allnighter.

The scene is thriving, loads of events and more DJ's needed to cover those venues. If I don't like what a DJ's is playing I don't dance, if enough people feel that way the dance floor empties and the DJ usually changes tact and gets the punters up dancing, the next DJ up usually learns what works at a venue.

I appreciate that many venues keep playing top 100 tunes and some people become disillusioned, instead of critising why not try and influence things by dusting off the old vinyl or produce a flyer listing 10 favourite tunes; the newbies can take the flyers away and have a listen to recommendations on youtube. If they like the tunes at the next event the newbies may request those precious tunes are played and the scene goes forward.

I'm sure a template could be produced that facilitates the 10 favourite tunes that can then be printed off in readiness for distribution at events.

BRING ON THE WEEKEND