Bert Decoteaux

[Soul Shrews]

Any Soul Sourcers got any information about this fabulous writer/producer/arranger?

Worked with Marlena Shaw and the Main Ingredient in the 70's to name but two, but I also believe he was involved with some rare/northern 60's as Norbert deCoteaux?

Asking this partly as a favour for a non Soul Source friend, who asked Marlena Shaw about him at the Jazz Cafe a couple of years ago. Unfortunately she could only tell him how to pronounce deCoteaux correctly!

Thanks in advance Paul Woosnam

[soulfulsaint]

Any Soul Sourcers got any information about this fabulous writer/producer/arranger?

Worked with Marlena Shaw and the Main Ingredient in the 70's to name but two, but I also believe he was involved with some rare/northern 60's as Norbert deCoteaux?

Asking this partly as a favour for a non Soul Source friend, who asked Marlena Shaw about him at the Jazz Cafe a couple of years ago. Unfortunately she could only tell him how to pronounce deCoteaux correctly!

Thanks in advance Paul Woosnam

Loved his nickname Bert 'Super Charts' DeCoteaux. One of the great supa-producers of '70s uptempo soul (aka 'Disco Shit') Parise the lord and hit the hi-hat. A minor genius.

[Soul Shrews]

Loved his nickname Bert 'Super Charts' DeCoteaux.

Yes and wasn't his sometime partner Tony "Champagne " Sylvester?

Edited August 20, 2006 by soul shrews

[Sunnysoul]

Loved his nickname Bert 'Super Charts' DeCoteaux. One of the great supa-producers of '70s uptempo soul (aka 'Disco Shit') Parise the lord and hit the hi-hat. A minor genius.

Absolutely correct, Bert is every bit as as important to the history of soul music as the likes of Van McCoy, Bert Keyes, Carl Davis etc.

I would love to know a bit more about his life !!!!!!!

[soulfulsaint]

I would love to know a bit more about his life !!!!!!!

Best I could find was Cuba Gooding's biog which actually has more on Sylvester than Bertie boy but here it is:

Gooding, born April 27, 1944, in New York City, grew up with Tony Sylvester, Luther Simmons, Jr., and Donald McPherson in Harlem. Sylvester, Simmons, and McPherson formed the vocal group the Poets in the mid-'60s. They released singles on legendary songwriter/production team Leiber & Stoller's Red Bird label:

With Cuba Gooding on lead vocals, the Main Ingredient had their first million-selling single with "Everybody Plays the Fool," which hit number three pop and held the number two R&B spot for two weeks on Billboard's charts in fall 1972. The follow-up, "You've Got to Take It (If You Want It)," was included on the album Bitter Sweet, which hit number ten R&B in summer 1972. Their next LP, Afrodisiac, peaked at number 16 R&B in spring 1973

The group produced their 1974 LP Euphrates River, which included their second million-seller, a cover of Ronnie Dyson's 1973 hit "I Just Don't Want to Be Lonely". Tony Sylvester left the group to become a record producer and Carl Thompkins joined the group. Teaming with arranger/producer Bert DeCoteaux as Tony "Champagne" Sylvester, he had hits with Sister Sledge ("Love Don't Go Through No Changes on Me"), Ben E. King ("Supernatural Thing" and "Do It in the Name of Love"), and Linda Lewis. Rolling Down a Mountainside was the title of their 1975 LP (number three R&B, spring 1975) and of the title track single that hit number seven R&B. "Shame on the World" the single peaked at number 20 R&B, while the Shame on the World LP made it to number 27 R&B in late 1975.

In 1977, Gooding signed as a solo artist with Motown Records. Amid much anticipation and critical raves, his solo debut, The 1st Album, produced by Dennis Lambert and Brian Potter (Tavares, the Four Tops), was released in spring 1978 with only one single, "Mind Pleaser," charting number 91 R&B in spring 1978. Another Motown LP, Love Dancer, produced by Michael Lovesmith, was issued in spring 1979.

Gooding re-teamed with Sylvester and Simmons, recording the Main Ingredient LPs Ready For Love (RCA, fall 1980) and the Patrick Adams-produced I Only Eyes for You (RCA, late 1981). Gooding recorded a remake of "Happiness Is Just Around the Bend" for Streetwise Records, which became a huge dance hit in late 1983. Simmons left the act and was replaced by Jerome Jackson with the group recording the 1989 Polydor album I Just Wanna Love You.

[Guest sydney bridge]

Yes and wasn't his sometime partner Tony "Champagne " Sylvester?

the information your after could be just around the bend

[Soul Shrews]

the information your after could be just around the bend

Sydney plays the fool

[Soul Shrews]

Best I could find was Cuba Gooding's biog which actually has more on Sylvester than Bertie boy but here it is:

Thanks for that 'saint, the most I've managed to find on t'net is references to him being involved with other artists work.

Do we need an inspecter Clouseau to track down monsieur deCoteaux?

[Guest sydney bridge]

The Saint and The Shrews spooling bodly now!

[soulfulsaint]

The Saint and The Shrews spooling bodly now!

C'mon syd the big punchline is what? Surely you're not Bert's antipodean love-child.

[Guest sydney bridge]

C'mon syd the big punchline is what? Surely you're not Bert's antipodean love-child.

No but he did work with David Essex so stanger things have happened.

[soulfulsaint]

No but he did work with David Essex so stanger things have happened.

Better to be a 'flawed' genius than never to have tried at all. Still rate Bert.

[Guest sydney bridge]

Better to be a 'flawed' genius than never to have tried at all. Still rate Bert.

exactly

[Soul Shrews]

Absolutely correct, Bert is every bit as as important to the history of soul music as the likes of Van McCoy, Bert Keyes, Carl Davis etc.

I would love to know a bit more about his life !!!!!!!

Yeah, go along with that 100% sunnysoul.

But why can't we find any info?

A couple of Berts northern classics;

Patty Young-"Head and Shoulders"

Gloria Parker-"Best Thing For You Baby"

And a couple of 70's;

Sister Sledge-"Love Don't You Go Through No Changes In Me"

Ace Spectrum-"Don't Send Nobody Else"

Anybody? Purleees!

Edited August 20, 2006 by soul shrews

[Guest sydney bridge]

C'mon syd the big punchline is what? Surely you're not Bert's antipodean love-child.

Theres some American sounding chap banging on my on my front door shouting,

"Syd,open up,its your dad,Bert"

[Guest]

Unfortunately she could only tell him how to pronounce deCoteaux correctly!

So how do you pronounce it? would love to know as it never sounds right when I say it, another one I have trouble with is Huey P MEAUX, any cajuns out there?

[Soul Shrews]

So how do you pronounce it? would love to know as it never sounds right when I say it, another one I have trouble with is Huey P MEAUX, any cajuns out there?

It's pronounced in French!

Bienvernue, Paco

[Guest]

It's pronounced in French!

Bienvernue, Paco

Now why didn't I think of that

Merci beaucoup, Paul

[Guest Paul]

Hello,

The name DeCoteaux is pronounced Dee-Koh-Toe. I learned that from ZZ Hill when I interviewed him for Black Echoes in the early 1980s. He said it very fast and it sounded French but I think the name has a Polish origin.

And the "Bert" is short for Norbert.

Paul Mooney

[Soul Shrews]

Hello,

The name DeCoteaux is pronounced

Dee-Koh-Toe

. I learned that from ZZ Hill when I interviewed him for Black Echoes in the early 1980s. He said it very fast and it

sounded

French but I think the name has a Polish origin.

And the "Bert" is short for Norbert.

Paul Mooney

And Norbert is German, I think?

Really confused now, and still not learned anything more about the mysterious monsieur/herr deCoteaux!!!

[Soul Shrews]

Now why didn't I think of that

Merci beaucoup, Paul

Je vous enprie,

a tout l"heur.

Le Paco

[Guest Paul]

another one I have trouble with is Huey P MEAUX, any cajuns out there?

Meaux is pronounced Moh.

Paul Mooney

[Soul Shrews]

Meaux is pronounced

Moh

.

Paul Mooney

Is Huey pronounced Hughie?

Paul Woosnam

[FrankM]

Is Huey pronounced Hughie?

Paul Woosnam

yes and his records are filed on the same shelf as Gary Glitter and Jonathon King.

[Guest sydney bridge]

My mate Mister Shrew has been tearing his hair out over this thread of his.You`d think someone on the scene would have a bit of knowledge relating to Mr.DeCoteux.

It seems that even the alleged free Carribean holiday associated with this thread isn´t going entice any tight-lipped chin strokers to blabber about Burt.

[Soul Shrews]

My mate Mister Shrew has been tearing his hair out over this thread of his.You`d think someone on the scene would have a bit of knowledge relating to Mr.DeCoteux.

It seems that even the alleged free Carribean holiday associated with this thread isn´t going entice any tight-lipped chin strokers to blabber about Burt.

Er.........BUMP

A couple more of Berts Northern classics

George Blackwell-"Can't, Lose my Head"

Maxine Brown-"Can't Get Along Without You"

And a couple of 70's

Inner Space-"Break The Chains"

Marlena Shaw- "Love Has Gone Away"

Cheers Paul

PS Really desperate for info' now!

[Guest]

Hey Paul, ca va? still on the trail then? Been checking a bit myself googled and yahoo'd as probably you have, checked through my little library, nowt, even been in touch with a mate who has an extensive music libary, nothing except the same as what's already down, the guy's a bloody enigma that's for sure.

Bert? Bert? are you there Bert?

Bon Chance Paco.

[Guest]

Er.........BUMP

A couple more of Berts Northern classics

George Blackwell-"Can't, Lose my Head"

Maxine Brown-"Can't Get Along Without You"

And a couple of 70's

Inner Space-"Break The Chains"

Marlena Shaw- "Love Has Gone Away"

Cheers Paul

PS Really desperate for info' now!

Didnt he produce all J Wells stuff on Calla if so should get a mention.

[Sunnysoul]

Perhaps Adey Croasdell can enlighten us a bit more on Bert ... Why ?

Well Bert gets credits on quite a few of those loungy anonymous instrumental soul LP's that RCA issued in the late 60's , and then by about '69 / 70 or so he started having his greatest successes with the Main Ingredient .. which has me thinking that perhaps Bert by this time was a salaried staff producer / arranger at RCA ... so since Adey and the Kent guys did those two fantastic CD's of RCA stuff a few years back , maybe Adey has some info on Bert ????

The other thing is .... Bert doesn't appear to ever have had his own production company / set up and seemed to either collaborate directly with other writers like JR Bailey (was Bert part of "Dish A Tunes " publishing?) or work as a staffer at major labels because he then went on to work on hits in the mid 70's for Atlantic artists like Sister Sledge and Ace Spectrum ....

Whatever the case .. one thing is undeniable , anything Bert was involved in was always very soulful and very classy !

[Soul Shrews]

Didnt he produce all J Wells stuff on Calla

if so should get a mention.

Yep, spot on Ken

[Tony Smith]

Not now Cateaux

[Guest lifeandsoul]

inner space - make it hard on him - sweet fortune was arranged by him

written, produced by Landy McNeal (and sung?)

played it at soul fusion last week

[Soul Shrews]

Hey Paul, ca va? still on the trail then? Been checking a bit myself googled and yahoo'd as probably you have, checked through my little library, nowt, even been in touch with a mate who has an extensive music libary, nothing except the same as what's already down, the guy's a bloody enigma that's for sure.

Bert? Bert? are you there Bert?

Bon Chance Paco.

Bonjour, DelTee, oui ca va vien, comme c'est va?

Still on the trail mate if you can call it a trail.

No real leads just snippets, mainly about his sometime partner Tony Silvester, thanks Tony Rounce

Some interesting theories put foward by Sunnysoul, gonna check them out.

Not giving up tho', keep ya posted(or keep me posted if you find something,please)

Cheers Paul

PS Ou est Bert?

Edited August 25, 2006 by soul shrews

[Eddie Hubbard]

Any Soul Sourcers got any information about this fabulous writer/producer/arranger?

Worked with Marlena Shaw and the Main Ingredient in the 70's to name but two, but I also believe he was involved with some rare/northern 60's as Norbert deCoteaux?

Asking this partly as a favour for a non Soul Source friend, who asked Marlena Shaw about him at the Jazz Cafe a couple of years ago. Unfortunately she could only tell him how to pronounce deCoteaux correctly!

Thanks in advance Paul Woosnam

Hello Paul , looking through my collection , have noticed Bert arranged Patti Austin's " Pain stain " , " Someones gonna cry " and " You better know " , Sam Dees " Fragile " and the beautiful Main Ingredient side " You've been my inspiration " .Got a nagging feeling he was on Madeline Wilson's " Dial L for lonely " [samar ] as well - will check when I find it !! Hope this helps ,Best ,Eddie

[Soul Shrews]

Hello Paul , looking through my collection , have noticed Bert arranged Patti Austin's " Pain stain " , " Someones gonna cry " and " You better know " , Sam Dees " Fragile " and the beautiful Main Ingredient side " You've been my inspiration " .Got a nagging feeling he was on Madeline Wilson's " Dial L for lonely " [samar ] as well - will check when I find it !! Hope this helps ,Best ,Eddie

Thanks for that Eddie, I'd say there was a good chance he was involved with Madeline Wilson as he produced Gloria Parker also on Samar.

I'm more after info on the man himself, although it's nice to see some of the great records he was involved wih on here. I didn't realise he was involved with Sam Dees for instance.

A discography would make for interesting reading I'm sure!

Sunnysoul put up some interesting theories doncha think? Any thoughts on them?

Cheers Paul

Edited August 27, 2006 by soul shrews

[Soul Shrews]

Perhaps Adey Croasdell can enlighten us a bit more on Bert ... Why ?

Well Bert gets credits on quite a few of those loungy anonymous instrumental soul LP's that RCA issued in the late 60's , and then by about '69 / 70 or so he started having his greatest successes with the Main Ingredient .. which has me thinking that perhaps Bert by this time was a salaried staff producer / arranger at RCA ... so since Adey and the Kent guys did those two fantastic CD's of RCA stuff a few years back , maybe Adey has some info on Bert ????

The other thing is .... Bert doesn't appear to ever have had his own production company / set up and seemed to either collaborate directly with other writers like JR Bailey (was Bert part of "Dish A Tunes " publishing?) or work as a staffer at major labels because he then went on to work on hits in the mid 70's for Atlantic artists like Sister Sledge and Ace Spectrum ....

Whatever the case .. one thing is undeniable , anything Bert was involved in was always very soulful and very classy !

Interesting thoughts Sunnysoul all of them seem plausable to me.

Not been able to find any info' on "Dish A Tunes" so can't confirm if Bert was a member or not.

Not giving up tho'

Cheers Paul

PS Think Adey would have been on if he knew anything(or is he on holiday?)

Tony Rounce could only supply a bit of info 'bout Enrique "Tony" Silvester.

[Guest Paul]

Generally, Norbert 'Bert' De Coteaux was an arranger on a work-for-hire basis. Of course he also had a production company with Tony Sylvester and at various times he had production deals or staff positions with record companies (such as Columbia in the 1970s).

But he wasn't part of A Dish-A-Tunes. That was owned by J.R. Bailey (deceased) and Ken Williams. They hired Bert to arrange some of their sessions.

Although Bert wasn't a prolific writer, he had a publishing company called Music Montage.

I'll try to find out if he's still around.

Paul Mooney

www.millbrand.com

[Soul Shrews]

Generally, Norbert 'Bert' De Coteaux was an arranger on a work-for-hire basis. Of course he also had a production company with Tony Sylvester and at various times he had production deals or staff positions with record companies (such as Columbia in the 1970s).

But he wasn't part of A Dish-A-Tunes. That was owned by J.R. Bailey (deceased) and Ken Williams. They hired Bert to arrange some of their sessions.

Although Bert wasn't a prolific writer, he had a publishing company called Music Montage.

I'll try to find out if he's still around.

Paul Mooney

www.millbrand.com

Brilliant Paul, thanks for that!!!!!!

Good luck with any further searching ,MUCH appreciated!!!!

Cheers Paul

[Guest Paul]

Brilliant Paul, thanks for that!!!!!!

Good luck with any further searching ,MUCH appreciated!!!!

Cheers Paul

A Dish-A-Tunes are clients of Millbrand so I've asked Ken Williams to listen out for any news on Bert De Coteaux. He hadn't heard from him in years. I can't remember the last time I saw Bert's name on anything.

Paul Mooney

www.millbrand.com

[Soul Shrews]

A Dish-A-Tunes are clients of Millbrand so I've asked Ken Williams to listen out for any news on Bert De Coteaux. He hadn't heard from him in years. I can't remember the last time I saw Bert's name on anything.

Paul Mooney

www.millbrand.com

Come on Ken!!!!!

Been a very long time since Berts names been mentioned I'll bet.

A discography would be long and VERY interesting.

Thanks again Paul

Cheers Paul Woosnam

[Soul Shrews]

[Eddie Hubbard]

A couple more of Berts;

Christine Cooper "Heartaches Away My Boy"

Oh, thats enough for anyone with a pair of ears surely?

Cheers Paul Woosnam

Also on Jean Wells " What have I got to lose "

and Ace Spectrum " Don't send nobody else " .He seemed to do loads of work for Atlantic , though Sam Dees didn't sem very happy with his arrangements on " Fragile " In an interview with Voices from the shadows mag ,he said something like " I sent it away as a ballad - it came back as disco !! " At least we loved in in England I suppose .Best ,Eddie

[Soul Shrews]

Also on Jean Wells " What have I got to lose "

and Ace Spectrum " Don't send nobody else " .He seemed to do loads of work for Atlantic , though Sam Dees didn't sem very happy with his arrangements on " Fragile " In an interview with Voices from the shadows mag ,he said something like " I sent it away as a ballad - it came back as disco !! " At least we loved in in England I suppose .Best ,Eddie

Yes Eddie I remember reading that too. Would'nt class it as "disco" tho' mind you theres a fair few Soul Sourcers who would. Maybe Sams a 60's only man!

A couple more of Berts;

Chris Bartley "Tomorrow Keeps Shining On Me"

Joe Simon "Your Turn To Cry"

Frannie Golde "Stop (And Look Around)

Milt Matthews "All These Changes"

Cheers Paul

[Simon T]

Generally, Norbert 'Bert' De Coteaux was an arranger on a work-for-hire basis. Of course he also had a production company with Tony Sylvester and at various times he had production deals or staff positions with record companies (such as Columbia in the 1970s).

But he wasn't part of A Dish-A-Tunes. That was owned by J.R. Bailey (deceased) and Ken Williams. They hired Bert to arrange some of their sessions.

Although Bert wasn't a prolific writer, he had a publishing company called Music Montage.

I'll try to find out if he's still around.

Paul Mooney

www.millbrand.com

Bert died around 2 years ago.

[Soul Shrews]

Bert died around 2 years ago.

Sorry to hear that SimonT, can you elarorate on that statment?

Cheers Paul Woosnam

[Simon T]

Sorry to hear that SimonT, can you elarorate on that statment?

Cheers Paul Woosnam

Just got a email from a friend informing of the fact and asked me to pass it on; I'll ask.

[Soul Shrews]

Just got a email from a friend informing of the fact and asked me to pass it on; I'll ask.

Thanks

Cheers Paul

Edited August 29, 2006 by soul shrews

[Guest]

Salut Paul, just found out that Bert did an album called "Bert DeCoteaux Plays A Stevie Wonder Book" the cover is apparently a sketch of the two of them back to back, it'd be nice to see what he looked like.

Not much, but it's another little piece of the jigsaw that is Bert!

Derek

That should read "......Stevie Wonder Song Book"

[Soul Shrews]

Salut Paul, just found out that Bert did an album called "Bert DeCoteaux Plays A Stevie Wonder Book" the cover is apparently a sketch of the two of them back to back, it'd be nice to see what he looked like.

Not much, but it's another little piece of the jigsaw that is Bert!

Derek

That should read "......Stevie Wonder Song Book"

Bon soir Derek,

Well I've never heard/seen that, but I'll certainly be keeping an eye out.

Just goes to show how ahead of his time Bert was what with all the Stevie comps over the last few years, think the last I heard about was DJ Spinna!

Who knows maybe in a few years time we'll have "various artists tribute to Bert" compilations!

Still hoping Millbrand and Simon T will get back to us on this.

Cheers Paul

[soulfulsaint]

Here's the cover - not much to go on alas: