Big Money, Low Regard

[Guest gordon russell]

Darrell Banks and Frank Wilson.... I think we should all be able to sing the words backwards by now!

A common practise in yorkshire lol    happy xmas neil    tezza & janxx

[Guest gordon russell]

Think some of you are missing the point  (as always)....whoever paid £15k for this tune ...did not raid the piggy bank or sell his old cortina............he/she could easily afford it. The very opposite of why many after 40 years have to sell up...they can,t afford to keep  £1,000's of pounds worth of tunes just sitting there,if they could they'd still have em.......if the £15k means not much to you.........then you lot might do the same.

[Frankie Crocker]

I have always found this derogatory attitude about British (UK) soul releases being nothing more than reissues to be very sad, they are the bedrock of the mod/soul and later northernsoul scene. Perhaps not the London release but without the Stateside release how many of us would have heard and fell in love with the voice and work of Darrell Banks ?

And while were at it let's give Angel Baby on Red Atlantic a big shout too

Dave

Hi Louise. I think most of us are pro-American releases as the music is American, rather than anti-British soul releases. I would imagine that loads of UK based US record collectors have a sprinkling of good tunes on British vinyl, I know I have a few. Trouble is, it is very difficult to collect both British and American in a big way given the costs and of course, the scarcity of the records hence the preference for one or the other. I will say that British vinyl is of a superb quality, and wish that plenty of US records I own were on this superior vinyl rather than styrene or low grade vinyl.

[Labeat]

I sold off the majority of my British once Northern started.... Down to personal choice. Right, thats that.

Let us remember one thing.... British released 60's soul was well established on these shores several

years before Northern imports took a grip, that was all there was for the older generation so i think it

is unfair to call them re-issues by members who started their affair with Northern only.

There is an awful lot of British collectors in this country.... die-hards if you like

[Pete S]

US Revilot is the American original.

UK London is the UK original.

Neither is a reissue.  They are both the first pressings in their respective countries.

[Labeat]

US Revilot is the American original.

UK London is the UK original.

Neither is a reissue.  They are both the first pressings in their respective countries.

Depends how people interpret that, what some say (such as Quinvy) is that the American label was first out, British second

[Jaco]

Depends how people interpret that, what some say (such as Quinvy) is that the American label was first out, British second

 

But that's not being denied is it? It's a fact but being an original by virtue of a timeline does not make the later UK issue a re-issue.

 

It's not that hard but some folk want to make it so.

[KevH]

Re-issue ?? My ducks arse lol !!!

[Tony A]

This is getting silly now.   

[Jaco]

This is getting silly now.   

 

Time to put this one to bed.

[Labeat]

A common practise in yorkshire lol    happy xmas neil    tezza & janxx

Thanks Tez... same to you&Jan x

Be a good boy

[Pete S]

Depends how people interpret that, what some say (such as Quinvy) is that the American label was first out, British second

 

OK let's just say this happened, it didn't but it's just a scenario: the US release was delayed for some reason and the UK one came out first.  Then that, in some people's minds, would make the original USA recording, a reissue!

Which is why they can't apply the same rules to different countries, each country has it's own original.

[Labeat]

OK let's just say this happened, it didn't but it's just a scenario: the US release was delayed for some reason and the UK one came out first.  Then that, in some people's minds, would make the original USA recording, a reissue!

Which is why they can't apply the same rules to different countries, each country has it's own original.

Dont wish to go that deep into it, all im saying is him him & him will say the US label was issued first, the British was issued second some time after.

that in effect is where folk are saying (or terming it) a re-issue. I don't have a personal opinion

[Johndelve]

Can't imagine any genuine Soul fans ever tiring of this wonderful record , maybe the sort of folk who see records as a vehicle for self promotion might cast it aside as "having had their use out of it" but personally always happy to hear it played out and I don't think it's been over exposed in the way Frank Wilson was.

I agree with Manus, and furthermore, see absolutely no connection whatsoever between the quality and the price of a record. There are brilliant expensive records, brilliant cheap records, terrible expensive records and terrible cheap records.

[Quinvy]

I was just winding the collectors up. I don't really give a **** but when members on this forum say that a lot of the UK issued stuff wasn't actually licensed it makes you wonder.

 

I seem to remember it was Butch who first called them reissues. I thought it was funny and have called them by that name ever since. 

Just a bit of fun.

 

A more pertinent point may be how obscene is it that someone can afford to spend that amount of money on a 45?

[Missing Link]

Pales into insignificance compared to the world's most expensive postage stamp at £5.6 million!

[Modernsoulsucks]

Yes, that's hard to lick.

 

Which funnily enough the wife was only...... but I digress.

 

ROD

[pow wow mik]

Hey, it's not me who brought up the re-issue thing, this is just my viewpoint which is based on facts rather than some romantic, I must hang on to my youth, oh it was better back in the day, if only these youngsters knew, kind of non-reality.

You carry on blowing 15k on re-issues just so you can show how big your knob is.

Stamp collectors!!!. I love 'em, now where's my bootlace tie..................

Hang on, you buy original issues of tracks that are perfectly enjoyable and available to listen to on mp3 or youtube. Why is your blowing of that money somehow more rational than the blowing of money on this? Why is your knob waving lesser?

is your way just the right way, is that what you're basically saying?]

Edited December 23, 2014 by pow wow mik

[Louise]

Hi Louise. I think most of us are pro-American releases as the music is American, rather than anti-British soul releases. I would imagine that loads of UK based US record collectors have a sprinkling of good tunes on British vinyl, I know I have a few. Trouble is, it is very difficult to collect both British and American in a big way given the costs and of course, the scarcity of the records hence the preference for one or the other. I will say that British vinyl is of a superb quality, and wish that plenty of US records I own were on this superior vinyl rather than styrene or low grade vinyl.

 Hi Frankie

 It's Dave under Louise's monica, she couldn't give a rats arse.

 I agree with most of your statement, these days the majority of my collection circa 1964 to 2014 is on US labels with the odd foreign or UK only release items. Having sold my UK 60's and 70's in the mid 80's due to being unable to afford both UK and US, and thus choosing to concentrate on US releases with them being more infinite. The point of my previous post is that I think that we (the soul scene) should be grateful for the foundations laid down by UK releases and not belittle them.

ATB

Dave

[Guest gordon russell]

Thanks Tez... same to you&Jan x

Be a good boy

Always ...........hope we,ll see you at  soul foonkshine

Edited December 23, 2014 by gordon russell

[Guest gordon russell]

I was just winding the collectors up. I don't really give a **** but when members on this forum say that a lot of the UK issued stuff wasn't actually licensed it makes you wonder.

 

I seem to remember it was Butch who first called them reissues. I thought it was funny and have called them by that name ever since. 

Just a bit of fun.

 

A more pertinent point may be how obscene is it that someone can afford to spend that amount of money on a 45?

Phil there are restaurants  that sell bottles of wine  for £20-£30-£40k a bottle.........i.m in one now

Edited December 24, 2014 by gordon russell

[paultp]

I wouldn't do it myself but I can see why this would be incredibly attractive to a collector, it's possibly a complete one off.

 

People who buy records to DJ with aren't collectors, collectors are a completely different beast. I don't want a complete run of a particular label but I understand that there are people who do. If they have the disposable income then good luck to them really.

[Crumb]

US Revilot is the American original.

 

Pink or Grey? 

[Stompingsevens]

Hang on, you buy original issues of tracks that are perfectly enjoyable and available to listen to on mp3 or youtube. Why is your blowing of that money somehow more rational than the blowing of money on this? Why is your knob waving lesser?

is your way just the right way, is that what you're basically saying?]

Yes, I do buy originals for very large amounts of money that are available on other formats but I am a record collector and I buy original pressings, I travel to the USA extensively hunting down R&B 45's a couple of times a year if I can. The point is that this is a re-issue and the only reason it's being bought (I'm guessing) is because of it's OTT price tag and that seems a bit dumb to me. All this fuss over a 45 that you can buy an original copy of for £30..........??

Beatles collectors (worldwide) consider the UK issues the original pressings because they are 'country of origin' and I think the same applies to Soul, Reggae and R'n'R markets aswell. I collect UK Ska and Reggae 45's but I'm fully aware these are just re-issues of original JA issues, although it should be mentioned that the UK issues do often differ from the JA originals, thus making them 'original' in their own right.

This is just my personal opinion of course but it's interesting that it seems to have struck such a raw nerve!

Stamp collectors................!!! Enjoy your filing systems.............

[Jaco]

Yes, I do buy originals for very large amounts of money that are available on other formats but I am a record collector and I buy original pressings, I travel to the USA extensively hunting down R&B 45's a couple of times a year if I can. The point is that this is a re-issue and the only reason it's being bought (I'm guessing) is because of it's OTT price tag and that seems a bit dumb to me. All this fuss over a 45 that you can buy an original copy of for £30..........??

Beatles collectors (worldwide) consider the UK issues the original pressings because they are 'country of origin' and I think the same applies to Soul, Reggae and R'n'R markets aswell. I collect UK Ska and Reggae 45's but I'm fully aware these are just re-issues of original JA issues, although it should be mentioned that the UK issues do often differ from the JA originals, thus making them 'original' in their own right.

This is just my personal opinion of course but it's interesting that it seems to have struck such a raw nerve!

Stamp collectors................!!! Enjoy your filing systems.............

So by this bizarre logic a US release of a Beatles track is a re-issue.

And that's supposed to make sense?

Country of origin - yes. Re-issue - never in a fukcing million years.

PS - no raw nerve here, just a shaking of head.

[Zed1]

[Guest gordon russell]

It is said that the buyer of this tune may be doing so  as a knob waving thing...well that may be true if he had come on here bragging about it ect ect,but as far as l know he ain,t.He may be just one of those quiet collectors who collect for the love who have no need to brag.Unlike some fellas at nighter who only talk about their latest BIG TICKET buys and have no time for small ticket records......mainly because they only consider a record good if it costs over a GRAAAAAAAND!! LOL.  We never hear Tom creighton bangin on about his rare expensive collection or  Fred Kroll or Dickie Watt.......so this fella might just be    a proper record collector.......now theres summat new!!

Edited December 24, 2014 by gordon russell

[Stephen T]

Original Vinyl Only, Stephen…. I'll tell you if no one else will!

 

edit: beat me to it Sean

Cheers Sean and Soul Stu. Year OV is great if you can get them for under about £30 but represses are great too for those expensive records. I'm away that normal people are impressed I'm playing records and wouldn't even be aware of any significance regarding types of pressing..

[Labeat]

I wouldn't do it myself but I can see why this would be incredibly attractive to a collector, it's possibly a complete one off.

 

People who buy records to DJ with aren't collectors, collectors are a completely different beast. I don't want a complete run of a particular label but I understand that there are people who do. If they have the disposable income then good luck to them really.

 

There are also collectors of anything.... so long as it's a "white demo", what category would they come under?

[Guest gordon russell]

There are also collectors of anything.... so long as it's a "white demo", what category would they come under?

multi coloured demo haters!!!!lol

[Chatty]

So after 3 pages of debate on here, am I allowed to call my FW on Tamla an original or not?

[Pete S]

So after 3 pages of debate on here, am I allowed to call my FW on Tamla an original or not?

 

Original British, yes...but be careful because it's been repressed three times on Tamla Motown, you have to have the right one from 1979 or you'll be arrested 

[Gogger]

i know where i was looking as well 

[Peter Richer]

So after 3 pages of debate on here, am I allowed to call my FW on Tamla an original or not?

 

No.

 

Because it was released as a result of northern soul demand/popularity (from plays of an actual original recorded disc).

 

Exactly the same as, say, Larry Clinton or Al Williams on Grapevine.

Edited December 24, 2014 by Peter Richer

[Jaco]

No.

Because it was released as a result of northern soul demand/popularity (from plays of an actual original recorded disc).

Exactly the same as, say, Larry Clinton or Al Williams on Grapevine.

B*llocks. How can a record that's never been issued be called a re-issue?

On that note I'm out of this one.

Edited February 7, 2015 by pikeys dog
swearing - work filters

[paultp]

Cheers Sean and Soul Stu. Year OV is great if you can get them for under about £30 but represses are great too for those expensive records. I'm away that normal people are impressed I'm playing records and wouldn't even be aware of any significance regarding types of pressing..

Normal people ?!? Who wants to play records to normal people?

[Guest son of stan]

Do we know for certain then that it wasn't a collector of reissues who bought it? ;-)

[Peter Richer]

B*llocks. How can a record that's never been issued be called a re-issue?

On that note I'm out of this one.

 

If I thought you were capable of understanding (the very simple concept), I would explain it to you.

 

Clearly, on the evidence of your post, you're not.

Edited February 7, 2015 by pikeys dog
swearing - work filters

[Godzilla]

So how come there's been nothing in the news about the price of crack plummeting in some parts of the country - which is clearly the case, judging by some of the posts on this thread...

[Jaco]

If I thought you were capable of understanding (the very simple concept), I would explain it to you.

Clearly, on the evidence of your post, you're not.

No please go ahead. Make my Xmas and a more accomplished and understanding human being.

[pow wow mik]

Yes, I do buy originals for very large amounts of money that are available on other formats but I am a record collector and I buy original pressings, I travel to the USA extensively hunting down R&B 45's a couple of times a year if I can. The point is that this is a re-issue and the only reason it's being bought (I'm guessing) is because of it's OTT price tag and that seems a bit dumb to me. All this fuss over a 45 that you can buy an original copy of for £30..........??

Beatles collectors (worldwide) consider the UK issues the original pressings because they are 'country of origin' and I think the same applies to Soul, Reggae and R'n'R markets aswell. I collect UK Ska and Reggae 45's but I'm fully aware these are just re-issues of original JA issues, although it should be mentioned that the UK issues do often differ from the JA originals, thus making them 'original' in their own right.

This is just my personal opinion of course but it's interesting that it seems to have struck such a raw nerve!

Stamp collectors................!!! Enjoy your filing systems.............

It hasn't struck a raw nerve, your argument is just nonsense. You're saying that spending huge amounts on one intrinsically unreasonable form of collecting is reasonable, but on another isn't.

if you buy a record for any other reason than to listen to it, as you do, then it's collecting and therefore akin to stamp collecting. Sure, some collecting seems to be more rational, or better value, than others. But who are you to judge? If someone wants to spend 20 bags on this, maybe instead of another buy-to-let or a stupid 4x4 or whatever people spend surplus money on, fair enough.

the only record collecting that is 100% free of irrational stamp collecting tendencies is the buying of newies really.

and, ironically, this talk of british issues being re-issues is the ultimate stamp collecting concern - they were part of the contemporary history of the record and the culture surrounding it and are as valid as major label pick-ups or second runs due to good sales. 'Only the first pressing is an original'? Oh get a grip - the only person who would care about such a unimportant detail is a stamp collector type...so, how can I put this :

Enjoy your filing system.

[Quinvy]

Shall we do a poll, are you:

 

A- a collector

or

B- a hot boxer

 

Always been a hot boxer me, even in the seventies I don't think I ever owned more than 500 records. I once started to collect the Loma label, but I soon came to my senses when I heard some of the God awful songs on it. 

[Stephen T]

Normal people ?!? Who wants to play records to normal people?

Sometimes they're at soul events- women, people who like dancing, dressing up etc. 'Normal' is anyone who doesn't spend all his money on soul records on this board right

[Stompingsevens]

It hasn't struck a raw nerve, your argument is just nonsense. You're saying that spending huge amounts on one intrinsically unreasonable form of collecting is reasonable, but on another isn't.

if you buy a record for any other reason than to listen to it, as you do, then it's collecting and therefore akin to stamp collecting. Sure, some collecting seems to be more rational, or better value, than others. But who are you to judge? If someone wants to spend 20 bags on this, maybe instead of another buy-to-let or a stupid 4x4 or whatever people spend surplus money on, fair enough.

the only record collecting that is 100% free of irrational stamp collecting tendencies is the buying of newies really.

and, ironically, this talk of british issues being re-issues is the ultimate stamp collecting concern - they were part of the contemporary history of the record and the culture surrounding it and are as valid as major label pick-ups or second runs due to good sales. 'Only the first pressing is an original'? Oh get a grip - the only person who would care about such a unimportant detail is a stamp collector type...so, how can I put this :

Enjoy your filing system.

 

We are all allowed our opinions and thank you for yours, it's appreciated.

I will carry on with my view that UK issues of the original US issues are in fact re-issues and nothing discussed here has changed my mind. 

You please carry on with the thought that your Uk issues are originals. 

Thanks.

[Mace]

We are all allowed our opinions and thank you for yours, it's appreciated.

I will carry on with my view that UK issues of the original US issues are in fact re-issues and nothing discussed here has changed my mind.

You please carry on with the thought that your Uk issues are originals.

Thanks.

Jesse, applying the same logic does that therefore mean you prefer 'Elderado' to 'Footballers wives' ?

Have a good Xmas you daft old teddy boy, and thanks for letting Damien know I was trying to get in touch....he phoned me a few nights back and we are catching up NYE.....sounds like he's had a rough last 5 months.

Regards UK releases.....isn't it just a question of preferring either ORIGINAL UK first issues or ORIGINAL US first issues......give me the likes of Ray Pollard, Sammy Ambrose, Darrow Fletcher et all on UK promos/issues to their US counterpart any day!

Merry Christmas you argumentative bunch of ball bags!

Edited December 24, 2014 by Mace

[Seano]

Do we know for certain then that it wasn't a collector of reissues who bought it? ;-)

Love that thought. Surely there has to be at least one out there??

 

Or is what we're all into entirely normal, and the minor disputes aired on this thread are a bit of shock to us all?

 

Have a lovely Christmas Day!

[Modernsoulsucks]

Mace,I don't think you can soft soap him into changing his mind.

[Mace]

Mace,I don't think you can soft soap him into changing his mind.

It's a cracker!

[Johnmcc]

It's contemporaneous, lovely word. Merry Christmas.

[Guest gordon russell]

the one on the right is a big ticket item,the one one the left is a .....more soul gem............l prefer the one on the left