Parisians/traditions-Twinkle Little Star?

[Dobber]

3 questions for the mentioned 45

1. which was released first

2. are they the same group,the 2 groups sounds similar

3. are these 2 the only versions, or is there others (apart from the nursery rhyme)

[Robbk]

What labels were each on?

[Guest Bearsy]

What labels were each on?

Parisians - Demon Hot

traditions - Abet

[Mrtag]

Abet/Traditions And Demon Hot/ Parisians

[Mrtag]

Parisians - Demon Hot

traditions - Abet

 

 Snap!!  

[Chalky]

Parisians is on Demon Hot and Traditions are on A-bet.  

 

I had several conversations with Paul Tefzeger about the Traditions and his other groups, Ditalians being one.  But I need to find them.  The Traditions on Barclay are a white group, the ones on A-Bet do sound black but I'm not 100% and Paul couldn't remember much. 

 

 

 

Both arranged by Jeff Dickson.

Edited October 12, 2014 by chalky

[Quinvy]

Traditions is by far the better version, much cleaner recording and better arrangement. 

Problem is it's ten times rarer than the Demon Hot 45.

At the end of the day it's still a bloody nursery rhyme.

[pow wow mik]

It's not though is it, they just use a line from the nursery rhyme, which makes sense as an adult sentence anyway, as a metaphor for a lonely girl.

prefer parisians, more balls.

[Guest Rubber Soul]

It's not though is it, they just use a line from the nursery rhyme, which makes sense as an adult sentence anyway, as a metaphor for a lonely girl.

prefer parisians, more balls.

Agreed!

I like The Tradition´s version, but definitely prefer The Parisians´one...

 Much rawer and more intense, he really sings with feeling with that rough voice.

[Guest Pussycat365xx]

Always gotta go with raw passion bumhead

[Guest Mellorful]

A real one for sale

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/381015892047?_trksid=p2060778.m1431.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

[Ted Massey]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Northern-Soul-45-PARISIANS-Twinkle-Little-Star-DEMON-HOT-HEAR-/381015892047?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item58b651204f&autorefresh=true

 

crazies are out

[Paul Shirley]

sold traditions a few months ago for 900 , crazies are here as well ted i got a great offer  of 400 lol   

[Guest marco]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Northern-Soul-45-PARISIANS-Twinkle-Little-Star-DEMON-HOT-HEAR-/381015892047?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item58b651204f&autorefresh=true

 

crazies are out

Wow!

[Wiggyflat]

Ive bought loads of stuff from funkyou.The thing is he often has multiple copies of certain 45's.I wonder if this is going to be a Jesse Davis situation.

[Mrtag]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Northern-Soul-45-PARISIANS-Twinkle-Little-Star-DEMON-HOT-HEAR-/381015892047?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item58b651204f&autorefresh=true

 

crazies are out

 

Yep! Dead Up From The Neck Up  

[Blackpoolsoul]

On 12/10/2014 at 16:27, Chalky said:

Parisians is on Demon Hot and Traditions are on A-bet.  

 

I had several conversations with Paul Tefzeger about the Traditions and his other groups, Ditalians being one.  But I need to find them.  The Traditions on Barclay are a white group, the ones on A-Bet do sound black but I'm not 100% and Paul couldn't remember much. 

 

 

 

Both arranged by Jeff Dickson.

Tim Browns quote from Traditions current auction "A superior re-take of The Parisians record on Demon Hot has a much clearer (and better) mix of the track on A-Bet which was then renamed as the group became The Traditions. Very rare (much rarer than the Demon Hot release) and only to be found on stock issue copies as the promo features 'Ruby Tuesday' on both sides."

[Frankie Crocker]

On 05/04/2025 at 07:34, Blackpoolsoul said:

Tim Browns quote from Traditions current auction "A superior re-take of The Parisians record on Demon Hot has a much clearer (and better) mix of the track on A-Bet which was then renamed as the group became The Traditions. Very rare (much rarer than the Demon Hot release) and only to be found on stock issue copies as the promo features 'Ruby Tuesday' on both sides."

Was this just a bit of marketing from Tim or what? Butch played the Parisians version out presumably because of the quality rather than its rarity. It’s Butch’s spins that’ve made the Parisians version as popular as it is. The Parisians is still a rare record and always been hard to come by. As indicated by the scans above, the song had the same arranger and producer so the musicians could be the same too QED? Was Demon Hot the small local label that was then picked up by Abet, a much larger company? The Parisians take does it for me - the Traditions take is fine though; the two groups are probably the same but the Abet version has had a few more tweaks in the recording studio.

 

[Chalky]

Someone edited the discogs entry from both Demon Hot and The Parisians and has them both as out of Florida?  I wonder where they got that info from?  They sound like the same group to me as the Traditions.

Edited April 6 by Chalky

[Blackpoolsoul]

20 hours ago, Chalky said:

Someone edited the discogs entry from both Demon Hot and The Parisians and has them both as out of Florida?  I wonder where they got that info from?  They sound like the same group to me as the Traditions.

Name is "TheGlassbee" who contributes a lot (don't know who this is though or if on this site)

45cat have info stating "backed by" Mike and The Souls who, at one stage (I thought) could be The Lost Souls (Mike Petra) from Arkansas who recorded on Leopard, but that is more guessing and It doesn't mention anything on their website. Drawing board again

One more thing was Ernie Fields the same man that was from Hollywood  "American Idol" and "The Voice" or his father (the band leader) or am I getting mixed up again.

Edited April 7 by Blackpoolsoul

[Blackpoolsoul]

20 hours ago, Chalky said:

Someone edited the discogs entry from both Demon Hot and The Parisians and has them both as out of Florida?  I wonder where they got that info from?  They sound like the same group to me as the Traditions.

The "reissue" on Discogs (Single Sided) is interesting copyright "Soulfulrecords" ? 45cat have it as a bootleg

Edited April 7 by Blackpoolsoul

[Chalky]

15 minutes ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

The "reissue" on Discogs (Single Sided) is interesting copyright "Soulfulrecords" ? 45cat have it as a bootleg

It is a bootleg. I'll give you one guess who owned the "company"

[Woodbutcher]

If the Traditions is rated at 10x rarer than the Parisians why do the prices on Popsike say the opposite ... ?

[Jessie Pinkman]

1 hour ago, Chalky said:

It is a bootleg. I'll give you one guess who owned the "company"

Does the labels of this company normally have a little star on them.

[Stanley]

i sold a stone mint parisions original and got a beautiful traditions abet to play out which has the added bonus of the bongos. if you know you know , better and a lot rarer. tim brown knows his stuff a real trophy piece.

[Chalky]

51 minutes ago, Jessie Pinkman said:

Does the labels of this company normally have a little star on them.

No mate, it’s the gang who served some time at her majesty’s pleasure a few years ago

[washlively]

Parisians every time for me regardless of rarity. Just an observation "Traditions" wasn't included on Kent's CD KEND 121 Abet/Excello "Uptown down South".

[Weingarden]

5 hours ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

Name is "TheGlassbee" who contributes a lot (don't know who this is though or if on this site)

 

That's Dante Carfagna, a very, very knowledgeable American collector and historian.

[Weingarden]

Sounds to me like the two groups share a lead singer at the very least. i prefer the blunt force of the Parisians recording. Don't need the added bongos or backing vocals.

[The Yank]

6 hours ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

6 hours ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

 

One more thing was Ernie Fields the same man that was from Hollywood  "American Idol" and "The Voice" or his father (the band leader) or am I getting mixed up again.

 

  There was a third Ernie Fields a radio deejay / ventriloquist who worked  at WHAT in Philly and moved to WMBM in MIami in 1967. Weirdly enough, the ventriloquist's dummy was named Cockroach. Not sure if if the Cockroach Production credits refer to him on the Demon Hot 45 or it's just a strange coincidence.

Edited April 7 by The Yank

[Woodbutcher]

22 minutes ago, The Yank said:

  There was a third Ernie Fields a radio deejay / ventriloquist who worked  at WHAT in Philly and moved to WMBM in MIami in 1967. Weirdly enough, the ventriloquist's dummy was named Cockroach. Not sure if if the Cockroach Production credits refer to him on the Demon Hot 45 or it's just a strange coincidence.

[Weingarden]

Certainly the same Ernie Fields as the one credited for Twinkle.

 

[Blackpoolsoul]

7 hours ago, Woodbutcher said:

Thanks he hung around with some interesting folks 

[George G]

Ernie has (had?) an instagram page

Ernie Fields | Ernie Fields & Cockroach Comedy Team | Instagram

The article below from a Miami newspaper Jan 1969 confirms the Parisians (mispelled Parsians) connection to the the Miami Ernie Fields, he moved from Philadelphia to Miami in late 1967/early 1968 

Also, Mike and the Souls could be Mike Vetro and his Soul Brothers and Sisters, a well known Miami band

Edited April 8 by George G

[Chalky]

11 hours ago, George G said:

Ernie has (had?) an instagram page

Ernie Fields | Ernie Fields & Cockroach Comedy Team | Instagram

The article below from a Miami newspaper Jan 1969 confirms the Parisians (mispelled Parsians) connection to the the Miami Ernie Fields, he moved from Philadelphia to Miami in late 1967/early 1968 

Also, Mike and the Souls could be Mike Vetro and his Soul Brothers and Sisters, a well known Miami band

Thanks George for confirming Dante’s source, good to know.

so either the group went with Ernie to Abet and re-recorded the track or the tapes did and they were remixed?

Edited April 8 by Chalky

[Sebastian]

22 hours ago, Chalky said:

so either the group went with Ernie to Abet and re-recorded the track or the tapes did and they were remixed?

The lead vocal phrasing is ever-so-slightly different on Demon Hot vs. A-Bet, so at least parts of it must've been re-recorded and not just remixed.

[Chalky]

22 minutes ago, Sebastian said:

The lead vocal phrasing is ever-so-slightly different on Demon Hot vs. A-Bet, so at least parts of it must've been re-recorded and not just remixed.

I’ve not listened that closely on a decent system. There could be more than one take on the tapes as well. If it was re-recorded then they must have had some faith in the group to take them from Miami to Nashville. 

Edited April 9 by Chalky

[Sebastian]

2 hours ago, Chalky said:

I’ve not listened that closely on a decent system. There could be more than one take on the tapes as well. If it was re-recorded then they must have had some faith in the group to take them from Miami to Nashville. 

Just because it was released on a Nashville label doesn't mean that it was recorded there. It could've been re-cut in Miami and then they just had the tapes sent to A-Bet/Nashboro. Or as you write, there might've been multiple vocal takes on the original master tape that they could've used for the A-Bet release. In any case, the bongos and backing vocals are not present on the Demon Hot release.

Edited April 9 by Sebastian

[Kjw]

On 07/04/2025 at 17:00, Blackpoolsoul said:

Name is "TheGlassbee" who contributes a lot (don't know who this is though or if on this site)

45cat have info stating "backed by" Mike and The Souls who, at one stage (I thought) could be The Lost Souls (Mike Petra) from Arkansas who recorded on Leopard, but that is more guessing and It doesn't mention anything on their website. Drawing board again

One more thing was Ernie Fields the same man that was from Hollywood  "American Idol" and "The Voice" or his father (the band leader) or am I getting mixed up again.

I think 'theglassbee' on Discogs is Dante Carfagna

[Chalky]

1 hour ago, Sebastian said:

Just because it was released on a Nashville label doesn't mean that it was recorded there. It could've been re-cut in Miami and then they just had the tapes sent to A-Bet/Nashboro. Or as you write, there might've been multiple vocal takes on the original master tape that they could've used for the A-Bet release. In any case, the bongos and backing vocals are not present on the Demon Hot release.

Yes I realise that too.  I presume the backing vocals and bongos are easy enough to add to existing tapes?  Guess we will never know for sure what really happened.